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S3E46RAOK-LincolnsLostSpeech-BillKemp100124

Natalia Sobery35min

Bill Kemp

00:01

What is the speech? Why does it become known as lost? Well, a story goes that the so called fervid brilliancy of Lincoln's words right, led the reporters that were there and others that were taking notes or doing a transcription to just drop their pens and live in the moment. Live in the moment of inspiration, and let Lincoln's words just melt over you. Well, as Michael Burlingame says, a well known Lincoln historian that really doesn't pass the smell test, right, one of

Steve Fast

00:36

the most examined figures in American history, if not world history, is Abraham Lincoln. So how can a pivotal point in Lincoln's career become overlooked and one of his speeches become lost? This is random acts of knowledge presented by Heartland Community College. I'm your host, Steve fast. Today we're talking with a historian who will talk about Lincoln's lost speech given in Bloomington, Illinois in 1856 it's a moment that was a pivotal one for the nation and the formation of the Republican Party in opposition to slavery.

Bill Kemp

01:15

I'm Bill Kemp. I'm the librarian and the nonprofit McLean County Museum of History. I've been at the museum for 21 years now. I used to teach part time at Heartland in the social studies history field, a class a semester or so, but I haven't done that in a decade or so, but I have turned my attention now to adult learning, and I find that very stimulating. There's always great conversation and questions and dialog, so I always look forward to that. And I'm especially looking forward to Lincoln's lost speech because it's interesting. On its face. You just hear the term lost speech and you're already drawn in. Abraham Lincoln, of course, speaks for himself, but the story itself, once you open up the book, is the most fascinating thing about it by a long shot. May

Steve Fast

02:11

29 1856, Lincoln gives the speech. For those of us who aren't historians, or even the more fervent students of history, please place this timeline in Lincoln's career, what was going on in the country and with Abraham Lincoln in the spring of 1856

Unknown Speaker

02:28

wonderful question. So to place Lincoln the man in context of the 1850s which is his time of maturation as a political leader, as a moral voice for the nation, as he steers the country, as the country's torn asunder by the issue of slavery the 1850s right? So Lincoln will butt heads, will face off against his political nemesis, Stephen A Douglas, the Democratic senator us, senator from Illinois, the Little Giant, so called because of his stature, Little Giant because he was probably the most formidable, respected and powerful politician nationally in the antebellum period that is pre civil War. But Stephen A Douglas and Abraham Lincoln stood on opposite ends of the issue when it came to slavery and its future and how that would shape the nation.

Bill Kemp

03:29

So in 1854 Stephen A Douglas shepherds through Congress passage of the Kansas Nebraska act, and that threatens them to open slavery into here to for free northern territories. It repealed the Missouri Compromise, and for people like Abraham Lincoln, who at this time were Whigs right, we know Lincoln as a Republican, Lincoln as the first Republican President in American history, but for most of his adult life, his political life, he was a Whig. But just as slavery will tear the nation apart, slavery will tear political parties apart, and Lincoln's beloved Whig Party, the party of pro business and westward expansion and a central bank and internal improvements and promoting education that party right was torn asunder by the weight of slavery.

Unknown Speaker

04:29

So northern Whigs like Abraham Lincoln were looking elsewhere, and passage of the Kansas Nebraska Act and the threat to open slavery into northern territories, where, with the Missouri Compromise of 1820 Lincoln and others thought that issue, that door had been closed, right but now it had been opened again, and here we go. Lincoln believed at this time, in the 1850s that slave power, the slave ocracy of the South, carried two. Much political weight the intentions of the founding fathers. Abraham Lincoln believed were to hem this appalling system of human bondage, slavery where it existed and hoped that it would wither and die on the vine. But yet, here we are in the 1850s slave power is ascendant and looking to expand so passage of the Kansas Nebraska act in 1854 the ripples of that then will lead to the creation of what we know as the Republican Party two years later, and that's where we find ourselves.

Bill Kemp

05:33

In the spring of 1856 slavery ripping the nation apart right, north and south and in the north, political leaders and voters are looking for a new movement to halt this expansion of slavery. So anti slavery. Whigs such as Abraham Lincoln, anti slavery. Northern Democrats such as William Bissell, who will become the first Republican governor in the state of Illinois, abolitionists will be a natural ally of this new political movement, soon to be the Republican Party. No nothings. What are no nothings. They're nativist, nationalist, anti Catholic, anti immigrant. They're known as the American party. They will run a pretty formidable race in 1856 nonetheless, a lot of the adherence of the know nothing or American Party will tend to coalesce along with this new anti slavery expansion party. And why is that?

Bill Kemp

06:33

Because these Nativists, these members of the Know Nothing Party, they believe that slavery represented the threat to free labor, free native labor, right? So they were again and allies. And you also drew in German immigrants who were flooding into the United States after the failed revolution in the German states, democratic revolution of 1848, so you have liberty loving Germans coming to the United States, and they're going to be natural allies of this new political movement, soon to be a party coalescing from the impact of the Kansas Nebraska Act passed in 1854 so throughout the North, northern states, in the spring of 1856 you have organizing what were known initially as anti Nebraska parties, right? And that's what happens on May 29 1856 it's a one day political convention of the anti Nebraska party of Illinois.

Bill Kemp

07:35

They will not take the banner of the Grand Old Party or the Republican party until several months later. So 1854 passage of the Kansas Nebraska act. 1856 formation of these anti slavery expansion parties, right comprised and radicals like abolitionists. There's always kind of this parlor game in local history circles for states or communities to claim to be the birthplace of the Republican Party nationally. That's because, organically, these movements were occurring on a state level throughout the spring of 1856 Illinois will will come a little bit later than, say, Pennsylvania or Wisconsin, two states that claim to be the birthplace, nonetheless, we know Bloomington is the birthplace of the Illinois Republican Party, right? Because that party is born on May 29 1856, with a keynote address that will later be known as Lincoln's lost speech with

Steve Fast

08:38

this site. Why did they come to Bloomington, Illinois. Why was that the place where all of these disparate groups of anti Nebraska act folks? Why Bloomington

Bill Kemp

08:50

delegates were invited from all counties throughout the state, and there were 250 delegates, all told, although some southern Illinois counties did not send delegates because there was precious little support for this new party in the deep in Little Egypt, in Southern Illinois, which has always been more conservative, more aligned with interests in the southern states than, say, the middle or northern tier of the states. Why was Bloomington picked? I don't know the exact answer.

Bill Kemp

09:20

I suspect, because it was centrally located, had railroad access Lincoln himself, I believe, is yes, he's practicing law in Danville. A few days before this political convention, he takes a train to Decatur, and then we'll take the Illinois Central Railroad up from Decatur into Bloomington. So that's probably a reason. And this was a stronghold of this new political movement. People like Judge David Davis on the eighth Judicial Circuit Jesse fell one of the founders of normal Leonard sweat, a fellow attorney with Abraham Lincoln and others, were leaders of this new organization. So for probably. Several reasons Bloomington was, was the site who,

Steve Fast

10:04

other than Lincoln, spoke at this convention. What type of people were speaking, and did they only just talk about the issue of slavery, or did they have other issues that they wanted to coalesce this potential new party around? Sure.

Bill Kemp

10:18

So slavery wasn't the only issue, because they are organizing a new political party, so a platform has to be created. So there are other issues economic interest and whatnot involved, also issues involved in immigration and issues such as that. So, but the primary focus, the reason for being there, of course, is the issue of slavery, and specifically the threat of its expansion. Who else spoke there? But it would have been leaders of this movement at the time, from throughout the state, including Chicago.

Bill Kemp

10:53

I mentioned William BISSELL. He will, he will be the governor, and he will win election in 1856 so this new political party will put up its first candidate for governor, William Bissell, a former Democrat. So this new political party is trying to appeal to all its different factions. Its Secretary of State, I believe, will be Francis Hoffman, a German immigrant. So again, you're appealing to one faction of this new political movement. It's just a one day convention. Most of the business is taken care of in the morning, in the afternoon, and then everybody reconvenes at what 530 in the evening to hear Abraham Lincoln speak. And he will speak for about 90 minutes. We know that he has notes in his hand, but he doesn't have anything like full transcription of what he will say.

Steve Fast

11:41

And this speech is something that well, one of his contemporaries, a person who was his law partner, William Herndon, who sort of became a Lincoln historians, or, you know, contemporary historian of Lincoln, he said that this speech, he saw all of Lincoln's speeches, and this was the greatest speech, or the grandest speech of Lincoln's life,

Bill Kemp

12:02

right? William Herndon, who might have known Lincoln better than anybody, long time law partner. They spent tremendous amount of time, and Herndon really had an insight into into Lincoln psychologically and then and otherwise. And he said it was his one of earth, not the greatest speech he ever had. This was, this was the New Testament Abraham Lincoln, for somebody like William hernand. Prior to that, Hernan said Lincoln was arguing the issue of slavery, primarily from the perspective of, say, a constitutional lawyer litigating the issue. But on this night in downtown Bloomington, may 29 1856, he was speaking to the converted, if you will, for the most part. And he got kind of carried away Lincoln from his boyhood.

Bill Kemp

12:50

We know he opposed the institution of slavery. Always found it repugnant. He believed in the declaration of independence as being the founding document right having the ancient faith, as he called it, in the Founding Fathers, in their belief that all men are created equal. And Lincoln believed truly that that was the mission the United States wasn't quite there. There was much work left to do, but that was the guiding principle. So he certainly got carried away to some extent, right? Because this new political party, soon to be called the Republican Party, they wanted to put kind of this veneer of moderation before the northern voter, right? They didn't want to scare people away. They didn't want to be the party of abolitionism. In fact, Abraham Lincoln, right, made it the point to say, I'm not an abolitionist, right?

Bill Kemp

13:42

He believes slavery was morally repugnant, was opposite to the to the core values right of the United States, but yet it was constitutionally protected, right? So there were ways to restrict it, and you certainly must not let it expand if you hem it in again, wither and die on the vine. Because he believed slavery could not compete with free labor. So he saw it more as a long game. The Civil War would certainly change that equation. So Lincoln was at his finest, right? He was speaking not so much from a he wasn't litigating the issue. He was speaking as a Old Testament preacher. And why is the speech? Why does it become known as lost?

Bill Kemp

14:30

Well, a story goes that, and we William Herndon played into this legend and lore as well, and others that the so called fervid brilliancy. Of Lincoln's words, right? Led the reporters that were there and others that were taking notes or doing a transcription to just drop their pens and live in the moment. Live in the moment of inspiration and let Lincoln's words just melt over you. Well, you. As Michael Burling game says, a well known Lincoln historian that really doesn't pass the smell test, right? Yeah,

Steve Fast

15:08

I It's hard to imagine even the regional reporters becoming so enraptured with the speech that they stopped taking notes. Were there media there that how? What was that, like, what people would cover this sort of event? So,

Bill Kemp

15:23

you know, newspapers were, this was, you know, a period of great newspaper culture in American history. And newspapers were usually known as political organs. They were tied to specific political parties. So we do know there were newspaper reporters there. So probably a better answer for why the speech is lost. So there are other answers, some more, a little more sophisticated in their analysis. One answer would be self censorship, right? As I said, Lincoln got carried away.

Bill Kemp

15:55

This wasn't kind of the voice of moderation they wanted to project to maybe leery voters who weren't quite sure about this anti slavery expansion party, right, maybe anti slavery Democrats that were still comfortable in the Democratic Party and weren't quite ready to make the leap to this new party. So the idea that the reporters that were there anti Nebraska newspapers, soon to be known as Republican newspapers kind of tamp down what Lincoln said. Certainly there was reports of large sections or sections of what Lincoln said, but you really don't get much of the of the force, kind of this Old Testament fervor that you hear from people that were there and certainly right local historians like myself, you always have to be careful not to make too much of events that occur in your community, right?

Bill Kemp

16:45

That's an easy fault, that anything that happens here is the most important thing. But this is certainly one of Lincoln's greatest speeches, and it certainly is reported as such by the people that were there. Ida Tarbell, we know her as kind of a muckraking journalist, but Ida Tarbell was also, in her day, a Lincoln scholar, and she was fascinated with Lincoln speaking style, Lincoln's voice and his speeches. And she when she would interview people, and she was around at the time where there were still plenty of people around that knew Lincoln, and she would always talk to them about speeches that they heard about his voice, things of that nature.

Bill Kemp

17:27

And people would often tell Tarbell and this is tarbells reading or account of it, they would say, Oh, this speech was wonderful. This speech was wonderful. But if you weren't there to hear the Lost speech, you would never have had a sense of really, the magic that Lincoln could bring to the podium. So tarball knew was always interested in this lost speech. So it kind of captivated Lincoln scholars as early as the late 1800s nowadays,

Steve Fast

17:54

if a politician gives a big speech, they have a printed copy that they disseminate amongst the media. So a lot of times, the media will know what's going to be in the speech before the speech is even given. I don't think it was a preemptive thing back in Lincoln's time, but there was no recording happening back then. In the 1850s you had to get close, not a lot of amplified voices. So people would hand out a written out version of it to the media. Apparently, this didn't happen, though, for the lost speech,

Bill Kemp

18:25

correct? Yeah, there are examples of people having copies of Lincoln speeches, or at least versions of that prior to the speech, I believe. So what did Lincoln say that night? Well, that, you know, we kind of, we do have some newspaper accounts to give us glimpses of that miraculous night. For example, the weekly courier of Alton, the week after this anti Nebraska convention, reports that Lincoln was here, ready to fuse with anyone who would unite with him to oppose slave power. And they quote Lincoln as saying, The Union must be preserved in the purity of its principles as well as the integrity of its territorial parts. In other words, Lincoln was arguing that it wasn't just the union to keep the union whole wasn't enough, right? This was an experiment in a republican form of government, of liberty, of democracy, and if you did not have the purity of principles which to strive for, it wasn't a country worth fighting for.

Bill Kemp

19:33

So there you get a little bit of a glimpse of Lincoln. He says, or perhaps he shouts in his kind of particular peculiar tinny voice that he has. We often think Lincoln must have had this deep baritone voice, but he actually had, we believe, from first hand accounts, a very tinny voice that could project very well. And he said, and he was, he was quoting, in a way, the great order. Or Daniel Webster, it must be liberty and Union now and forever, one and inseparable again. Union, yes, but liberty without liberty, there is no union. So there we get a glimpse. For me, the true lost speech is found in the Belleville weekly advocate, another weekly paper down in the Metro East area, on this side of the Mississippi River, across from St Louis.

Bill Kemp

20:30

And during the speech, according to their account, again in the Belleville weekly advocate, Lincoln criticizes members of his own party. He was still a Whig at that time right, and he called them national Whigs, a term for members of his party who, in the name of national unity, refused to fuse with Lincoln because they thought that's too sectional, right? They wanted to remain a National Party. But Lincoln said these conservative Whigs who were fearful of antagonizing the south embraced Union at the cost of what aiding and abetting the expansion of slavery. So this account in the Belleville weekly advocate says quote national Whigs Lincoln is saying, are all the time stepping about to the music of the Union.

Bill Kemp

21:23

Lincoln had no doubt, but that the music of an overseers lash upon a mulatto girl's back would make some of them dance of Virginia horn pipe. Let them step, said, Lincoln, let them dance to the music of the Union while we my old Whig friends, stand fast by principle and freedom and the Union together. So I think here at last, is at least a glimpse of the power of Lincoln on that night, on May 29 1856, right in downtown Bloomington, he's telling to his fellow Whigs conservative wigs that to remain a National Party is a danger, because you're aiding abetting slavery. The music you think you're hearing of the union is actually the lashes upon an enslaved person's back. And Lincoln said, We will listen to the real music of the Union by creating this new political movement. It's interesting

Steve Fast

22:25

to contrast that with the challenge that he would have then to keep the union whole. As president as the Confederacy wanted to break free and keep those practices and that form of their independence. So then Lincoln would be saying, we have to keep the entire union together,

Bill Kemp

22:47

right? He was, he strongly believed, as much as perhaps anybody who ever occupied the White House in both in union and liberty, any hundreds and hundreds of 1000s would die for that cause. Now it's interesting here. The term lost speech really doesn't begin to appear until the late 1800s turn of the last century. And as John G Nicolet says, One of Lincoln's great personal secretaries, says, You call this the Lost speech, but he had given at least 50 other campaign addresses in 1856 as he was stumping for John C Fremont, the Republican presidential candidate who will lose the James Buchanan, and he was stumping for other Republicans as well, 50 or so speeches. There's no transcriptions of those. So those are also lost, right? Well, one of the reasons I think this speech becomes so called the Law speeches, right?

Bill Kemp

23:49

What does Lincoln talk about that night? He talks about enslaved people. He talks about slavery, right? He talks about this evil that is tearing the nation apart, which the nation in the 1850s is embracing wants to see expanded. That's the message maybe later manifestations of the Republican Party really don't want to emphasize, right? So by the 1920s 1930s as the law speech, or as this important event, this establishment of the Republican Party, is being celebrated in anniversaries every spring. The tendency is to really ignore the message right, to just emphasize that the birth of the Republican Party, to emphasize kind of the magical speech making of Lincoln, though we won't mention specifics of what he said that day.

Bill Kemp

24:47

They'll talk about kind of his backwoods background, Prairie lawyer, kind of his humor. They'll talk about many things about Lincoln, the man, his life and career. But they won't. Really talk about in these anniversaries slavery and race and this community will plaque to death. Majors Hall. Majors Hall is the building where this convention is held. It's held on the third floor of a building located at East and front streets in downtown Bloomington. The building is torn down in 1959 for parking. So that's an old story in downtown Bloomington. You

Steve Fast

25:27

don't have any account other than these various contemporaneous accounts of this. And as because of that, the story maybe shifts a little bit over time and the importance of it and what was said.

Bill Kemp

25:40

And like many things with history right, our understanding of the past is often is a reflection more of our current interests or needs or passions or prejudices than it is really about the past, and we're making the same mistakes today. We just really don't know it, hopefully not as bad as the mistakes made in the past, but live and let learn I got so this community as it thought about as it commemorated what is arguably, probably the most important event locally that impacts the nation. Right? This is Lincoln's, in many ways, the birth of Lincoln as the moral voice to oppose the expansion of slavery. Right?

Bill Kemp

26:22

The Republican Party is founded here, right, and that will give him the launching pad to face off against Douglas in 1858 for Senate, and then again against Douglas in 1860 for President. So, this community, how did it commemorate, right? The Mo, this, this important, emotional, historically deep event, right? You know, it sidestepped it, right? We put various plaques on or next to the building over the years, but there was never a plaque that really told the story. And what's the story of Lincoln's lost speech?

Bill Kemp

26:58

The story is that illinoisians gathered from throughout the state, about 250 delegates to what to address the issue of enslavement and Black slavery and the expansion of slavery in this country and its future. That was the story, and that's the story this community really did not want to emphasize until rather recently, and the approach has certainly changed over the last 20 or 30 years. There's a really nice looking for Lincoln wayside or signage now at the site of former majors hall that gives a a much more accurate depiction of the issues that were wrestled over at the time, and

Steve Fast

27:42

that site is, as you mentioned, a parking garage, which itself is need a little repair, just an aside there looking back. So you said that, how long did majors Hall survive as a building? You said maybe into the 50s. Yeah, majors

Bill Kemp

27:58

hall itself is a fascinating story, right? So again, it was located at the corner Front Street and East Street in downtown Bloomington. It was three stories, majors Hall, very typical, 1850s building. First story was for commercial, dry goods store, grocery store, things of that nature. Second floor would be offices or light industry, like textile work or things of that nature. And the third floor was the hall, so about 3000 square feet or so, so you could pack about 1000 people or so really tightly and hold meetings.

Bill Kemp

28:35

People could give speeches. Traveling theater troupes could perform there. Fraternal societies could hold meetings there and whatnot. So on the third floor, that's where Lincoln gives the law speech, the keynote address to the formation of the Illinois Republican Party in 1856 in 1872 the third floor, the floor where the address was given, is lost in a fire. They do save the lower two stories, and it remains occupied. In fact, the first floor is a Kroger grocery for a while, I think, in the Great Depression, and then a little bit later. But the building then is torn down in 1959 there is a kind of a debate, because people realize the historic importance, there's actually a proposal to reconstruct the third floor.

Bill Kemp

29:27

Think about how different downtown Bloomington would be today if we had a rebuilt majors Hall. That would be in a very important stop for Lincoln tourism, certainly, but it was taken down in 1959 for about a dozen or so parking spaces, because the parking deck that's there will not come until later, right? Late 1950s most middle class families in Bloomington, normal at this time have an automobile downtown.

Bill Kemp

29:55

Bloomington is still the shopping district, and people are desperate for more and more. Parking in fact, they're so desperate, they're willing to tear down some of the more historic buildings for just a few parking spaces. If there is any bright spot about this whole thing, the loss of majors hall that kind of awakens the community. It is the loss of majors Hall and the loss of what's known as the Pillsbury Hill mansion on East olive that will be taken down for the current city hall. The loss of those two buildings and the loss of the Bloomington Coliseum will really kind of create a historic preservation ethos in this community, as

Steve Fast

30:37

we look today at what immediately happened after this speech and after this convention. It's almost kind of hard to wrap one's head around in our two party system today, that the idea that such a young party would gain so much momentum in such a short period of time, really, after this 1856 convention, that you would have a offshoot party, a third party, present a candidate who would become governor within a year.

Unknown Speaker

31:10

Again, I think that speaks to the weight of slavery on in this nation's history. And for example, when I taught at Heartland Community College, I always made it the point. I think most professors and instructors should that your political inclination should remain somewhat mysterious for class, right, for your students, right? It's really just gets in the way of things. And I really took pride in never letting and never preaching to students, right? That's just not the classroom is not the place for that, right? But I did say there was one thing that really we couldn't argue much about, and that was that the Civil War, the cause of the Civil War was slavery, right?

Bill Kemp

31:48

Because that's just an uncontested fact, right? And a lot of people don't want to face that because it's unpleasant, because much of history the United States history is unpleasant. But that doesn't mean when you address and examine those issues, that's somehow un American. In fact, nothing could be more American than looking at our past, both good and bad. So certainly, if you look at the primary sources, look at the pages of the weekly pantograph in the 1850s it's all about slavery and race. You look at the party that opposed this anti Nebraska party, Stephen A Douglas Democratic Party, both north and south, virulently racist, right? The language that Douglas used, right was just drenched in language that is unfit for this podcast, thankfully. Right. The N word was tossed about, right? What was one of the main Democratic Party's arguments in 1856 with the formation of this new Republican Party, right? They talk about, and this is, I'm being Douglas, Stephen, a Douglas here the Mr. Lincoln, my opponent, right?

Bill Kemp

32:57

This new political party, they talk about wanting to halt the expansion of slavery. That's one thing, right? But what they're really about is abolition of the institution of slavery, not only that, therefore the equality of the races, not only that, they want black men to marry your daughters, so the threat of black male sexuality right was out in the forefront in the 1850s so Stephen A Douglas was playing the race card, playing it all the time, and newspapers that supported the Democratic Party in Bloomington, such as the flag and the times Were veeringly racist as well. So how could a party in just a matter of months, basically become a party that could compete on a national level as this anti Nebraska slash Republican Party?

Bill Kemp

33:51

Did I think again, going back to slavery and this threat that the anti Nebraska party posed to opening this institution of slavery into heretofore free northern territories was enough to get people motivated. Was enough to create enough voters to coalesce into this new political party strong enough to oppose the Democrats come 1856 and in fact, in Illinois, Republicans will sweep statewide offices in 1856 so in the spring, the parties formed. In the fall, they are triumphant. John C Fremont, the Republican candidate, though, does not carry Illinois, it will be James Buchanan. Now we'll have to wait till 1864 years later for a Republican to carry Illinois. That, of course, will be Abraham Lincoln. Well,

Steve Fast

34:42

Bill, thanks so much for coming in to talk about this really overlooked part of one of the most examined figures in American history, Abraham Lincoln. It's hard to believe there's an overlooked element to his career, but here, I believe we have one that is a little bit that way. And thanks for coming in. People that are interested in learning even more about this. This class is in the continuing education department at Heartland Community College, and is a popular topic. Thanks for coming in.

Bill Kemp

35:10

Thanks for having me and have me back.

Steve Fast

35:19

Bill Kemp is a librarian at McLean County's museum of history in Bloomington, Illinois. He talked to us today about the subject of his continuing education class at Heartland Community College Lincoln's lost speech. If you're interested in other interviews about history or other topics, subscribe to random acts of knowledge on Apple podcasts Spotify, or wherever you found this one. Thanks for listening. You.

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