Call yours a surgeon, former state legislator and recent governor of Kansas. It's that last job title. That's the point of emphasis as a moment, Mr. Collier as a candidate for the Republican Party's nomination for governor of Kansas, it looks to be a showdown with Attorney General Eric Schmidt. The voters will settle all that in August of 2022. The doctor is joining the Kansas reflector podcast to delve into why he's running and what he wants to do as occupant of the governor's office at the Capitol. Mr. Kaul, you're welcome. Hey, it's great to be with you, Tim. Thank you for taking time out of your busy day. I know, I know, you're busy with all kinds of things. So let's get right to it. Why are you running?
Yeah, I'm running to change the direction of Kansas, Kansas needs to be the dynamic state where our economy is growing, where our kids see their future in the state of Kansas, rather than leaving the state and deal with the real issues that affect Kansans on a daily basis. And, you know, having been a governor. And also, as a surgeon, I'm talking, I'm with people all the time, and the direction that Kansas is headed. We're in exactly the wrong direction right now. And so my goal is, as governor, have conservative Kansas policies that really are dynamic and helping Kansas move forward, particularly over the next seven, eight years and changing the direction of the state.
Yeah, it's like turning a big boat around. You are lieutenant governor for seven years. And Governor for one year prior to the election of Governor Laura Kelly, can you point to any particular piece of unfinished business or policy issue and idea, from those days that you'd still like to pick the thread up? of?
Yeah, so as Lieutenant Governor and Governor, as Lieutenant Governor, I was the longest serving lieutenant governor in Kansas history. It's hard to believe. But it was, it was a really important experience going through what we dealt with. As I'm looking forward as governor, I walked in under very difficult circumstances that everybody understands. And within a matter of weeks, we changed the tone of Kansas. And we were starting to look forward as a state. And as I came in, we had to do a lot of things very quickly. In those first 100 days, we have a list of over 100 items, but things like transparency, getting school funding settled, dealing with the budget, trying to build additional plans as businesses, those were things that we started out with. And as we went through, and we were starting to change the direction of the state. We were we were seeing good results. And, you know, at the end of that year, Kansas was certainly in a much better place than it had been before. And I look forward to dealing with the problems that we have now. And as we're going forward, we can talk a little bit about some of those issues as we're going forward. But as the governor, you make hard decisions, and people expect you not only to be out there listening to them, but you're working 20 473 65 that, how are we going to move our economy forward, listening to people getting those job done, and having the principles the conservative values that really most cans and share that really are the basis of where we are as a state?
Three, your three years ago, excuse me, you ran in the GOP primary against Kris kobach. Who won that contest but lost to Laura Kelly, how are you approaching this election differently? I don't know if the the environment out there is is is different from back then or you're taking a different philosophical approach or a message. Something different.
Yeah. So we are approaching the situation differently, because we're in a different situation. That was the closest election in Kansas and frankly, in the country. In years, we had to change 175 votes out of several 100,000 votes. And so I look at that and say, Fine, we've got to do things differently. Everybody agrees that if we had won that primary, we'd be in a different position now that we would have elected a republican governor, then, as I'm looking forward to this. We are approaching it differently. We're in a different situation. For starters, we have President Biden and the democrats pushing down these unbelievable changes in social and economic policy that are adversely hampering the state. We have a governor who has taken the state and moved us in the wrong direction closing schools Keeping abortion clinics, open closing churches. And, you know, now that we're coming out of COVID, we're actually still slow and behind last month, we lost 1500 jobs in Kansas, where every other state is grown. And those are policy decisions. So I'm approaching the situation differently. We started earlier, for example, and weight earlier than what normally happens in a campaign. But I wanted to get out and look at people and talk with folks and really build our message. We're building a little different team, we have some of our old team, but we're adding a horn section, you know, to the band. And, you know, expanding what we do. This race is a very different race in the primary and the general, in the primary, instead of there being nine candidates on the ballot, we have to that changes things dramatically. If there have been one less person on that ballot, we probably would have had a different answer. And so, but the main thing, though, where we're still the same as you got to be yourself, and I am the authentic conservative with a long track record track record of conservative principles, as well as competence in getting the job done. So I'm just running for, here's who I am, here's who I believe. And here's how we do it. And we're building, you know, a big team. In fact, we already have over 100 volunteers. And that's, you know, we're a year and a half out from the general election, in people are fired up their concern. So our focus is going to be not only do we need to Fire Lord Kelly, but where are we going? I'm working on building a mandate for machine mandate for, you know, conservative values for making sure that the economy is growing with low taxes, low regulation, but a very dynamic economy so that we can grow over the next decade.
Okay, let's talk about issues. Voters in Kansas have an opportunity to express themselves next year on the subject of abortion. There's a constitutional amendment on the ballot that says Kansas women don't have a right to bodily autonomy when it comes to abortion. And that would be contrary to what the Kansas Supreme Court declared. Is this amendment necessary? What do you think about it?
Yeah, absolutely. The value of them both amendment is necessary. Under the current ruling that we had, you know, the state of Kansas was overruled on a number of issues. And what it looks like is in that original reading, is that there can be no restrictions on abortions. So the notion that a 12 year old child does not have to have parental consent to have this surgical procedure. We wouldn't ever consider that for any other situation. notions of we're going to use federal and state tax dollars to pay for abortions, Kansas are clearly against that. One of the policies of the Kelly administration was we closed our schools, we closed businesses across the state, but we kept abortion clinics open. And what the result of that was, Kansas saw a spike in our abortion number of abortions last year by 10%, we actually had hundreds if not 1000s of people come to Kansas for an abortion, Kansas being the destination for a dismemberment. Abortion is clearly not who we are. And so the value them both amendment allows the state to regulate it, you know, regulate this procedure, just like we would regulate any other procedure. And so I think it's very important that the issue of life be on the ballot, but then you have to have a conservative governor afterwards to make sure that those policies are put in place. And that's my goal is that we want to make sure that we have common sense restrictions on abortions. So we have fewer and fewer of them.
Alright, so school finance, k 12. Public Education always comes up in campaigns, there's been a lot of litigation in the state over that don't think you're a big fan of all that legal wrangling. But where do you see funding of public education going? what's what's your sense of it all? Do you think the money is too much too fast? And are you concerned about academic results?
Well, I'm very concerned about academic results. To me, the whole point of education is to get kids ready for the modern world. For a world where there is technology for a world where mathematics is important that their social skills and you know, the ability to read, those are important things, but also that their understanding of who we are as a country. You know, that America is is a country that has, you know, long term values that are in the declaration of independence in the Constitution, that these notions of, you know, critical race theory that, you know, we should set individuals apart on the basis of their skin color, and that the sins of our great, great, great grandfather's should be visited on children 200 years later, is wrong. We need to deal with race issues, and we and we will, and we will continue to do that. But this notion of setting people against people is absolutely wrong. And as I'm going out across the state and talking about that issue, people are responding. And I hear it in every town hall meeting, they're concerned that these issues are going to infect and that infects schools that you have ideologies that come into schools, you know, where kids are not learning the value of America, which we are an exceptional country, America is a place where you know, freedom is first and that the rights of the individual are first, rather than the rights of the state. And so, I'm going out, and I'm talking to folks last night, I was just at a visiting in Kansas City, Kansas, we had 87 people show up. And, you know, the issue of, you know, how, you know, critical race theory could come into schools, and that schools can be failing, they don't want to see that they want to see good educational results. And so, you know, one of the things that I'm looking forward to is, we signed the 1776 declaration, which really said that, you know, the patriotism of America is a good thing, and that teaching these values is important. And we've had several school board members sign on to that. And we've already had several 100 people signed on to our petition, you know, for that issue, and it's a hot button, and Kansans are concerned about it. So as governor, I'm going to do a few things. One is, we're going to do everything in our power, that that is not the basic education that critical race theory is not we're not going to be teaching ideology in school, we're going to be teaching math and economics, and, you know, reading and basic skills, but also, the skills for today's technology, with computer science and programming are essential skills for us. And we've got to be ready for the modern and see those opportunities here. We have some good schools, we have a few bad schools, we need to make sure that the schools that are failing, we need to get those kids an opportunity to get a better education. And I think, you know, when schools are failing, we need to come up with other solutions, whether it's a competitive school, or how do you rework that whole school district and that school system, those are important things to do. And we'll work with those local school boards in Kansas, much of that much of those decisions are in the local level. But as governor, you set expectations, and you make sure that they're followed, and that's what we'll be doing.
You're a physician, obviously, the covid 19 pandemic continues, throughout, we've had people openly reject the idea of wearing a mass social distancing, that kind of thing. And we know people are hesitant to get a vaccine in your medical opinion. What should we do about COVID-19 variants and what's happening in the state and elsewhere?
Yeah, so COVID, vac COVID-19 has changed our lives. And we're going to go to a new normal. And it's one that shouldn't be based in fear. It should be one that we base it on science, we base it on knowledge. And we also have the understanding that we don't know what the future entirely holds for us. I was just talking to a patient last night, that is one of the COVID long haulers and, you know, they're having all sorts of additional symptoms, and we're going to learn a lot over the next 10 years. And so we're gonna have to be open to dealing with that issue. But from my perspective, I look at this situation this way, I would have approached it very differently than governor Kelly. For months, Kansas was ranked 47th 45th 50th. In testing. Every state had the same opportunities for testing but in fact, Kansas had several large labs here in Kansas that could handle that. We didn't do that. We didn't bring those on in so Kansas was late. Behind, that's an organizational problem that starts with a governor, Kansas for months was behind in vaccinations, ranking 47/45. In it, we were lagging behind all of those, you know, for months and months, we finally are starting to catch up. You know, with that, and they've done a better job, but that's an organizational problem. Every state had the same procedure, number of vaccines, Missouri, you could get a vaccine much faster than you could in Kansas, I found that out personal. You know, in so deal it, those are organizational issues, then there comes the unemployment insurance issue. Kansas, we had over $700 million in fraud. And, in fact, not a single person has been arrested for those crimes. That's outrageous to me. And believe me, it wasn't all Nigerian, Prince's and the money is all out of the country. These are, you know, these things have not been prosecuted. And they did not in a timely fashion work to prevent them. Many other states took software that was off the shelf very early on, when they saw an early spike, Kansas has had two spikes in unemployment, fraud, that second one should never have happened. But it did. And then at the same time, though, I'm talking to numerous Kansans, who can't get the unemployment benefits that they need, that there isn't a responsiveness I have people reaching out to me. And when I reach out, back into state government, you know, they don't respond, you know, to individual Kansas, those sorts of problems. Those are management problems. Those are things that sit on the governor's desk that you got to solve. So we would approach them very differently. And, you know, we showed you dramatically how much, you know, we could change things in a very quick fashion. But as we're looking at Coronavirus going forward, you know, the Delta variant, the vaccines that we have that we use in the United States, CDC says it is very effective against that delta variant. And so I do encourage people to get a vaccine, but they need to work it out with their doctor in their own situation. In Kansas, we're now catching up with it, we have big gaps, particularly in black and Hispanic communities that have been left out of the process. And I think you need you need to really target you know, how you how you deal with that. Now, on the other side of that, is, this is an issue of personal choice, in the notion that we need a vaccine passport. In order to get along, I would have issued an executive order very early on banning such a requirement, thank those are individual decisions in Kansans. If you trust Kansans, and you educate them, they will make good decisions. And that's, that's who we are as Kansas. So, you know, I don't want us to be in the situation where we keep giving government everything like our social security number in our vaccine stacks, well, then, then now you're going to start create when you start linking that and start linking where you can go, what sort of job that you have. That's big brother, and we're not going
I'm thinking about rural healthcare. You know, there's a lot of communities out there that are a little anxious or just individuals that have to drive an hour to go to see a clinician. So you have ideas about improving rural health care?
Yeah. So I was, I was very fortunate President Trump asked me to run the National Advisory Commission on rural health. This is a commission that's been around for about 25 years to advise the president and HHS on things that we can do to improve rural health care. Well, I started that early last year, we had our first meeting at this obscure place you've probably never heard of, called the CDC, in February of last year, and, you know, we were looking at, you know, a number of health care issues for us. And we had to make some good advisory decisions. And a lot of those are things that worked in the background, but in a matter of six weeks, we started getting telehealth out to everyone that you could actually use your iPhone for a telehealth visit with your doctor. And I as a practicing physician, that changed the character of it before he had to send the person to a hospital so that they could have a camera they couldn't do it over zoom and they had to have this big add up the cost hundreds of 1000s of dollars. And then you had to have the same thing on the other side. That's not telehealth. telehealth is using your phone and being able to do that. And yes, there are some things that you can't check. But one of the things is being able to have that access to people very quickly changes things. I see it in my own practice, I'm a surgeon. And so you kind of think of that as largely I've got to see and touch and feel what's going on. And what we found is right now, in the post COVID, as things are starting to go down, I still have about 25% of my patients I see through telehealth. And it's a real benefit to them. Because we can see them a little more often. If they need to come in the office, I have them come into the office. But the big thing is, you don't have to drive two hours to go see the doctor, then waiting this waiting room for an hour get into the room, you see him for 15 minutes, and then you leave and you go through all that bureaucracy, you can still keep your job and not lose a day's work to do that. And this is a transformative thing. And I hope it continues on past the pandemic. Other things was getting additional money out to rural hospitals, there was about $10 billion that was distributed to rural hospitals. And in Kansas, you know, rural community hospitals, we have what are called critical access hospitals. And for decades, they have been, they've always had big financial problems. Most of their patients are Medicare patients, they're older patients. Most communities, what we're finding is, you know, they need that for their emergency services. And maybe there are some ways that we can help transform those. In right now we're going through a process that are looking at how can we help these rural hospitals cut, you know, particularly the ones that are failing, that, you know, the community really needs as a cornerstone, but they need some essential services they're in so we're working on options there. And I think that is something that's going to be really important for Kansas, it's important for economic development, it's important for keeping our small communities alive. So as we're looking at that, the other issue is on getting enough residents and nurses there. And in rural communities, there's actually we there's now money available that we could start up some rural residency programs, not necessarily through the University of Kansas, but a group of community hospitals could get together and do that. And if you have that local training, where there's this connection, you load up, what we found is that where you do your residency has, has the biggest impact on where you settle, to do your career. And we'd have a we have a very successful program that's been out in Salina. For example, where have residents and medical students out there, if we could do and spread that across the state in places like dodge and garden, that would really have a big impact. And I think it's part of the long term solution. But we're gonna need we need more medical students, we need more residences, we need more nurses. And we need more lpns and certified nurse assistants. And so when I was lieutenant governor, and as governor, we were increasing the funding for those nursing programs for those, those certificate programs through community colleges. And we saw a big increase in that and we need to keep that up and move forward.
What do you think about the idea of potentially expanding Medicaid to lower income Kansans?
So the issue of Medicaid expansion in Kansas, there's a couple things one is, most people don't want more Obamacare in Kansas, we'd rather have more private insurance. And what we're seeing with right now we have a program, which, you know, every child that is eligible is on Medicaid. In fact, the majority of children in the state of Kansas are in Medicaid. Now, most people don't realize that the group that is open right now are able bodied adults who have you know, who do not have a disability and have the capacity to work. And if they do work at even at a minimum, which if you are working, you would get eligible for Obamacare through that will be eligible through the exchange for a highly subsidy based plan. And what we found is that we What happens with Medicaid expansion is many people who have insurance, that those ensure that those companies that are insuring them are dropping their lower page that are lower paid workers dropping the Health Care Benefit. And what we're seeing is that the states have expanded Medicaid, the number of people on commercial insurance has gone down, rather than going up. And we're shifting people into a government program. And the problem is the Medicaid pays less than the cost of care. So it actually drives up the cost, you know, for rural communities in particular, and the the profit side goes down as well. I think there are better local solutions for us, rather than just taking on, you know, full Obamacare. And then there's one other thing, which is those rural hospitals who are hurting, and there are many hospitals in Kansas, that have three or five years of continuous losses of very small census, like less than, less than 200 nights total, in a year in the hospital. Medicaid expansion isn't going to save those hospitals. We could do that better by taking some of that money, and frankly, giving it to them working with the local community on a better solution, rather than doing p Do you do Medicaid expansion, those hospitals that are going to close are still going to close?
Let's I want to ask you about medical medicinal marijuana, what do you What's your view on that subject?
Yeah, so right now, we have several dozen states that have legalized either marijuana directly or medical marijuana or medicinal marijuana. I'd like to have some real data for this, that we, you know, treat this the same way we do any other medication that is prescribed. And we don't have those studies. You know, right now, and I think that's important. Kansas, as I'm talking to Kansas, there may be some ways that medical marijuana may make sense, but I think most Kansans right now say no. And as we're looking at that, you know, we now have this difficult situation where most of the states around us have now legalized marijuana, and we're gonna have to deal with that issue.
Yeah, even recreationally. I wonder if you could take I know it's hard to do 60 seconds and just tell folks about your humanitarian medical work from? Can you do that? Thank
you. Yeah. So I grew up in Hayes. And the issue of service was really what I grew up with that we're here to make a difference in our neighbors lives in. So I do a lot I, you know, more than 20% of my patients are no pay. Now, here in Kansas. Most people don't realize that, but I'm taking care of trauma, you know, hand injuries, facial injuries, things like that. But in addition, I work with an organization called International Medical Corps, IMC suggests love it if people would go and look at International Medical Corps Corp. s.org, is the website is the largest American organization that works in war zones. And in the last 25 years, I've worked in more than 20 different war zones around the world, places like Afghanistan, or Iraq, or I was the only surgeon in southern Rwanda during the genocide, in so worked in a number of places. And what I've learned from that is a lot of things. One is, you don't give people things, you help them help themselves. And they may be in their worst situation. But when they can take control of their lives, again, that helps not only helps them, but it helps their community build resilience and to respond. We make long term commitments. We've been in Afghanistan since 1985, and will still be there if the Taliban take over. Now, it will be in a different form. And probably a more violent form against us. But I've worked in a lot of these four zones. And you know, I've been there with people and they do shoot at us, and we've had IEDs. But I've also found the most amazing folks that are willing to serve their communities there. And the one other thing is, and I talked to them, and they'll ask me where I'm from. And I'll say I'm from Kansas, and they'll go, oh, Kansas, that's the real America. It's not New York. It's not Hollywood, it's Kansas. And that to me is who we are. And I think the rest of the world recognizes that we don't realize that just being ourselves is, you know, it's a special thing in and of itself. And I think that's kind of a way of saying, if we want to make America a better place, let's start here in Kansas. As a reporter, I sometimes battle the transparent government transparency issue. And I know when you were actually governor, you spoke about this topic. And as I recall, you, you're interested in making at least the cost, the public cost of obtaining public documents, less, less onerous. But is this though part of your portfolio?
Absolutely. Um, you know, I think government should be very transparent to people. And it's not just core requests, but it's the information that we give out. And that we, you know, we try to be responsive to people and we try to give people lots of information so that we can make real decisions, that legislators can make good decisions. And so one of the first things I did was, we brought in a number of executive orders for transparency to allow core requests, things like that, I still find this it, we still see government's blocking that. Now, even on the local level, I've seen a personal here that they would not respond to a former Governor's request for information on how they're dealing with how do they protect people's personal identities, will tell you the policy, so that that's wrong. For me, that personal transparency is important. And, you know, working with people and talking to folks, and it starts at the top, and part of that is having a governor who's out across the state, you spend three or four days a week, you're out, you're not sitting in Cedar Crest, and you're not seeing in the Capitol Building, you're out being with people, and you're going into agencies, and you're meeting with business people, and you're seeing schools and you're talking to moms, you know, who are worried about, you know, their food stamps. That's what that's what you do as a governor, and then you go out in your, you go to California, and you recruit a business from there, and then you go and start recruiting businesses from New York City, that in the way you do that is being visible, invisible, is being part of that transparency. And as people, you know, I think as people see this, they can trust, you know, we want people to trust what government is telling them. And a lot of times, they don't, and I don't blame them. And, you know, if they, you know, if they will share policies, you know, with the news media about or individuals or government officials. That breeds suspicion, and it creates problems.
The economy always comes up in campaigns, what kind of ideas are you throwing out there in terms of job growth?
So let's, let's first talk a little bit about the economy and the impact of it. And we're in this unique situation where you can actually compare two governors side by side. We've never had that opportunity in the modern world in Kansas. So we can take my years governor, Laura Kelly, his first year as governor before Coronavirus, and that's the end of my, you know, term, we have more Kansans working than ever before in the history of the state. We were at an all time personal income, we'd save two and a half billion dollars in Medicaid by making program more responsive so and what the result of that was, we had a $900 million surplus. So I handed Laura Kelly, a bigger surplus than any Governor's handed to another administration coming in. And in that first year, our growth rate slowed down, our unemployment rate stagnated. And we weren't seeing as many business formations, and then COVID hit, and we lost 38% of all the small businesses closed in Kansas over the last 1518 months. That's entirely the wrong direction. So how do you do as a governor, you know, I, I have a unique experience of everybody in government that I actually have had a business. I employ people, I make their paychecks and when, you know, when COVID hits and revenues go down, I give up my paycheck in order to make sure my employees you know, get paid so they can support their families, that you have to, you know, deal with, you know, the loans and mortgages and all of those things that they're that's it it's it's a hard job being, you know, a business person, but I think it's an important experience for a governor. And as governor, the way I look at is I want Kansas to be the dynamic state. Right now we're seeing South Dakota, South Dakota, is being the socks off of us, as we're coming out of Coronavirus. If we'd approach it differently, where we are lower taxes, lower regulation that we use are really valuable students that we have that we help them get their opportunities here, that changes the economic climate of the state. And we're on you know, we're in this cycle where we're just kind of trudging along behind everybody else. That doesn't work anymore. And, but we have all of the building blocks right here, we have the advantage of being in the exact center of the United States. So you can transport anything anywhere, you know, within 24 hours, we have one of the best workforces in the world. And our kids are great kids. And unfortunately, we lose about a third of our college graduates actually leave the state and they see their opportunities someplace else. I want to see those entrepreneurial opportunities here so that you make it simpler to have a business that you make sure that you have things like rural broadband, that we use the technologies such as starlink. And you know, some of the cable fibers that you get those access so that you can get them out to rural America, this would be an opportunity for us if we would have done those things, you know, where we keep taxes low, where we, you know, really incentivize creations of small businesses, we could be looking a lot more like South Dakota, or Texas or Florida, rather than looking more like California. So how is fundraising going? The campaign issue? campaign is actually going phenomenally well. This is it's too early for most people. Yeah. fundraise. And so you know, it's early, fundraising has gone much better than we expected.
With that we have a track record, you know, on fundraising. It's a little different environment. And as we're going forward, we're seeing that pick up. So we have fundraising is going very well. Another issue that's out there. Another strength of your campaign is the number of volunteers and people are coming out of the woodwork. As of last night, we had 121 people already volunteering for the campaign. And, you know, we when we did, we did an event in Leavenworth. And, you know, we had 15 volunteers show up in Leavenworth County, to help out with campaign. People are energized, they want to see, they want to see a change of state. And so we're out just being ourselves talking to folks, real listening to them. And we're dealing with real problems. And you know, as a surgeon, that's what, that's what I'm after. And so when you talk to people, you know, very directly about your hair solutions, what solutions do you have? How can we build this better, stronger, using your Kansas values? We get a big response on volunteers on fundraising, you know, and as we're looking across the state, we're out, you know, all over the place. And it's really kind of fun. I'm really enjoying it.
Before we before we have to go. I'm just curious, what are a couple of the other subjects that we haven't addressed, that maybe voters are, are bringing up on the campaign trail, they raising issues that, that? Maybe you want us to anticipate that question? For a moment. Yeah.
So people are bringing up a lot of issues. So I'm hearing. So I've heard from several college students that they're, they feel like they can't, the political correctness, CRT sorts of issues, that they can't write what they truly believe on their sad. I'm hearing a lot about education issue. critical race theory, the 30 by 30 issue is huge. We started a petition on 30 by 30. That was the notion of 30% of the land in the United States would be under some sort of federal protection. That doesn't, that doesn't sit well with Kansas. These are agricultural people that these ranches have been in their families for 150 years in many instances, and to have the notion that the federal government knows better how to use your land than the people who have nurtured it for generations is just wrong. And You know Kansans want Kansas solutions for it. So I hear a lot about 30. By 30. We've had several 100 people sign petitions on this. And there are meetings across the state that have actually attracted 50 100 things some time. The 100 people have showed up at some of these meetings across the state. A lot of people don't realize how concerned Kansans are. I hear a lot about concerns that this notion of socialism and defunding The police is a huge issue. And, you know, people want people believe in their neighbors who are policemen that, you know, their neighbors work hard, and they're, they're protected. And so I hear a lot about that. And that's really going to be something that's also going to be
an issue. Interesting. Well, we could keep going. But I want to thank our guests today on the Kansas reflector. Jeff Paul, you're a candidate for the Republican nomination for governor. Good luck, Governor on your race. I'm Tim carpenter. Thanks for listening.
