Get it on Google PlayDownload on the App Store

Aquarium of the Podcific: Rays

Aquarium of the PodcificApr 29, 2024 at 6:46 pm41min
EErin Lundy
00:05
Hi, I'm Erin Lundy.
MMadeline Walden
00:07
And I'm Madeline Walden and this is
Aquarium of the Podcific
00:09
Aquarium of the Podcific.
MMadeline Walden
00:11
A podcast brought to you by Aquarium of the Podcific. Southern California's largest aquarium.
EErin Lundy
00:15
Join us as we learn alongside the experts in animal care, conservation and more.
EErin Lundy
00:21
Welcome back to Aquarium of the Podcific. We made it to season twwwwwo
EErin Lundy
00:28
if you can't tell that is a large crowd of people cheering in the backgorund.
MMadeline Walden
00:33
studio audience today
EErin Lundy
00:34
Yeah, totally live. Totally not just recording this in an empty studio, with just us two. Speaking of I'm Erin Lundy. I'm the conservation coordinator for mammals and birds.
MMadeline Walden
00:43
And I'm Madeline Walden, the aquariums digital content and community manager.
EErin Lundy
00:48
What have we been up to since season one launched a lot of jobs? Yeah. There's been a lot going on other jobs. Yeah, you've been up to a lot, a lot a lot. We've had a lot of different conservation projects that we've been working on. We've had our mountain yellow legged frogs continuing to grow and be awesome here, working on some new habitats and stuff for some of our animals. So we have a lot of exciting things happening this summer. But for now, we just wanted to make sure Season Two gets brought to your ears. I know it's been a minute, and we can hear a little bit more about our animals, which I'm so excited about. I missed those stories. I know. It's so fun. So tricking our co workers into talking about, hey, whenever
EErin Lundy
01:27
I think it works great.
MMadeline Walden
01:28
I think they do it's really fun.
EErin Lundy
01:30
Today we want to talk about one of the animals that is in actually quite a few exhibits at the aquarium. They are rays. And rays are pretty cool animals that are pretty closely related to sharks, which I don't think a lot of people know. They are a cartilaginous fish, which is how I am often described as
MMadeline Walden
01:49
I have heard that
EErin Lundy
01:51
going around. Yeah, there's a rumor about it. This
MMadeline Walden
01:55
is a really cool episode i It's surprising and not surprising that Ray's get a ton of love on social media. We talked a little bit about it in the episode, but they're there with the sea otters and the mammals here at the Aquarium and even offer sharks sometimes.
EErin Lundy
02:12
Even though they're there because it says there's a popular cousin there the flat sharks, sharks, so therefore sharks are still popular because they're just flat sharks. Exactly. Today, we're gonna be talking to Sarah Nevarez, who is one of our aquarists who helps to take care of our race and she's going to tell us all about what it looks like to take care of the flattest sharks of all.
MMadeline Walden
02:32
She's so knowledgeable. I really love this episode. I know I learned a lot. And I know you are too.
EErin Lundy
02:37
Yeah, I think it's a really great episode. And I'm excited for everyone and I'm excited to be back with you. I am excited to be back. It has been so long that this intro we're like are we good?
MMadeline Walden
02:48
Do we need to do this? Do we remember how to talk? But then we put the headphones on and we're like, oh, yeah, talk we can really hear or, or big metal.
EErin Lundy
02:57
This is metal yapping. But anyway, without further ado, let's get into our episode. For today on our podcast, we have Sarah Nevarez, who works with our rays. Hi, Sarah. How are you?
SSarah Nevarez
03:10
Hello, I'm great.
EErin Lundy
03:11
What is your job title here at the Aquarium?
SSarah Nevarez
03:13
I am an aquarist one here at the Aquarium and I've been paid staff for about two years. But I was a volunteer diver before that for four years.
EErin Lundy
03:21
Oh, I didn't think I knew that. Before. So our dive program does have volunteers, which is awesome. And what level of dive certification? Do you need to be a dive volunteer here?
SSarah Nevarez
03:31
You have to be at least rescue certified. So that's, I think the third level of certification and you have to have 50 logged ocean dives. Oh, wow. Which is quite a quite a lot. Lot. Yeah, but we do do a lot here. We were doing feedings we're doing presentation. So you got to be kind of moving the whole time and be a good experienced diver. But it's ultimately what got me my job here. So that's true. All I
EErin Lundy
03:52
heard was hairs like an amazing. So basically, I'm the best diver you've ever seen. So did you start working with or around some of our rays when you were a volunteer diver,
SSarah Nevarez
04:01
the only thing I can remember is sometimes the volunteer divers will go into the RE pool exhibit and clean so I remember this was probably back in 2017 Getting in and a wetsuit and like doing the stingray shuffle as they call it and just walking around and being careful and just scrubbing the walls and the rocks.
EErin Lundy
04:18
So the stingray shuffle is not a term I had ever heard until I moved to California. Oh right. Yeah, and people are now just like everyone knows the stingray shuffle so for listeners who might not be familiar what exactly
SSarah Nevarez
04:28
is the shuffle so it's not a cool dance that you do for no reason and make it a cool dance. Yeah. So beaches in California here super populated with little round rays and it's can be dangerous. So you basically instead of walking normally on the sand, you shuffle your feet so that whatever rays are in the sand will feel those vibrations and take off and be away from you and you don't step on anybody. Human being stung and the
EErin Lundy
04:53
Wrangler, right it's like oh, what has been your favorite part of your job so far?
SSarah Nevarez
04:59
So far, I recently got checked out to be a field divers. So yes, I am part of the team that will go out and collect animals or go do surveys out in the open ocean for our research projects, such as our abalone project that we're doing with a bunch of different partners. So that's been really fun to get out there and feel like a real scientist. on Avalon. Sometimes we do, we'll run what's called transects, which looks like a big measuring tape underwater and you run it a certain direction, certain location, and you're counting things on each side, or you're surveying or doing things like that. Yeah, on our last time, we released a bunch of baby white abalone, which was so cool to see. Yeah,
EErin Lundy
05:41
I think we're going to talk about abalone in a future episode. Yes, our participation looks like so this is your preview.
MMadeline Walden
05:49
Of abalone abalone
EErin Lundy
05:52
abalone teaser? So it sounds like you did get your start sort of in our dive area. But how did you start working specifically with rays? Did you have any specific experience that led you to that?
SSarah Nevarez
06:04
It's kind of funny when I started, I remember my first day I was being shown around by my supervisor. And she was basically telling me what exhibits I was gonna have. Because in my position, I'm in charge of four to five exhibits. And we walked up to a pool and she was like, this is yours. I just took it over. I mean, I've been around. Like I said, before, I've been around the rays and stuff. And I know about their anatomy, I have my degree in marine biology. So I have like, very intro right knowledge. But that's pretty much how I got the gist given to me. And I've had it the whole time I've been here. And I've loved it. It's super cool. I
EErin Lundy
06:37
think one of my favorite things about working in husbandry, and that sort of has been a universal experience for everyone is, you know, a lot of people come up to me, they're like, You must have loved frogs getting into this. And I'm just like, No, someone one day just was like, hey, we need to help you seem like you like plants. And probably animals, like, do you want to help with this? And of course, I didn't, you know, like, I love learning new things. But there was no initial passion for amphibians. And now years later, it's like such an ingrained part of my whole personality. To How did this happen all of a sudden, and you know, like that mountain yellow legged frog project is so much a part of what I do here. But if you had asked me five years ago, oh, how interested are you in frogs? I would have said, not at all. They're They're cute. I like them, but I know nothing about them. And I think that's almost a misconception, because like, how can you possibly come into this field with the level of expertise that you need to learn like to know about ray, you know, it's not a pet animal, it's not an animal you could have kept. But you know, one day you were assigned ray pool, and all of these rays are your responsibility. And then the passion sort of follows, which I think is cool. But it must, what's that learning curve? Like, for you?
SSarah Nevarez
07:42
It's very intimidating. And a lot of things too, you can only learn about these animals when you're working with them this true? Yeah, so we just finished up welfare assessments for our rays every year, we whale them and we measure them and we do a visual inspection. And so the first time I we did that we weighed all of them. Big scale. We use the otter scale the first time it's so weird. You don't realize how heavy they are. Until How
EErin Lundy
08:09
heavy are they?
SSarah Nevarez
08:10
I think our heaviest one is 27 kilograms.
EErin Lundy
08:13
Wow. 60 pounds? Yeah.
SSarah Nevarez
08:17
I think that's steady. Yeah. But yeah, so like, I didn't know how much weight or re weighed.
EErin Lundy
08:25
That's hard to say.
SSarah Nevarez
08:26
I didn't know how much a re weighed. You know, I'm taking it out of the water. Yeah. So Well, yeah. The longer I'm with the tank and with the animals, the more I learn about them. Yeah, that's just that's just how it
EErin Lundy
08:36
is. So much of it is such like niche knowledge to have like, oh, for this ray, the best way to carry this animals that and you're like, how would I have ever come in with that information? Yeah. But I think it's really cool. And I love that people sort of get assignments, and then part of the assignments, essentially learn about the animals and do everything you can to provide the best possible care. And of course, we have guidance, and we have like husbandry care manuals, and things like that, but so much of it is like on the job learning. Yeah, I think that's really cool. Yeah, but since you know so much about rays, we are going to be asking lots of questions, since I'm an expert on rays. Yeah. So who are our current rays? Like, what species do you take care of, of our sting rays. So
SSarah Nevarez
09:14
in Ray touchable, we have the bat rays with the main attraction. We have six of them. They all have names, but we'll get to that in a second. We have three little round rays. And so those are the ones that you're you might find on the beaches here in Southern California around there. That's yes, they're gonna round rays there. I don't know, maybe four or five inches across, and they're the brown colors that you see like brown light brown, they camouflage really well in the sand. And then we have a shovelnose guitarfish and Ray pool as well. It's kind of the one that's like, it doesn't look like a typical Ray.
MMadeline Walden
09:48
It looks like the shovelnose guitarfish you just draw it Yeah, just
SSarah Nevarez
09:53
draw you think that is?
MMadeline Walden
09:55
Probably yeah, you're
EErin Lundy
09:56
so right. Yeah. Is
EErin Lundy
09:57
it considered a ray
SSarah Nevarez
10:00
I think so. Okay. Yeah,
EErin Lundy
10:01
there's some confusing like rays and sharks and the
SSarah Nevarez
10:05
terminology related. Yes, skate is a whole other thing. Stay tuned for the Stay tuned for skate episode another preview. Then, okay, shovelnose guitarfish. Weirdo and then to sturgeon, which are the big fish in there.
EErin Lundy
10:20
We get asked a lot of questions about the sturgeon fish or sturgeons,
SSarah Nevarez
10:29
the big boy or girl, I don't know, actually the big old, the big sturgeon maybe around 10 or 12. Oh, wow, I think that goes off of when we got them and everything. The smaller one, she's a little female, and probably four or five. Okay, but again, that's a very big growth area rough estimate. They grow slow. And and yeah. But the bat rays in a pool have names and all the names are based off what their tail looks like, because there's no other way to name them. To tell them how often we tell them. So we have s whose tail shaped like an S, we have curl who has a little curl at the end of her tail. Tiny is the smallest one clean when we added as opposed to as opposed to everyone else, so ungrateful. They're kind of their big animals, they can be a little rough with each other. So sometimes we'll have little scratches on them. I think when clean was added, she was like one of the newer ones with no scratches. So I seen she was pristine and clean. Yeah, we have stubby, which we mentioned before, and stubby has the shortest tail and then we have kink who has a little kink at the end of her tail. Okay, so you
EErin Lundy
11:39
can't like if you looked at the majority of their body, it would be hard to tell them apart. Yes, but the tail is very tail. If
SSarah Nevarez
11:46
there's no tail, then you need to help because there's no way you're gonna tell them this, but that's fair.
MMadeline Walden
11:52
Yeah. Well, then it would be none. That would be their name. Yes, None. None. None. Tail.
EErin Lundy
11:59
No, we don't have a none. We
MMadeline Walden
12:00
don't have one that no, no.
EErin Lundy
12:02
Do the round race of names. No.
SSarah Nevarez
12:10
No, they just don't. I was thinking of a way that I could maybe kind of tell them for but no, no, because they're all similar size to. And
EErin Lundy
12:18
I mean, they're like exactly sand colored. You're like I could see how someone would step on that. And that's why this thing right
SSarah Nevarez
12:23
shuffle is very important. The Bat rays if you can't see that, then you need help, again,
EErin Lundy
12:30
four feet across. Totally different color than the sand. But I understand when I looked at the round rays
EErin Lundy
12:37
why that's important. Speaking of their tails are their stingers on their tail. So we
SSarah Nevarez
12:43
refer to it as a barb. Okay. I know it's called Stingray. I know it's called sting, right, but the barb is actually at the base of the tail. So they should be called barbed rays, I'm changing their name to barbed rays. The barb is at the base of their tail. So if you look at the body and just where the tail starts to come off the body, you'll see a little barb A lot of the rays in Ray pool are pretty old. They're around 2020 years old. Oh, yeah, some of them are charter animals. They've been with the aquarium since we opened. So over time that barb, we trim it so that it can't hurt people. So some of the reason people actually don't even have their bars anymore. Sometimes if we trim it down, or sometimes it'll grow crooked, so we have to remove the bar. So it doesn't hurt the animal anymore. So a good majority of them I think four or five of them don't even have barks or just like a smooth little part on their tail. But we always keep it clipped so that no one gets
MMadeline Walden
13:38
described as kind of like a fingernail. Yeah, back. So does it does it hurt the animal or does it cause any other issues? No, I'm in a, you know habitat where it doesn't have to defend itself I'm assuming right? Not necessary.
SSarah Nevarez
13:50
Um, it's kind of like a dog's nail. You know how you can't cut too far. Otherwise you'll get the quick so we cut just kind of at the end where it's pointing. It doesn't bleed or anything it doesn't hurt the animal and you're just cutting off the sharp part of the nail or the sharp hair the barb manicure Exactly. And yet they if they don't have to use them in the rate and the rate pool, they're they're fine without it. Yeah, it's perceived. Does
EErin Lundy
14:12
it feel like if you get stung if Oh,
SSarah Nevarez
14:15
it depends on the species. So if we're thinking of more common ways to get stung out here with the little round rays if you get barbed I guess. strong willed.
EErin Lundy
14:26
I've been barred if
SSarah Nevarez
14:28
you get hurt by Ray by a little round Ray I know if you pour hot water over it's just it's irritating and it hurts but it's not like gonna die or anything Yeah, I'm assuming a battery because it is a bigger animal will probably be more painful. And again the treatment for that is probably hot water until you can go to the hospital if you need to eat at a hospital for I know that he's worse. Sure and they're here and they're huge reason the wild can get up to 7080 pounds I think oh ours are ours are 5060 Probably but They can get big and they can get, I think six feet and wingspan which is my height. Very tall person.
EErin Lundy
15:07
So everyone says six feet tall. Yeah. Just imagine that. Oh, that's why you're in charge of them. Yeah. That's why they do supervisor was like, You seem exactly like, let's put you in charge of them. Yeah. So have you ever been stung by a ray in general? I have not ever in your life are all 50 Plus
SSarah Nevarez
15:30
my 5000 million dives I've done never been stung. No. Yeah, bat rays are usually they're not ones are rays in general are not animals to go and attack you. It's pretty much only if, like we said, if you're stepped on, or if you're kind of in their area, or you're reaching down and you accidentally are near them, then they will whip their tail around and get you with the farm. So they're not aggressive animals.
EErin Lundy
15:51
They're so like, there's such interesting animals because like to think that this thing is related to a shark. And like I hear people describe them as like a sea pancake, or you know, like, they're so flat, they look so different than a shark. What are some of the similarities or characteristics that they have in common with other elasmobranchs? Like, what do you see across that family? So
SSarah Nevarez
16:11
yes, they related to sharks. They both sharks and rays have their skeleton is not made out of bone, it's actually made out of cartilage. So it makes them very smooth in the water. It makes them very flexible and easy to fit into maybe smaller spaces, but they're a lot more aerodynamic that way more water dynamic.
EErin Lundy
16:30
I want to call everything water. What did I make? I loved it. So
SSarah Nevarez
16:33
that's one of the main things that sets that short summaries have in common.
EErin Lundy
16:37
Scott has a question. Ready? Welcome
MMadeline Walden
16:40
Scott to the podcast.
SSarah Nevarez
16:41
Yeah.
EErin Lundy
16:42
And a ray nerd. And a rock nerd and a shark tooth nerd. Yeah.
SScott Shaw
16:47
Sharks. I know, if you turn them over, they go into the tonic immobility, but do rays do the same.
SSarah Nevarez
16:52
I believe some species do. I honestly have never flipped one of the batteries over because I would get slapped in the face. Or someone being like, what are you doing? And then by double yes, they're flat. They're very strong. Like I mentioned when we do the assessments, and we have to handle them and weigh them and all that it takes a couple people. So that's an excellent question. But I believe some do, yes. It's
EErin Lundy
17:22
funny because sometimes I'll walk over by their a pool and they'll just like slap the water so hard that they cause like those tidal waves through a pool, so I can't even imagine that like on your body.
SSarah Nevarez
17:34
Yeah, and the more they're kind of routine is in the mornings, they're very splashy, they will be up against the wall. We think they've just always done that. It's usually in the morning when I feed them. And then in the afternoon, they're worn out and they're sleeping. Exhausted. So yeah, sometimes in the morning, it just sounds like someone
MMadeline Walden
17:54
has mistakenly sat there like waiting for to go into pinnipeds or some flash though and just fully gotten splash. Yeah, this is my fault. Thank you for thank you for the good morning. Wake up. Yeah. It was just refreshing. Yeah. wet pants. That's pretty common for you guys. I'm sure Oh, yeah. Yeah, wet pants. That's just okay.
EErin Lundy
18:13
I'm pretty sure I've seen Sarah in fully inside of the REI pool more than anyone else. Because usually, like go with regular plants in a wetsuit, typically, but I'm not in uniform.
SSarah Nevarez
18:27
No, really, I have and you won't, and I won't and I'm just manifesting that. Well, okay, it doesn't count if Okay, so they count when I go in the exhibit, I'll be either in a wetsuit or in like fishing waders that come up to I don't know, my stomach. And so I was doing something and I slipped. I can't sorry. Okay. And some of the water got into the it wasn't the whole thing. But so technically, yes, I have fallen while I was inside. And
EErin Lundy
18:57
you got water in your pants. My pants and my pants are all wet. We have to get in the waiters to clean the pinnipeds, Windows sills and ceiling window and there was the one worst thing is I found out there was a hole in the butt of the waiters because Parker's swim by and I just got so much water down. My pants was like, Ah,
SScott Shaw
19:17
I had that happen when I was working on Trump up in the exhibit because the audio box you actually have to go down. And I leaned down too far to pick up something and water just filled the way. Oh, no, I live in here now. Yeah, that was my day. Yeah,
SSarah Nevarez
19:31
all of your clothes are wet. It's not like a wet sock or anything. No, like your whole body.
EErin Lundy
19:37
You're just full of water. You're basically in like a woman exhibit. I'm in the pool. Cool. Well, in terms so you talked a little bit about how some of our batteries are 25 plus years old have been at the aquarium since we open How long do rays live? Are they're very long lived species is a species dependent.
SSarah Nevarez
19:54
Its species dependent, bigger way bigger species like species of mantaray I'm assuming live wait longer, but battery lifespan is about 25 years. In captivity, they probably live longer, which is why the ones that we've had for so long are still kicking and slashing. Everybody still splashing. They're considered older animals. Yeah,
EErin Lundy
20:16
I know. One of the questions that one of our listeners had was what are the differences between sting rays in manta rays? So manta
SSarah Nevarez
20:24
rays are those big, big pelagic, meaning midwater species that you see people diving with? They have the big oral lobes that they take in their food with and they're there. They're giant one day I will. One day I will snorkel with manta rays when
MMadeline Walden
20:40
I've done it either, but I know I've seen some of our colleagues have gone and shared the most amazing picture. Yeah, it doesn't even look real like No, it looks like just a sea monster. Yeah. But a few months at least have them painted on the front of the aquarium, even though we didn't have manta rays
SSarah Nevarez
20:54
here, this misleading. Still very pretty like the front end.
MMadeline Walden
20:57
So before PV, we had a muralist from I think it was from Portugal. Come it was part of like the Long Beach, like walls project. It was pretty. It was really, really cool. I'll send you a picture and yeah,
SSarah Nevarez
21:10
I don't remember that. Yeah, this was pre PvE. Creatively 2016. I
MMadeline Walden
21:15
think it was my first year that went up.
SSarah Nevarez
21:17
It was that's when I started diving. Yeah, no. Manta Rays giant no barb. Oral sting rays are usually smaller. They're more benthic. So they're more on the bottom as opposed to manta rays and more pelagic in the water column. And stingrays
MMadeline Walden
21:33
have bark and bark.
Unknown Speaker
21:34
How are
EErin Lundy
21:35
so serious typically, like I know we have a species pelagic rays?
SSarah Nevarez
21:40
Yep. Oh, yes. Yes. Sorry. Yes. Oh, I forgot about Sansa.
EErin Lundy
21:43
We do have a flood. Oh, yes. So I know we have pelagic rays, which are a stingray that is pelagic. So they sort of deviate from the norm of what stingrays do. But do stingrays? Are they shaped like that? And their mouth is on the bottom? Like, is that a feeding thing for them or a defense thing? Like why are they at the bottom?
SSarah Nevarez
22:03
Well, yes. So first, I forgot about sonza, which is our pelagic ray in ray pool. We do have one. And so she
MMadeline Walden
22:09
over one more time,
SSarah Nevarez
22:10
let pelagic Yes, pelagic is describing the water column. So you're not at the very surface of the water. You're not in the sand in the benthic zone. You are in the pelagic. So you're kind of in the big, open blue water. The Zone jellies or jellies are pelagic species. Dolphins are pelagic species. Most whales are pelagic species. Yeah. So our pleasure gray is named sonza. And she does have a barb in her mouth is on the bottom, like traditional stingrays, but she lives in the pelagic zone. So for our bat rays, all have an other benthic species, all of their food is usually going to be found in the sand. And so bat rays will use their little like kind of the tip of their nose like a little shovel and go through the sand and get different mussels, clams, things that live in the sand, and that's what they eat. And I don't know about pelagic, pelagic graze will eat things that are in theirs pelagic zone, like midwater column midwater column. Yeah, sounds it does eat off the bottom occasionally.
MMadeline Walden
23:11
I was gonna ask, do you see like kind of a difference in behavior and the way she eats compared to the other race?
SSarah Nevarez
23:16
It's very cute. So sonza is the light of my life, if you can't tell. So when so we got her when she was very little. She's about three or four years old right now. And so before she was the size she is now she would kind of we would target her and she would eat separate from all the rain so that we ensure that she actually got food. And she would come to the surface with her little face, and then we would give her with tongs, food, and then she kind of flips on her back and swims backwards and she'll use her pectoral fins to kind of like, bring food to her mouth. So think of like a little taco being folded. She would Yeah, she would do that. Use her wings and kind of get food and sometimes I would throw food onto her little mouth when she's on the surface. And this will kind of flip and come back and do the same thing.
MMadeline Walden
24:01
So we'll see pancakes, see tacos, taco.
MMadeline Walden
24:05
We'd call them see ravioli. See ravioli?
MMadeline Walden
24:08
That's
Unknown Speaker
24:08
a good one. You like little baby ones? Yeah.
EErin Lundy
24:11
It just reminds me when you like to throw a cheese ball in your friend's mouth. That's exactly what I would do. Yes, sorry. Little pieces of clam and Yes.
SSarah Nevarez
24:20
Yes. So backtracking to that's how pelagic rays eat. They use their they use their wings. They use their wings to catch some video
MMadeline Walden
24:26
of that lock to post along with it. Yeah, and release this. It's real cute.
SSarah Nevarez
24:31
Yeah, she's my favorite.
EErin Lundy
24:33
Wow, can you tell just right out there. We're gonna tell all about rays. They're fine. Do our rays ever breed here?
SSarah Nevarez
24:41
So we have all female rays? When female and male elasmobranchs sharks and rays are together. The males are extremely aggressive to the females. Yes, because yes, very rude. Because they're trying to mate and so They'll grab their wings, though. Yeah, it's very, very intense.
EErin Lundy
25:04
Need a sorority only? Yes, males are alone together.
SSarah Nevarez
25:08
So all of the boundaries that we have are actually all male. And they're fine. Yeah, they're fine. But it's when you have the same species of different sects that you get crazy.
EErin Lundy
25:17
I remember one of the cownose rays was pregnant. At some point, what is a pregnant Ray look like? How can you tell?
MMadeline Walden
25:25
They're just choppy? They just have like, chop chop? Yeah, the countless ways they just you can see a little, little tummy on them. It's
EErin Lundy
25:32
really seen. Well, that's interesting. So we need to keep same sex of the same species together. Yeah. Just
SSarah Nevarez
25:38
to prevent? Yeah. Any injuries or issues?
EErin Lundy
25:42
Are they? Do you consider them to be like a pretty intelligent species? Do you do any training with them?
SSarah Nevarez
25:48
I do. Like we mentioned before I we would sonza We would do the target training. So she would come up and II so that you can target train them, you can Station Train them. We had a couple of batteries in blue cavern cup, maybe I think last year, and they were able to come to the little target with and the diver was able to feed them. Yeah, they they're intelligent to that point. But not, I mean, not like a GPO or something.
EErin Lundy
26:12
Yeah, for sure for what they need. What they need, they get around,
SSarah Nevarez
26:15
they splash around, and they're fine. Yeah,
MMadeline Walden
26:17
what a life.
EErin Lundy
26:18
What was the last
EErin Lundy
26:20
question I wanted to ask about sort of our rays in general, do you find that they each individually have their own personality? And like, what sort of enrichment Do you provide to sort of keep them mentally stimulated.
SSarah Nevarez
26:31
So whenever I am in the exhibit, either with waiters that are not flooding or with that I'm not falling, and sometimes I'll put food on the bottom and then put kind of like a weighted net over looks like a big square net, and they'll kind of have to dig through. And kind of it's whatever high school feeder Yeah, it's exactly like a puzzle feeder, like a cotton ball. Whatever you can do to stimulate their natural way of eating is a great type of nourishment. So they're using those little plate teeth and they're shuffled little noses to get the food out from under that net. And they really like it. But in terms of personality, I sometimes relate their personality with their name slash with their tail looks like
EErin Lundy
27:12
so. Tiny just head to tiny.
SSarah Nevarez
27:16
She's Yeah, she's not kind of one of the more I don't know. Not aggressive because when when I feed them, they get very crazy and they're not being mean or to each other and kind of excited. Yeah. And Tiny is kind of the one that will stay back a little. The biggest one is are stubby Yeah, the biggest one is stubby and she'll kind of be more excited, but other than that, they're kind of all the same. So I know those are all female, but what is the sexual dimorphism? With rays? So with rays just like with sharks, the females on her underside, she's just gonna have event and then the male has to clasp errs. Oh, which looked like yeah, kind of elongated fins. Yeah, exactly. Oh, yeah. And the small round, rays the males, you can see their claspers, even when they're right side up. Where
EErin Lundy
28:01
is it relative to their barb, their claspers
SSarah Nevarez
28:05
it's basically the same location but on the other side and underside of them. Okay, yeah, kind of at the base of the tail ish, but the clasperes will come out towards their tail. Okay. And the vent is kind of right before their tail on their main body.
MMadeline Walden
28:19
So rays are really just kind of like a shark. Kind of pancaked. Yeah. Yeah. It's question
EErin Lundy
28:25
all like fins. They just like
SSarah Nevarez
28:28
everything melts into one pool.
SScott Shaw
28:30
You can't remember if you already said this, but they have teeth. Yeah, so they have
SSarah Nevarez
28:34
Yeah, since they're eating hardshell items, mostly that are in the sand, they have kind of their teeth are flat, kind of like two plates, like two blank grinding plates that are against each other, and they'll kind of grind them together and to crush up the shells. And then they'll eat the meat and spit out the shells. So it's not like traditional shark's teeth, like the pointy scary things. Very messy. If you go up to a pool and you see the shells in there, that's because I haven't taken them out. But she's working on it, but I'm working on it. Okay.
EErin Lundy
29:05
But I know that like similar to sharks that do sort of like have teeth that replace their teeth, like I've found the re like dermal or dental plates or whatever they're called, like, I found those in the sand before how like frequently are they like dropping those?
SSarah Nevarez
29:21
I don't think it's very frequent but I know that they will replace them continuously. Okay, as they Yeah, as they lose
MMadeline Walden
29:27
them as often as sharks do necessarily.
SSarah Nevarez
29:29
I don't I don't believe so.
EErin Lundy
29:30
I wish that if my teeth they just come back
SSarah Nevarez
29:34
not to get like a crown. Yeah. I'm just gonna free tooth Yeah, they don't. They're not gonna come back.
EErin Lundy
29:39
No, Natalie and bad news. Those are your last ones. That's it.
MMadeline Walden
29:44
I'm assuming you know with it. It's probably a lot more work to grow up plate than it is a tooth continuously, so probably a little less often.
EErin Lundy
29:52
Speak for yourself. How many of you grow plates over there? I have a lot of plates. Don't worry. Well, Oh, that's sort of what I wanted to ask you. But I wanted to know what your favorite story has been personally working with the race. What is your favorite thing about working with them? Or what is your best race story?
SSarah Nevarez
30:12
My best race story. I love working with the rays. Because whenever they're one of the first exhibits I go to in the morning, and they're just always so excited. And always, even though they're splashing and getting me wet or whatever, they're still just, I don't know, they're very routine, and they kind of do the same thing every day, which is comforting to me. Yeah, it sounds weird, but and then whenever I go up and feed them, and as soon as I throw food in there, all common, they're all They're just so happy to be eating and like, Okay, same, but I just love how I mean, we talked about how they don't really have like, specific personalities, but I do like how they're all kind of just little, little cows and they just kind of do their own thing and, and they're really cute. So, David, good to be here. Yeah, they have a good demeanor. Exactly. Sweet. Yeah.
EErin Lundy
30:59
Madeline, we'll go over some of the questions we had from our listeners and social media. And we have some really great questions.
MMadeline Walden
31:06
Great questions, especially this first one, which is, how silly are they?
EErin Lundy
31:12
scale of one to 10 1040? No.
SSarah Nevarez
31:16
I would say they're kind of silly. I mean, it was flashes against the wall for no reason. Yeah.
MMadeline Walden
31:22
I just got those little smiley faces.
SSarah Nevarez
31:24
I mean, they don't call them like ravioli or cake.
MMadeline Walden
31:29
Yeah. That's amazing. Um, how do they sleep?
SSarah Nevarez
31:33
They will usually if I mean, sometimes they do it and read pool but out in the wild, too. They will kind of bury themselves under the sand with their wings to hide themselves. And they just kind of chill on the bottom. Yeah. In the alimony? Yes. In the afternoon. Here at the aquarium they will just be all kind of cuddled together all kind of touching beings sometimes. And we just hang out there.
MMadeline Walden
31:56
Separately from the conversation, or the questions from social media. Rays are a social media favorite. Like more than sharks. Shallow. Like I think if it were the Order, order of like kind of our most like what gets the most engagement on social media. It's otters Of course. pinnipeds and then rays like above octopuses rays perform now.
EErin Lundy
32:24
Let's see, Brooke, listen.
MMadeline Walden
32:26
I wanted to get your perspective on like, why you think that is? I mean, they're cool, obviously, but But why do you think they're so up there? Why do you think they're so engaging?
SSarah Nevarez
32:35
I think rays are just like we talked about their, their shape is just so silly. And I think a lot of times they're either in cartoons, I think they're just very, a very easy animal for kids to identify and to kind of know since childhood, so I mean, that wouldn't they're so cool. So yeah,
MMadeline Walden
32:53
that's awesome. Yeah. Do you have a favorite race species? Baby like it doesn't have to be one that you've been work with? Because sounds like sounds like yes, yeah, that's
SSarah Nevarez
33:02
my heart I would say I love in the shark lagoon which was I love the blue spot rays. They are beautiful. They don't even look real. Yeah, like they look like someone painted blue. Yeah, we did not we did not paint. Yeah, no, no painting. This
MMadeline Walden
33:21
is a natural. Stop it
EErin Lundy
33:23
and painting them blue. It just counters
MMadeline Walden
33:28
exclusive species at the Aquarium of the Pacific.
SSarah Nevarez
33:33
They just I don't know they look like yeah, like so.
EErin Lundy
33:36
Thank you. Great job. Great
SSarah Nevarez
33:38
job. They all look so cute.
EErin Lundy
33:40
They're really really cool. Are they more venomous like why are they blue? Is it a warning coloration it
SSarah Nevarez
33:46
Yeah, I mean it might it might be a warning coloration is I don't know when that habitat where those rays live but that wouldn't surprise me if that's why they were so like kind of unnaturally. Yeah, it's like
EErin Lundy
33:57
almost like fluorescent
MMadeline Walden
33:58
yeah look at them shiny. Do you have a ray that you would like to work with them in the future or a species have one already here or a dream one that we would like brought in doesn't have to be Pacific Ocean animal either sweet babies.
SSarah Nevarez
34:12
I do love whenever I remember my head. Whenever I dive in Shark lagoon I do love diving with the giant reticulated ray that we have. She's such she's so big. She does the
MMadeline Walden
34:24
animal at the aquarium in size and weight and she doesn't let belongs to Parker.
SSarah Nevarez
34:28
Oh, right. Parker's I don't know. 800 pounds or something. And it's max
EErin Lundy
34:32
leave him alone. But still so big and he's heavy. He's 850 Okay,
MMadeline Walden
34:37
but the ridiculous I have such a hard time saying particularly retake. Retake rate. Yeah, she's about like, 400 Wow. That's 11 feet long. Biggest pancake.
EErin Lundy
34:49
11 feet long. Yeah. That's to Sarah's
SSarah Nevarez
34:52
I know. Can you Yeah,
MMadeline Walden
34:54
that's a huge
EErin Lundy
34:56
everything everywhere. I get
SSarah Nevarez
35:02
to what a dream
EErin Lundy
35:04
long right? So how long is her body? Because her body is not 11 feet? No, that's like
SSarah Nevarez
35:10
her tail is very long. So I don't know how long her her long her body is, but I think it's majority
MMadeline Walden
35:15
tail. Jordan her body's still
EErin Lundy
35:18
10 feet of tail and
MMadeline Walden
35:21
that's kind of like the eagle. Glorious. I mean, they're still big, but that the tail is
SSarah Nevarez
35:27
long. Yeah, I remember when well, when we got them when they were Do you remember when their eagle rays were little? Yeah. We I was a volunteer diver. And we would feed them with a little because they're trained to like the purple cone shape that was on their stretcher. So we would carry down a purple traffic cone with clams in it and they would come up to it and they were I don't know, like three feet. Yeah. Yeah. A little tiny and now they're huge. Yeah.
MMadeline Walden
35:50
Do you know how big that you Glory's got?
SSarah Nevarez
35:52
Like in general? I don't. How
EErin Lundy
35:54
many Sarah's 60s.
SSarah Nevarez
35:57
I think well, they just I think they just weighed the female and she was or she's made the male and he was around one between 150 and 200. I think he was 150 Oh, awesome. Big animal. Yeah, I know. They look like pizza slice are so cute. Yeah,
EErin Lundy
36:16
they kind of look like they have like a very I don't know, like if their side profile is very distinctive,
SSarah Nevarez
36:22
like humanist
EErin Lundy
36:25
view. Are they anyway? Are the eagle rays named that because of the shape of their like face?
SSarah Nevarez
36:31
Yes, probably probably. Probably very Eagle shaped. Fun fact the eagle ray and trap reef? His name? Elvis. Oh, yes.
MMadeline Walden
36:39
Do you think that there's a ray factor that people would be the most surprised to hear?
SSarah Nevarez
36:43
I have not watched seen. But some rays can actually jump out of the water? Obviously not here. But yeah, somebody's can actually jump out of the water back in and they can like start flapping?
EErin Lundy
37:00
Do you think that they belly flop? How bad? Would that hurt? If they just
SSarah Nevarez
37:05
assuming if they're coming up? They would kind of maybe go nose down. But maybe they learned
EErin Lundy
37:10
over time? Not not too it'd be such a jarring sound to hear out in the ocean just like mix
MMadeline Walden
37:19
to shape that way to do that they
SScott Shaw
37:21
were sharks and flatten them.
EErin Lundy
37:27
Anyone that really? Do they
MMadeline Walden
37:30
communicate with each other in any ways? Or any sort of like social structure with? Yeah,
SSarah Nevarez
37:34
some rays will actually be solitary or a couple and then some live in big, big, big aggregations with each other. Like, I know, I've seen videos of like drone footage of like 1000s of rays congregated together.
EErin Lundy
37:47
What are they up to? Flag?
MMadeline Walden
37:51
Is it like? Is it potential?
SSarah Nevarez
37:53
Is it a breeding thing? Yeah, I'm assuming Yeah. If it's that that many. I'm assuming
EErin Lundy
37:57
a lot of rays, billion rays. They are cool to see those overhead shots though, when you can just see so many of them. Yeah.
MMadeline Walden
38:07
But do they communicate with each other in any way? Have you? You've noticed mean or not
SSarah Nevarez
38:11
that I've noticed with my girls, but I'm assuming just what their spatial awareness and they've been with each other for so long. And so I'm like little family.
EErin Lundy
38:20
Yeah, if you had one thing that you wanted our listeners to take away from this, including the stingray shuffle. Please do that.
SSarah Nevarez
38:30
I would say that there's a lot of things about rays that maybe aren't super obvious so that people don't know like difference between Mandarin Stingray, which we talked about. Did we talk about that? Yeah. I thought we just did it before. And there's so many different species of rays out there. It's not just the batteries that live in the sand or the runways that live in the sand. So I would encourage people to go out and research or if you're curious about something, find out as much as you can about it. I mean, I work with these batteries every single day. And I still for this had wanted to look up different facts and different things about them. Because there's still stuff that I don't know. And so I would just encourage people to keep researching what they're curious about, especially about rays because they're so cool. Keep your curiosity. Curiosity up.
MMadeline Walden
39:17
The rays of curiosity
EErin Lundy
39:20
to Sarah yourself.
MMadeline Walden
39:24
She's got enough. Yeah.
Aquarium of the Podcific
39:26
send them to us
MMadeline Walden
39:29
I think they might have rays in every gallery right now. Let's see. Maybe not in northern specifically
SSarah Nevarez
39:40
in that northern proper area, no.
EErin Lundy
39:43
Northern proper. Oh, do
SSarah Nevarez
39:45
we wait, we
MMadeline Walden
39:45
had a little there was a little sandy bottom right. That's the name of the exhibits.
SSarah Nevarez
39:53
What are you laughing at? Because the bottom anyways, no, I don't think there's any up there. Okay,
MMadeline Walden
39:59
so we have rays in just about every gallery here at the Aquarium so Sarah is talking specifically about the race she works with. But I know we have a low res and tropical we have several species and tropical of two so you can visit the aquarium soon we'll be able to see stingrays pretty much everywhere. Um, see the floppies. Yeah. Thank you, Sarah, thank you so much for joining us on the podcast today. I learned so much about rays. And I'm excited for our audience to do the same. Of course, thank
SSarah Nevarez
40:22
you so much.
MMadeline Walden
40:29
Aquarium of the Podcific is brought to you by Aquarium of the Podcific a 501 C three nonprofit organization in 2023. The aquarium celebrates 25 years of connecting millions of people worldwide to the beauty and wonder of our ocean planet. Head to aquarium of pacific.org to learn more about our 25th anniversary celebration. Keep up with the aquarium on social media at aquarium Pacific on tick tock Instagram, Facebook, Twitter and LinkedIn.
EErin Lundy
40:54
This podcast is produced by Erin Lundy, Madeline Walden and Scott Shaw. Our music is by Andrew Wright's MA and our podcast art is by Brandy Kenny, special thanks to Cecile Fisher and Anita vias and our audio visual and education departments. And to all of our amazing podcast guests for taking time out of their day to talk about the important work that they do. I'd cific wouldn't be possible without the support of the aquarium stoners, members, guests and supporters. Thanks for listening
00:0000:00
    Aquarium of the Podcific: Rays: Otter Voice Meeting Notes