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Momentum call
Jessica Mehring
00:00The website, the tool is having issues. I don't think it's us
Jessica Abel
00:04okay. All right, so today is an open session, just you have a question we want to talk about for sure, but let's go around and get some, you know, something good, and something that's been a challenge. And let's start with Jennifer this time to make sure we fit you in, or you have to run for some reason. Glad to see you here.
Jennifer Catalano
00:29Yeah, I'm glad to be here, sure. Should I jump right in?
Jessica Abel
00:32Yeah, jump right in.
Jennifer Catalano
00:36So it's been about two weeks since I had my one on one with you. So the first week, I was thinking about this all the time, and I was really diving into the material as much as I could. I mean, it's all within the capacity that I have right now. And then, to be honest, I have not thought about anything since the election happened, I am still getting my feet under me in terms of just like, just all of that so but I was really excited to have this call, and I'm really excited to get back to this, because this feels like such a center of agency and hope just centering myself in my own creative process and remembering that I can, I can have, I can have agency over my own practices, right, like so that that's a space that I'm actually wanting to lean into, even though it's been like a weird week, to put it mildly. So um, I my next task was really to create a habit stack, and I did. I've looking at this in like, large pieces of paper when I'm doing thinking words. So this like, huge notebook, um, which doesn't actually fit on my desk, so I have, like, a bunch of notes jotted down about that. I haven't actually put it onto a tracker. Yet, I think I'm going to use a physical tracker for this, even though I use digital things for other things, just because I don't know, I think I need that for the stage. So I have kind of an emerging habit stack that I haven't started to implement, and I sort of have what I what I want to do next with that, in addition just starting to implement it is also then start to create the templates for like when an election happens, or like when I get thrown off, right? Because what happened this last week was that I just didn't think about any of it. And maybe that just has to happen sometimes. But I love the idea of having something so simple that when I get thrown off, I can just still do something. Um, yeah. So go through what my habit stack is, yeah, go for it. Tell us what you're what you're thinking about. Um, okay, and I actually think I want to add something to it, but based on, but I'll come back to that. So basically, um, my morning routine right now is, you know, I kind of do my own morning I made I wake up, I meditate, and then I always go out of the house to get coffee. I started that during the pandemic. But since I work from home a lot of the time, it just like, gets me moving. I get to talk to someone. I get to like, it's this ritual. And I don't want to like that. I don't want to, I don't want to change that. So I think, for me, like the trigger is going out to get coffee and then coming home, and then I'm gonna, I think, have to think about what my ritual is for, like, when I when, but the cue would be as soon as I come home from coffee. I'm, I'm transitioning into this, this time, and the way I've got it charted out right now is that I would spend 15 minutes collecting things, so looking for pieces of writing that I've already written, five minutes reading through something, and then 20 minutes working a piece of writing. And I think that is either going to be reworking a piece that I found or using that as a prompt to continue the thought or expand it. And because of my capacity right now, like we talked about, I'm really focused on, like, how do I just get four sentences done? Right? I'm not trying to write paragraphs. I'm just working with a very small piece. And then, based on our conversation, the last step of that would be to leave myself a prompt or an opening for the next day, although I'm not sure if I need that, because I think that kind of that first step in the process, in some ways, is the prompt. So that might be redundant. So that's what I'm thinking. I'm also thinking, and I think a lot of this, I'm just going to experiment with this process of collecting writing that I've already done and bringing it together. On the one hand, if I don't do it, I'm not getting into the process I want to do. But on the other hand, it actually doesn't have to have my morning energy. It don't have to be super fresh for that part. So I might experiment. I'll start with putting it at the beginning of that flow, but as I go on, I might experiment with just kind of trying to do that at the end of the day for 15 or 20 minutes when I don't need to be super fresh or that sort of thing. And then kind of have a, kind of have a two pronged habit, where I have my morning work and then I have some kind of an evening process that's related to the prompt that gets me started in the morning work. So that's where I am and feeling excited about it, but I haven't implemented it yet. And I think the only other thing that is clear to me, having just spent a week not working on this, is that I also need to create some space and some structure around doing this program, which I have not sort of successfully done yet. So, so I think that's a piece that, and then the piece of like, contingency planning kind of templates are the next two pieces that I want to think about. So that's
Jessica Abel
06:01right, yeah, I would say, like, that sounds really good to me. It sounds like a good process. But I think you're right that the collecting part could be a very satisfying end of your day ritual, where you're setting, you're setting the table for tomorrow, so you're collecting the things, you're putting them sort of someplace where you're going to be looking at them in the morning, and then when you walk in, you you know, it's right there in front of you, and you're going to read some stuff and then write a little bit. And maybe it's a half hour totally, you know. And if you, if you have the energy at that point, you could spend half an hour on this, you know, for now, yes, the, I think the thing that I want to say here is, like that, I think you're planning for this sounds great. But also I think simply having a container of saying like, I'm going to spend some time with my writing, and this is the process I use. Here's my SOP, essentially, here's my like, I need to collect some things, I need to review a little bit, and then I need to write a little bit. And that's the order of things. And it doesn't necessarily need to be, like, 20 minutes here and 15 you know what? I mean, it can just like, I want to go through these three steps, and I'm going to go through them in 30 minutes. Yeah, yeah. And that, I think, could make it feel a little more flexible and doable. Like, some days you're going to spend more time reading, some days you're going to spend more time writing.
Jennifer Catalano
07:20That's a great point. Thank you. I like that, yeah,
Jessica Abel
07:24but it sounds really good. And so then I would, I would look at sticking the, you know, the collecting stuff and putting it out of pile. Like, that's a way to sort of tidy up your day. It's a great shutdown routine where you're thinking, like, oh, okay, days over, now I'm going to make a few piles and just kind of tidy up this and that. And that, and then I'm going to go off and have dinner and do whatever. And then, you know, it's a physical sign yourself, because you're literally probably getting up and walking around the room as well. You know, finding things that there's a shift in energy.
Jennifer Catalano
08:03That's a great point. Yeah, I like that. The
Jessica Abel
08:05other thing about this, in the in terms, and this goes for templates, is, like, when there's a super stressful, you know, painful thing that happens, like last week, I the thing I want you to think about as you start thinking about, like, what does it what does a template look like to deal with that is what would be sort of life giving for me, not like, what would be a, you know, rule I can easily follow, but what would be something That would re like, recenter me and put me where I want to be. Because the thing you said at the beginning when you were talking that this is what we do here, is all about agency and taking control of what you can take take control of like that can feel really good, especially when things just are like crazy in the world, and you want to feel a sense of control. But it's not necessarily like, enforcing something isn't necessarily the way to go. It's more like, what can I sort of sink into and feel like, Yes, this is me. This is mine. I think one of the things I thought about after the election last week and thinking about my work and the role of my work, I'm like, you know, like a lot of coaches, you have these moments where you're like, what? What's the point of this in the face of all of that, you know? But the point of this is that what the election told us is that, at least for the present, in the US system and around much of the world, individualism rules. We don't want it to necessarily. Want to have more collective action. We want to be able to make changes collectively. But the voters have said, No, they don't want that, and that's what we're dealing with right now. And so we do, I think, need to assess where we're able to have positive impact on ourselves and people in our immediate circle and honestly, long term, that's what really we can do. You know, even when it's we're talking collective action, that's what we really have control of. Is what you know, what's going on with us and what's going on with our neighborhood and our, you know, our town, whatever that is, right? So, you know, the way that news comes to us, it fools us into thinking we have a lot more influence over world events than we really do. But what we do have a lot of influence over is what's happening in our local area and in our family and in our own creative practice and so embracing that is I think it is empowering and it is important.
Jennifer Catalano
10:51Yeah, yeah. I also think, just to add to that, for me, there's an element of not only responding, it's necessary to respond to the threats that are outside, but I also be acting from a generative place. I want to be listening inwardly and listening to things that Trump is not telling me I need to listen, right? It's like, I don't want him to be setting the whole agenda, right? Yeah. So for me, my creative practice is that's a big part of it. It's like, this is my agenda, right, the things I care about, and this is the how I devoting energy to them. And I'm not just kind of getting sucked into this vortex of,
Jessica Abel
11:29yes, exactly, exactly, very much. So, yeah, thanks, yeah. Anyway, thank
Jennifer Catalano
11:36you. Yeah,
Jessica Abel
11:36of course. Jess, do you want to go next to go next to make sure we have time for your thing?
Jessica Mehring
11:45Sure? Um, yeah, so I have been working on my lead magnet for my personal brand and the coaching that I'm that I would like to do, that I would like to do there that is a very, a much slower start than I anticipated, and I think that was the universe God looking out for me, because with my with what's going on with my primary business, I've had to redirect a lot of my effort over to Verizon peak and just lead generation there. So I'm taking it a little slower with the personal brand, and that's okay. It's okay, but I landed on this, this topic, ideation system for my lead magnet, and I will share my screen in just a moment. But the idea is, so I've been doing these informational interviews with leaders who write their own content, at least write some of their own content. And one of the things that came up over and over is that they feel like they can't write unless they are inspired, unless the Muse is getting them to their desk. They feel like they can't do their own writing. And as we know, the Muse is fickle, and sometimes she needs to be coaxed out. So for these leaders who want to be doing more of their writing but feel like they can't unless they're inspired, just looking at a topic through different lenses can really, really help there, and really just bring the muse to the desk, get them thinking in new directions, and often be the inspiration that is needed to get the work done. So I have this topic ideation system, which is really just looking at a topic through different lenses, and I toyed with two different ways of presenting it, one in more of like a Google doc kind of format where there are prompts and then space to write, but then what, what I found Is that when I used it, I liked seeing the different ideas kind of all together. I liked it being more interactive and having a document where you're you're using certain prompts and filling out certain boxes. You can't see everything together the way you can in, maybe like a Google sheet. So I'll share what I've got in this Google sheet, which I think is a more I like the more interactive format for this see. 
Okay, so this is what I've got it in a Google doc format here. And these are kind of the seeds that I like to plant with people when we're talking about getting inspiration to write content. Of course, having kind of a core topic that you want to address, thinking about the audience that you want to address it with the format. And this can change, but thinking about kind of what format this may land in is a good thing to have, you know, the seed of that in your brain. And then I've got all of these different lenses and prompts, and this is where it's not working. So we have these different lenses, which I like the look of it in general. It's pretty you know, it's got the colors, but you can see some of the prompts are longer than others. And unless you're using a big screen like I have right here, some of these get truncated on a smaller screen, not to mention it doesn't really enable me to have like follow up prompts. And some of these really benefit with a follow up prompt. Have
+1
Okay, so this is what I've got it in a Google doc format here. And these are kind of the seeds that I like to plant with people when we're talking about getting inspiration to write content. Of course, having kind of a core topic that you want to address, thinking about the audience that you want to address it with the format. And this can change, but thinking about kind of what format this may land in is a good thing to have, you know, the seed of that in your brain. And then I've got all of these different lenses and prompts, and this is where it's not working. So we have these different lenses, which I like the look of it in general. It's pretty you know, it's got the colors, but you can see some of the prompts are longer than others. And unless you're using a big screen like I have right here, some of these get truncated on a smaller screen, not to mention it doesn't really enable me to have like follow up prompts. And some of these really benefit with a follow up prompt. Have Jessica Abel
15:52you thought about using air table?
Jessica Mehring
15:53I love air table. I use it for a lot of things. I thought about using it for this. But where air table becomes a problem is sharing anything publicly, so people would have to,
Jessica Abel
16:08well, no, but using an air table interface,
Jessica Mehring
16:13yeah, it still all ends up in my database when people fill out a form. So here's an interface. What
Jessica Abel
16:20I do with with you all, with the like the weekly reviews and stuff. I think I still have that in Google Docs, but I do have ones that are in air table as well. I have forms that are in air table, like your onboarding form and whatever. They're set up with an automation to mail it back to the person,
Jessica Mehring
16:40and that would work. I think actually, that would work well to get people a collection of their ideas in a workable format. But it's still all that data ends up in my base. So over you know, if this takes off, this is something, something that gets popular, that's a lot of data that then I am having to manage in my workspace. And as you know, airtable is, I swear, every year, limiting the free databases or the free bases, more and more, yeah, just Yeah. Don't want to get stuck in
Jessica Abel
17:16you can do it in Google, Google forms as well. Where you can, you can have it's just a little clunkier, but you can totally do it where you have conditionals, where if this answer gets answered because put in, then other questions appear. So if you want to have that kind of waterfall thing, and then they're putting in answers, and you can have it mailed back automatically. It does go into your database, but it's Google, so it's,
Jessica Mehring
17:43yeah, that's more manageable. Yeah, I love air table. It's so powerful. I do so much with it. But no,
Jessica Abel
17:50I see what you're talking about. Data ownership. I think it's it could really take off, but it's also unlikely to really impact your you know data that much. But why not just start off someplace where, you know, it's not going to be a problem, but, yeah, I mean, Google Forms is less it's less pretty, but you can definitely use it for this, and I think it would be better than this, because then you have the, you know, some of these are just open. They're just, they're going to type it in. They're just going to type in some text, and some of them are going to be drop downs, and the drop downs, then you can link to conditional questions that follow.
Jessica Mehring
18:31Yeah, that's a good idea. I'm going to try that because I I like the drop down format and where you can go in and just kind of choose your prompt, choose your lens, pick the thing, and then use that as inspiration for an angle, right,
Jessica Abel
18:50which you can totally do, yeah, yeah.
Jessica Mehring
18:53And it'll, I think it'll be more the drop down itself will look better in a Google form than it does here,
Jessica Abel
18:59yes, because you can see it'll wrap and you'll Yeah, awesome.
Jessica Mehring
19:04Okay, thank you. I will try that. That might work a lot better than this.
Jessica Abel
19:08It's a great idea. I think it's really clever.
Jessica Mehring
19:13You know, this is, this is how I have kind of coached people through this process, not formally, but colleagues, clients who are struggling with this, these are the lenses that I've used to help them just get new inspiration. And it seems to really work. So I think creating a tool out of this, yeah,
Jessica Abel
19:32yeah, I've used something like this much less formally as well, to teach people how to come up with topics and things. But it's a it's a subject that comes up less often for me as a coach, but, like, it definitely has come up. Ri, did you want to add something to this?
Jessica Mehring
19:48Yeah. I
ri
19:50mean, I think you got to what I was going to point to, which is, for me, the really juicy stuff is that drop down menu, and I wanted just to see that. And if it's a Google form, then the other tick boxes, what audience and stuff can just be on top, and you get to it quickly. But I wanted, like, that was what I wanted to spend time on. Oh, which question am I going to answer? And then what happens? And all the other stuff feels like organizational for you, but not for the audience. So, yeah,
Jessica Mehring
20:21thank you. Yeah,
ri
20:22it's like to redesign
Jessica Mehring
20:24it, yeah? Like, I want to present it in a way that's really usable on the front end, but then have it be manageable on the back end too. So yeah, that was kind of the challenge.
Jessica Abel
20:35Yeah. And you can, then, if you're interested in what people are choosing and what they're doing with it. You can turn it into a spreadsheet, just like, click a button on Google Forms, and it'll put everything into a spreadsheet automatically. And so then you can do data, you know, mining on it, and figure out what people are
Jessica Mehring
20:51asking about. And, you know, I'm all about that. Give me some data.
Jessica Abel
20:58Yeah, I don't know how useful this particular data will be for you, like, which, you know, angles are people into or something, I guess, but, but sure, why not? What audience are they writing for that might be useful?
Jessica Mehring
21:12Absolutely. Yeah. All right, thank
Jessica Abel
21:15you guys. Yeah, of course. Anything else you wanted to bring up?
Jessica Mehring
21:21No, like I said, this is kind of what I'm focused on for the personal brand right now and then the creative practice is going really well. I mean, kind of in a good groove with that, no complaints or changes happening there. Yeah. And this is good. This is the way that we've arranged. This has been really flexible with me needing to focus on Horizon peak more during the work day. So good. Flexible container.
Jessica Abel
21:49It's all about name for the game. All right. Great. Thank you, RI. How
ri
21:58about you? So I'm I have this thing where I've been working on interview questions and organizing kind of on a list, mostly in my mind, people who I might hit up for interviews. But until yesterday, there was this kind of refusal to take it seriously. And yeah, like, I have, like, Whatever, whatever resistance patterns I have were showing up. And what happened yesterday is my housemates really interested in some of these things that I bake and these candies I make, and has this idea about turning it into a business. And we were having a conversation about that, and then I realized, Oh, this is, like, this is a giant distraction. I will never make a good living from baked goods, even, like, seasonally, like, it's just, it's just nuts. And I, anyway, I don't really want to, but I was kind of, it's just so It's so delightful to have someone take such an interest in something I do and want to do something with it. It's like something I've always wanted, but it's just not the right it's not the right topic for me right now. Anyway, I just in the conversation with her, I was also like, oh, wait a minute. I need to just be clear and do the thing. And then as I do the thing, there'll be time in the rest of my day for my creative work, which is actually bubbling along for the first time in a long time. And I think part of what's been happening is I've wanted to protect that and not invest in a business, because I don't want the business to take over my creative practice. But I can recognize that fear and organize my day. And it's, it's quite all right, actually, so we'll see. I think I turned a corner. But like, for example, like I said I was going to email Lizbeth, and I didn't, sorry, I still want to, but it's just like, there's this kind of, like, self protective vagueness of just not doing the tasks.
Jessica Abel
24:01So what I want from you by the end of this hour is for you to identify three tasks you are going to do in the next two days.
ri
24:09Great. Thanks. Yeah,
Jessica Abel
24:13like doable, small things like email. Elizabeth, that's an easy one, right? So yeah, but things that are concretely tied to the business you want to build, because I think you're right that like, until you start taking steps that start creating their own facts and momentum. Yeah, it's going to remain this kind of it's easily, easily avoidable. And you know, of course, you want your creative work to be primary. That's the whole point of what we're doing is to make this something where the creative work stays first. And your experience with businesses in the past is that they take over, but it doesn't have to, but it does need attention, like, in serious chunks of time, at least three times a week, let's say, you know, yeah, yeah,
ri
25:10yeah. I mean, it's, it's funny to me, because I'm actually really delighted about the possibility of this business, like, I know it's
Jessica Abel
25:17also a little scary, though it's not that scary.
ri
25:22It's actually not that scary. It's, it's, there's just habits of habits of self protection more than actual fear. Well, good, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's good, yeah, it's a good thing. Yeah? All right, so that's really it, yeah, I'm short. Okay, I'd like to take up more space, but I don't, I don't. I don't have the content at the moment. Well, we'll, we'll
Jessica Abel
25:48go over your tasks. Okay, great. Garima, are you jumping in? Is that? Yeah,
Garima Goel Lal
25:59so I did create that page, and actually, can I share and show what realization I had after doing that? Please. Let's see.
Garima Goel Lal
26:16Okay, 
so what I already was working on this before joining the program to be a business coach, basically. And then I tried to add in programs, the menopause, Freedom coaching, but then I realized it's basically probably sits better here on my food and health blog, where I write about, you know, already, about how to stop hot flashes and all those kind of things, yeah. So, so now I'm going to be transferring that page to my this, which is not going to be a whole lot, because I already have all the content. So, yeah, so
+2
so what I already was working on this before joining the program to be a business coach, basically. And then I tried to add in programs, the menopause, Freedom coaching, but then I realized it's basically probably sits better here on my food and health blog, where I write about, you know, already, about how to stop hot flashes and all those kind of things, yeah. So, so now I'm going to be transferring that page to my this, which is not going to be a whole lot, because I already have all the content. So, yeah, so Jessica Abel
26:57I'm, I'm confused about the business coaching. Is that a new thing you're thinking about?
Garima Goel Lal
27:01No, this is what I was working even before I joined the program, because women were coming to me for business coaching as well as for health coaching. Okay, so some of them said, you know, we wanted a separate portal where we can actually reach you and but then at that point, I kind of stopped Do I just said, I'm not doing it at this point, but I did start to, did start to make the the website. So I already had very minimal basic website, which I just published, and I try to add the menopause. So there were two thoughts around it, whether I could actually just go with women over 40, for both, you know, just the health coaching work and the the business coaching. But then when I just wrote the the about page, it just didn't feel right. It just felt mish mash, you know,
Jessica Abel
27:54yeah, well, that's the thing is, I think that, yeah, you know, when
Garima Goel Lal
27:57you 
look at my about page here, it's like, you know, this is my health journey. This is my health coaching training. This is my business journey. So I just thought, you know, this is I could just put my health trainings all in my health type of blog. Okay,
+1
look at my about page here, it's like, you know, this is my health journey. This is my health coaching training. This is my business journey. So I just thought, you know, this is I could just put my health trainings all in my health type of blog. Okay, Jessica Abel
28:14but Garima, what I want to say here is, I think that the the if you want to really build a coaching business that has some momentum to it, that you're bringing people in regularly to it, and you have some efficiencies there, where you're able to create programs that you're using multiple times and so on. I think it's really important to pick one.
Jessica Mehring
28:38Oh, I
Garima Goel Lal
28:39see you're saying either business or health Yeah.
Jessica Abel
28:42And I don't necessarily think that if somebody comes to you privately and is like, Hey, can you help me with some business stuff, that you have to say no, but you might want to say no. You might want, you know, like, if the health coaching is what is really lighting you up, and that's what you want to do for people, there's certainly ways in which, even within the context of health coaching, you can kind of, you know, this is me doing, you know, within, within this context and momentum system, we are talking about business stuff, right? This is my business coaching, but I'm still kind of like bringing a little bit of that in. I think you can still do that in a way, if people bring it up and they're asking questions about that, you can still bring that in to a certain extent. But I think that the clarity around who you are in the world, right, is really, it's really confusing. If it's like, I'm a, you know, menopause health coach and I'm a business coach for stuff, you know, like, it's not even about, like, if you want to, if you were a business coach for health coaches for menopause, then there might be some way to put that together, build your own competition or something, you know. But I
Garima Goel Lal
29:51did go through this soldier searching this one of the days on the weekend, I didn't do anything, drove around. And I think this is what's confusing me. Basically, my identity in the world is almost like a business person. I have been in a business forever, and that's what I get called out even for. Like, you know, if I want to, do you want to give a talk and this incubator, or do you want to do this? Or do you want to? So what I realized, which was kind of little the thing that I don't know, if you have read that book be so good that nobody can ignore you. I'm not sure this is about read it, but I know about it. Yeah. So what he says is that what you want to do passion versus what you're good at is it counts a lot. I mean, you can be passionate about everything, but would actually end up where you move the needle is where you were actually good at as well. So what I figured out was, I'm really good at business, and menopause is something that I might like to see in the world. But what, even more than that, what I like, is actually getting that message out, how to eat healthy to everyone. So that was, which is I'm already what I'm already doing through my blog, right?
Jessica Abel
31:20But you we've talked about how the blog
Garima Goel Lal
31:27Right, right? So what I'm saying is that I already have a full time job. I mean, what I'm saying is I already have so then it came down to, can I do? I just do it really seriously, any one of these business coaching versus the blog, and just start slowly with one and just stay with one. So I am there right now. I'm like, I'm still gone back to,
Jessica Abel
32:00I mean, the decision is yours to make clear, like you need to figure out where
Garima Goel Lal
32:04actually all the things intersect and and make sense for me, because, you know, the other pieces of puzzles are also there, family and my job, which I also like very much. I mean being in business so and establishing myself as a health coach. Do I want to do that from start, which I'm not, I can't say I'm like a really, really good at so, I mean, just now. But business is something I have been doing for 20 years. And
Jessica Abel
32:39let me just ask you this, though, because you already have a job. As you pointed out, this is not a sink or swim decision in terms of your family finances or anything, right, right? So it's not you actually want to be making a mark and spending your time, right? So I think that's the question I want you to ask yourself, is you have made a big difference for people going through menopause, right? You know that I do, and you've also been able to help people getting into business. Think about where you are more inspired and where what gives you more joy, what feels more important to you? What is something, if we're looking towards like retirement age, you know, like when you retire from your job, something that you want to be doing that's going to keep you really engaged and excited. What is that thing? That's the question to answer, not this, you know, what are you good at? Versus, you know, because that you are good at both of these things, maybe not equally good, but you're very good at both things, right?
Garima Goel Lal
33:33Not equally experienced, probably, right. But that's fine, right? But the thing was, when I see both of them mentoring women for business versus mentoring women for health, mentoring women for business is much easier as well. I mean, and that's
Jessica Abel
33:51a that could be a big part of your decision. But again, you want it to be, or do you want it to be affecting people's health, which you you keep bringing up, like, if you go into mentoring people for business, it is not going to include a health component. You can mention sleep, you can mention food, you can talk about those things. But
Garima Goel Lal
34:13right? I That's why I realized immediately that this is not going to gel with the business mentorship at all. So yes, I
Jessica Abel
34:20am. Let's listen to ri. Ri has a big statement to make. Here
ri
34:24I do. So what I'm hearing is a binary. It's this business or it's this health, and I'm also noticing that, well, I always have protests against binaries. And I'm wondering, I'm wondering, what happens if you allow them both to be true. And I personally noticed that I really love thinking about and working on businesses when it's in this container of absolute health that my business isn't so foregrounded that, okay, fine, I'll eat healthy and I'll sleep if I can, but it's more like there is no business without health and well being and self care. And so there's this model where it's yes and yes and yes, and it's not either or, and you're actually synthesizing your your expertises and your passions and putting them all on the table, and then something new and strange and magical will arise. That's my belief.
Jessica Abel
35:23I think yes. And to your belief, the question is really about what outcomes you were talking about for your clients. And I think that the the saying like, you will get business results and still be healthy, you know, and not bring yourself out and not be you know, like, you know, crack your health like, that's an important thing to say. Let me just finish what this statement and then. But I think that the the primary, if you do business coaching, the primary reason people are coming to you is for strong business strategy, and it needs to like, that needs to be. Then the framework that you're teaching, and there can be parts in there which are like, and let's talk about how this fits into your day, like, what are you doing so that you are supporting yourself to get through, you know, and build this thing. It's very difficult to build. It is possible, but the messaging around it gets very confusing, and especially the way you've been doing it so far, which is like, here's this whole health framework, here's this whole business framework. It can't be that. It's got to be like, here's a business framework, and what supports that is your health. And so let's make sure we talk about that too. You know, it has to have a subsidiary kind of function.
Garima Goel Lal
36:40Actually, that was the intent. The reason I brought up that whole concept was that my I was struggling at some point in my life with my energy, because I had really debilitating migraines and I was not able to even though, you know, I may have been smart or whatever, I was not able to do anything fully. So that's why this whole thing came up. But once I took charge of that, I was able to show up so much better and with so much energy to do business. It can be anything, you know, it can be if you want to write, if you want to do a business, or if you want to take care of better care of your family. So I just thought, you know, if women in general are have more energy at their disposal. They can do whatever they want to do
Jessica Abel
37:24better, but that's being a health coach, which is, I think, I think if that's where you feel passion, that's where you should be and and you have, with this business background, you have an ability to maybe focus on entrepreneurs. You're doing health coaching for entrepreneurs, you know, so you you niche into, you know, female entrepreneurs who are at menopause age, and this is who I'm talking to, because it's so important to maintain our energy, because it's so difficult. And then you can help people with business questions in the context of health coaching. But the framework that you're using is around health coaching, health coaching and energy and navigating menopause, that it's just, it's really important, like, you can do all kinds of complex things within a coaching container. We're doing very complex things here, you know, and I think you all sense that, like, the stuff that we're doing here is nuanced, and there's, like, a lot of different things we're doing. You're all working in different directions. But the message around a coaching container needs to be clear, and it needs to be fairly simple, straightforward. There needs to be a sense of like, it's step ABC. This is what happens. These are the outcomes you're going to get. Because without that selling it is near impossible. It's really difficult. People need clarity in their mind of what they're going for and why they're making this decision.
Garima Goel Lal
38:45Thank you. I think I'll have some thinking to do to
Jessica Abel
38:48do something, yeah, and I think either direction would be great for you. But I do think you need to pick Elaine, you know, in terms of, like, how you're going to frame this thing, even if the container, even if the container does have elements of both inside of it.
Garima Goel Lal
39:01Thank you. Yeah,
Jessica Mehring
39:04I think too that this is an entry point. You're choosing an entry point that people can come in through, and then on the other side of that, within your coaching container, do all the things. So you're not necessarily choosing to not focus on business at all. You're just choosing an entry point for people to get through, to get your help.
Jessica Abel
39:26Yeah, and I think outcomes are important. So saying like it's an entry point, but also like you're going to have steps A, B and C, they are going to get to C. C is having more energy. It is having a functional business. Whatever the C, you know that whatever the end point is, that's what you're going towards. And these are two tools you have at your disposal to get there, two sets of tools, right? And they both need to exist. And we know that. I mean, I believe that. I think that's very true, but I do think that if you go the business coaching direction, you're not going to be able to throw the whole framework thing at them, it's going to be a much more lightweight version of just kind of lightweight support around, you know, making decisions around health and, like, looking at various, you know. And maybe that's like the health coaching is an offshoot of business coaching where, like, people who need it are like, Okay, I'm going to raise my hand, and I really want to do health coaching with you so we can get that sorted, you know, while we do this business coach coaching thing, or once we finish, or whatever, you know, I don't know that's also complicated. And the other piece of this is, the the more sort of separate you have these things, and the more you don't really know which one's on top and which one you're really focusing on, the more confused you are, the less able you're going to be to do the work on the project that will actually get it to the point of having, like, regular clients and, you know, viability. I mean, you know that as a business person, like, that's what happens, right? And that's what Ri was talking about with the cookies. It's like, you can't, you know, it's not that making cookies is bad or couldn't make a little bit of money. It's that. It's about time and energy and focus, you know.
ri
41:11Okay, good, all
Jessica Abel
41:13right. Lizbeth, let's hear from you. How are things going with you?
Jessica Abel
41:38Are you with us?
Jennifer Catalano
41:41Reloading?
Jessica Mehring
41:51She's still in here. She's just muted, and her camera's
Jessica Abel
41:53off. Yeah, so I just sent an ask to unmute while we're waiting. Anyone have anything to add.
Jessica Abel
42:09Other questions we didn't cover.
ri
42:13If I just want to say if, like, my chiming in drives people crazy, let me know, and I can rein it in.
Jessica Abel
42:19I just, I have, I have thoughts, fair enough. I like the thoughts. Anybody else feel free to bring up objection. That's fine. And I think too, like, if, if anybody's asking a question where they don't want input other than mine, you can set that expectation at the beginning and say, like, I just want to hear from Jessica on this. That's also fine. Yeah, Lisbeth, you're here.
lisbethf
42:42I am. I was the whole time, and I really like the input as well. And when I listen to all your, you know, your stories and situation, I also always want to respond. So lots of ideas about coaching and what, what I just heard but to focus on myself, I would say I've had a really good week up and down. I mean, I freaked out over the the election, which led me to really attack my whole decluttering thing. So I cleaned up all day. I just non stop cleaning as a way to kind of cope with the chaos of that I hear ya and anyway, and that kind of led me to an appreciation of just my own influence in the world. And then another odd thing this week was that I've been planning for some weeks to go to Paris, so I just came back last night and and it was just really great. I was with two artist friends, and we were at this big art fair, and I went to this special place that's for people who make artist books. Most of them are photographers, but it's really like a spectrum of things. And it was so interesting. And I, you know, networked with people, and I was just so completely high, like, higher than I've been in a long time. We went to the Pompidou and saw the Surrealists and
Jessica Abel
44:09show, and see the comic show, the huge comic show there.
lisbethf
44:13It just closed the day before we got Yeah, yeah. It's too bad, but yeah. But we saw the other things, yeah, yeah. And, and it gave me an inspiration to really believe in this artist book project. And I also realized a couple of my stumbling blocks. As you heard last week, I get really annoyed with digital media, and then sometimes I feel like I'm fumbling around, like I just did, and I get so annoyed. You know, I used to be one of the pioneers of, like, software. Worked for software companies. I was, like, a leader in the field, you know, in various bureaus here in Denmark and and for Lego and everything. And I've just and my PhD is really about digital media and art, and I just have this backlash against it, and I have to kind of overcome it, both on a very practical sense, getting my stuff organized and just to not get so annoyed with it. And it also relates to how I want to publish, or whatever I want to do with these artists, artist books. Do I want to do a handmade thing, or learn in design, or have somebody else, perhaps set it up? And so I got some good input on that. I don't want to take up too much time. But in any case, it's been, it's been a very up and down week, but, but very inspiring so and, and I feel like I'm progressing. Yeah, yeah,
Jessica Abel
45:47that's great. That sounds like a really good week, actually. I mean, some dips there clearly, but like, you know, dealing very well with the I mean, I think spending a day decluttering is a perfectly logical reaction to what happened. Yeah, it makes a lot of sense to
lisbethf
46:08me. God, really cleaning madness and also just unplugging,
Jessica Abel
46:12you know, just doing the thing that's in front of you.
lisbethf
46:16Yeah, yeah, keeping it simple, but also trying to reach out. And I think I have an incredible shyness mixed with like, a lack of self confidence, and that also irks me, because it means I don't, I don't post anything on social media. I really have a goal. I'm saying this out loud, but I want to make an Instagram account, but I want to post things, but I want to reach out to people who know me and who welcome and tomorrow I'm going to see someone to talk about my project, a man who's a professor at Copenhagen university who's been very supportive. And it's like, I just don't, I really have trouble reaching out really hard for me, my own family and my network and, yeah,
Jessica Abel
47:05well, it is hard, especially when you're not in the habit of it. Like, when you're not in the habit of it feels really monumental. Honestly, making an Instagram account and posting a thing on Instagram, basically, literally, no one would see it, like, you know, there's, you know, in order to get somebody to see it, you'd have to tag them and say, like, hey, there's a post here. So which Sure, why not? You know, go ahead. The thing is, the stakes are really low, and I think that's important to keep in mind in terms of doing this and getting started, once you get rolling, then, you know, it's easier. Stakes are a little higher, but they're not as high as we think they are. You know, I'm writing to a list of 1000s of people every week, and it's fine. I write stuff that's weird. Sometimes I like, you know, tell, tell stories on myself. Like, it's people kind of like that. It's completely fine, but it takes a long time. I did not feel that way when I started doing it,
lisbethf
48:03I think it goes into a bigger thing of, you know, and Brene Brown and all the work on shame, I mean, certainly echoes this. But it's like my work, or the my project, my main project, is so private, and it's about me as a private person, and so to make it public, I think it's, it's like, I have a hurdle there that's really deep.
Jessica Abel
48:24I mean, do you know, make it public?
lisbethf
48:26That's the question. Well, I
Jessica Abel
48:28think that's the question to think about this week, is, is this a project that you want to be in the world publicly, and if so, in what way? It may not be an Instagram type project. It may be something that you share with a small group of people, or maybe something that goes through, like, you're going through certain sort of art book channels, and you know it's going to go into some world, but not some other world. Like, just think about what you know, what would make this feel finished to you? This is part of the one one project certificate you know, is like, what does finished look like for this? So think about what finished would look like for you. That would feel good, like you've shared it with the right people in the right way. And it does not have to, and probably won't look like, you know, the things that are done in general. No, right? If you have mentors and colleagues who are interested, if you want to share with them, maybe you're making a tiny email list of 50 people, and those are the people who you tell about this, and you write once a month, and you go, here's some progress, and here's what I'm thinking about. You know, like, it really could be just that, because that is going to fulfill your goal of doing this work and sharing it in a way that makes sense to you. That would be fine. You don't have to make it something bigger than that. Yeah, if you want to be. I mean, again, I just want to make very clear here, since you're not on Instagram and not doing stuff on Instagram, doing stuff on Instagram does not get it in front of a lot of people. That algorithm makes sure of that, like you don't get in front of a lot of people unless you use ads. So that's not a guarantee of a large audience, but it is a kind of semi random audience, you know. And so if, if what you want out of, maybe not this project, but your work in general, is just to kind of be out in the world and like sharing and be a public person, doing public stuff, then maybe Instagram is something you want to have. But for this project, it may not be the right thing. You can even you can create like my kids have, and many, many children have a private Instagram where you have to request to be part of it, and then you can approve people or not. Again, they still won't see it unless they go look. But it's it could be a place to post stuff like you're posting progress or whatever, and you have 15, 2024, 1520, 2550, people who do this thing. And you can send an email. Be like, I put some stuff up on Instagram if you want to check it out. And here's a link. And like, people can go look at it because they are subscribed to your their followers to your Instagram.
lisbethf
51:16Yeah, it's definitely a small thing. It's like, artsy book niche. I mean, the people I saw at this place called poly copies in Paris, which was on a boat, it's all these artist books, and, you know, different small, really small fringe publishers about, you know, Cold War and family trauma, and, you know, those kinds of topics in this, in these beautiful, poetic books and handmade prints, yeah, so I
Jessica Abel
51:50mean, and if that's the goal, then you don't need to start creating an author platform and, like, get out there and do a bunch of marketing. You just want to be thinking, Who do I want to make sure they see this and how often, and what kinds of progress stuff do I want to share with them? And then let's think about a container for that. So think about that this week. Let's touch on it next week or the week after, and see where we're at all right, we're about to wrap up here. So Ri What are your three tasks for the week?
ri
52:18Ooh, you remembered. So good. I'm going to eat my Lisbeth, who's already decluttered, but maybe has some insights for me anyway. She can always say no. She can always say no, go away. That'll be useful. I have somebody else, a neighbor, that I'm going to text about interviewing her. And then there's this I'm going to take, I put together a list of tasks for my project planner, like, what goes on there? And I'm going to start to make the project planner, and I'm going to, I started getting really creative with what my project planner might be, and I'm going to dial that back and just make something like on a piece of paper that I can just use, not, not turn it into a whole giant art project, which I maybe later. Our projects
Jessica Abel
53:03are fun, you know, I mean, if it makes you happy, that's fine, as long as it doesn't take so much time that it was,
ri
53:07it was, I might still do the art project, but it's gonna be in parallel, on its own track, and not like, it's not one of the contingencies for me starting the business to get that thing done that doesn't make sense. It's like the wrong anyway, even
Jessica Abel
53:21your work with patterns and repetition and stuff, it would be really fun to come up with a planner idea that was like, make one of your pattern every day. Oh God,
ri
53:32that would make me fucking crazy. Would make me crazy? Oh my god, yeah, I'd have to be in like a deep trance to be okay. Donut. No, no, no, yeah, no, it needs to be sloppier and freer.
Jessica Abel
53:47Yeah, okay, sounds good.
ri
53:50I'm done with patterns. Jessica, done. No more patterns. I don't believe you. Okay, fine. Um,
Jessica Abel
53:59okay, everyone, any final thoughts before we wrap up? Okay, next week we're going to go over the reflect phase, and so the recommended we're going to send out this afternoon, like, what to do? Basically, just listen through it all. It's a lightweight in terms of activities unit, because there's, well, it isn't. It isn't. The main thing that's in there that I think everybody's going to want to take a little gander at is the inner critic should monster stuff that comes up for everyone and in different ways. And so I think the one thing in there that I think is of great use is this idea of triaging your shoulds into things that are very actionable and you can kind of deal with and things that are more like bring to your therapist like these are deep, you know, and they're and they get mixed up. And so you think there's so many of them, but sometimes there's not as many as you think that. And then we will be going over weekly review process, but it's not that dissimilar from, you know, the daily stuff that we've been talking about. So it's not that big a deal. And then it's kind of like, how do you keep going? How do you keep this product, this process rolling? So that's the content of the reflect phase that we'll be going over next week. And then we have another open call after that, and then we're going to do a quarterly review call, which is just kind of, it's a little early, because we've only been doing this for two months, but it'll be like looking back and seeing what has happened, kind of setting some expectations going forward. There might be a better time to do it, time wise, and I'm willing to shift it if we want to move it a little, like do a couple open calls and then do it or whatever, but we'll talk about that later. Okay. All good. Great, thanks everybody for bringing your great questions and comments and supporting one another. I love it and I will see you guys soon. Bye. Thanks.
ri
55:56Thanks, Jessica. Thanks you all.
lisbethf
55:59Bye bye.