Hello, and welcome back to so you got a lifestyle degree. We're your hosts, Frieda and Lisa, who lives by undergrad students trying to navigate our future careers. This is Episode 11. And we're talking to Jared coonara. about working at the science career and Cooperative Education Office at McMaster University. How are you doing today? Lisa? How am I doing? Well, for anyone who watches community, there's that episode retort goes to get a pizza and then it comes back and then the whole apartment is just on fire. Yeah, it's been made into a meme. So if you don't know the episode, you at least know the meme where it's a guy holding a piece of box and like at the apartment is just burning people are running all over the place. There was like an evil version of his friends around. And like get rid of it, I
think,
yeah, I've been meaning to maybe rewatch some of it. But there's like this, this one meme where it's like you, you you move something like one centimetre on Microsoft board. And then it's like in the distance. thing. And so I feel like that's just me right now with my whole email situation, because I finally decided, because it was the break in everything that I was going to change my email kind of organising tool app kind of thing, because I've always just used the standard app on the phone, and kind of like the email app that comes with the Mac laptop, right? But then I remember you told me about how you can like, do things like schedule emails, I was like, what you can do that and you can after you send an email, if it was a mistake, you can unsend the email. And you can't do any of those things on the built in app, actually, like the Gmail app is a lot better for those things. And so I finally decided I was going to switch. And I just feel like everything is chaos. I just I don't know. I spent like 30 minutes the other day just trying to figure out how to send an email from my McMaster email. And it was just it was just so hard. It was just yeah. I don't know what it is. I'm just like, I'm so used to it, you know, and then, yeah, and so that's why when we had to send the link to our guests, it took me five minutes because I was like, why? images? so confused. Welcome to the 2006.
Well, yeah,
yeah, but also, isn't it all just like automatically set up? It's not like you're configuring specific options. I know. But it's like, I mean, do you really want me to get into the details of email like I had to add add our podcast email at McMaster email as like Linus. aliases? alliances? Okay, I'm gonna get made fun of for how i'm pronouncing whatever, on my Gmail, and it's okay. Just Just have I guess. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah, I feel like the whole meme with the Microsoft Word thing that you were saying earlier, that really applies to when you're making resumes on word.
For one thing, and you have no idea how to like,
or if you copy something from word into Google Docs, or vice versa. My bioinformatics prof he makes everything in Microsoft Word. But then I copy it from Microsoft Word into Google Docs. And it's just like, none of the the DNA reads are lined up. Wrong. And I'm like, going through like left and right, trying to like fix everything. Yeah. How are you doing? I'm doing pretty good. started school again. Technically today.
I'm not ready.
I start wait. Today is Friday, right? Yeah, I'm starting on Monday. But you already started, which is weird on Thursday. Yeah, it's a little bit weird. But outside of school, I'm actually taking another course. Yeah, so I've been hiding this for like a little bit. And I've been almost saying this for like a month. Like, how could you not tell me? Yeah, yeah, it's intentional decision. So I don't know if you watched our Grover's second to last video, where he announced that he was running a creative engineering course. What? Yeah, so I'm taking that course.
How many people are in it?
I don't actually know. Because it doesn't say but there's like groups, and I think there's like 20 people in my group. Uh huh. But I don't know how many groups are in total, so I have no idea. Oh, wow. Yeah, it's really cool. Yeah. Mark Rober is like your, I guess, kind of like a prof to you. Can you communicate directly with him? Um,
I mean, I don't
really think so. Like, he does comment on certain posts sometimes. And you can see the ones that he comments on it. I think it's mostly like you interact with your group. And some people are pretty advanced in the group. So you don't have a you don't have a group lead or anything like a TA kind of thing. It's it's kind of just like you lead yourselves. Yeah, I think yeah, I think the groups are intentionally mixed so that some people can help other people who have no idea what they're doing. Yeah. How do you rate yourself on the idea of But you're doing skill. I'm on the no idea what I'm doing outside of things. Okay, yeah, but he actually does, he makes it very accessible. And like, you can tell he has very thought out processes for everything. So it's not actually that difficult to follow. That's cool. What's one of the projects we're working on? Um, so the coffee pots that I vide, they're like, every time I drink one, I get hyper and then I crash. Tired for the rest of the day. When you made that car, the sound I thought you were gonna say cry.
Coffee does not make me cry. So I think I'm gonna try to make like a coffee portion or like it gives the same amount of coffee every day. So that I don't end that amount. I'm going to run some experiments so that that amount aligns to how much I actually need. Later, gentlemen, our very own frita at a time. Yeah, the the issue is that there's some constraints on what we can build so as to be like, technically all the ideas I really wanted to do involved a little bit of programming, which we weren't allowed to do for the first project. Oh, and also ask me something that I can actually make, which is very close to nothing. So.
Yeah.
So we're taking baby steps. It's not like a genius idea. It's just something to work. Okay, that's cool. It's cool. Wow, look at you go. That's Damn, that's a commitment right there. Yeah, it's been pretty fun. I mean, speaking of school today, we have a guest who from my school is from McMaster University itself. It is Jared qunar. And I'm pretty excited to talk to him. He seems like a cool person we were emailing before and he was telling us about his adopted dog. How he was taking on the walk to make it calm for the podcast. So yes, he's on here yet. So we'll see if you hear any snuffling when he's comes on. Yeah, I'm excited. Let's get into it. Jared is currently the career development and Relationship Manager at the science career and Cooperative Education Office, otherwise known as the SCC at McMaster University. He helps students develop job search techniques, create targeted resumes, and cover letters and improve their interview skills. He is known as the sweet prince of career services and an overall cool guy. Jared completed his bachelor's degree in life sciences at McMaster University. He then became a certified Human Resources professional through taking courses at McMaster University and Mohawk College. Thank you so much for joining us today, Jared. Yeah, no problem. I'm happy to be here. Yeah, it's super cool to chat with you. I understand you're known around Mac as a pretty friendly guy. So we thought it'd be a pretty good guest for this podcast. And to start us off, we were wondering if you could just describe what what your job is, what is a career development and Relationship Manager do?
Yeah, it's one of those like, giant fancy titles that probably doesn't need to be that giant in the first place. But really, what it comes down to is, it's helping students try to help find their way right and talking about their futures. So it is like kind of mentioned in that intro, so a lot of like the resumes and cover letters, a job searching, but it's also then sitting there and talking just how do we go from where you are right now to where you want to go, and any barriers in between. So it's really trying to sort that piece out. And on top of that, it's also working with our Co Op programmes that we have in science at McMaster. So it's, it's really, you know, let's find new opportunities. Let's talk about how do we get good Co Op opportunities, and essentially just running that programme. So it's a little bit of a combination of both. And kind of, I'm in there right in the middle. And right now I'm looking at just seeing if we can come up with some new programming to maybe modernise some of our services try to get into the hands of more students. So I got some things that I'm working on behind the scenes right now to see if I can make a couple changes going forward.
So being like a manager at the SCC Edu still spend a lot of your time working one on one with students or, you know, do you spend your time more so kind of organising these programmes and deciding what your office is going to do moving forward?
Yeah, yeah, it's a little bit of a hybrid. And it's, I mean, it's because it's I so I just recently came off of doing like a little bit of like an interim manager position where I was completely kind of in charge of the office. But right now, I've kind of just slipped back into my old role as we hired somebody is a director. So I'm doing a little bit more of those those student conversations now, but still, at the same time, I think I'm in a little bit of a transition period. So it's, I get to still work on some of these these bigger projects behind the scenes, some, I kind of like right in the middle of everything right now. So it's actually kind of interesting because yeah, you get to see, like, this is where we're gonna go in the future, but also still group Get that contact. And that's the part that I love. I love talking to the students. So
yeah, I was just gonna ask you which one do you like more?
Yeah, I mean, it. They both have their perks. But I think what really drives me everyday is is still being able to talk to students. And if I lost that I don't know what I'd ever do. It's just one of those things that I like so much. And I teach science to see 000 Yeah, yeah, I took that with you. Yeah. And I will never give up. They never give it up. But
my,
take it away from me. No. But yeah, I love it so much. So it's one of those things that Yeah, somebody would have to wrestle it out of my hands to not go into like one class. So for us non McMaster folk.
Can you just explain what that courses?
Yeah, yeah, for sure. That would make a lot of sense. So it's science to C 00. So it's, it's basically building a foundation for careers. So we talked about I mean, it's, it's the basics, the resumes, cover letters, job searching, interview skills, just a little bit about, you know, how do you manage your professionalism at work? So it's just like a good intro to to those subjects.
That sounds really cool. at McGill, usually, that responsibility just falls amongst the various props, and some of them take that off, and some of them don't. So it's nice to hear that there's actually like a concentrated way that bikemaster students get to learn that. Yeah, and I was wondering for you, Jared, you mentioned that you like talking to students, but I just want to know more about the nitty gritty of what an average day of work looks like for you. So like, what time do you arrive and leave? And how many hours do you work? And, you know, do a lunch break? What what happens on a daily schedule?
Yeah, I guess every day is always a little bit different. But when standard schedules that 830 to 430, I get that lovely, like one hour lunch break whether or not I can actually take it or not. I think technically, I get 215 minute breaks, and a one hour lunch break. So yeah, I'm living the dream at this point. But yes, it's just a matter of whether or not you can take it. But yeah, and it's, I mean, it's a variety of different things. So some days it might be and this is kind of going back a little bit like my days used to be like appointments, so I've done drop in hours for like a morning, and then do appointments in the afternoon. Other days, you know, it might be looking at Co Op, so then it's contacting employers figuring out where students can go. And then more currently, right now, it's doing a lot of like research, reading, finding best practices, a lot of communication to go back and forth with whether it's stakeholders, or people who have done like really cool things with careers. And it's just trying to figure out, I guess, where I can go from there. So it's a lot, a lot of digging around a lot of contact these days.
Okay, I don't know if this is just me not knowing things. But what exactly do stakeholders look like in the office that you worked in?
Yeah, stakeholders is good question. So that would just be essentially anybody that would be impacted by our programming or wants impact for our programming. So I could look at somebody like, like grad studies in general, right? Like, they could be a stakeholder could be some of our employers could be like University Advancement. So like the fundraising that goes on behind the scenes. So it's, it's lots of different people. I mean, the way I think of it, all of us in science are kind of working towards a common goal at the end of the day, and it's like for undergrad, it's it's all about like education, right. But there's different ways that we can interact with each other, to help each other out with our own small little goal so that the rest of science kind of moves forward with it. So those are the people that would be kind of my stakeholders,
that makes a lot of sense. It actually sounds like you wear a lot of different hats and get to do a lot of different things in your role. Are there any challenging aspects to your work?
Yeah, yeah, I think, you know, kind of the biggest challenge is that this is probably tough to hear as a student, for sure. But we are underfunded. in her office, she does, you know, prevent us from being able to do like, big expansion projects, really kind of get out there. So we have to be more aggressive with, you know, looking for funding, whether it's from the university or external grants to bring in to do some of these cool little projects. So that's, that's always one of the things and it's, we're a small team. We're a small but mighty team. And that's for sure. But sometimes you just need hands, right? And that's sometimes we're, we're fine, we have a little bit of trouble. And the other thing is just we genuinely care about the students. I think it's one of those, like, especially our office in general is one of those places where even if you came to us with the wrong question, and like the wrong department will still find a way to make sure you need or you get what you came for. Even if it ends up being a referral, but we never have that. Like, no, sorry, I just can't help you. So go somewhere else have attitude. So I usually say like, that's a super like big positive for us, but it also ends up being kind of one of our biggest burdens as well. Because, like yeah, if you came into our office And just said, like, please help me. Somebody is going to drop everything they're doing and just like, okay, let's let's figure it out. So, yeah,
someone's like, Where's the pizza place? And you're like, I'll walk you there. Well, yeah, then we'll have a big discussion about, well, what kind of pizza? We'll find the right one for you. talking a bit about a bit more about you, I guess, and why you chose to, you know, study life, sigh and then transition into kind of more of this career stuff. If you think back to, you know, 1718 year old Jared, why did you or he choose to study life? sigh and like, what were you thinking about your career at the time when you enter that Mac?
Yeah, I guess my whole career path has been a giant mistake, but a giant wonderful mistake. But so I yeah, it's and this is okay. This is this is the message everybody needs to hear. I came to Mac actually because of a course that I took in high school. And it was just like an extra course where they sent me to a sent to Ottawa, eu I grew up in Ottawa. So I went there, there was this course, where there's a psychiatrist that trained at McMaster. He was teaching and I, like, loved what he had kind of developed and delivered during those like his quick seminar day, like three or four days or something like that. And he went to McMaster and I was pretty much sold at that point, I was like, Okay, well, I'm going to I'm going to go to Mac. And science was just because like, I love science, and I couldn't really see myself doing anything else. And it's just what I was good at. It's kind of one of those, like, I didn't really need to study science, I didn't need to what we're gonna slowly find out here, I'm sure is that I was an awful student, and I did. So this would be a cautionary tale to anybody who's listening. But yeah, I didn't, I didn't have to study for tests. It didn't take me long to write assignments. So I was just like, this is kind of easy and like, make sense to me. So let's just keep doing that. Because if it's easy, then I should just keep doing it. So there's, as you could probably tell that there's not a lot of thought put into it. It just felt right at the time. But yeah, and that's that's kind of how I ended up at Mac and in life science. If I go that particular, because I stayed in life science through my whole undergrad. I'll be honest, it was I didn't have the grades. So I was one of those students that you know, like you, you have to apply in in second year. And yeah, I just didn't quite have the exact cut off to get in. I was actually looking for one of the site programmes. Like PMB kind of thing. Yeah. PMB. Yeah. So I didn't have the cut off to make it. So I just kind of stuck it out in life science. And I just kind of worked through kind of shadowing some of the courses. I mean, still doing what everybody else did. Where are you? Are you taking organic Chem genetics? Yeah, just because you're supposed to, I think that's the kind of the rule on the, at least through the students, you're just supposed to take those classes and go through that pain. But yeah, yes, you'd want to know about or go, I can talk about our guts. But yeah, so I never quite got to exactly where I wanted to go. So I just stuck it out in life science. So doing all those labs, like the organic chemistry, I don't remember what else their labs I was taking, but it was, every time I had to do one, I was just like, why am I here? Right? Like I started to realise like I actually hated being in the lab. And as like, my, my tangent here is that I also had like this sinus problem. So like, I would put goggles on, and then like 20 minutes into a, like a three hour lab. Like, I'm just in an immense pain, because like, you're bordering on that migraine type thing. So it's just like, clearly you know why I'm not going to like enjoy this lab, because like it just felt off.
Even as someone who doesn't have any health issues to deal with Additionally, just yelling, not drinking water and being in a lab for like four hours. No fun.
Yeah, exactly. Eventually, I got my sinuses all like, cut out and sorted. And then I was like, that was great, but, but it's at that point where it's just like, that's just another obstacle that I ran into. So I kind of said, like, okay, I don't want to do this anymore. And I didn't want to do the labs anymore. So I was like, Okay, well, let me just take some like additional site courses. I did like them, they weren't too lab heavy, especially under the the life science banner, because you're blocked out of like a lot of the more research based things. So I took them and I was like, for the most part, I liked them. But what I found is those like a lot of like, the motivation and emotion type stuff that I was looking at was like, This is genuinely interesting for me. So I started to think, Okay, what can I actually do with this? And I thought, Okay, well, maybe what I'll end up doing is a little bit more business because like that motivation and emotion were started kind of piquing my interest was like, how can we do it in a business setting? So how can I get people to essentially do what I need them to do at work with some sort of reward, right? Whether I'm alive Sometimes it's just like, here's a boatload of money and go, like, awesome. But it's actually yeah, it's far more complicated than that. So I was like, Okay, this is what I'm going to go do. And it's basically there's programmes out there called industrial and organisational psychology. So I thought, Okay, well, let me go out and apply to a couple of Master's programmes and see where it takes me. But if we cycled back a second, it's just my grades. Right? They weren't that great. I mean, towards the end, like everything kind of picked back up. And I was kind of in around that like, b minus ish range, but kind of that the track record to that may have not been great. So I actually didn't get into the programmes that I wanted to. So all of a sudden, you know, I'm at the end of my, my fourth year, and I'm going, Okay, so now you're not into your programme that you wanted. Now, you have to kind of figure out what what you're doing with your, your life? And like, how do you get there. So it took me a little bit of time to start sorting things out, I still took a couple extra courses at Mac, but around like the winter when I was in my fifth year, because I was just taking extra courses, I kind of turned around and said, Okay, you know what it has to be I have to start working towards HR. That's the only thing that makes sense to me, because I want to do industrial organisational psychology, it's a branch of HR when we start talking about like, at work. So I was like, Okay, let me take some some courses at Mohawk. So I started doing those, and then started really kind of aggressively trying to pursue work in that area. But me about six months into that, still not landing a job. And it was kind of tough at that point. I said, Okay, like, I need a little bit of help here. Like, there's got to be something that I'm doing wrong, because you know, I'm job searching for six months, I'm a new grad, like, I should have the skills to get into something. So I ended up going to a just like a local, like an employment help centre. And I ended up I mean, I did a resume with somebody, it was the worst and awful experience. So this that always sticks in my mind. But they said, you know what you go, go talk to one of our advisors, and we'll book you an appointment, so you can come back in and do it. So I said, Sure. Anyway, so I worked with her for quite some time, she's actually very good. And she basically told me, like, I'm doing a lot of things, right. But it's just not quite working out. And it's just not lucking out for some reason. And eventually, she just said, like, okay, there's this, this job at one of our sister locations just out in Burlington, I can get you an interview, if you want to go. And it's, it's just putting you in a like in an employment help centre, but you're going to be kind of really that front facing person. So you're going to do like, really basic resume critiques, you're gonna do a lot of community referrals, you're gonna get to know everything in the in the neighbourhood. And that's kind of what the job is. So I looked at that and said, Okay, well, you know, at least and I'm working with resumes and things like that. So that's probably a step towards HR. So that's gonna make a tonne of sense. So let me put my hat in the ring and go for it. And I totally remember showing up to that interview. And it was a group interview. And I was the least qualified person there. Because everybody was going around the table. It's like, oh, I've done this for employment. I've done that for employment. There's internal candidates in front of me. And I'm like, oh, boy, this is this is bad news for me. And we had to give a presentation that we have to create with a partner. And two people that were internal, were partnered together and had pre built presentations. To compete against this. And just like two minutes before we went up for our presentation, my partner was just like, I can't do this. I can't go up in front of everybody and do a presentation. And I'm like, wait, like, No, you have to come up. Just like, say your name. Do a brief introduction. I'll take care of the rest.
And yeah, I did the presentation kind of worked out. Well did the one on one afterwards made a few jokes, which seemed to land pretty well. I remember it. Yeah. I talked a little bit about like enjoying hockey in my interview, because I'm a big Ottawa Senators fan, and I'm surrounded by leafs fans, so they mocked me for it during the interview. But ultimately, it ended up working and like I worked really hard for that interview. Like I studied absolutely everything, and knew it really well. But they liked me enough that they gave me a shot. And they knew they're taking a little bit of a gamble. But I like to think the gamble kind of worked for them too. Yeah. And so I just kind of got this job. And I said, Okay, let's just, let's just do it. I'll keep my eyes open. I'll apply to HR when like, the position comes up, and I'll keep doing that. So keep towards my goal. And I was working for the why at this point. And I all of a sudden, I think six months there a position opened up in HR with the why and I was like, Okay, well let me apply. I didn't actually get that job, even though it was internal. They basically just told me I'd be bored with it. And I was like, okay, and you're just like, what I'd be bored with it because it's what I want to do and where I want to But slowly, what ended up happening is like, I realised that I actually, like, thoroughly enjoyed doing my job. And I kind of just started setting goals for myself where it was, okay, so, you know, you're starting off in this, like, really basic role, but like, I could see the kind of the people above me and it's like, Okay, well, I'm gonna get there. So it was, I think, pretty much every year and a half, I kind of had a little bit of a, whether it's a promotion, or like a change in job. So I changed from doing like really basic stuff to doing like full case management. So that's when you like, see people, multiple appointments, you're taking notes, it's almost like going to see like a, like a doctor or counsellor kind of thing. And not that important. But, you know, something along those lines. So I did that. I did that for about a year and a half. And then there was this new programme that came out where you're working with employers, and we were giving out training subsidies for them. So I took over that programme. So all of a sudden, I had like a programme or is dealing with like, $350,000 budget, and I was like, Whoa, this is crazy. Yeah, me thinking that's a big budget at one time. And then I kind of just got lucky and ended up at McMaster because I saw the posting go up. And the manager at the time was relatively new to her position. And I think she just saw that that life science degree and I was meaning to go back and ask her, it's like, Why did you take me because I was still relatively young at that point in time, because I've only been out of school like now 10 years, so guess it would have been out six years at that point. But yeah, she must saw that that life science degree and was like, yeah, you know, we could probably take a little chance here. But all throughout, it's just like, basically, I just kind of set my goals and my sights on something. And I always knew that, you know, if I was going to stay in Hamilton, I was going to come back to McMaster at some point. And I had applied the different programmes I got applied to engineering, I applied to very when Biomedical Discovery and commercialization opened at McMaster I applied to
that like to do the programme or to help do like the HR for it.
Yeah, to do the programme, so that they do the same thing where they do like Co Op positions. So I was going to see if I can do that. And still talking to students and stuff like that. So yeah, I just got really lucky that I was able to come back to master and it was just one of those like timing things, it kind of worked out. They were in the right need, the right person was in charge. So yeah, and that really just kind of solidified my spot at McMaster, which it's where I want to be. And I'm working with a demographic that I like. So I like talking to the students. People don't realise, I guess when they come talk to me, they don't realise that I was probably equally as lost as them or more lost than them at some point. So it really does give me a little bit of perspective, when I talk to students too, because it's, I saw it, I went through it, but at the same time now I have the all the extra tools that I've picked up along the way to make sure that people don't make the same mistakes that I did. So it's really quite helpful.
I'm so glad we talked to you right now, because I feel like I'm very much in that transition stage of I just finished my undergrad and don't want to continue down the life science path. So your story is super encouraging, I think. Yeah. Yeah, as lifestyle majors, I don't think I have a good grasp of what HR and organisational psychology and I think you mentioned the estriol something is so if you could explain a little bit about what those are, that would be great.
Yeah. And it's, it's really, where you find them. A lot of times working is in what we call total rewards in HR. So it's a big fancy term for how do you essentially compensate employees so that we can get the best out of them? Right? And when we're thinking about total rewards, like that's things like planning, you know, do you plan a pension programme? Do you do health benefits? Do you pay people more or less, I'm hoping you never pay people less a big fan of getting everybody getting paid so but it's trying to find out those things and you know, like, do we do things like a company barbecues do you do you know, what I mean? Like, it's, it's basically like fun things to get people active and engaged with their work or, you know, do we volunteered, we volunteers a group, give them individual opportunities. So it's trying to find different ways to to engage people. And then hopefully, from that, they like their work atmosphere, they want to stay they want to grow with the organisation. So you're really trying to cut down a lot of like, people coming in and leaving quickly because it's really expensive to hire new people and train new people. So that's really your goal is to come up with like, the right package the right mix of things so that it works for you as a company and at the same time. I mean, you always have to look at the people above and your CEOs and stuff like that and they want to make sure that they're saving all their money. So yeah, I mean, that's a part I guess I now thinking about it, I would have a harder time with is like how can we cut our costs at like, get people engaged at the same time, because I've definitely fallen too far to the other side where I'm just like, let's just make sure everybody's happy and kind of whatever cost.
Yeah, given that you, you've worked so much, you know, with students and with our demographic, and that a lot of our listeners are, you know, just coming out of high school or just graduating University. We were wondering if you could tell us about some common concerns that you see, among people our age, and kind of what advice you would give to kind of ease those concerns?
Yeah, yeah. And I think, you know, if I really were to think about it, it's, it's really not having like a large enough view of kind of what's out there. And I don't put that, like, it's not a fault of any students coming into the programmes, or of that age demographic, it's just, we just don't talk about those things early enough. So what ends up happening is we find like, you know, I see a lot of students that come in, and like, maybe it's just that they want to do one or two different things, right. Like, I guess I'll pick on the life sciences here. And it's, it's perfectly okay. But like, you know, they want to come in, they want to do research, or medicine, right. And it's just like, those are two things that we know about. And I think what ends up happening is there's all this pressure from kind of everybody around them at the same time, even just like other students that it's just like, Oh, yeah, like, I'm doing research, or I want to do research, I want to do medicine, and it's just kind of like, they kind of just push each other, but don't help each other always expand their, their view of the world. So it's one of those things that I mean, it's definitely manageable in undergrad to kind of start seeing those things. But what it requires is, like breaking out of your shell a little bit, you know, it's joining those clubs, those organisations, those groups, you know, even let's just those things that, you know, weren't cool in high school, but now you get to do them at university. And it's just to see, like, what else is out there and just going interact with people, because then it's going to help kind of broaden that, that view of what's out there. And it's really starting to stick yourself in like, uncomfortable situations, taking summer jobs that you're just like, I don't really know if I would like this. But I'm a big fan of just going out and like experiencing things for the sake of experiencing them. Because it usually tells us like a bare minimum one of two things, or it's just like, I really enjoyed this, or I really hated this. And you learn a lot from both, and especially if we're doing something like you know, like a summer job. And you kind of put yourself out there and you realise over four months that you're just like, this was literally the worst thing I've ever done. It's like, I'm super happy, because you know, you're never going to go touch that again. So it's really just trying to figure out like, yeah, how do we? How do we deal with that that future? And how do we navigate that it's okay to be uncertain about your future, and just kind of run with it? And I don't know, that's especially if you have that personality type where it's like, you got to be a planner. Yeah, it's a very hard thing to like to reconcile where I'm just saying, like, don't worry about it, just kind of go out, have some fun, see where it starts pulling you. But I think that's, that's one of those big challenges that I see with, especially with the undergrads where it's just like, yeah, I feel like I can only be one of three things, or one of four things. And maybe the other thing is just come talk to like a career advisor to that's my subtle plug. But yeah, you come talk to one of us. And it's just like, you know, what, we're not going to judge whether or not you want to do one thing or another. But, you know, if you just want to come in and say like, I just want to see what else is out there, it's like we can absolutely take you through those those exercises to go figure it out. So it's just broaden those expectations. And also, I mean, there's so many things, it's, you want to be happy, right? And we got to find out what those things are that make you happy. And I think sometimes we think about these big grain careers. And it's like, they have like a name attached to them a title attached to them, maybe a certain level of respect attached to maybe it's an income attached to them. But it's just like, you know, are those the things that really make you happy? Or is it like just hanging out with your friends? Is it travelling, and it's just like, those are perfectly okay, things to want to do. And we should be looking at careers that let you do those things. So and But yeah, I do think that's like, the toughest thing to realise at that point. It's not to say that you can't go off and do something big and grand, but there's also nothing wrong with just being that person in an office. Right? Because if ultimately that makes you happy, then then why not? That's kind of a really big, tough question.
Yeah, I mean, I think it's a pretty broad question to answer. So fair enough. And I think like the one advice that we give consistently on the podcast is to do that exploring and kind of try out different options. So I'm glad that it's been further validated by someone who actually knows what they're talking about.
Like I can't stress it enough. I'm glad Because I have this podcast, but it's just like it's go all I can tell anybody just go and explore. And I think University undergrad is the time to do it for sure. Because whether you know, you're talking to somebody who's just coming into the programme, or maybe talking to somebody who's graduated from programme, I think they'll tell you that there's, there's no experience quite like the undergrad experience. Where it's, you know, like, you can just kind of go out there you can, you can literally go talk to anybody it chances are, somebody will listen to you, you can make all sorts of different connections, all I can say is really just take advantage of those opportunities. And also remember that, you know, it's, you don't necessarily peak at the undergrad point, hey, certainly hope you. I would say, you know, what, like, probably kind of the most fun I've had was actually when all my friends started earning a salary. And we were all earning kind of a little bit of money for like, the first time in our lives. Because we had the opportunity we hadn't finally had the means to go like, do fun things. Right? So it's kind of like a different transition once you kind of leave school. And yeah, you can all of a sudden, just do a little bit more, whether that's, you know, like, you take a trip or you, you can actually go out to dinner and go to someplace that's a little bit nicer. You can get that nicer pizza. Finally, it's just like, it's kind of one of those, those things that I say, you know, keep looking forward to. Yeah, exactly. You finally get one. So yeah, just keep looking forward to those things. And keep always looking for that, that next thing for you to, especially when I talk about careers, I'm always, I always recommend, keep an eye open, because you never know what's going to come your way. So take advantage of the opportunities that come to you. And really just kind of put yourself in uncomfortable situations and see where it kind of takes you. All right. Well,
thank you for that. And thank you for joining us today and for chatting with us about your experiences. Yeah, no problem. If you'd like to keep up to date with the McMaster science career and Cooperative Education Office, you can follow them on Instagram using at McMaster SCC e or the link in the show notes. You can also visit their website listed below. For McMaster science students, they are having drop in hours as well as a live chat from 9:30am to 3:30pm, Mondays through Fridays, so go and check it out. So we wanted to take this moment to tell you about our Patreon. We're raising funds in order to help pay for a podcast hosting service equipment upgrades and our own website. If you head over to patreon.com slash so you got a life side degree, you can view our three membership levels and the cool perks that come with them. For $1 a month you can access bonus mini casts, which are five to 10 minute episodes where we talk about the interesting shenanigans in our lives, including weird animal discoveries, like the truth behind blobfish. To check out this and our other perks, click on over to patreon.com slash so you got a lightside degree. So what are your thoughts, Lisa? I thought it was good. I think he definitely has a voice for radio like points while we were listening to him. I just kind of turned to my left and pretended like I was listening to a podcast and it felt very much like the case. I also think that in a weird way his voice doesn't necessarily match what he looks like. If that makes any sense. Like Like he if you see him he's he looks like a very friendly approachable guy. But his voice sounds like very like, I know what I'm talking about. And I'm on the podcasting things. But but not in a bad way. It was nice. Yeah. I think Yeah. Like the prerequisite qualification to being a career counsellor is just making everyone around. You feel very comfortable. Yeah. And I think he did that. Well, you would think But wait, sorry, I was that was not a diss on Jared. That was
over your past experience.
With a separate office, not the SCC at McMaster, but a separate office at McMaster. Yeah. Yeah, but yeah, it was I thought I thought it was a good interview. Also to the listeners, I want to apologise for correcting Jared that the Y means the YMCA because apparently I've been notified by my co host that the formerly YMCA now wants to rebrand as the y's so yeah, correct term is the why, but yeah, I think they're trying to make it more inclusive because YMCA is like young men's Christian Association. Oh,
yeah.
So nobody should have just like changed the words but kept the acronym the same, like they should have. They should have been like, we need to find another name that has like the acronym YMCA. I think that'd be too confusing. Yeah, but yeah, good on them on trying to improve a little bit, I guess. Yeah. Wow. I shouldn't know it's for that. Yeah, I'm pretty sure I've told you before, but also the Y does actually offer some great services like they do run a lot of cool programmes. Yeah. I always assumed the wife stood for like, like youth something. I don't know. I never Wow. Yeah, in more substantial discussion topics. What do you got? I think this has come up in our PhD episode. And then again, with Jared now, I don't actually understand how expensive it is to hire and train someone new. Yeah. I don't know what they mean, in terms of expense. Maybe they're talking about in terms of time, like it takes the time of your existing employees to interview people or it takes time to train someone. So you're like, kind of like paying for the time of that person who's training the newbie, but then you're also paying the train? Yeah, in terms of that way. I can't imagine there's there's many like, actual like things you have to buy when you train someone? Oh, yeah. I don't think it's actual things you have to buy. I think it's in terms of wages. Yeah. Hmm. I'm trying to Google and see if there's like anything interesting here. Oh, okay. So some common hiring cause or an external hiring team. So usually, if you're a small company have to hire like a recruiter or something like that. Or you can have an internal HR department. Yeah. Career events. So putting on an event, job board fees, oh, checks. And then onboarding training? Yeah, that's true. Yeah, I didn't think about Yeah, I guess you do have to pay to post on indeed, and stuff. I didn't know about that. I thought it was free. Yeah. So on onboarding, it says when you hire someone new, they most likely won't be fully productive on their first day of work. That makes sense. And so as confirmed by research, it will take eight to 26 weeks for an employee to achieve full productivity Chief Product. I just actually chuckle I don't know. When they say that, like, it's it's like you're talking about them? Like they're a plant like full harvest. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, basically, you're just like losing money on that entire time. Yeah, in the article, this is a quote of some of the research. And it says an average company loses anywhere between one and 2.5% of their total revenue on the time it takes to bring a new hire up to speed, a single new hire. That sounds really, really high. Yeah, maybe they mean for new hiring in general? Oh, yeah. Probably, I don't know. It's phrased as one new hire. But that sounds very large for one new hire. And also, it doesn't mention anything about the size of the company. So okay, that's confusing. But yeah, you should take a look at the study itself, or what it's lingering, because we're obviously not super knowledgeable. We just googled it. Yeah, in this article that we're going to link in the show notes. It claims that for a company that's zero to 500 people, it costs on average $7,645, to onboard them, and hire them. But the article also shows some other studies that show it's around like $4,000, to hire an employee. And replacing someone can cost you up to 50 to 60% of their annual salary. Hmm. And apparently, if you're replacing someone, instead of filling a new position, stakes get even higher. So replacing someone can cost you up to 50 to 60% of their annual salary. And it just says that turnover can be quite costly summing up to a total of 90 to 200% of an employee's annual salary. I'm not entirely sure how that adds up. Please do your own research, even though we will link this. Yeah, I mean, take this with a grain of salt. I think this is just one article on the internet. But yeah, take it with a salt shaker. And I'll just agree. Yeah. But yeah, that's actually interesting, because I actually had no proximate numbers whatsoever. Yeah. Yeah. That's interesting to note, because if you remember back in the VHD episode we were talking about, it might be more worth it for companies to hire like masters students over PhD students and stuff like that. I think we ultimately cut that from the discussion actually, but it's interesting to think about in terms of numbers, right.
This has been another episode of so you got to live side agree with Jared coonara. About being the career development and Relationship Manager at the McMaster SCC we want to give special thanks to our crew of lovely patrons, including our little leaf patrons. nyeem, the Neil Shafiq and shamima and aren't fantastic foliage patrons Stephanie. If you would like to become a supporter of this podcast, you can visit our patreon@patreon.com slash so you got to lightside degree can also rate us on Apple podcasts. using the link in the show notes. The music you're hearing is no regrets from audio hub.com Thanks for listening and see you next time.