[COLD OPEN] So many Jews have so many different tribes. They're Jewish, but they're maybe in the queer community or they're Jewish and maybe they have a parent who isn't Jewish. You know, they're feeling this kinship to both parts of themselves. And so I really wanted to embrace not just Native American and Jewish tribes, but you know, any tribe.
[MUSIC, INTRO] This is The Book of Life, a show about Jewish kidlit, mostly. I'm Heidi Rabinowitz. Emily Bowen Cohen is a Jewish member of the Muskogee nation. Her debut graphic novel, Two Tribes, explores the complexities that come with having a dual identity. I can't think of a better book to read in November, which is both Jewish Book Month and Native American Heritage Month. Emily and I recorded this cheerful interview well before the Israel-Hamas war began. We wanted to acknowledge that new reality, so she sent me a blurb to suggest a favorite Israel book. Please listen for that suggestion at the end of the episode.
Emily Bowen Cohen, welcome to The Book of Life.
Thank you. Happy to be here.
I'm so happy to have you here. Emily, can you tell us a little bit about your unique background?
My mother's Jewish and my father is -- was -- he passed away, a member of the Muskogee Creek Nation, as are my siblings and myself. So I'm Jewish, and Native American, currently living in Los Angeles and within the Modern Orthodox Jewish community. So I think a lot of that has all sort of played into who my character Mia is.
Two Tribes is your debut, and it's a graphic novel. Can you tell us a bit about your journey to becoming the author and artist that you are today?
I'd love to! The book actually started as an attempt to teach kids curriculum. My children were going to an Orthodox Jewish day school, and I found that when they did talk about Native Americans, which was usually around Thanksgiving, it lacked some nuance. So I wanted to go in and share with the kids that they were at school with, Native Americans are still alive, still thriving, and give a little bit of a narrative to make them understand that the typical Thanksgiving story isn't the whole story. So I decided to do that by drawing, because I'm an artist and I love to draw, and my own children responded to comics. So I drew up some of my memories in comics form and would go into their Jewish day school, and give them a little sense of what it was like to be a kid growing up Native American here in the United States. The curriculum actually inspired me to reunite with my own Native American family in Oklahoma, whom I'd been apart from for almost 30 years. After I went to visit them that, of course, led to another kind of opening of the story. And to tell that story, I really thought that comics would be the perfect medium for a story that has such personal meaning and also historical aspects to it.
Wow. So that's an interesting origin story, the way that the inspiration came to create this book. So tell us a little bit about Two Tribes in terms of what it's about, like give us an elevator pitch.
Two Tribes is a coming of age story about a 12 year old girl named Mia. She's really fed up with her mom and her stepdad who have become more religious lately. So she decides to steal her bat mitzvah money, and run away to visit her biological father in Oklahoma.
And this is parallel to your own journey, but not precisely a memoir. How does Mia's story differ from your own? And why did you decide to make those changes?
Wow, Mia's story is how I really wish things had gone. My own father died when I was nine years old. So it was really a chance for me to have conversations with him about his history and my own identity, that I really missed when I was Mia's age, you know, when I was 12. That's when I had just moved to New Jersey, which was unfortunate because just as I was starting to ask questions about who I was, I was suddenly in a place where there was no Native American family around me that I could really connect to. I did find that when I went back as a 34 year old to Oklahoma. So Mia was really special to me, it was like taking my own little 12 year old self and sort of recreating the conversations I finally got to have as a grown up, but when I really needed it.
And if it's okay to share, you have a twin sister. Has her path to integrating her own dual identity been much different from your own?
Oh my gosh, I'm so happy you're talking about my twin sister! I also have twin daughters. So...
Oh, wow!
I know. So it's really, it was weird for me to tell Mia's story with her just being a single kid. My sister, her name is Jenny, her path has been a lot different than mine. I think she presents more Native American looking when people see her. So for her, I feel like her identity, in a way has sort of been more easily integrated. And also, I'm in the religious community, and she's more culturally Jewish. So I think in many ways, she's been able to sort of be both things at the same time, sort of in an easier way going through life. Because I married an Orthodox Jewish man and was in a world that was Ashkenazi Jewish, so it's by its nature, more European, I think some of the questions about where I came from, just got asked a lot more than me for my sister. But we actually -oh my goodness - after I reunited with my family, about six years later, I got to go with her and her kids to go back and visit the family for the first time. It was really, really beautiful to be able to watch her go back and see some of the things in Oklahoma that we remembered as kids together.
Awesome. I'm glad I asked!
Yeah, me too. I didn't even know you knew I had a twin sister.
Well, you mentioned it in some of your web comics.
Oh, right. Oh, my gosh!
I actually wanted to ask about your web comics. So...
Deep dive!
Yeah! I did some homework.
Thank you!
So you began with web comics.
Yeah.
How does that differ from the graphic novel?
Oof. Short form comics, I found were so much harder to tell a complete story in just a few pages. I really felt obligated to keep things sort of punchy. And it sort of felt more like poetry in a way because you've got to cram so much into your pictures and your words in such a short space. With the whole graphic novel, which of course has its own challenges, you know, I really felt like I got to immerse myself in a character in a way that told the whole story in a way really wanted to tell it, especially since the medium it can be as fantastical as you want it to be, there's really no limit and I could have my character, you know, we could go really into her interior mind. Or we could go into the past. You can do that a little bit in the web comics, but I really enjoyed the ability to just live there for 256 pages. Yeah, that was a surprise because it's so daunting at first. It's it's so much, so many pages and so many pictures.
It's pretty rare that you see Torah study happening in a graphic novel. Tell us about this part of the story.
When I first met my husband, and I was considering marrying into Orthodox Jewish family, Torah study was something new to me. And it was something that a boy and a girl could do together. And it seems so natural to all of the other people in the Beit Midrash. I was surprised, it was really different from what I understood about being Jewish and the way I studied Judaism when I was growing up, and I really enjoyed how much, if you have a study partner, you each get to contribute to what's going on, you're equally important. I know that's so important to I think especially girls who are 12 and 13. To have an authority figure like a rabbi (she's learning with her rabbi in the book), to have him validate her opinions and encourage her. That just seems so beautiful to me that there's a space where even though there's so many things, sometimes, it feels like girls can't do when you're Orthodox Jewish, but I did see rabbis learning with girls and encouraging them. And that's like a positive part of it that I really wanted to point out, especially because I knew for my character Mia, who is so hungry to learn about all sides of her identity, I really felt like she could get a lot of value out of that. And it also shows a different side of the rabbi who I think starts off in the book sort of being a figure that pushes her away from Judaism. So I really wanted them to be able to come together again through Judaism.
Yeah, I really liked that while Mia was learning from the rabbi, he was also learning from her.
I mean, that's the beautiful thing I think about Torah study. I mean, when I would study Torah with my husband years and years ago, I was so new to it, but my opinion was equally valid. He had gone to yeshiva, and even though I hadn't, I had different things to talk about that were validated.
The word "tribe" - it's sort of a play on words with the title Two Tribes. We've got "members of the tribe," you know, the Jewish people, and then we've got the Muskogee tribe. So does the word "tribe" have different implications among Native Americans versus among Jews? Can you break that down for us at all?
Oh, my gosh, well, I can try. And I certainly don't want to speak for all Jews, or all Native Americans. I feel like "members of the tribe," for Jews, it's sort of more embraced than in the Native American community. Because the word "tribe," it's not negative so much, but it does sort of make people think of like, a time when people considered Native American communities savage. "Tribes," like "to be tribal," it's sort of old. And I think that is something that among the Jewish people, because we are so present, in the present, it's special. And it reminds us of where we've come from. For example, now, my tribe is the Muskogee Nation. We don't necessarily call ourselves a tribe. So I mean, I think there is a difference between my two sides about the word "tribe" but Two Tribes, I really liked the title, not just for the play of being Native American and Jewish, but also because so many Jews have so many different tribes. They're Jewish, but they may be in the queer community, or they're Jewish, and maybe they have a parent who isn't Jewish. You know, they're feeling this kinship to both parts of themselves. And so I really wanted to embrace not just Native American and Jewish tribes, but you know, any tribe. I think that the word sort of encompasses more today than it used to.
Interesting. So the title really means intersectionality.
Exactly. Yes. Yes. Without being too like didactic, I hope.
Right. Yeah, it's a clever title.
Thanks.
So speaking of wordplay and words, can you clarify the language that non Native people should use when referring to Native people? There's so many terms Indian, Native American, indigenous, First Nations, the specific names of different tribes or nations. Is different terminology acceptable depending on the speaker? Can you talk about that?
I'd be happy to. Certainly the word Indian is something, if you are not yourself Native American, you should just stay away from. I use the word in the book, because among Native American people, like I grew up saying Indian and I might say that to another person, my generation. And that's, that's cool. But it gets a little confusing, because I prefer Native American. I know some of my relatives prefer American Indian, because they like to specify exactly where they're coming from. And Native American could be anyone who lives in America. People who I know who are writers, like out here in LA, they use indigenous. I guess just follow the lead, I would say like, in a way someone might say like my pronouns, are she/her. If someone themselves says, Oh, I'm Native American; if you said indigenous, and they say, Yes, I'm Native American, then just, you know, try to pick up on whatever their terminology is. I think that's the best way. I mean, it's still confusing, although I'd say like the absolute best, most gold standard, if you happen to know someone's tribe, and you can say, like, Emily, I hear you're a member of the Muskogee Nation. I mean, that's like, oh, my gosh, that feels so special and amazing. That has happened to me only a few times, but when it does, I'm like, Oh, wow, that's my personal favorite. It's so complicated! I'm sorry!
It's complicated and confusing, but that's still helpful.
Thanks.
Yeah. Are there any myths that you would like to bust right now? For Jewish listeners, you might bust some myths about Native Americans; maybe we've got some Native American listeners who you could bust some myths about Judaism for them?
Wow, that's such a good question. Okay. So I can definitely say a few times I've encountered in Jewish spaces, the understanding that Native American religion is absolutely tied to nature and the sun and communing with animals. I mean, I'd definitely say culturally, that's something that all Native American tribes have in common. But it does leave out a really important moment of history, which is when so many indigenous people of the Americas were put in the missionary system, and were converted to Catholicism. And my father and his family, and they're all Baptists, and they're devout Christians. And they've incorporated a lot of their customs into Christianity, but they are really devoted to their church. So we are unfortunately no longer practicing that sort of Native American religion in a widespread way. And I feel like that's almost hurtful when people sort of assume that because, you know, it's like a really big shift in the history of our communities to not acknowledge that we were colonized. And part of that process was to change our religion and to make it illegal. Oof, that's a big myth!
A myth for Native Americans about Jewish people. Oof. I've found that among my family and the people I know because of the process that we went through of becoming colonized and becoming Christian, people honor Judaism as an old religion, and it's beautiful that we've able to keep it for so long. That's not a myth. I guess that's more like something I want people to understand about the Native American community if they're Jewish.
Yeah. Interesting. So when you are among your Oklahoma family, or other neighbors and people in that community, you don't hear misunderstandings or assumptions that are incorrect?
My family always knew my mom, who's Jewish. So my family has always been almost to the point of just sort of like, it's no big deal. Yeah, I went to a birthday party at the Muskogee Nation Community Center, and my cousin had made sure that there was kosher food for us, like they're like on top of it and very accommodating. There is some sort of political stuff because some Native American people I've encountered do feel a certain affinity to the Palestinians. So I do think that there is a bit of a sense that Jewish people have political power in a way that indigenous communities have not. So that's something that has taken some, just some gentle pushing back.
That's really interesting. Is there anything you would like us to know about the Muskogee Nation specifically?
I think I want everyone to know that the Muskogee Nation who are now in Oklahoma, and if you missed this part of your history lesson, I want people to know it, that we were originally in what is now Georgia and Alabama. And I hope people are aware that we were brought to Oklahoma by foot and by pony, and that's called the Trail of Tears. We're also part of the Five Civilized Tribes, so called, which are not called that anymore. Now we're called the Five Tribes. I mean, I guess we were called civilized tribes, because our tribe and these other ones were considered people who adopted American customs, the way we govern, the way we farmed, in what we wore, it was sort of like we took what was good from, from our, from the settlers around us. And I kind of feel like we, in a way, are still doing that today. You know, like we, as a tribe, have embraced what is good from contemporary American society, and you can see it in the amazing artists and writers who are so visible today. Like one of our most recent poet laureates, Joy Harjo, who is part of the Muskogee Nation. I think Sterlin Harjo who created Reservation Dogs, I think he's Muskogee. I know, he's Seminole. I think he says both. So there's just so many of us who are out here trying to work as best we can, within contemporary society to keep our culture alive. And I'm so proud of that. So I want people to know that about our nation.
Beautiful.
Thanks.
Your story is pretty unique. But did you have any mentor texts or mentor graphics?
That's such a lovely question. Because I was separated from my Native family for a considerable amount of time, I really dove into literature and history books to understand more about my own tribe, which is something Mia does in the book as well. There's a beautiful Muskogee Seminole artists named Jerome Tiger. And his artwork, which also was on the walls of my home when I was young, really sort of formed a lot of the idea of what I think of when I think of my tribe in the past. In some parts of the book, I kind of go into our history, and his artwork inspired a lot of those vistas, especially when I go a little bit into the Trail of Tears because I really felt like I needed to rely on mentors and elders, I guess, to show me how to start to tell that story. For the Jewish parts, I tried to make the artwork a little bit different and more friendly, I want to say, than just text, especially when we went into Torah study. I wanted to highlight the playful side of Torah study. I was thinking about the books that my kids liked to read when they were little. Very accessible children's books, like Are You My Mother?, stuff like that when I was considering how I wanted to represent her Torah study, just so it didn't seem so heavy. So I found both of those very helpful when I was thinking about how to draw these very different cultures.
What's your artistic technique?
My artistic technique. I really like starting off with pencil and paper and ink. And I do all of that work by hand and then scan it into the computer. And then at that point, I kind of clean it up in the computer. And of course, the balloons and the lettering are a lot easier when you're on computer. But I don't think I'm ever going to be able to give up using a brush and an inkwell. I mean, I feel like I could do better, I could look more perfect, but I really like to show like a hand, I like to show the fingerprints in the work. I hope that comes across. I don't know that I'm ever gonna be able to give that up, as time consuming as it is to scan every single one of my hand pieces into the computer. That's just the way it's gonna be.
Can you talk a bit about some of the surreal moments? Like when there's a bully, and Mia seems like she's getting smaller and the bully's getting larger, or there's a missionary and the hands are abnormally large and scary looking. Talk about that surrealism.
Oh boy, I especially that bully one, that scene was always sort of, in my mind, with Mia getting smaller and smaller. I think that's one of the beautiful parts about being able to create a graphic novel, because that's just how she's feeling. You can make that part of her imagination, visible and real. I really feel like the surreal aspects are a glimpse into Mia's interior world. And especially when you are 12, I think it's more of a feeling like, I feel small, because you still have not really figured out why you feel a certain way. But you know, you feel it. There's a part at the Shabbat table where she's having a conversation with the rabbi, and the rabbi makes an Indian joke. And she doesn't have words yet, but she knows it's making her feel like he thinks her culture is scary. And it's just such a gift to be able to communicate her thoughts that way, because it seems more truthful to who she is at that point in her life. That's a real story, that has actually happened to me on more than one occasion. Rabbis telling Indian jokes is like a thing.
Huh!
That's something we should let be known. Rabbis! Please don't tell Indian jokes. Please.
I would not have expected that!
I know! It's always a shock to me too. And I'm like, what? Where did this come from?
Weird.
Yeah, right?
Mia's Muskogee cousin Nova does some creative cosplay and Mia comes up with her own superhero name, Indigenerd. And as a geek myself, I enjoyed this very much. Please talk about this thread in the story.
Nova! Nova! Oh, I wish I could be Nova. She was like that super cool girl. She knew herself so well. I just I love that character so much. I have a relative, a cousin who does cosplay and she's brilliant at it, and so she inspired the character. Big ups to JC! Indigenerd! Oh my gosh, I did not coined the phrase, which is such a great phrase. Right before the pandemic, there was an indigenous Comicon, which I did not get to go to and then COVID happened and I'm not sure where it's at right now. But that is where I first saw that word coined. Like "calling all indigenerds," which I think there are many. You say you're a geek, yes?
Oh, yes, definitely.
Okay, cool. So you know, in cosplay, everybody puts their twist on things and makes their character their own. And I love when I see that happening in the Native community. I've seen people who cosplay is something but then they've got regalia on. And it's such a great way that you can see that Native Americans are right here in the present, and they're still creative, and they're taking culture and incorporating it into what's going on right now. And that's why Nova was so important to me, that she was a creative person doing something that was relevant to right now. I wanted her to really exemplify that for Mia's sake. She's such a cool girl. It's someone Mia could really look up to. And she does, she decides to do it on her own. She's going to become her own kind of superhero. You know, at the end, she kind of finds a way to say like, she's gonna break away from Nova 'cause she's gonna go her own way.
I love that so much.
Thank you. That was one of my favorite characters.
There's a book within your book. Mia reads a story called Little Indian Girl about a white child taken to live with Native people. Is this based on a real book?
Yes, it is. It is based on Indian Captive. Mary Jemison wrote a story about being captured by an Indian tribe, I think it was in the 19th century. And I read the original, her own words. And then I also read Lois Lenski's story of it called Indian Captive, which is a Newbery winning book. I took Mary Jemison's original story and I sort of played with that, to turn it into an amalgamation of all of the Indian captive stories, which is like a whole fascinating part of American literature in itself. When I was deciding what I wanted to include in Little Indian Girl, I wanted to capture the harmful parts of those narratives. And I also wanted to make it a generic version of one of those stories. Because they're just such a foundation, I think of so much of what came later, and how Native Americans were perceived in popular culture. I could really go into the weeds about those narratives.
Well, go on!
Okay! I mean, I think if I recall correctly, they were the first books to be mass produced. Like they were one of the first bestsellers, for these stories of Indian captives. A lot of times, they actually were pretty true to life, but sometimes they're kind of just made up. And the storyline was basically like good Christian people go into Native tribes and maintain their Christianity throughout. But sometimes they were different ones where it was like some people wanted to stay with the Native tribes. And you can't take away from the part that, like, they are written not from a Native point of view. I guess that's essentially what I wanted her to read. Something historical, that felt like bedrock in American literature. And even if the stories could sometimes be kind to tribes, they're still not told by Native Americans themselves. I think I finally figured that out.
Figured out what you were saying.
Yeah.
Yeah, I know, I read at least one of those because I remember the Childhood of Famous Americans series of biographies. They were super cheesy and probably all fairly inaccurate and mythologizing. But there was, I think my favorite one was complete fabrication, because it was about Virginia Dare from Roanoke.
Oh, yes.
Like she was, quote, unquote, kidnapped as a baby. And I don't think she was ever seen again. So nobody knows...
Yeah.
...what her story actually was. So they invented a whole childhood for her among whichever Native peoples she was living with. I don't remember now. And, you know, just came up with something that was complete fiction. But it was a good story to me as a little kid. So, y'know...
Yes, I mean, they were good stories to me as a little kid, which is sort of part of the harmful part of everything. You know, I loved those stories. And I just drunk them in, you know, didn't know any better.
So the story, in one sense, it satisfies Mia's urge to read more about Native people. But at the same time, as you're saying, it reinforces stereotypes. So as a librarian, I really appreciated that Mia decided to talk to her librarian about Little Indian Girl's inauthentic and harmful representation. And on the one hand, I'm very much for the freedom to read, I'm sure you are too. On the other hand, I'm not in support of spreading stereotypes. So what are your thoughts on the many similar books that still reside on library shelves?
My wonderful editor, I have to give her a shout out, suggested including that she was going to go talk to the librarian. That's where the great part about having a collaboration with a really, really great editor is so helpful. And my grandmother was a librarian for the public schools in New Montclair, New Jersey. So it was important that she felt free to like, go talk to her librarian.
How do I feel about the books that are still on the shelves? I mean, I certainly like, wouldn't want any of them taken down. I mean, removing a book from a shelf doesn't seem right to me. But like, I went to visit Plimoth Plantation, one of those places where you go and watch recreated villages, pioneer villages, they have an Indian village. And they had a little sign at the front of it that said, this is a recreation of a Wampanoag family. And then they had a list of things, like don't call them squaws, you know what I mean? And they are in their traditional clothing, but since they are representatives of the present day Wampanoag people,speak to them like regular people, basically. Maybe having like a little sign like that, I felt that was so important to see it before you even walked into that part of Plimoth Plantation. You couldn't go in without seeing that sign. So I think that was a really good way to address it. Just give a framework. If it would be possible to have like a little slip of paper when you check out your book. And it's like, you know, just, this is a certain narrative that was told at a certain time, and Native Americans still out there today, this might not represent them as they themselves would like to be represented.
Okay, so treat it as an educational opportunity.
For sure. Yeah. Like what does Oprah say? She's like, teachable moment, it's a teachable moment.
Yeah. Okay. As far as I know, this is the first Jewish book ever published by Heartdrum, the HarperCollins imprint that publishes Native works. You mentioned your editor. Can you tell us about your experience working with Heartdrum and with Cynthia Leitich Smith?
Cynthia is the author-curator of Heartdrum, and my editor is the wonderful Rosemary Brosnan. I was really lucky because Cyn is also Muskogee. That's a real rare pleasure, she was able to make suggestions about our Muskogee language. Just, it was so nice. Usually, you know, it's like, you know, you hate to be the only Native American person and you've got to kind of represent for all, and it was such a thrill that I wasn't the only one. I've been reading her books and my children have read her books. It was just so nice to have such an experienced storyteller treat Mia's story, both her native story and her Jewish story, with such care. I feel so blessed to have had the chance to work with them.
That's wonderful.
It was great.
What was the easiest part of the story to tell and what was the hardest?
I think the easiest part was the stuff in the schoolyard with the bully, because being confronted about my Native American heritage in a way that my shoulders go up and maybe feel upset or something is such a everyday occurrence. Oh, that just flowed. And as I said, being in a Jewish space where rabbis have made Indian jokes, it was just so familiar, and I was just so hungry to get those scenes in place, and the confusion and the upsetness and the feeling like, but I'm Jewish! But then feeling so like, not part of the family, you know, when those things happen. I mean, it's an, it's such a part of the work that I've been doing to, to express those feelings of being all alone in the synagogue. I mean, so that was probably the easiest.
The hardest part. I think I started off this process, a little bit angry with the Jewish community, like a little bit upset that I had to write this book, in a way. I just felt I had to do a lot of explanation about how I could be Native American and Jewish. This is something that makes me feel like I'm not Jewish, like, I'm not really part of the mishpacha. And I think, reconnecting to what I love about being Jewish, and what I feel is beautiful about the learning, for Mia's sake, she's got to find what's beautiful about it, too. So I kind of had to take that journey with Mia, and just sort of get back to the things that I really love about it. I couldn't write if I didn't believe it. So it was really nice to feel like I believe this. I want Mia to feel good about both sides of her identity. So I had to too, which was good.
That's so healthy.
Yes, it is healthy.
Yeah. Writing is good for you.
Yeah, who knew?
It's nice, because it's good for you, and it's good for everybody else who gets to read it. So...
Yeah!
What do you hope readers will take away from your story?
I think I got into this a little bit when I talked about the title Two Tribes, I hope what they take away from it is that no matter what your background is, so many people feel like they're part of two different worlds. And I hope what they really take away from it is really getting to know yourself, every single part of you, is only going to help you feel better about all of you. Yeah. But it takes some work. And so just do that deep dive, try to enjoy it.
That's beautiful.
Thanks.
What are you working on next?
I was an artist in residence through the Neighborhood BK and Asylum Arts. I had the great luck to be mentored by Trina Robbins, who is a great feminist icon of the comics world. And I have a comic in her anthology called Won't Back Down, which is comics about abortion. And it's in support of Planned Parenthood. And for that comic, I dove into my inner Orthodox Jewish woman, and that's the character in a short form comic. So that was really cool. And now switching gears, hopefully for the next graphic novel, I want to look into the story of Native American activists, and all the work that they've done, and doesn't get out there enough. So I'm going to be talking about a young activist who was inspired by his Auntie's time when she was occupying Alcatraz in 1970. So that's the area, that's what I'm thinking of now.
Sounds great!
Yeah, I'm excited about it.
Awesome. Where can listeners learn more about you and your work?
They can go to my website, EmilyBowenCohen.com. I'm on Instagram at @MemberOfTwoTribes, T W O. Probably the best way is Instagram.
Okay. It's Tikkun Olam time. So what action would you like to call listeners to take to help heal the world?
I'd like listeners to think about the global nature of Judaism. Because I think that can help heal the world, to know how many of our people are everywhere. To that end, I love the organization Be'chol Lashon, which has been around for about 25 years celebrating Jews of color internationally. And personally, they have inspired me when I first found them 25 years ago, and they continue to support me today. So I encourage everyone to check them out and the good work they're doing.
Okay, excellent. What interview question do you never get asked that you would like to answer?
What interview question do I never get asked that I would like to answer? This is so silly, but I think I'd like to talk about cholent. Cholent is the sabbath stew. I'm not like a huge fan of cholent, but I think it's so fascinating how you can add whatever you want. We've had cholent with cornbread, we've had cholent for my daughter who's vegan. I just think it's such a great way to talk about, like, how many different cultures there are in Judaism and how many people can take part in it. You could put cholent on frybread, which is like a traditional Native food and it would taste like chili. And I am Sabbath observant, so creating a good Shabbat meal is something I think a lot about and I never get asked about it.
I think you just came up with a book idea there.
People are passionate about it, too, so...
Emily Bowen Cohen, thanks so much for speaking with me.
Thanks so much, Heidi. I'm really happy to be on the Book of Life podcast.
[MUSICAL STING] If you heard my October 2023 episode, We Need Israel Books, you know that one way to support the Jewish homeland is to read and share books about it. Thanks to Emily Bowen Cohen for sharing a favorite book about Israel.
I'd like to recommend a book about Israel called Lon-Lon's Big Night by Miri Leshem-Pelly. The book is aimed at children aged five to seven. The story follows Lon-Lon, a sand fox who lives in the Negev. It's his first night outside of his burrow and into the big desert. Children in this book are introduced to lots of desert creatures they've probably never heard of. And my children were fascinated that Lon-Lon goes to bed during the day and wakes up at night. It's an exciting read too! Lon-Lon gets lost when he wanders too far away from his home. My kids loved this book way past the age of seven. The text on the page is written in both English and Hebrew. As their Hebrew got better, they returned to this book to practice. But mostly I'm recommending this book right now, because I wanted to share a title I would read to my Muslim friend's children as well as my own. Lon-Lon's Big Night is a book about Israel that I would give to her family.
[MUSIC, TEASER] Hi, this is Elissa Brent Weissman, author of Hanukkah Upside Down. I'll be joining you soon on The Book of Life podcast. I'd like to dedicate my episode to everyone who lives too far away from family to celebrate every holiday in person, but still finds ways to celebrate together.
[MUSIC, OUTRO] Say hi to Heidi at 561-206-2473 or bookoflifepodcast@gmail.com Check out our Book of Life podcast Facebook page, or our Facebook discussion group Jewish Kidlit Mavens. We are occasionally on Twitter too @bookoflifepod. Want to read the books featured on the show? Buy them through Bookshop.org/shop/bookoflife to support the podcast and independent bookstores at the same time. You can also help us out by becoming a monthly supporter through Patreon. Additional support comes from the Association of Jewish Libraries, which also sponsors our sister podcast, Nice Jewish Books, a show about Jewish fiction for adults. You'll find links for all of that and more at BookofLifepodcast.com Our background music is provided by the Freilachmakers Klezmer String Band. Thanks for listening and happy reading!
[MUSIC, PROMO] Many people are aware of Operation Moses and Operation Joshua, which rescued Beta Israel, the Ethiopian Jews in the mid 1980s. But when you look at the large numbers, it's hard to understand the actual experience. Kim Salzman focuses on one family: Kebede, who makes aliyah, moves to Israel first, and we see his life in the absorption camps, his daughter Azmera and his brother Solomon, whom we follow on the hazardous journey through Ethiopia and Sudan, and finally, his pregnant wife, Tigest, who is left behind to raise their four youngest children. The author takes the statistics of Operation Moses and turns them into people. I'm Sheryl Stahl. Join me for a conversation with Kim Salzman about her book Straddling Black and White at JewishLibraries.org/NiceJewishBooks.
