My tech cane tells me to pause which is good. So we don't have to keep all the propaganda when we actually started addressing questions. So that's the Bardo. Do you get it? Alyssa? That's the Bardo. That's my pause.
Now I also got a new pair of glasses. Let's just call it the switching back and forth. I got these new glasses that allow me I have a hard time because I'm spending so much time in front of a computer. Now. You may have noticed, I'm always doing this or looking up. People think I'm a real snob because I am. But you know, I'm always looking at people down my nose because I have progressives and I can't see right so I'm doing all this stuff all the time and people just think I'm arrogant. Which is true. Sometimes, but I got to do lenses so I can now look their model. I can look straight ahead and I can actually see without doing this QA or like, you know, Bob Thurman Yeah, you do that you do the chat thing you're doing like, Ha. Anyway, great questions came in. So let's get it up. That's what we do. Here. People send me questions, which is fine. I'll do my best to address them. But it's also participatory. If you haven't done this before, you can ask a live question always best raise your hand and always better if you do that, because then I can have some dialogue. You can put a question in the chat column, I'll address it and if you have a contribution if you want to just share something more than welcome to do that as well. So it's just a way to hang up. So I convey these anonymously. This one is reads as follows. I'm very worried about being in the Bardo after death. Concerned about going into a dark realm and being born into a harsh life like the one that came into many years of my life were filled with emotional suffering because of childhood trauma. Well, first of all, I'm very sorry for that. That's that's one day at the beach. And I'm not going to use dismiss that in any way. But here's the thing about this. I'm very worried about being in the Bardo after death concern about going into a dark realm. Being born into a harsh life like the one I came into this is really a good question in the sense that it's somewhat revelatory, perhaps, of this assumption that we all seem to think many of us do anyway, that somehow we're the Bardot's piece this thing like heaven or hell, and that is just waiting for me. And I'm just gonna plop into the Bardo and then whatever, I'm screwed. That's not the way the Bartels work. There's nothing there waiting for you. It's a little bit like saying I'm afraid of dreaming tonight. Because I'm going to enter this preexisting dreamscape. The Bardo is a state of mind. It's it's this nirvana is a state of mind. There's no Nirvana out there waiting for you. samsara is a state of mind. It's all mind. So this is a good question. You're worried about being in the Bardo after death. One way to rephrase this is you're worried in this context is you're worried about being with your mind. And so this is actually something you can do something about, if you understand that, and this is why by the way, the Bardo are connected to the dream states they you've heard me say this before. The Tibetan Tibetan tradition talks about three types of dream. Nighttime dream, we know that one, this this is actually your dream. Look around. This is a dream. We just haven't woken up to it yet. And then they call that the dream at the end of time, that's that's debt. That's the Bartos. Everything's a dream. Because DREAM IS code language. For manifestation of mind. It's all mind. There's no Bardo, waiting for you. It's your mind that's waiting for you. Free from the limitations, that obscurations of your body. And honestly, that kind of fear honestly is good. This is what Lama Zopa Rinpoche taught he has a whole book about this called wholesome fear. This is good fear. Because this is the fear of like, hey, wait a second. This is just karma. This is just pure causality physics. What is found now is found then could be or sad, right? So if you want to know what's going to happen to you when you die look at the mind that you inhabit. Now, it's like a promise above all when said if you want to know your previous lives, look at your present condition. If you want to know your future lives, look at your current actions. And so this is actually it's good news, bad news. It's bad news. If you're not prepared, because then you gotta enter your mind free of any limitation and that depending on the contents of that mind, that may not be so propitious that could be like, advantageous, I should say that could be like inhabiting a nightmare.
So a nightmare, you know, it's not a preexisting landscape. It's a MindScape. But here's the really good news to just put this on a really powerful positive note is that you can do something about this. Start to work with cultivating love and kindness and compassion and all these natural wonders qualities that you have within you. Because then when that is revealed, when that becomes your Bartow, then you have something to look forward to anxiety is replaced with anticipation. You realize I'm going to descend and I talked a little bit about this with Delson yesterday because when he was talking about his memory, I asked her how did how did you come to remember your past lives? And he actually talked about the mechanisms of how we did it. It was all it was great stuff because all classic. It was just exactly what the judicial say when you reach these certain proficiency. So it was really pretty cool. But the idea here is this can be a wholesome fear, it can be good fear. And here's let me see if I can remember it. Here's a verse. I'm reading this because this is important. This is a verse from Milarepa, who attained enlightenment in one life because of his fear. He killed this guy killed 37 people. That's not That's not a lot of good karma waiting for you that that's not exactly a warm reception committee after you. Mark the best welcoming committee. So he realized and he said in horror of death, I took to the mountains contemplating again and again on the uncertainty and the hour of Daft I captured the fortress of the deathless and then the nature of mind now all fear of death is over and done with so he used his fear in a good way to like whoa, I think I know what's gonna happen I better do something about it and so he spent 12 years and intensive retreat, purified all his karma, get rid of all this stuff died before he had to die, and then attain enlightenment in one lifetime and then had everything to look forward to. So really great question. You're not going to go into any pre existing landscape because there isn't one. It's your mind. So this is something you can do. You can work with this. Create a heaven waiting for you. Proof of Heaven, right? So for the I'm not going to mention names, but if the person is listening, who did ask this and wants to follow up, raise your hand and we can talk further if that's what comes to mind. Okay, here's the sleep and dream question I took Galantamine, that's a acetylcholine esterase it's a many of you know, this is a it's a naturally occurring substance that's been somewhat synthesized that you can take that increases lucidity in terms of clarity. I use it in all my dream yoga retreats these days. So anyway, I took lying to me for the first time two nights ago. I had trouble falling asleep. Okay. First thing is, you generally the recommendation is you don't take it as you're going to sleep. You take it six hours after you go to sleep. So you're in bed. This is the best way to do it. You go to sleep. Set your alarm for six hours later or depending on your sleep pattern. Two to three hours before you normally wake up. Set your alarm wake up. Take the 48 milligrams Galantamine, Dan don't take it when you're just going down to sleep. That's probably one reason why this happened to you. So don't do that. You can MIT you then you have these problems that you're talking about. It's not falling asleep as fast as usual. Not uncommon liminal state was much more vivid than usual. I would expect that that makes sense. I could manipulate the images and semi pre dreams. Yes, these are dream image amalgamations thought image dream amalgamations. They're called Dream Lutz with much more ease than usual. Cool. That night though I did not dream usually I can remember my dreams very well and have been journaling. You probably did dream you just don't remember it. It's only people who have somewhat rare organic brain disorders that don't dream everybody dreams. We just don't remember it. The difference between access and phenomenal consciousness the frustration anxiety carried over into the blackness of dreamless sleep. Okay, I am wondering if I experienced lucid sleep doesn't sound like it because you wouldn't be feeling frustration and anxiety. When you're in in deep dreamless sleep there there are clear markers for this and actually Dustin's he's named study with this stuff as well. We talked about that. It's pretty cool.
That nothing is formless. So you can't be anxious in that state. There can be no anxiety there can be no frustration if there is that's not dreamless sleep. dreamless means formless. So doesn't sound like you were quite there. I was wondering if I experienced lucid sleep? I don't think so it doesn't sound like it. That's one way to recognize it. There's no affective component to it as we know it. And secondly, even deeper is one way to really test this is if you're in that state and you feel I'm experiencing this. That's not it, because that's still subtly dualistic. That's the way you can tell. And that's why it's hard to talk about because it's not an experience. Experience, by definition, is based on Consciousness which is dualistic. That's what makes this stuff slippery. When you're there, you know, you the bigger part of you. It's not an experience. It's a realization is a non dualistic type of knowing. And so not only can you not have frustration and anxiety, but there's also the sense that there's no longer the sense that I'm experiencing that that's not there because of it. Is that still dualistic so you're not there. I could feel that my old nervous energy that I think incubated unknowingly Yes, I think that's true. You probably incubate that unknowingly. And I was focusing my awareness on the Awareness itself. That's good. But see awareness, focus on awareness itself. This is a multi valent practice. So because awareness is a multi Vaillant term. So when we talk about awareness in the sense that it's like what level of awareness are you talking about? Even if you're doing things like open awareness, which is the practice of awareness of awareness, that's still dualistic. If you associate awareness with REG PA, which is what happens in deep dreamless sleep, then that's real awareness of real awareness. See, so this stuff gets this very nuanced, very kind of subtle stuff. Was this lucid sleep? I don't think so. Can the anxious anxious feelings carry over into lucid sleep? No, because nothing fits through their chipper right that's why I have that image of the hourglass same thing applies to death. The hourglass with doubles as a chipper you know one of those roadside thingies that you throw crap into it, it gets all chewed up. Well, that's what happens to any form when you fall into deep dreamless sleep, which is why we don't recognize it. Because we identify with the forms that arise in awareness, not with formless awareness itself. That's why we blackout but for Yogi's, they light up hence luminosity yoga, that's what it's called, because they can identify formless awareness. itself formless awareness falls into itself. rombach recognizes itself. So can you take these feelings into lucid sleep? No, you can't even if all thoughts images and emotions are not there, or is the body completely numb to the nervous system and the state? Well? That has is another good question. You're in, you're in a very subtle body here. So there's no this is what makes it difficult to send signals from this in the lab. To the scientist, it really difficult to send a signal. So you've you've subtended physicality. And so you've subsetted everything you're talking about here. I woke up thinking I only slept for two hours. Yeah, sleep state misperception that's called when in reality was closer to six. We talked about this with Dr. Ed yesterday. By the way, for those of you are night club members, you might want to spend more time with what we're doing with Dr. Ed once a month now. He's talking about some really cool stuff. Really great questions are coming in. We posted it yesterday. And the questions he's so great, he The reason I mentioned this is we talked about this called sleep state misperception Where do you think you're sleeping one or two hours people come in? They're complaining, I'm not sleeping. I'm not sleeping. You're on a lab study and you show them? Yes, you are. Is you are you just don't know it. But small sidebar for nightclub members. We're starting to type some cool stuff with him on these Wednesdays. Yeah, so that's it. That's my little riff on that. I love these questions. These are good. Okay, a couple more than we can open it up. Regarding dream signs, yes, there's dozens of those. So this is a question about lucid dreaming and dream signs. So dream signs are what they sound like dream signs are signs indications that occur in a dream that you can sensitize yourself to so that when they occur, they clue you into the fact that you're dreaming. super powerful. I use them all the time. Well, let's see where this question takes us.
I've been brought into lucidity twice by dream elements that were too outrageous to accept shocking me into lucidity spot on Amigo. I've done this hundreds of times. Dream science totally work is I began to dream journal and look for signs should I consider dream signs to be one. Any element that recurs in my dreams absolutely positively. This is the way you can use Recurrent Dreams for lucidity. So you have a recurring dream. I've done this. I can't tell you how many times and there's a recurrent pattern. I write it down. I highlight the common features. And then I sensitize myself to those. I used to have all these dreams of my childhood home in Michigan and all kinds of waves crashing into the house, that kind of thing. And so I just started to associate those signs to Recurrent Dreams with in fact lucidity triggers, and so the Recurrent Dreams became an absolute treasure trove of dream side material. So absolutely any element that recurs in my dreams, Recurrent Dreams, write them down, circle them, study them become familiar with them, and then say to yourself the next time I experienced this whatever it is in my dream, I will recognize that that's a dream sign and then I become lucid. Okay, should I consider dream signs to be that number one? Yes. Number two outrageous elements that recurring my dreams? Absolutely. Anything out of the ordinary that can't happen in normal life. I mean, that's what triggers a ton of lucidity. I have to share this story with you. Every time I get these kinds of questions. I have to chuckle because my dear friend Joe parent, he shares his story liberally so I'm not violating anything. Just to show you how sometimes intractable this can get right. So Joe shares the story all the time. It's fantastic. So he was under dream in his teacher I think it was the recording stopped. Well, Alyssa, why did the recording Stop? Good question. Let me recording in progress. Recording and progress. See, that's a dream. Right there. It's a dream side. Anything that's unusual. That's a little weird. Do you conduct a state check? I've done this so many times. That's weird. Jump up. Jump. Why do I do that? Well, because if I come down, I'm probably still here. Still awake, so to speak relatively. Next time I'm going to do this. I'm working on this. I'm going to jump up and I'm going to keep going. I can't wait to do that. Or even better. I'm going to go up and then I'm going to come down and like disappear. I could do that. All right. So anyway, drink joe shares the story. Sorry, I didn't sleep enough last night. Just kidding. So Joe shares the story. We're talking about dream signs. So he's having a dream. His teacher Trungpa Rinpoche appears in his dream and says to him point blank, Joe, you're dreaming. Like, hello, could you ask for a more blatant dream sign? And sweet Joe? comically shares you know, I just didn't get it. Right. Here's this teacher in a dream saying Joe, you're dreaming and it wasn't enough for him to become lucid in the dream, but it sure does make fodder for great comedy and humor around lucidity. I love that he shares that story. Okay, outrageous elements that occur. Yes, any of these are called strong dream signs. All there's so many different names for these strong dream signs. are like, you know, I'm sitting here and an elephant walks into my study. Whoa, that's a pretty strong dream sign right? A weaker dream sign a bird hits the window. It's still unusual, but not as strong as the elephant coming in. I can still sensitize myself to that. So what you want to do here is just like what we did is kind of serendipitous event a few seconds ago. Anytime anything just a little bit unusual or weird happens which happens all the time. You sensitize yourself to those discontinuities, whatever, and you conduct a state check for me like I just did I usually just jump up. Why do you do that? Well, one of the characteristics of our dreams is weird crap happens all the time. That's what defines a dream. If you just take it at face value. Welcome to the world of non lucidity. If you start questioning appearance, questioning the authority of appearance, then all of a sudden, like whoa, wait a second. I've got tons of opportunities to work with the city. And if you start to train yourself in this, this is a big deal for lucidity. Okay, can I focus my intention to be on the lookout for any outrageous ailment, even if non recurring Yes, exactly what I just said. Yep. There you go, my friend. That will really help one more, at least on this list. I'll try to summarize this a little bit longer.
I've had some success with lucid dreaming previously. I'm currently in the second month of rededicating myself to practice very cool. Hope being to practice to progress practicing Dream Yoga, even more cool. In this time, I've been keeping a dream journal and have gone from a few fragmentary recollections to three to six complex and interesting dreams each night. Whoa, that's awesome. Good for you. Perfect. In some of these are recognized dream signs and other thing, like the previous question like a lessening of gravity or other anomalous phenomenon realized I'm dreaming perfect. But I have no dream superpowers. Okay, we can work on that. In my previous experiences with lucid dreaming, I've gone directly from the realization that I'm in a dream to for example, the ability to fly my favorite. Yeah, that's kind of cool. I do that too. I like to fly. However, my current experience is that I realized that I'm dreaming, but be unable to do anything with that realization and remain non lucidly and the reified dream reality. Well, that's, that's an oxymoron. So if you realize that you're dreaming, you're not going to remain non lucid. So I think you're using the term lucidity of two different senses here, right? The sense of driving here is you still think that what you're lucid to the dream, am I reading this properly, but you're still reifying the contents of the dream that's the way I read this. That's where Dream Yoga comes down. Because Dream Yoga, stage two through nine is all about this. It's all about working with the reification with emptiness, the whole the whole Dream Yoga path is about just this. And so then you give some examples, I don't need to read those. But this is exactly the whole point. You know it basically dreams are truth tellers, right? So you're in the dream, you're lucid, but you're not lucid in the sense second sense that you're talking about it because you can't seem to have superpowers to do anything to dream. Why is that? Because your habits, your habits are being revealed your karma is being revealed. That's why this is a slightly more advanced practice. Some people don't want to be so revealed. And so basically what it's exposing is your habits for reification your habits for taking these dreams, it promises to be real. And so that's actually if you relate to it properly, that's that can be seen as a metric of success. It's like Whoa, it's pointing out to you where you're stuck. It's like, well, I am still really reifying my reality. And this is why Dream Yoga is a path. You're not going to just wake up one day and have these superpowers. And accomplish everything you want in a dream. It just doesn't seem to work that way. You have to slowly chip away at the process of beautification. And the processes these powers then evolve from that. Then you say something here, you get these two examples, which I don't really need to share eyes. Alright, these examples, I can provide psychological explanations for each. That's fine. That's great, but that's not Dream Yoga. not dissing that at all. But that's not Dream Yoga. That's dream interpretation. Fine, great. Do it, but it's not Dream Yoga. Dream Yoga is not interested in interpreting content. Just like meditation. Meditation is interested in mental content. It's interested in changing your relationship to that mental content. Same with a dream. Dream Yoga, Dream Yoga is not interested in dream interpretation as valid is that isn't its own classification. It transcends that. Okay, as I write these examples, I can provide psychological explanations for each basically having the message to be here now that's a good message if you got it. Yes, not a bad message anytime. However, I wonder if you have any suggestions for moving beyond what seems like a plateau? Yes, it's called the path.
Moving beyond this just takes time, patience. What Jay talked about is manual labor, because we are really reified beings. I mean, if you see me separate from you, you're reified, you're sleeping. If you see the world as separate from you, that's another bad habit. We these bad bad habits of reification will not be exhausted until you attain Buddhahood. So what you're talking about here is just basically the process of the path and the dream. What is the moniker of Dream Yoga, a measure of the path, your dreams will show you where you are, because the parental function the the kind of mediating editing function of the prefrontal cortex, no longer censoring. And so your stuff in this is why some people like oh my god, I didn't realize Oh, geez, my dreams are still showing me this. Yeah, they will. Right. So this is really if you relate to this in a in a healthy way. This is really good stuff. Because it will show you where you're stuck in Dream Yoga, your failures, our successes, because they show you where you're stuck, see. So the way to get past this is you just keep going study everything in this tradition, emptiness, emptiness, study more about reality, emptiness, work with it, engage meditation more deeply. And honestly, I'm saying being somewhat glib here, but any suggestions for moving beyond this? Yeah, it's called the spiritual path. You just keep going. And then you'll start to see the signs of progress in your dreams, you'll start to notice these it's not always linear. It can be nonlinear. So don't expect to see an absolute direct correlation. But you will slowly as you look back you will start to see your abilities. To wake up more readily take control developed these so called super powers, and then attain awakening and the ultimate set. So let me just see, I think there was one more here bear with me for just a second. Yeah, so here's another one and then I'll open it up. As I scroll through some of this other stuff. I just joined and would like to begin your meditation program as a beginner so I guess that means you join my club, which is great, wonderful. I would like to begin your program management program. As a beginner. We're all beginners. It's just a matter of degree. I have some experience with meditation. Very cool. I can sit still. That's a great start. We like to start at the beginning of my program. Okay, I did your free beginning. session and would like to go on from there. Or would you suggest I go through and pick the topics I find most interesting. Thanks for any help. I'm mostly asking you how do I access the archives? Oh, well, if you're a member of nightclub, you just go into the into the Monday meditation session. We've got at this point, I don't know how many it's 60 of these maybe I don't really know a ton. And so if you're going to go through that particular venue medium, then I would recommend you started at the beginning because I somewhat systematically presented articulate levels of unfolding of the path. And then at a certain point, you may want to get a meditation instructor someone you can work with. Unfortunately, I don't have the time to do that. But I do believe that my dear friends Jeffrey, who's very gifted who also helps out on Mondays and Joel they might have the capacity so you can reach out to them through me. If you want to work with an EMI meditation instructor we can help that as well. But I applaud you meditation is like a revisionist says is the greatest gift you can give yourself in this life. For a number of reasons. One is you're always working with your mind whether you know it or not. Everything is about working with mind, mind, heart, everything. And so when you engage in meditation, you're just working with a mind directly. So I'm not sure what other tracks you may want me to run with this one, but basically, logistically, go back to the beginning of the meditation Monday night sessions. That we started well over a year ago, started at the beginning where I was running most of those at that point. And I'm pretty sure I went somewhat rigorously, systematically through the basic stages of fundamental mindfulness or shamatha. That's the infrastructure right. And then from there with Joe's help and Jeffrey's help and Janet's help in this, I'm having this European coming in on May 30. She's gonna start doing some stuff this summer with us. Then we started talking about all these other different types of meditations as well. So hope that's helpful. Let me see if there's anything else here. I think I got these in less than Okay, so if there are any live questions or my favorite questions or dead questions, if anybody can send a dead question through the internet, that'd be great.
But anyway, in the meantime, what do we have here, Judith? Hi, Judith. How are you?
Hi, I'm doing I'm good. Thank you. I hope I can put this question in the right way. So I in meditation that I don't think I've ever been able to really slip into that place. Luminous emptiness. I've been doing it for a very long time. But what I've done in the last year is I've had two heroic doses of psilocybin Oh, wow. And, in fact, I talk a lot. And it's, it's been really, really instructive. And I'm wondering if it feels like it could be like luminal luminous dreaming because you, you lose your sense of yourself. But it feels at the same time, more intimate than I could ever imagine.
I mean, but what do you mean by that?
It's really hard to explain and I'm sure there are other people that could explain it. But you Yes, you've lost your ego, but you know, what you're doing, you know,
that's not mutually exclusive. Yeah. Okay.
Yeah. And so you know, you have you have these various experiences that are very, you know, they're very patterned. They're very dramatic there. And I'm wondering, I'm taking one more and that's probably it. But I want to I want to try and use what I've learned in my meditation to get somewhere or to get or to feel that yeah, I'm making some kind of progress. Okay. Well,
let's there's a lot there. Dude. You started something you said something at the beginning of this very interesting about wanting to slip into luminosity and emptiness. What what does that mean to you?
Well, I'd like to, you know, you've talked about that before Andrew about slipping through, like, you know, and space and being able to be in to be honest, I think a lot of it has to do with fear what you were talking about before, you know, there's this fear or there's this drawback that I've experienced sometimes. And then you can't do that with with a heroic dose, you're there, you're gone, you're doing it. Whereas with meditation, you can pull back. And so you're not you know, I'm trying to say,
by really, but let me tell you what I see as a potential thing you may want to consider, okay, is that
it is helpful. There's so many there's a number of ways to address what I'm gleaning from what you're asking one is that if your intention is to actualize luminosity and emptiness, then it really would be helpful to understand what that means. Because otherwise it's somewhat haphazard and directionless. And so therefore, understanding what that experience altogether it's like when I when I, when I did, let me give you an example of judo when I did my long retreat. We were introduced to a number like dozens and dozens of practices and we had llamas in November, cheese and trainers come in and we had weeks of intensive training before we started these practices, which was fantastic. And I took it upon myself every single time with every single practice, to press the teachers because I knew I'm going to be spending months doing this thing. I wanted to know exactly what I was doing, why and what it meant to accomplish the practice right view. So right view is key here. So let's say in this case, I want to actualize luminosity emptiness. What's that mean? What does it mean? Because if one doesn't really understand, okay, like this is kind of what I'm trying to actualize. We're never gonna get there is going to be somewhat haphazard, scattershot in lucky you know, like you might just get a little bit of luck. Another thing here, let me just say something a little bit about the whole psilocybin thing in the psychedelic thing. If you listen to the Chris patient interviews, you know, almost five hours with him now if you haven't read his book on my recommended these LSD in the mind to the universe, these agents have a place but they're there one has to be very cautious with this place in my estimation, because they kind of pointing out transmissions or in this case pointing in transmissions their neurological correlates to phenomenological states they will help you using this kind of chemical mysticism. I'm not dissing it. I'm just trying to put it in his place. That they have a place and again, full disclaimer. So it doesn't ruin my political career.
And I'm not endorsing this stuff as illegal. I'm not endorsing everybody should run out and start taking these agents. I am not saying that. What I am saying is they have a place they can be used to point out particular states but then and even Chris says this. What do you do with those states experiences by design by definition, always have a beginning and an end, and therefore they can become somewhat problematic. The blessing is they point out certain states beautiful. But then then what do you do with that? Where's the path quality there? So you can use those states but I just do it if I would just be a little bit cautious not to rely too much on that crutch, because eventually that crutch is going to buckle underneath you and then what are you going to do, right? So, you know, explore it, work with it in that capacity, but in an integral way, realize the strengths and limitations of that kind of approach. To me, it has a place but it's a slippery place. The other thing that I would say to you and this this, this denotes is very interesting on one level, and I talked a little bit about this with Delson yesterday when he was talking about all these amazing powers, which are great. I mean, I was really inspired by what this guy was saying. So then we got into this riff I introduced the issue that you know Delson, you're sharing these amazing things. On one level, I'm inspired. On one level listeners can be intimidated, because you're talking about they're literally called attainments. And so the reason I mentioned this year is you know, there's two ways this is a slight different track of answer. There's two ways to look at this whole thing. One is in fact that you're trying the path of effort, you're trying to attain certain qualities in this case, in his case, like the jhanas in these sorts of things. And on one level, you're trying to attain luminosity, emptiness, you're trying to attain these particular dimensions of mine completely viable. Absolutely. Totally cool. But not, not absolutely. There's still relative approaches. So the other approach is more fruition or is the not the path of attainment or acquisition, the path of subtraction or discovery and I think this is the more important path, that luminosity and emptiness is the quality of who you are. That fundamentally, this is why it's really helpful to centrifuge these things out. Because if you're actually trying to achieve these types of states, the trying itself will prevent you from actualizing them. Right? And then okay, then you say, well, then what do you do? Well, that's where a real sense of understanding of the right path and right meditations is critically important because on one level, it's like the Nike approach. I mean, a lot of teachers came in way back 3040 years ago that they had to just do it and some new age. People I won't name names still do it. They just run around saying just do it. Just do it. Yes, in theory, beautiful, great. But what does that really mean? How do you do something that is so so incredibly subtle, so I'll pause for a second and get some more guidance from you. Where do you want to where do you want to take this but when you're talking about luminosity and emptiness, this is something you can't do. These are absolute levels. If you're talking about specifically that you're talking about that. That is something that cannot be actualized through effort. There's no path to this. In fact, trying to get to it keeps you from it, right. So when you start talking about luminosity and emptiness, non duality, that's a slightly different approach to meditation, more graduate schools to fruition approach but you really, you really just have to be, I think, very clear about what those things really are, what it means to actualize them that do different types of path. Because at these deepest levels, is Trump in which I said striving is the only is the only obstacle. So I'll pause for a second just make sure I'm getting your sweet spot on
this. Thanks. I'm doing fat. When I was saying that. I I realized I realized that as I was saying as realized that this is something Yeah. So I think probably the biggest the biggest aspect for me that's been helpful is firstly, overcoming my fear of it, because I think overcoming fear for me is an important thing.
And what do you feel about it?
Can you articulate here about taking psilocybin? Oh, that yeah,
so you know, you're back to psilocybin. Okay,
yeah. Yeah, I was terrified the first time. Which I think in itself was helpful. To realize that I could do it, that I can actually let go to that extent. And do it. I was, I was glad. And I think that what I do find myself doing is remembering it. And for some reason, it helps. It helps because I know I may be wrong, that I feel there's a similarity between that state that I was in
Yes, yeah, sure. Yeah. So if you're using it in that capacity, is it kind of again pointing out transmission, or in this case pointing in? And then you can kind of use that as an aspiration to remember that kind of state? That's okay. But I would be, even though I've opened my mind these sorts of things. I'm still a little bit more on the conservative approach with these. And I might just recommend, don't put too much into that. You know, fundamentally, this is an organic, organic process. And you've already had these kinds of pointing out transmissions now for me, like, why do you want to go back in that particular way? That's just me. I'm not being judgmental. I'm just saying why do you want to do that? Why not work to understand refine your understanding of what you're really after? These ages are basically bringing about a particular state of mind. Using chemical means that you can attain completely organically. And so why not be green? Why go to the natural produce section in your grocery store? Don't don't go to the artificial food coloring department.
That's a very good suggestion. This is an element of impatience,
your fruits and vegetables don't go to the gods don't go to the candy counter.
Yeah. I didn't listen to Chris that interview. It was amazing.
The second one I think should be up or No, actually, it's not up yet, but we recorded it last week. No
thank you.
Okay, let me see if there's something in the chat calm in the meantime. Well, here's one from psilocybin is organic. Yes, yes, I know what you're saying but still I just let it go. Are you familiar with the surroundings of MEMA? Yes, I am is gorgeous. Is it possible to stay outside the premises? Now? That's a really good question. Am I right? Ask Michael. Right Tim? I don't know.
First of all, I'm not sure they would allow it. They might I have no idea. I'm cool with it. I'm okay with that. I'm not sure they are. So you'd have to ask them and they're really great about that. So just ping ping the front desk at Menlo and just say, hey, what's there? Is it possible? I'm not even sure it's possible but it's they do have stuff around there. I know. I can't speak with authority or you can't stay outside. You know that Barry. Okay, talk to Barry Barry knows everything. Yes, you can't stay outside but I don't know whether you can say outside and still attend the program. I just don't know that. was speaking your real time and Barry my Siddha is popping up all the answers. Anyway, I'm sorry, George fire away bud. Are you doing? I'm good man. How
are you? Thanks. Thanks, fine. Actually, I was pondering about my daytime informal practice of revisiting an old idea I want to just to to check in with you about that because I've been rereading your book Dream Yoga, and also 10s manuals book. Now a few reading a couple times both of the books and especially the chapters on experience and how experience arises. Then dynamics began mechanics of experience arising both in daytime and nighttime were especially super, super interesting to read that again. And yeah, to get deep into that. So basically what I mean by that the flux of the movement of unnoticed emotional energies, mental mental pictures and so on, which happened during daytime but also during nighttime, especially clear during nighttime during dream if you're lucid. So those are those happen also during the daytime and if we if we don't notice these energetic flows, these these changes is their mental activities. It's very easy to fusion with those and be not lucid right and lose oneself in the experience self. And so I was wondering if that is so it could be a form of all the awareness to be lucid to that to those energetic changes during the day in order to also carry that into the night is like like a form of all day. awareness but on those say very subtle, subtle Undertow energies, which basically, normally would distort your experience during the daytime. Wanted to float that past you. I mean, you touched that ground to a great extent also in your books, but is that something that you're doing? Is that something that you would recommend?
Oh, absolutely. Yes. If there's one fundamental curative agent to any pathology, cycle, spiritual, whatever, it's awareness, I mean, it really is a one size fits all thing, awareness, wareness curious everything. And so in that regard, for sure, whatever you can do to bring unconscious processes, subliminal consciousness, subconscious processes, and to the light of awareness, that's colossal. In fact, Jung knew this. The psychologists know this, that and in many ways is one way to talk about the Enlightened journey. Where you're unburdening yourself from all these energetics, again, depending on which language you use, that always run you know, they run below the radar and they run the entirety of our lives. And so when we open up become more porous, permeable to ourself these things gradually percolate up to awareness. We become more aware of them, and then they're in so doing we can establish a more sophisticated relationship to them relate to them instead of from them from them is no relationship at all that's samsara and then allow them to fundamentally purify itself liberate and so these are this is one way to talk about the whole journey. I'm one kind of on one way, one way is that all these undigested unmetabolized all this stuff that that actually creates certain dimensions of the unconscious mind. That stuff has to come up and it does come up and so making it allowing you to come up more and more, allows you to fundamentally be free of it. And then therefore exactly like you said, that also has applications to how you relate to those same contents when they arise when you're dreaming, right. So I'll pause for a second and see if that's kind of what you're asking. But that's that's what comes to mind.
Yeah, yeah, basically. Yeah, I mean, it's it's, it's so subtle, though, right? I mean, like, happens all the time. And it goes by and it goes by unnoticed and so basically, the reason why I'm asking this because I had this at the start of the idea to make that my main daytime informer practice, basically, right.
Let me drop your idea. When you say that. What do you mean that when you say,
yeah, exactly. I mean, I mean, anytime I notice, or train myself to be lucid to that emotional Undertow, basically like flux of energy basically, let me give you an example for example, always best right? So during daytime today, you know, today I was working right. So working on some projects in my in the company I work with, so there was certain subjects I had to work on and so on. And I didn't notice for a long time that I had and then like I had an aversion to a certain that's a part of the work right. And at certain point, I noticed that and I became lucid to that. So So basically, what I'm trying to say is basically I mean, that's happening all the time, on a very, very, very high frequency and very, most of time not running by unnoticed and so basically would this not be actually the the, how would you call that the go to technique? I mean, if one could do it, I can't do it. The go to technique basically, to go to the core of being non lucid basically to to do this. I mean, that's the mechanics of becoming a lucid if that's true, I understood that well. I mean, that if you break the dynamics, in the moment where you fusion, where you enter the aversion or the attraction to to an impulse, at that point, you lose your lucidity right, I mean, or you have the chance to become lucid, but it seems so subtle and hard to do, but it's actually at the core of the question, isn't it?
Oh, high five, bro. That's well said. And that's spot on. I agree with you. 1,000%. Yeah, it's only subtle because we're so loud. It that's why we it's subtle, because the ego of mine is just so loud. But subtle does not mean ineffectual. Subtle dictates everything. These are these are these were they call them these these routers, there's a particular name. It's escaping me I actually write about it, but I'm forgetting it. trim tabs. It trim tab you know what a trim tab is you know, either in a plane or liners like the rudder within the rotor. It's just the tiniest little bloody thing that can direct as monstrous 1000 foot long ocean liner. That's this. So subtle does not mean ineffectual. Subtle, runs groats, backstage runs on stage and so what you're doing here is absolutely spot on. And until we do that, we are fundamentally automatons. We're running on automatic ignorance. Based on I talked about this with depth on a lot yesterday, largely based on speed of mind, powers of habit, where we literally, you know, we confuse we fuse all this crap together, largely out of fear. And it's only when we slow down and shut up, right shamatha passionate start to meditate, that we start to see all the stuff that is fundamentally running our lives. And so what you're talking about here is I agree with you 1,000% It's spot on. And then you will notice just to reinstate one proficiency and that develops not only does it bring about lucidity at life, this this brings about lucid living, then the natural consequence of that is what lucid dreaming. So again, in short, 100% Spot on that's it and so whatever you can do to facilitate that, you know, just continue to do it and you will find it's both inspiring, I would say disconcerting, but revelatory. How how subtle and insidious these dimensions can be. Because it's layer it's like onion layer, layer upon layer upon layer. You start it's like a sedimentation processes were taking place for depending on how you believe in these things for billions of years. That is all part of the opening and releasing process that constitutes the journey and that's what it is is letting all this stuff come to the surface, accessing it, releasing it, opening it. And then eventually you start to notice profound changes in your life, you're already noticing that you're no longer so non lucid to the contents of your unconscious mind. You're actually starting to gain more control over your life, you're starting to gain a more refined relationship to this display. And whoa, that's no small thing. That's you so good for you. Awesome.
Thanks, Andrew. Yeah, yeah, good.
Appreciate it. Hey, Maura.
How's my favorite lawyer?
The only one to be the favorite. I'm reading the trackless path, a commentary on the great completion, a commentary that is a translation from Ken MacLeod of Jigme Lingpa. And he seems to be that a lot of the questions today is a very simple point. That he translated with the commentaries in his I find it beautiful. It's almost like each one of the verses can be a contemplation, but it goes a lot into how we get trapped with all the effort that we do. It's not like is that be that it's sodden? Or is it the path? And he's kind of both in a way, but I just recommend it to people that may may feel that pull from is it so they're not southern? Should I work hard or should I practice should I not practice? But it's a beautiful translation on the great completion of this point from this stage. And it gets a lot into the traps that we get into with the effort to and then I have to laugh. I have to laugh because we one of the big traps is our intellect an arrogance of understanding six or this and seven or that and maybe older consciousness and what is first what wave it in. We get lost in the explanation instead of sitting back and the clarity itself doesn't have a color but is the manifestation of reality. Well, the manifestations that happen, but I just recommend that I just wanted as an offering if it calls to somebody else, because it's been like a very sweet, subtle poem. And I was wondering if you had read it because maybe I'm just
I have not read that I mean, I'm a fan of Ken MacLeod he does cool stuff and signaling very killing these giants. Maybe you can type into the into the chat call on the actual
title to that trackless path
Yes, trackless path is I would do that. Yeah, there's so much it. We're really living in a rich. What aspect of the Information Age is really tremendous resources, with people like Ken and others bringing up these massive treasure checks for popular popular made public consumption and so great, and you'll find, you know, resonances, obviously, that certainly at a certain point, you'll start to realize the deeper levels of a lot of these topics start to bootstrap each other. And that's why when you read that, you go, Oh, that's, that's what Jimmy linkway says. That's really cool. And a certain point, you start to see how it all kind of starts to sing in a chorus of sanity. So thank you for sharing that. Yeah, I
will do that. Yes. Thank you.
Nice to see you there. Okay, anything else before? See when we look through here? I think the poem is a long commentary, right? There's a question here. Make sure you read the poem. It's probably a poem that runs for some pages with a couple 100 pages of commentary. I guess. Okay.
Surely put her hand up. She messaged me in the chat. She had an unrelated question. Oh, it's
okay. You can still ask. unrelated questions are welcome. All right away. I surely.
Ah, Andrew. Thank you. Thank you. This is this is the unrelated question. Hi, um, I'm in Long Beach, California just till the 31st and I found this little stray in my mom's garden. Obviously abandoned no chip, no owner he's about to, he's going to the vet again today and he's going to the to get all juiced up with a flea bath and everything and, and sorry, guys, but he's getting the snip next week. Yes, sorry. Anybody in Southern California, I can deliver him to you. He's probably the reincarnation of Padma sun. Bhava will help. If you dream of cats tonight. Here's your dream sign right here. He'll help with your dream yoga. Love bug.
Oh, that's really awesome. That's beautiful. Yeah, I don't live in the hood. So it doesn't apply. But I mean, what a sweet little gesture, right? Yeah.
I don't either. Otherwise I would take him home. But the UK does a pretty horrible quarantine policy
or sweetie tamales. Yeah. I animals are better than people in my opinion.
Yeah. So if anybody and and you decide or you your dream of him tonight, Dream sign. Get in touch with with me on night club. Surely cookbooks or Elissa or anybody and I will bring him to anybody in Southern California. I will pay all his health bills.
Oh, awesome. That's real Borisov activity. Thank you. That's totally appropriate completing the thank you for offering. That's just adorable. Thank you. Bye, Kitty. And you know Rosie, it could really really could be Padma Sun bhava you could have a little Bodhisattva in your house. But anyway, I know I understand. Yeah, it's painful sometimes. Right? I mean, the whole animal thing. I mean, don't get me started on that the what's happening? It's just like, yeah, so anyway, good for you good karma for you. They cover for the pets just beautiful. And maybe somebody will actually be able to help. So anything else? Before we Yeah, let's see anything else here. Anything else before we pa Oh, that's really cute. Padma Sun bhava pa W DMA. That's very nice. I like that. Judith reflections on Silver Lake There we go. See I took my glasses off. You see what I have to do when I go to my other glasses. Okay, anything else before we close out for today?
Oh, wait one second being flagged down.
Let's get candy and then maybe we can close after that far. Away candy.
Hi, hey, I wasn't expecting to do this. But. So about a month ago, I had a dream that I met a really scary creature. And something happened where I was able to go wow, I can face this down. And so I did I just kind of I got really present in the moment. I've never had a lucid dream. So this was like the closest thing I don't know if it's considered one, but this creature kind of dissolved and became ineffectual. And so So I guess I wanted to share that out if I'm anywhere near in the territory. I have a lot of content dreams and then remember them. But um, and then ask about Galantamine because I haven't had another one of those. And when I heard you talk about Galantamine, I'm thinking how much would I take?
Yeah. So when you say when you say face it down, so it sounds like there was some level of decision and lucidity in your capacity to even do that. Right. So in other words, there are some creat some an insanely frightening entity that appeared in your dream and there were some decision making process that said instead of running from this, I'm going to face it down, right? Yes. Yeah. So that's the degree of lucidity. So this is the other thing that's important is lucidity is it's not a one size, fits all phenomena lucidity is codeword for awareness. And so you can have a brief moment of lucidity, you can have really extended so called hyper lucid dreams. But if you actually able in the dream, to make the decision, I'm not going to run from this. I'm going to face it. There's a moment of lucidity there. And so perhaps, you know, maybe it didn't stay into a full blown lucid dream, but that give yourself some credit for actually doing that. And secondly, what's also interesting is just the fact that you even elected to do that too, because the usual that's why I think there was more lucidity going on than you think. Because the usual default with that is what to just run from it. And then what happens it just keeps chasing you right? Because briefly psychologically, the so called a creature monster, whatever. I mean, what is it it's not it's just a rejected aspect of your being there's there's part of you that hasn't been healed hold the residue taking a particular imagistic form coming back for integration and wholeness. And so, if you keep running from it, which is what most people do in those cases, guess what keeps chasing you, right. So if you face it turned around and then incorporated dissipated or whatever, then you may notice that that particular manifestation will will be processed, metabolized and so to speak excreted in your head that you'll feel a bit lighter and for your so good for you on that there's probably more going on there than you think and really for old iron out psychopaths, those who explore their mind. This is the kind of warrior relationship we need to have that become open minded, big minded. And courageous enough to the strength of your own kind of meditative power and goodness, actually, to face whatever comes up. And then at that point, then you know, these demons that become your friends, these are really profound opportunities for integration and healing and so for, for like, really deep divers tantric practices that were like, This is the kind of stuff they crave for this. This provides really powerful opportunities for growth and transformation. So that's another thing just to keep in mind for right view, that this is different from some pacification traditions. This meaning of the approach I like to riff on where you want to develop a right and think, perhaps, conducive to develop a more fearless relationship to the contents of your experience, no matter how it arises, and a dream or otherwise, and then incorporate it, love it, embrace it, and then that's how you dissipate the otherwise demonic energy. It's just it's just a refused part of your experience thrown into the refuse heap of your unconscious mind. That's coming to you calling back for integration, right? So in terms of that, in terms of galantamine, I pretty sure can if you're a nightclub person, there is at least one entire session I gave to Galantamine, but I'll tell you a little bit about now. You can order it. It's, I don't need to go into all that kind of science behind it unless you want me to. But the best way to do it, the best way I recommend is usually comes in four milligram capsules or tabs. I recommend you start with four milligrams like I mentioned earlier, first question or second question of the session today. Take it wake up six hours after you go to sleep take it then stay up for about 20 minutes to half an hour. That conjoined it with awake and back to bed method and then simply just go back to sleep. And then just see what happens for some people. Nothing but a lot of people me included. Your dreams just become more clear. It doesn't make them lucid. It just makes them more clear lucid in that capacity. Your dreams just get more heightened. And so that gives you a greater capacity for many people to actually recognize the dream as a dream. And so with that said, if there's anything else you want to ask about it, it's pretty straightforward in that regard. All the details and whatnot are beyond the scope of what I can riff on now. But if you're in a Club member, I'm pretty sure I talked about this in quite some detail.
There is another question that this brings up because I you know, I noticed that it is it's also something people take for Alzheimer's.
Yes, exactly. And prescription strike for correct prescription
strength because it runs in my family I'm afraid. And I've heard as I'm listening to some of your teachings and stuff I often think of, well, is this ego lessness what's the difference between that and what happens when somebody forgets you know about like, just what happens when somebody loses memory.
You have to say more, I'm not quite sure where you're going
as in terms of Alzheimer's and the aging brain and you know, losing words and such. You know, I'm just trying to
so what are you asking? What is the relationship of that to egolessness? Is that what you're asking?
Yes.
Well, yeah, that's that's a that's a pathological type of egolessness. So this is a this is where things like pre trans fallacy come into play. Because we're the type of eagles we have to centrifuge these things out. Because if we're talking about egolessness in a spiritual sense, that's a transcend but include phenomena. Alzheimer's is more an exclusion phenomena. So it's not spiritual in that regard. You become egoless selfless not in a developmentally progressive way, but in a developmentally arrested way. So there are qualities yes, there's, you know, kind of less selfhood because there's less referentiality and hence less memory. But that's not that can be pathological. real growth, what did Jack Engler say? You know, you have to be someone before you can be no one. You have to have a healthy ego before you can transcend it. And so, this is a pre trans fallacy where it's not the same thing. Some of the same qualities can seem to be there. It's like the same qualities you see in a child. They can appear very kind of elevated and awakened until what you take the toy away from them, right. Where's their compassion? Where's, where's their wisdom, right? That's pre personal, if not transpersonal. So when you're talking about selflessness in the way you're talking about egolessness that's that's a pre egoic function that a transit guard function, okay. And that's important because they're not the same. They're definitely not the same.
Oh, all kinds of, you know, unless I'm going to ask you to leave this open for a little bit so people can scan through some of the links and stuff. There's all kinds of really cool things being posted here. But for now, yeah, I'm going to check out nice to see everybody dedicate whatever value we have down here, send it out. This is not just for ourselves, send it to all sentient beings who are suffering everywhere, animals, humans and the like, and others. We don't want to keep all our little goodies to ourself. But until next time, sleep and dream healthy. And those of you who know we do I'll see you what other venues and formats and two weeks I think I'm back. I think I'm not sure I might be an aspen that weekend. Anyway, you'll see me around somewhere you know where you know where I am. You can track me down in the hood. I'll be there right So hi, bye to all my friends and enemies. So nice to see everybody. Really, this is so fun. I really do enjoy it. Everybody till next time. Recording. Stopped
