Maybe get started with just some thoughts off the top of my head, connecting back to the idea of, like, the narrative that's being constructed. When I think of neutrality, I think of status quo. I think of don't talk about things, don't change things, keep things exactly as they are. I was really intrigued by really the focus on like, the victim, perpetrator language that just seemed so prevalent throughout the podcast episode around this topic, and one just kind of thinking about like bystanders, kind of being absent from that, and I think frequently as part of maintaining oppressive systems and their dynamics, is that bystander that is quote, unquote neutral, but that's really actually siding with whoever's causing perpetrating harm, but not actually being An accomplice or being an ally to inhibit harm is occurring, and actually, like seeking justice. And when I think of neutrality, I'm really again, drawn to, like, what's the narrative that's being created, at least, that's being purported, this idea of indoctrination, this idea of basically reverse racism. And I'm just thinking like, how I'm really lost on a podcast and in addition to the complaint itself, but I'll focus on the podcast specifically, of four white men, seemingly white men, say they're behaving along the lines of white maleness, with some just from my Google searching and like, trying to find information about, like, what's their expertise, what's their qualification and competence, to like, speak on this and share their knowledge. Like, I'm not seeing dei I'm not seeing race, white supremacy. I'm not seeing anything that says, like, these people are experts that are qualified, they're competent, they're sharing their lived experiences. And from that I'm just like this narrative feels when I think neutrality, it doesn't even feel like it's neutral. What's being sort of suggested and promoted. It seems like not right lie, especially when thinking about literature and work advocacy that's already been done in the field to document like WHAT THE. Norm is that we're trying to change. For those of us who are social justice oriented, you know, I've just kind of went through some brief research spanning all the way back to 2004 probably earlier, just different experiences of like, racialized exclusion, marginalization, tokenization, isolation, looking at some experiences of AAPI folks thinking about experiences of black men, like, there's plenty of resources of documents that actually like there is discrimination in this field, and that discrimination fits along the lines of, if we're just focusing on race, along the lines of how white supremacy functions, where it excludes racialized minority, racially minoritized people. And so when I think of neutrality, that being stated as a norm, it seems really disingenuous as something that others claim to be seeking.