| 7 | The Nine Breathings of Purification Part One

5:42PM Jul 13, 2024

Speakers:

Chelsea Waves

Katie Love

Bodi Mack

Philippe

Garrett Kincaid

Armida

Keywords:

practice

dream

lucid dream

breath

lucid

channel

experiences

nostril

clear

lucid dreaming

work

aversion

sleep

chelsea

yoga practices

body

grasping

question

breathing

feel

And people are coming into the room. Welcome everybody. Hello, hello.

All right and see and is everybody in? Do we have? Yep,

they are. They are,

okay, great. Hello, everyone. Welcome to this edition of dream induction or her dream induction group so and so. Today is July 13, just for the record. In the recording and so this is where we get to talk about, kind of all things lucid and in induction for lucid dreaming, just a brief review of the topics from the previous gathering. So the last time we got together, we talked about some of the creative benefits of lucid dreaming. And then we also talked about the technique of called mild. And we also talked about dream signs and how to use those to induce lucidity. So if any of that interests you, we invite you to watch the recorded video, and it's on nightclub, and you just scroll down to the bottom and you'll see it so really good. And want to share with everyone that we have a new format, and that's two sessions a month now. So the first session of of the month, we're going to introduce, like, say, some type of a technique or or something that will help with, uh, lucid dream induction. So then we we want to encourage people to try that out for the month. Try that technique out as much as you can. As you know, does it feel right? Does it feel good? Does it work for you? But we invite you to try that out for the month following now, two weeks in, we're going to be like, reviewing, checking in, maybe adding a little bit into that technique and stuff like that, and then doing a lot of like, Q and A and questions. Hey, you know, this came up for me and whatever. So that's the format that we're jumping into. So great. And if you have any questions on that, we'll have Q and A later, just later on in the program. So right now, we're going to just go ahead and jump into our poll that we love to do every month? So, so we're going to pop that up, and if you, if you would like we, we'd really love to have you participate in this poll. So just being able to answer these and see which one fits for you. So we're going to just take a few minutes let people read through these choices which one fits. And definitely if this last month, since we met last if you've had your first lucid dream, we really would love to celebrate that with you. So please let us know, and we understand if some people are shy, but it's always so wonderful to hear that somebody had their first lucid dream. And boy, since we started doing this, this group. Katie, Chelsea, do you remember kind of where we're at as far as how many people have had their first lucid dream in our group.

I don't know the exact number, but I think it was like two people, the first month, three, the second, two, the third, three, the fourth and four, the fifth. So some somewhere around 12 or 13, maybe,

yeah, so, so, yeah, that. So it's really exciting. Things are happening. People are trying new stuff out and and it's working. So isn't that wonderful? Okay, uh, Chelsea, do you think we've we've got enough people. Where are we at? Yeah,

we're about at 28 out of 33 people. So I think we're good. Like, okay, the results, yeah,

what do we got? Um,

so I'll go through and read them. So one person said they've never had a lucid dream. Nine people said they're unsure. Possibly have had a lucid dream? Zero people said had my first lucid dream in the past month. One person said unsure, possibly had my first lucid dream in the past month? Um, during the Q A that person that said, unsure, if you want to come on and tell us about your lucid dream so that we can explore it together. Feel I encourage you to do that, if you want to. And then the next one is three people have been lucid dreaming for a while, and did not have a lucid dream since our last gathering on June 22 and then 14 people, this is fantastic. Have been lucid dreaming for a while, and did have a lucid dream since our last gathering on June 22 so that's fantastic. Yeah.

Awesome, awesome. Thank you so much for for participating in that. That just kind of helps us out, and it's it's wonderful. So thank you very nice. All right. Well, onward and upward, we got the poll done, and so now Chelsea is going to introduce us to something that that really helps out with inducing lucid dreams.

Thanks, Bodi, so I am going to share a practice with you all today. We're going to introduce the nine breathings of purification, also known as the nine fold breath, or the nine breaths. And it's a Tibetan Buddhist practice that has been practiced for 1000s of years, and something that Katie, Bodie and I have been doing for many years, and it's really supported us. I'm going to share a general overview, and then Katie is actually going to be guiding us in the practice. So this practice aims to use the body to purify the channels of our subtle body and connect to our own one's natural mind. So the subtle body serves as a link between the mind and the physical body, and this practice is really a methodical way to remove mental obstacles and distractions and deliberately use the breath to alter one's experience. So why are we learning about this practice? And like in connection with lucid dreaming. So for an order, in order for us to have more opportunity to have lucid dreams, it's really helpful for us to clear out the karmic traces, to really clear out our body before we go to sleep, so that we're less likely to get distracted in the dream, and then we'll recognize the dream as a dream, and we'll become lucid. And so in our lucid, lucidity induction group in March, we actually discussed emptying out before bed, and specifically the practice of recapitulation and clearing karmic traces. And we recommend that you return to that recording that's on the lucidity and lucidity induction group web page at the very bottom, I already put the link in the chat, and that you return to that recording and really listen to that practice again. Because this particular practice the nine breaths of the perfect purification, is a great companion to recapitulation. And I know some of you just can't wait. And you want a reminder, you want to know what recapitulation is, so I'm going to briefly describe it for you. So recapitulation is reviewing the day before going to sleep and remembering what occurred as a dream so particularly difficult emotions such as anxiety, anger, distraction and disappointment, and it's really helpful to practice recapitulation before doing the nine breathings to provide elements to work with with the nine breathings practice. So getting a little bit more detailed into this actual practice, so this practice can be used as a standalone purification method throughout the day. So I find it's really helpful for me if maybe I'm going from one meeting to the next, or maybe like leaving work, and then I'm going to go outside or something, and I want to be more clear in my thoughts and in my body. I'll do this practice. It's also a great preliminary practice before engaging in meditation, or as part of your ritual, before going to sleep. And it can be really beneficial when your mind is speedy or racing or windy, or if you're experiencing insomnia, it can help clear the mind of distractions and negative emotions, creating a more conducive inner environment for self awareness, lucid dreaming and sleep. So this practice in particular, works with explicitly, with the subtle channel, subtle energy channels of the body. So you may be familiar with these channels, hearing about them in acupuncture or yoga, and these channels are actually the conduits of prana. And prana, or wind, are also known as chi, is the foundational energy of all experience, of all life. And so the concept of this practice is to really completely clear out all the stagnant prana. So Katie is actually going to show an image right now on the screen. So while I am talking about these energy channels, you can see them and start connecting to them. So in this practice, we take an upright posture that supports wakefulness, and imagine the three channels of light in our body. So there's going to be a white channel that's on the right, a red channel that's on the left, and then a blue central channel. So the central channel runs from the top of the head to the basis of the spine, and the left and the right channels begin at the nostrils, curve up to meet the central channel near the top of the head, and then run parallel to it to a distance about four finger widths below the navel, where they merge with the central channel. And I recommend just taking your fingers and doing four finger widths below the navel, just so you can get an idea of where that actually is in your body. So the white channel on the right represents anger and aversion, the red channel on the left represents attachment and desire, and then the blue channel, the blue central channel, represents self doubt and ignorance. And these channels are connected to our experiences of these emotions, and we can use this practice to clear our subtle bodies before sleep, to support healthy, spiritual well being and our ability to have lucid dreams. So there might be a couple of words that I used in that description that I just want to go back and kind of redefine for you, because it's important that we have a deep connection to these emotions while we're going through this practice, so we can know what we're trying to bring up in our body, in our mind. So the first one is aversion, where anger and anger, which is on the right side the white channel, and this refers to a strong feeling of dislike or opposition towards something, it implies a strong inclination to avoid or turn away from something due to discomfort, displeasure or opposition. So say, you hear somebody say something, and right away your whole body just goes, That's not me. I'm not that right, like you just feel a push. That's aversion. The next one is grasping. So grasping refers to the mental and emotional clinging or fixation of things, ideas, experiences or relationships, as if they are permanent, satisfying or inherently real. So for example, this could be an idea that you just keep having about maybe a conversation that you had and replaying it over and over again. Really common at the beginning of romantic relationships, feeling like you want to be around that person all the time, really grasping onto it, feeling like you need it to feel real. The next one is ignorance, which refers to an ignorance is the blue channel in the center. And I realized I forgot. So grasping is actually going to be the left channel, the red channel, that's attachment, grasping and attachment. And then ignorance is the center channel, ignorance and self doubt, which is blue, and that refers to the misunderstanding of the true nature of reality, particularly impermanence, unsatisfactoriness and non self, nature of all phenomenon. So when we are wanting to make things solid, lasting and dependent real, so that our egos can feel real, that is ignorance. And so to complete my section on this um, I'm going to read a little section directly from this book from Tanzania ricochet. It's called awakening the sacred body. I'll put a link in the chat when I'm done reading um, so that you guys can check this out if you want to. And he goes into real depth about the nine breathings of purification in this book. He also talks about it in the Tibetan Yoga is a dream and sleep. I'll put links to all of these in there. And then Andrew talks about it in his lucid dreaming workbook. So, all right, so once again, I'm reading directly from Awakening the sacred body by Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche, After reflecting on the presence of challenges in one's life, the focus is brought to the inhalation as the breath is imagined moving through specific channels in the body held slightly and then released in the exhalation. As the practitioner releases the breath through a specific channel, subtle obscurations are released, facilitating the recognition of openness. After nine successive breaths, the practitioner rests in open awareness, bringing clear attention to the openness itself and connecting to the source of all positive qualities.

And now Katie will be guiding us in the practice. Thank you everybody for listening.

Thank you, Chelsea, can you all hear me? Okay, good, okay, great. Nice to see you all. Thank you all for being here. So shortly, I'm going to guide us in the practice, and I want to add a few comments before I do that, comments and some description of the practice as well. So in this practice, we're going to be in meditation posture, ideally upright. If you have trouble sitting fully upright, just sit as upright as you can and have a mental posture of alertness and uprightness. So this could be done seated in a chair or sitting on a meditation cushion on the ground. The position with the hands is the tips of the thumbs pressing against the base of the ring fingers. And the reason for this is that this position closes a subtle channel that's associated with windy or speedy thoughts. So it helps to create more stability and balance in the mind. The hands will then be placed, one on top of the other, left on top of right and less and rested gently in the lap with the awareness of the three channels. For the purposes of today, we are mainly just going to focus on the visualization or imagining or feeling of the three channels, there is a more detailed version of the practice, which we will deepen into in the next session that actually visualizes the energy moving through the channels as we're breathing out the prana or lung or wind energy. But for the purposes of today. Since for many of you, this may be the first time doing this practice, we're going to leave that, the part, that specific part, out, and just feel the presence of those channels. If you do have it already as part of your practice, to visualize the movement of that energy. Please, please do that. And then we're going to go through the nine breathings in three distinct rounds. The first round will focus on the right channel and clearing the karmic traces, or as some call it, the root poison of anger and aversion. The second round will focus on the left red channel and clearing the root poisons, the karmic traces of attachment and grasping. And then the third, three rounds will focus on the central channel and clearing the root poisons of self doubt and ignorance. And in each round, we will have at the beginning a moment of silence to allow ourselves to connect in with specific experiences around each of those three poisons. So for example, in the first round, we will have a moment of silence to connect in with specific experiences of anger or aversion in our recent past. So it could be the day up until this point in the day, or if it's quite early for you, wherever you are in the world, you can go into yesterday as well. But we want to work with recent experiences because and the purpose of this practice is to do it before we go to sleep, so that we're clearing out the day before we drop into the dream space, so that we have more space in our minds and hearts for lucidity. So after we feel and let arise those experiences of anger and aversion, we will then bring our awareness to that channel, the red channel, just sensing it. And then we will do three purification breaths with that specific channel. So the first three breaths, we'll start with the right hand with the tip of the thumb pressed to the base of the ring finger, and we'll begin by blocking the right nostril as we inhale, the inhalation is slow and smooth. There's a brief pause at the top as we switch to the left nostril, blocking the left nostril, and then exhaling out of the right nostril, initially slow and smooth, and then at the end, there's some forcefulness to it, to make sure that we're expelling all of the stale wind out of that channel. And we'll do that three times. And then after we clear that channel, we will rest and feel the difference. Notice what happened there. Does it feel more clear? Does it feel more spacious? Does it feel more open in that channel? We'll repeat this same process with the left side, only this time blocking the left nostril first on the inhale, switching to the right nostril On the exhale, and then the third set of three breaths is with both nostrils, so the hands rested in the lap left on top of right, and inhaling through both nostrils, pausing briefly at The top, and then exhaling through both nostrils with again, that forcefulness at the end. And we want it to be forceful so that we blow out all of the stale winds. But we don't want it to be so forceful that it's painful or uncomfortable in the body. So think about having a middle path with that not too tight, not too loose. So I'm just going to demonstrate one of each of the breaths. You can see what that looks like, and then we will go into the practice together. So this is the breath for clearing the right Channel. And

the breath for clearing the left channel

and the breath for clearing the central channel,

and so breathing in this slow and smooth way prevents us from hyperventilating when we're doing this practice. If we go too quickly, we can our breath can become more shallow. We want to make sure that it's smooth and clear but also complete, in terms of clearing out the winds, completing the exhalation, fully emptying the lungs. Great. So with that being said, I will now guide us in the practice. So the invitation is to take a seat in meditation posture, either in your chair or on the ground, if you're lying down or reclining, just be as comfortable as you can and have an upright mind posture, pressing the tips of your Thumbs to the base of your ring fingers and resting the left palm on top of the right in your lap.

Your spine is straight and erect, but there's a sense of relaxation in your belly, the softness. Open your heart, chest slightly open, inviting warmth, connection. Chin slightly down to elongate the spine. And for this practice, it's nice to close your eyes, if that feels good for you,

and first simply bring your awareness to the presence of the three channels in your body. On the right side of your body, there is a white channel on the left side, a red channel, and in the center a blue channel,

the exit point for the right. White channel is the right nostril, the exit point for the left, red channel is the left nostril and the exit point for the central blue channel is the crown of the head.

As you feel the presence of these three channels. Also notice how you feel. What is the current state of your mind? What is the current state of your body? Simply take note of this and

and now bring your awareness to the root poisons the karmic traces of anger and aversion from your recent life within the past 24 hours, as we spend a few moments in Silence, simply notice what arises that you are averse to or that you have been angry about in recent time you

and feeling the presence of the right white channel as you raise your right hand up to the right nostril and begin the first three purification breaths, clearing anger and aversion at your own pace and your own timing, beginning Now you

and whenever You complete the three breaths, return your right hand under the left and simply notice the difference. Does it feel more spacious, more open, more clear in the right channel? Now?

And now bring your awareness to the second root, poison of attachment, grasping, and for the next few moments in silence, notice what arises for you around grasping attachment in the past 24 hours of your life you

and now bring your awareness to the left channel, the red channel, intend to clear these graspings attachments from this channel, beginning by bringing your left hand To the left nostril and completing the three purification breaths in your own pacing, In your own Timing, you

and whenever you complete these three breaths, return your left hand on top of the right and simply notice, does it feel more spacious, more open, more clear in the left channel now,

round three. Focus. Focusing on ignorance, self doubt, disconnection from our true nature, distraction, first, simply bring your awareness to these karmic traces from the past 24 hours, anywhere you felt this ignorance, this self doubt, let them arise as We sit together in silence For a few moments. You

and now bring your awareness to the central channel, the blue channel that begins four finger widths below the navel, goes through the body and out the crown of the head and

and for these next three breaths, through both nostrils, clear out these karmic traces, these root poisons associated with ignorance and self doubt, beginning now and

And as you complete These three breaths, notice how do you feel? Is there more spaciousness, more openness, more clarity? Is the mind less windy? Simply allow yourself to rest in this space for a few minutes in silence you

now, as you feel Ready and in your own timing, gently, blink your eyes open, stretch your arms and legs if that feels good,

coming back into the group space. Thank you.

And now, Chelsea, would you share the link for the 10s and wing yar Rinpoche video on the nine breathings of purification. There's this beautiful video that we are suggesting as optional homework if you'd like to deepen into the practice and experience an added layer, or layers to it, as taught by Tenzin Nguyen.

So Chelsea will share that. And thank you so much, everyone. And now we are on to Bodi.

All right. Thank you. Katie, so how was that for everyone? And how you know, is there any anyone in the group right now that has been doing this practice? You know about it? Maybe you do it a little different. Maybe do it more the way maybe Andrew taught you, or maybe a different teacher, maybe let us know in the chat you know, like you've been doing this, you feel it works, or something like that. That'd be great. And also, if this is the first time that you tried this, maybe in the chat, just let us know that was the first time, and what was it like for you? Was it, you know, did you notice something or or do you have questions? So that's where we're at right now. It's time for questions or shares. So we're going to go ahead and open it up to and just go ahead and use the little What is that thing as things you put raise your hand or something like that, and we can call on you and and

all right,

I'd love to hear how the practice was for you guys, just like in general, kind of experiences that you had, or if you felt any kind of aversion to, like a specific channel or anything like that. If you want to share around that or the person that was unsure if they had a lucid dream, so feel free to come on and share your experiences too that you've been having with lucid dreaming as well.

Looks like we got a question from Phillip. Phil I bill, go ahead. You're still on mute, yeah,

thank you. My question is about the nine breath, and in the way you do it, what is a sense of the of the breath. When you in breath, do you? Do you visualize a certain track, and on the out breath, another track for the three channel? Can? Can you say something about it?

Yeah, absolutely. So, yeah, this is the next layer of the practice as well that is described in the video, but I'll just describe it briefly here as well. So when we are clearing the right channel, we start by closing the right nostril, and as we inhale, we actually imagine the breath traveling through the left channel. So through the left red channel inhale, the breath travels all the way down to the junction at the base we switch. And then as we exhale, the breath travels all the way up the right white channel and out the right nostril. So it travels that whole course within the context of one breath. For the other side, when we are clearing the left channel, it's opposite to that, and when we are clearing the central channel, when we're inhaling through both nostrils, the breath travels up through both channels and then down to the junction. On the inhale and on the exhale, we exhale and expel it out of the central channel and out of the crown of the head. And in each of these cases, whatever we are expelling the aversion and anger or the grasping and attachment or the ignorance and self doubt dissolves into space as it exits these three channels. Yeah, so I think you're muted again. Let me unmute you. Does that? Did that?

Yeah, thank you. It's clear. And when, when dissolves, you imagine that it dissolve in a kind of black smoke, or whatever image come to you at a certain distance from the body. Or,

yeah, you could imagine it dissolving in black smoke. If that works for you, it can also just be kind of a dissolves into space itself. And I think it varies a bit depending on the person where they see it or feel it dissolving. So I would say, play with that in your own experience and see what works for you with it.

Thanks a lot. Yeah,

great questions. And the Tenzin Wangyal video has a beautiful video and imagery of what I just described that, I think will help also anchor that in your awareness. So I do highly recommend watching that. Thank you. All right.

Very good. Garrett, thanks. Go ahead.

Oh, we thank you. There you go.

Yeah, that was my first time doing the practice. I really, really enjoyed it. Thanks for getting us through it, Katie, and for the contacts, everyone, I think I felt mostly physical sensations. It wasn't so subtle. So I'm looking forward to connecting with that part of the practice as I keep doing it. I was focusing mostly on the breath, and actually felt my airways, not my subtle channels, airways like opening up and being clear, which is part of it too. I assume that was a nice feeling, and the question you just answered, Katie, was helpful. Because typically I think of holding my breath here, especially if I'm like holding inhale a picture in my head, but it's helpful to imagine it going all the way down to the junction of the channels. Thanks,

nice, beautiful. Thank you. Garrett Kincaid, thank you everyone for that. Put in, you know, a comment in the chat about how it worked for you. Dominica, I believe you mentioned that the breathing kind of stuff is hard for you to do, or, or some, some kind of difficulty, and maybe slight headache and stuff. So something that I, once in a while, just for my comfort, I might alter it as you know is that maybe I don't close off with my hand. So this is if, if you notice that it's you're having difficulty. This is an option, and so I've taken this practice and I've used it to focus on the energy, not so much the physical, making the breath go in one nostril out the other, and stuff like that. So you can actually take this and go into the super subtle and it's where. So I'll actually try to to make my breath go in one nostril, although I'm not using my hand. I know it sounds really weird, but I'm kind of breathing, but I'm focusing on the energy and the breath cleansing a channel by going in one channel and then coming out the other. And so I'm not really so focused on the physical now that might be for those people that you know, doing the the nostril breathing. It's difficult. It causes headaches. Maybe just try focusing on the real, subtle energy of the practice, and then subtly, you can go into it. I've also have just like gently put my finger to close off a nostril where it's not quite all the way closed. And sometimes, you know, maybe that day I just could tell, you know, doing the full exercise might leave me light headed or with that, you know, slight headache or something. So hopefully that helps, maybe gives something for you to maybe work with Dominica. So just something to mention. Man,

yeah, I have something to add on that too. Buddy that I've I've played with that as well Dominica, and sometimes I have a really difficult time getting a full breath. And something that's really helped me is actually before I do the practice breathing in as deep as I can, but like, not too fast, right? Like being really gentle with myself. So breathing in and then actually doing, like, a sigh, just like, and something about doing that several times can really open up that space for me in my lungs, and then also tapping like around the area too. So maybe doing like the side right here, this is like the lungs and then the other side, and then doing like the central right here, all the way down to your Sea of Tranquility, which I really love, that name. It's right in between your like nipples right there, then you go up, and you can just kind of like, do that to open up a little bit before doing the practice. And that might support folks too. So just play with it. Be gentle with yourself, and like with all of these practices, if it's not working for you, don't do it.

Yeah. Thanks, Chelsea, fantastic. Do either of you ladies, notice anything else in the chat.

Yeah, I see a question in here from Patrick. Question for all three of you before going to bed, what is your favorite relaxation technique to do to help you get to sleep? That's a great question.

Nice, nice. I can

mute it for a second.

Um, well, I have, I have a whole evening ritual that I do that's the Dream Yoga practice. So it's not necessarily specifically a relaxation technique, one relaxation technique, but before I go to sleep, I always do a meditation. Actually do the recapitulation clearing the karmic traces of the day. I do the nine breathing of purification practice, and then I rest in a meditation. And then I do a number of other dream yoga practices, which vary at different points depending on what I'm working on or focusing on. And then as I lay in bed right before going to sleep, I'm often focusing on whatever my main Dream Yoga practice is going to be, whether that's my intention or if I'm working with a specific practice like peace, expansiveness, power of presence and fearlessness, which are in the the Bon tradition, the dream yoga practices. So I'll focus on that um. And if I'm it's it's not very common for me to have trouble falling asleep, but if I am having trouble falling asleep for one for certain reason, I'll usually do a breathing practice. So I'll either do the 21 breaths practice like we taught in a previous session, where I'm breathing 21 times with a focus on visualizing a red Pearl at my throat as kind of a way of descending and settling, or I'll actually do a practice, which is having an exhale that is slightly longer than my inhale, so perhaps a count of four on the inhalation and a count of six on the exhalation, just as a way of emphasizing the exhalation the parasympathetic nervous system in on occasions where I do have insomnia, that's I'll Use that breath, and it helps quite a bit. Those are my Those are mine, so Chelsea or Bodi can share now.

Yeah, Chelsea, what do you got? I

have a very similar practice to Katie, but my go to that, I really love when I'm feeling like a little windy, is mantra. And we kind of went into that a couple a different session as well. I usually go to the own money pod may hum. And sometimes that will naturally just turn into an induction techniques, actually, and I'll go straight into a lucid dream from the mantra. So that can be really helpful. And we're actually planning on diving deeper into that as well in the next several months. So something to look forward to

cool for me, if I'm Yeah, usually I don't have a problem going to sleep, but sometimes I do the thing that I really works for me, and it's kind of opposite of what might work for other people, or What people say you should do. So typically you want low lights, no lights, or, you know, as you're going to bed, or even one hour before going to bed, to just bring, bring down everything but staring at a candle. So if I'm having a hard time going to sleep, staring at a candle, and you know, hopefully it's not too bright and Ida, so have it trimmed. But that meditating with where I'm focusing on the candle, kind of, just for me, somehow kind of clears the winds. I don't know, the flame, whatever it just, it does. And it seems like right after that, I can, I can go to sleep. So I don't know if, like Ed, the sleep doctor, would say, Oh no, you shouldn't look at a candle. I'm not. I don't remember. I think some people you know, but generally you don't want too much light when you're going to sleep. But I think for me, the candle works. And I see Chelsea's saying no shaking her. I think

a candle is fun. It's all good. It's like, it's you want, like, low light. So, okay, you just don't want to be looking at like, blue light, for example, or like fluorescent lights, you know, but candles are a beautiful tool to concentrate, you know, and release wind before sleep.

Yeah, I didn't want to counter, you know, say anything counter to somebody, you know, that's that's in Andrew's circle or something. But, yeah, so the candle works for me, um, and then breathing too. I'll usually do the breathing first. And if it's still I'm still, like, wound up or something, the candle for me. So there you go. Hopefully the those are some suggestions that help. And

yeah, we've got one more question in the chat, and then maybe we'll wrap up and do our blessing and dedication. So we have one for our media. I'm sorry if I'm pronouncing it incorrectly. Are our lucid dreaming dreams to be considered as meditation objects?

I'm

wondering, I'm wondering, armita, if you're here, if you can actually come on. Because I I'm not sure I totally understand your question, and I'd love to get you know where you're coming from with it in more context. So, oh yeah, I see you there. I'm going to ask you to

unmute. Oh, there we go.

I don't know if I will be going through gyrations of explaining what I mean by what I wrote, We dream, we lucid dream, and ultimately we want to go into deep sleep, which would be the sleep yoga, right? And not have all these constructions and visions in our dreams, you know, the lucid dreaming, basically, that's what I mean. But it should be an experience of of us being in the Bardos and possibly strengthening our concentration and absorption, absorption practice. So that's what it that's what I mean by my question, because sometimes just attached to our dreams, the fact that we're lucid dreaming, and there's probably just another level of it that we're missing.

Yeah, thank you for this. A beautiful question and a beautiful inquiry. And I understand where you're coming from with it now. So, and it's actually quite relevant to the practice that we did today too, which is really about clearing, grasping and diversion. So in sort of like Western lucid dreaming that is in the earlier stages, where it's done for maybe entertainment or self fulfillment, or self Yeah, self fulfillment, we might be relating to the dream in more of a grasping and diversion kind of way. But there's another way that we can lucid dream, or practice our dream yoga practices, which is actually the opposite of that. So there's a there's a type of lucid dreaming, which I think Ken Wilber coined this term. It's called PE lucid dreaming, which is where we're no longer in the dream space trying to manipulate the dream or even be active participants in it. We are more like a witness observer. We're more of a neutral party that is witnessing what is arising in our dreamscape or in our MindScape. So thoughts are to waking consciousness as dreams are to dreaming consciousness. So what we're experiencing in the lucid dream is really the thoughts and emotions of our mind, if we can relate to the dream as a witness in a PEL lucid way, it's actually a way of minimizing or grasping and aversion and ignorance. And it's also a way of identifying where we have grasping and aversion and ignorance. Because if we are in a lucid dream and we're walking Pell lucidly through the dream space, I do this practice often. I actually did it last night, when we're walking through the dream space, we can notice where we're pulled where we're like, oh, I want to go towards that great dream culture. I want to go towards that situation. And we can also notice where we're pushed away and where we're pulsed by and in the PEL lucid space, when one of those two experiences happens and we give into it, our lucidity decreases. We're not as lucid as we were before. So I find that working with Pel lucidity is a really beautiful way to work in the lucid space as a meditation practice, not cultivating or nurturing grasping and aversion, but really working with being more of a witness to our own minds.

Thank you. I appreciate what what you said, how Wilbur labels that experience because I had one that kind of threw me last week. And it was the experience of this dazzling bright light, which I experienced some time before, but my reaction was still the same of recoiling because it was awesome. It was stronger than staring at a neon light, you know. And a quick background is that my spouse is in maybe second stage dementia, and so he wakes up at night. He's not aware that he's awake. And in this dream, I witnessed that he was up and he was saying, we have a ghost in the house. And I said, it's okay, you're dreaming. Come back to sleep, and then all of a suddenly, as I stare out of the bedroom, this dazzling, electric body walks across the door into the Yellow Room. And you know, it was like a being. I mean, it was a, it was a young man, and he was totally bright, too, with his blue garb. But the sense was that he was, you know, just aimlessly walking in in the space there. But I recoiled, and I experienced fear. I woke up from the dream. In other words, I lost it, and I became aware that I need to strengthen my meditation practice. So

thank you. Anita, that's a beautiful share. And Chelsea, I wonder if you have anything to say about this.

I was actually um, finding answers for people in the chat, so I wasn't fully present to your share. Armida, um, but it sounds like you had a dream in which your husband shared with you that there was a ghost in the house and that what was, what was the last part, and I might be able to I'm sorry about that, asking you to repeat yourself. I

I don't have problems with ghosts or spirits. I mean, I've had some interesting experiences working for hospice as a volunteer. Now this It wasn't about him. It was about experiencing what you would experience in a Bardo, this dazzling, bright light, and it talks about it in each of the days that you are, you know, de escalating from day one into the ninth or 10th Bardo. Let's see. How did I write it?

I think you're talking about the Bardo of dharmata, which is the Bardo after the painful Bardo of death,

right? It's, it's this particular day would be day two of the Bardo So,

and what was your response to the light?

Well, it was so dazzling. I experienced it one time, and I did the same thing again. I withdrew, I got scared. I was awed by it, but it was hard to look at, and I broke the chain. You know,

many of us do, and thankfully, we have many opportunities in the Bardo, yeah, awaken because

it happens again and again and again. The light, yeah,

the light can happen. And then there's also just several opportunities in the different Bardos, in different ways, to become lucid. And that's the beauty. Part of the beauty of lucid dreaming is that we actually get to practice for the Bardos. It's one of the main reasons why I practice lucid dreaming. We get to practice for the Bardos while we sleep. We get to practice right now for death. This is the main opportunity to practice for death. We have no other opportunity. It's only in this life, and so that's what you're doing, yeah, and it's beautiful. So thank you for bringing that into the group. And really appreciate your shares. Thank you, Amina, and may we all I can go into the blessing right now, actually, okay, so may we all have lucid dreams? May we all recognize the light, the vibrant light that we each ourselves possess inside of us, our true nature as loving awareness. May we become lucid to this in sleep, in waking life and in dreams.

Thank you, Chelsea, thank you everyone for being here. We dedicate the merit of this practice, this gathering to the benefit of all sentient beings. May it be so,

may it be so. Thank you everyone, and we'd like to remind you that we're going to do this again. It's July 27 is our next meeting gathering, and so it's at 11 Mountain Time. So July 27 is the next time we're getting together. And we'll probably be asking you, How did it go with the nine breaths? Did you try it? How did it work? Did you have any results? So we'd love to see you back on the 27th and the other thing that we'd like to invite you, if you're not, if you haven't looked at nightclub, go check it out. See, look at the benefits and the different things, the different groups, activity and stuff that that nightclubs putting out. So we just invite you to check that out if you haven't. And that's I think about it. So thank you, everyone. Bye. everybody. Thank you for being here.