Okay, let's have everybody be seated. We're on the air. And I think I have everyone here. So, good evening. Today is Tuesday, April 25 2023. It's 7pm. And we're ready to begin the town of Estes Park Board of Trustees board meeting. And I'd like to start with the Pledge of Allegiance, please. So all stand up. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. All right. And we have a very special graduation ceremony. So I'm going to come down front and we've got our CIA participants here tonight so.
Well, welcome.
Let's see if this is on it is or welcome. Tonight, I'm pleased to welcome the participants from our community information Academy, better known as the CIA. So you're all agents now. Over the past two months, the civic minded residents have gathered us with us to gain a behind the scenes perspective of the town's government work for our customers and the community. They have diverse backgrounds and interests are busy with their own jobs and families, as well as volunteering in the community. The fact that they took a significant amount of time to engage in the CIA to further their knowledge of local government in their community is truly commendable. And I personally thank all of you, Travis.
Thanks, Mayor. That on, all right, I just can't hear it. That's troubling. I want to thank our public information officer Kate Miller and our management analyst Susanna Simpson, who helped to organize and facilitate CIA class. We really appreciate the time you spent on that. And this is not a small feat. The group of graduates you see before you today, spend time with Mayor co NYG trustee marching myself municipal judge thrower, former town attorney why in every town department director and I know all of them enjoyed their time with all of you and appreciated the good questions and feedback that you had for their operations. They also had the opportunity to meet with many of our local government district partners and find out how we all work together to do good things for our valley. Many of our CIA participants are already contributing the energy to important local causes. You may see some of them tonight in other aspects, and I suspect we'll see more of them in the future contributing as well. So thank you for your dedication to this program and also to the town and the community.
It's so nice to see you all here today. We had some hurdles this year with weather and luckily we made it tonight but this this is the hearty part of The group and there are several who couldn't make it tonight. But we'll go through all the names here in just a moment. But I just want to say thank you. That was an investment in your time. And it was a lot of fun. And I think for me, CIA is enjoyable, because we get to go out and show like, what makes it fun to be public servants. And I see enthusiasm and you guys for that. So I appreciate that. And we all learn the staff learn from you, and our elected officials as well. And hopefully you learn from us as well. And I think this is a nice step into civic involvement for some of you, especially those who are new into town. So thanks for spending that time with us. And I also want to, again, thank all of our staff and the mayor, and Trustee marching for spending time with the group. There are a lot of other departmental staff that welcomed you for the facilities to our to and that was, that was a lot of fun. So we appreciate your involvement once again. And I'd like to very much thank Eric White with the Estes Valley Library. The library was our partner for the first time this year. And they hosted the series, which was wonderful and very helpful. So that Eric might like to say a few words as well.
Thanks, Kate. Yeah, I want to congratulate all the graduates and when the town approached us about partnering on CIA, we're excited because it fits right in with one of our missions, which is to promote civic engagement in the community. And I got, I got to be the best of both worlds. I got to partner on this and be a student. I learned a ton and I appreciate the town, bringing this to the community. And yeah, we'll be excited to work on it again in the future.
Thanks. We really appreciate your help, Eric. Now, I'd like to read off your name's alphabetical order. We have a certificate from you. If you could come down. I'll hand that to you. We have a couple hands to shake and then if you wouldn't mind wrapping around here. We'll get a photo at the very end. So get started with that. At first Mr. Jeff Bailey.
Jeff, thank you so much. Hand Sanitizer has been used. Okay. I'm Bill Brown.
Thanks. Marcia Campbell
Mel causer
thanks for coming now. Christy crosser.
Thank you. Thank you. Scott SEF. Gentlemen. Seth and my unofficial official assistant Dana Klein.
Thanks for all of your help. Lonnie McDonnell.
Maggie Rothermel
Thank you Maggie, Carol Washington
and Jackie Wesley
I have a few names I'd like to read from the people who couldn't make it tonight. We also had in the class Laura Jane Bauer along with Chris Greenwald, Jim Hulu, SCA, Maddie COVID Avro Kumar, Hannah McKellar, Christine Winokur and Trevor Whitworth. So it was a hearty group it was a really great group so thank you. Now we'll we'll kind of line up if I could get the board to stand behind everyone we can. We're gonna have to compress
Eric and Jeff. need everybody get a little bit closer
This? So at the snow we can all go home now. No, I'm just joking. We need to stay. Let's go ahead and I'd like to have the agenda approval please.
Move to approve.
Second. It's been moved and seconded. Are there any comments from the board? Okay, seeing none, let's vote.
And it passes unanimously. So let's move forward at this point in time. We have public comment on any item that is not on our agenda tonight. So does anyone have any public comment they would like to state? Come down? Give us your name? And your address, please. Good evening.
Good evening. I am Steve cruder 1715 GRAYL court just wanted to thank those of you who attended the first responder initiative that we kicked off last night or last Wednesday at solitary cabins Lodge. Also want to thank you for all the support that you've shown this organization. It's a relatively new thing. And we just appreciate all the time that's been invested by our community. On behalf of Katherine who has stuck in some sort of traveling snafu, she sends her very best and she wants to thank everybody up here. And she wants to thank the entire community for the support. She was really impressed with the turnout last Wednesday, and just really felt like the community was just very much encouraged and loved what they heard. And she plans on being up here more often. Currently, Caitlin and I are setting up appointments with our logic colleagues, were able to start populating the Beller vacation website with some great list SS Park offerings. And again, we just want to thank you for that brother vacations restoration ranch. Was have some roots here. That's
okay. Thank you so much for getting involved in all of this.
My pleasure. Yeah.
Anyone else? Hi, come on down. Give us your name and address.
Hey, good evening.
My name is Bruce Darby 642 Aspen Avenue, Estes Park. And just I was a letter writer for the open position on to put a face to the name and thank you for the opportunity.
Okay, thank you very much. Anyone else? Come on down, Christine.
Hello. Good evening, everyone. Christine puppets I live at 650 Devon drive. I came to just for a couple of things. I wanted to say thank you to the mayor and to the police chief in acting on the written attack or harassments. Me I believe personally and or on the group that I'm involved with that happened last week. There is an ongoing or an investigation going into it and I feel personally attacked and harassed and I just thank the mayor for helping me get it in front of Chief Hayes and hopefully we can find the person responsible and there will be adequate punishment. On a lighter note, I wanted to say that we have 1080 signatures on our petition just to give you an update. I know you're all thrilled to hear that. And again invite you Pep Preserve. Estes Park has a meeting again this Thursday from five to seven at the American Legion. Pep is preserve Estes Park preserve Estes Park exists to act as an advocate and source of resources for the communities of the Estes Valley of Colorado. It is comprised of families and dividuals concerned about maintaining and improving the environment, wildlife and the quality of life in the area and is open to all who share the same concern. It is a nonpartisan, diverse and inclusive group and welcomes participants from all backgrounds who desire to keep to work together to keep the park in Estes Park. So that is the meeting. That is my group. And I thank you all.
Okay, thank you. Do we have another comment? Okay, seeing none, we'll move forward on the agenda. And I, we're ready for our town board comments. And, you know, Trustee McAlpine, I'm going to start at the other end just for fun. She always gets hit with that.
Thank you, Your Honor.
You're so welcome.
One thing that I actually had an opportunity to talk with Deputy Administrator and Mayor clinic about during this week's or last week's Mayor chat, I was reached out to by Deanna Farrell is the current vice chair of the tsunami sunset female advisory board. She just made some general recommendations on like the onboarding and sunsetting process when it came to all advisory boards. Talked to both Jason windy about it. And then I also mentioned it to the transportation advisory board. My plan was to just send those recommendations out to the town board transportation advisory board, because that seemed to be I think, our last advisory board at least for right now. And town staff through the clerk's office, just for feedback, and to see if there's interest in moving forward and implementing those into the new bylaws or standards for onboarding advisory board members in the future. Be careful, probably say it all the time, when it comes to the amount of construction that's happening in and around the Estes Valley right now. The detours the traffic is it's only going to get worse, it's only going to become more challenging as our tourism season really hits. Make sure you're taking advantage of our transit opportunities whenever you can to keep your car off the road. And then, yeah, just be patient. Be kind, there's a lot of people that aren't from up here. So please do just think about all the workers that need to get back to their families and so on. Appreciate it.
I have several things on my list tonight. But they're all fairly quick. So I'll try to burn through them. The first is just want to echo congratulations to the CIA grads. I went through CIA in 2019. And it really changed my perspective of what we offer as a community from our municipality, and also just all the ways that everything works together. So I'm really thrilled to honor you tonight. I know that's a long program. It takes a lot of time and effort. So kudos to you. I'm really glad that Steve Kruger was here, I was able to attend the presentation in reference last week, talking about restoration ranch and the value of vacations. And just as a recap, that's an effort that Steve and his wife Kay are working on in conjunction with our police department on how to make SDS a welcome place for first responders to come and take time to germinate and just restore themselves and their families. And it's just he's working really closely with the lodging community visit Estes Park in the chamber to just kind of establish us as a safe and comfortable space for our first responders. So it was a great presentation, I'm looking forward to supporting the work that they do there. I also want to thank manager soulsby for her presentation to the library staff. Last week, she came and spoke in front of the library to talk about parking and transit for this summer and just making sure she's getting in front of as many downtown touch points as possible. It was a great presentation, the staff was really appreciative of your time and just want to give you kudos for that. Thanks for all you do to be in front of various groups in our community. As far as my liaison reports, go the EDC we had an executive committee meeting last week discussing the transition plan for not only new staff, but also for our shift to a seven member acting board with our investors still involved on throughout the year. We have another meeting on Thursday about a potential interim CEO. So hopefully we'll have some good news to share after that, and then we have a couple of meetings in May to kind of tie up some loose ends and shift us into this next step. So looking forward to reporting back on that. Restorative justice. We have a meeting Thursday morning in this room. It'll be our first time meeting in person for me ever since I've been a liaison, but also for that board since COVID. So it'd be great to see everyone's face. And my last item is just to remind folks to get out and vote. We've got three great elections going on right now. It's really important that you Whoo. I'm from Chicago. So it's really important that you vote early and vote often. And make sure you get all your ballots in for the various elections, valid issues and board members. Lots of ways to have your voice heard right now, so please get your ballots and that's it for me.
I'm not too much I too attended the program for the valor and the restorative ranch and it was a great presentation, excited about what they're doing and Steven K are putting a lot of energy into that. And I have no doubt that our community will step up and be be a top notch contender for the top Colorado community to be present on that valor website. Um, as far as my liaison on the police auxilary Matt Thursday, they have a lot of events coming up. Course summer is a huge time for our volunteers, and we couldn't do it without them. And so just keep that in mind when you're seeing them out. Helping with the elk coming, you know, season calving seasons coming up. Just thank them for for all their volunteer hours because they sure do save our, our town a lot of money. They have the hours put in I can't remember how much it was last. Last week or a couple weeks ago, we mentioned how many dollars that they do save our community. So they're training, they have training, every time we have a meeting. And their training. This last Thursday was on the elk and the calving and that was put on by wildlife officer Chase. So he's took his time to come He usually comes about twice a year, fallen and spring to bring us to bring them information on how do they how they can educate the community as and more so the visitors on safe watching. So that's all I have tonight.
Okay, thank you.
Sorry. So the rooftop rodeo parade, rooftop rodeo rodeo. Let's go back. The rooftop rodeo parade is going to be July 6. So it's coming back. We haven't had it in a few years. This year's theme is a cowboy salute to the armed forces. So it should be really nice. The next meeting of the rooftop rodeo committee is Thursday, April 27, which is this Thursday at seven o'clock at the event center. And you know they need volunteers for the rodeo days, all fashion but people that want to work every night to Rodeo or if you just want to work a few nights that rodeo it's a really a great organization. It's really a wonderful group of volunteers. So we have a little reorganization this year with we have a coordinator for the entire radio and it's being run a little bit differently. But the whole fun behind the volunteer part is all the same. So what we do is we really welcome anybody who like to just see what's what it's like and what you can do. And you don't have to be, you know, a wrangler to be in the rodeo. I mean, you can work tickets if you want, but there's so many positions that we need people. That'd be great if you want to volunteer to please come and show up at the meeting. And that's it for me.
Okay, Barbara. Almost last but not least three small items I attended. Excuse me, I attended the electric vehicle ride and drive event, which thanks to Vanessa soulsby for putting that together. It was held during the Bigfoot Days Festival, rather, rather a chilly day. But it was it was great to see some of those little cars sitting there waiting for people to drive them. And we had the pleasure of trying out a Kia Nero, which I had never heard of before, but it was very smooth. As I told Vanessa, it would be great in the summer and probably the fall here, but it's two wheel drive and for our driveway would have been a dead issue. So we're still looking at well get there. Anyway, I think it's great that the town is supporting, letting people know what's out there in terms of EVs and what they might want to do about them. Last Tuesday was the planning commission meeting started out with a study session that was focused once again on aspects of the missing middle also known as medium density housing. And that was followed by a regular meeting in which the main agenda was as it turned out reelecting the officers for the next for the coming year. So Matt CommSec, Comstock will continue as the chair and Matthew Heiser will be the vice chair and then the Last item. Last Wednesday night I attended the EV student nature Film Festival. This is put on through the land trust, but also with the school district. And it's a kind of a combination thing. There were 12 Moody 12 movies produced by high school students. I'll have to say the students in this day and age are way beyond anything I ever saw as it for years and years. In any event, it was very impressive. Some were a little bit better than others. But it was a major endeavor on the part of the students nature film was the emphasis, there were a number of them that really dealt very specifically with environmental issues. And that was good to see. The one that wasn't exactly nature was skateboarding. I guess that's nature, if you look at it in a different way, but that one was quite interesting also. And the thing that I took away from it, in addition to the fact that these kids really know how to do stuff that's impressive, was that they had some interesting comments about what town what the town and really what town government is doing. And it was fine for them to say that was a little bit critical, which I'm always good for criticism. I think that they didn't know some things that maybe they either learned in the process or still don't know. But the films are going to be available at some point. And I think I will be sending links to some people here within town government who might get a bit of a charge out of it, but might also want to figure out ways to get out a little information more effectively, because some of the content for way off the wall. But anyway, it was a good experience. And I this was the second year they've done this, and I I'm pretty sure they will continue. And they had a reasonable amount of funds that are going to be awarded to the top three films, sometime in May burden Tim's was behind the funding on that. So kudos to all of them, really, it was kind of knocked me off my feet. Thank you.
And I'll give the final report. I went also to the first responder meeting. And it was wonderful to see all the involvement in the town. And you know, we forget first responders are across the board and all organizations in town really take care of all of us. And you help each other take care of us. So it's an opportunity for maybe our community to help take care of you when you've had a rough rough patch. And I think that's really very important. So I kudos to Steve and his wife getting that started and connecting and chief Hayes also came which was really nice to see him there. And he was able to talk to all the officers from Lakewood that had been involved in the original incident. The meeting that I have this week is TRPA. It's in Fort Collins. It's not tomorrow, which I'm really glad about with the snow coming down, but it will be Thursday. So I'll be driving down there on Thursday morning. And I had already reported on some of the other events that I had been in. So we're gonna move forward now to the town administrator report.
I mean, I don't have any comments this week. Thank you.
You were on vacation. Did you have a good time? That's a comment.
I did thank you. It was nice to catch up with my family and it was much nicer where I was and where I am now. Yes, for sure. From sorry. Thanks Travis. It was 70 degrees down there. And I come back here to snow in July when it's 100 and tendon down there I'll be much happier to be here.
Yeah, you say we're like family and just now you ever said that we're not just like family.
I'm glad that my review happened a couple of months ago.
Maybe she'll forget what just happened tonight. All right, well, let's move ahead to the consent agenda. And we start off with the bills and second item is town board minutes dated April 11 2023. town board study session minutes dated April 11 2023. And town board strategic planning study session meeting minutes dated April 5 20 23/3. Item is the Family Advisory Board minutes dated March 2 2023. And special family advisory board minutes dated February 24 2023. Acknowledgement only fourth is Estes Park Board of adjustment minutes dated January 3 2023. Acknowledgement only. Fifth Estes Park Planning Commission minutes dated January 17 2023. In Estes Park Planning Commission study session minutes dated January 17, February 21 and march 21 2023 acknowledgement only 2023 Art in Public Places aipp yarn bombing application has Solution 42 Dash 23 setting a public hearing for a change of location for a tavern license liquor license held by Montego Bay enterprises Inc. Doing Business as the Whopper at Colorado pub. From 247 West Elkhorn avenue to 1350 Fall River Road Estes Park, Colorado 80517 for May 9 2023. Resolution 43 Dash 22 setting the public hearing for a new hotel and restaurant liquor license application for Montego Bay enterprises Inc. DBA the downtown eatery 247 West Elkhorn Avenue, Estes Park, Colorado for May 9 2023. The ninth item is resolution 44 Dash 23 setting the public hearing for a new hotel and restaurant liquor license application for all international kitchen LLC DBA. All international kitchen 145 East Elkhorn Avenue units 300 to 400 304. Estes Park, Colorado for May 9 20 23/10. Item is correcting the appointment of Richard Dowling to the Estes Park Board of Appeals for a term expiring may 1 2025. Is there any member of the public wishing to have any item removed from the consent agenda? Okay, seeing none. I'd like to have a motion to approve the Consent Agenda.
I'll move to approve the consent agenda as presented. Second,
it's been moved and seconded to approve the Consent Agenda. Is there any other comments from the town board? Seeing none, let's go ahead and vote please.
And it passes unanimously. Let's start with the reports and discussion items from outside entities. New initiatives for future success SS Park museum friends and foundation Eric Adams Estes, Park museum friends and foundation Inc. President. Hi, Eric. How are you? Doing? Good. Thanks for being here today.
I have reached a point where I'm going to pull these out just in case anything but we'll see. They don't pull it off without him. Good evening, trustees. Madam Mayor, administrators. Thank you for the opportunity to share what the SS Park Museum, friends and Foundation is doing. On behalf of the Friends and foundation. I'd like to acknowledge and thank the Board of Trustees for including in your strategic plan. Within the outstanding community services goal, the statement that we will preserve and make accessible the history of Estes Park to understand how the community became what it is today, and to make informed decisions about its future. The mission of the Friends Foundation supports. The mission supports this through fundraising and advocacy for the essence Park Museum. Now I'll go through some kind of a broad overview of the organization. Start out with financial support. The friends provide roughly 20 to $25,000 on an annual basis to the museum budget. This provides funds for museum services that include exhibits programming and education, collective collections care, museum advertising, and the printing of the members only newsletter three times a year. The friends have also committed to contributing at least $10,000 annually to the ongoing project to digitize newspapers. This is a double match to the town's $5,000. Another contribution is that the friends apply for grants on behalf of the museum that they may not be eligible for as a municipality. These grants are sought out based on an annual project needs. The friends are fundraise since 2016 to contribute towards the professional collections and research facility. This will happen with upgrades to the museum annex facility. The friend has donated nearly $100,000 towards improving the building foundation to support the preservation of more than 30,000 artifacts which are valued at over $2 million. Another $400,000 has been raised and is set aside to spend during 2023. That money will be put towards a new H vac system, installation of new security cameras, installation of a new fire and security alarm system LED lighting and potentially the installation of a compact storage shelving units. With these improvements of the annex building for collections and research services. It's important for the town to budget for maintenance to protect the value of assets inside have enough. Having a facility at museum professional standards ensures the preservation of artifacts for posterity and better sets of museum To achieve its mission volunteers. We know volunteers in this town is amazing and we have our fair share. volunteers serve on the board and on committees and subcommittees. There are four standing committees, the executive investment advocacy and fundraising. Within these four committees, there'll be several subcommittees that will include membership events, press, and table setting. And I didn't know what table setting was either until recently, but talk to me and I'll tell you all about it now. Membership, we wouldn't be where we are without our members, and currently we're at 389 members. We hope that each and every one of you are a member. And if not, please see Christie crosser because, you know, she'll be in her arm just as hard as she did me to get me on this board. So, a little bit of the history, the essence Park Museum, friends and foundation incorporation was established in 1979. And it's varied in its title and organizational structure over the years, but always with a focus on supporting the museum. The town took over museum services, and the friends became the primary nonprofit support for the museum. Right now we have a transition board in place for this calendar year. Previous boards for the past 16 years had an employee. When this employee resigned, there was a void in daily services which the immediate past board stepped up to fill. Unfortunately, daily operations consumed enough times, and the governance of the nonprofit was overlooked. The previous board has voluntarily resigned after approving new bylaws and a mission statement and making a financial decision to close the museum shop in order to install a new board with a focus to better align the organization with museum goals. The current board is interested in forming a subcommittee to consider reopening a retail shop at the museum. And another priority is to sell the remaining Then and Now books authored by historian Loretta vessels Park James Pickering with make cleaner and museum director Derek 14. In order to accomplish these priorities, that transition board will focus on good nonprofit governance, sustainable practices and new policies to ensure consistency with an emphasis on partnering with a museum. In short, our job is going to be to get the groundwork set and get a framework set for a new board to come in, in the next year. Prior to the resignation of the previous board, they had the foresight to adopt new bylaws and this is allowed for an organizational restructuring. As we're talking currently on the board, the President is myself. The Vice President is nine and McGivney. You're in the back. Secretary Christie crosser right back here. Why she was on the CIA, I'm not quite sure because I think she could have taught that class problem. Our treasurer is David Hemphill. And we have a director at large Jan gal housing. So what's next, appointed committee chairs will be meeting with current volunteers and existing subcommittees to establish goals and budgets. With those interested in retail opportunities, a plan goals and budget will be discussed and developed after a decision is made to open a shop. The board is excited about a new webpage on the museum's website. Thanks to museum staff Makayla funding for her design skills. Grant application was submitted to the village thrift shop that powerhouse of grant giving here in our community, to partnership with museum staff and this was for supplies to properly store valued historic loose photographs, and that grant has been ordered. Most importantly, however, the essence Park museum Friends Foundation will continue to partner with museum staff and support the museum's strategic initiatives, including working to adequately staff the museum to its fullest potential. That's a brief overview of what we're looking at doing, how we are organized now, and how we plan to move forward from here throughout the next for the rest of the year. We'll see how much action takes place as we move forward as we get everything kind of set and the framework created to help guide a new board Coming on into the future by having any questions.
Any questions? You guys are busy. We are. Yeah,
I just like to thank you all for stepping forward on this. You fill the vacuum and it looks like you've got a lot of energy and we appreciate that.
Thank you. And my arm was in a sling here recently, our tiniest board member twist it so hard it was just now it's getting back to
anyone with any other questions? Thank you very much and we look forward to seeing all the progress. I appreciate the time. Okay, thank you. Let's go ahead and discuss resolution 45 Dash 23 opposing Colorado Santa Bill 23 Dash 213. And we've got attorney Kramer.
Thank you, Mayor. So I put this down as an action item even though we had direction from the board already, to bring back a resolution opposing this bill. In case you all had any questions or in case I had updates to share, because as we talked about last time, when you all directed us to advocate against the bill and bring back this resolution, the bill could look very different at this time than it did at that time. The truth is, there's been so much going on with this bill, that it's hard to isolate exactly what is changing and what is not. And that's not just because the amendments that have been put forward, are so lengthy. It there's been a storm of them. There's another committee meeting for the Senate Appropriations Committee tomorrow, they may make a number of very significant changes to the bill. On the other hand, they may not we don't know, the Senate housing and Local Government Committee, met and did recommend amendments as part of the committee report to the body, the Senate as a whole. That was I believe, last week, early last week. And that would change a number of things about the bill, a very extensive amendment, it would change a couple of things regarding accessory dwelling units, but it would leave most things the same. So that's a recommendation unless the bill is changed extensively even further, that would most likely become part of the bill that the Senate adopts whenever the Senate as a whole takes it up. So that would change a couple of things about the adu provisions, namely, the size requirement would change to 500 to 800 square feet, regardless of the size of the principal dwelling. And also, the setbacks would change, you might remember, the setbacks were very small maximum of five feet, it would become the same as anything else required for a single family dwelling in the zoning district. So so those were changes, especially the latter one that would probably be welcomed by the town board. At the same time. At the moment, at least, all of the other provisions regarding accessory dwelling units are recommended by that committee to remain the same. So without any official changes to the bill, at this time, I wouldn't recommend any different course of action than what the board was considering at the last meeting. Of course, anything can change moving forward. But with that storm of amendments and the potential for all kinds of changes. I just wanted to give you that update and see if you had any questions about it.
So you're recommending using the resolution 45 Dash 23?
Correct, Mayor, you have in your packet, a resolution that would take a formal position of the town. We have been advocating with legislators on the town boards position, but a resolution is really the formal way to do that. And we can communicate that to legislators as well. Of course, we're not recommending that the town board oppose the bill. That's really a town board policy decision. But we can advise on different aspects of that. And if you would like to oppose that bill, then yes, I recommend this as a good way to do it to do that.
Well, it says the town of Estes Park opposes the adoption of Senate Bill 23 Dash 213 and urges the members of the General Assembly to reject it. So we are opposing it. In this resolution,
I think he was saying that it's staffs position isn't that they could support it. Yeah, right. Maybe would just be us making that decision. Right? Right. Correct, though.
Okay, any comments?
Do you have any sense of where this is going? It's been really interesting to watch.
Trustee McAlpine if I were a betting man, I would sit this one out.
This has had so many changes in momentum changes in direction. It has been pared down. The bill as a whole almost went away at one point, according of course to rumors, and I could not make a prediction on that. I think that we may learn a lot tomorrow with the Senate Appropriations Committee hearing.
And are you watching those hearings?
Trustee McAlpine I am watching parts I should say listening to parts because video was not online. Okay. The last one lasted seven and a half hours. And no, I listened to the pertinent portions of that after the fact.
We'll give you lots of credit for using judicial judgment.
Sounds good. Do we have any comments from the public? anyone who'd like to speak on this welcome to come to the mic. Okay. Then I'm requesting a motion. And a second. Regarding the resolution,
I'll make a motion to approve resolution 45 Dash 23.
Second, okay. It's
been moved and seconded, either. Any more comments from the board? Seeing none, let's go ahead and vote please.
Man That passes unanimously. So I guess you get to present that. Thank you.
Thank you, Mayor. And we will communicate this to our legislators. I should also know that I will continue to advocate for this bill to have less of an impact on the town of Estes Park, even if it does pass in some form.
Thank you so much, may or
may just make a quick comment to that. For folks who are wondering, you know, we're referencing a lot of the discussion that we had, in our last meeting about this, that I'd encourage folks to go on to the town's YouTube. And if you have questions about the comments that were made there, I think a lot of us aren't repeating them, because it's the same conversation that we had at the last meeting. But I'd like for folks that are interested to go and listen into those because I think it gives a lot of insight on on why we are so firmly in this direction. Thanks.
And I know actually, prior Mayor Troxel has a whole item that he's doing in Fort Collins getting people to sign on and they're opposed to it, they feel the bill just takes away the individual towns rights to make their own decisions on their property uses. So that's kind of in a nutshell, what it deals with. Thank you very much. Let's move on to our next item. Turn to the correct page. We have setting the public hearing for ordinance 04 Dash 23. A man amending chapter 14.12 of the essence Park municipal code to adopt the 2022 editions of the international codes including the International Building residential existing building, fuel gas, mechanical, plumbing, property maintenance, energy conservation and swimming pool and spa coats. With amendments. I don't think it deals with alcohol within the spa does it. So I hope not quite so jovial. Thank you very much.
Thank you very much, Mayor and trustees. Thank you again for the opportunity to have a what we're hoping is a fairly brief discussion this evening. That's really built on the many discussions that we have been having with you over the course of the past year or so. So I appreciate your time and your attention tonight. I'm going to I have many people behind me that can support this, I also have some people to my right that can support this, namely, Dan Kramer, who is our town attorney. And he's been enormously helpful. As we've been wading through the complexity of all of these codes. We have Christine Brinker here who is a code consultant, and she has been helping us out. I do believe that her participation in the last meeting was enormously helpful to clarify, especially with our energy code. So we're back up tonight to focus and to have a little bit of a discussion in order to clarify our direction as we set the public hearing. And this has been a learning experience for myself as well. This is the first time that I've adopted building codes. So I appreciate your patience and everybody else. As we've been working through this process, it has not been fun. But I do believe that the end result is going to be what we're all hoping for, and that it's also the result of a lot of good thoughtful dialogue with the community and also with the board itself. So again, tonight's meeting, we're setting the public hearing. What that means essentially is after tonight, and we have some questions for you, before we are off to the races, we will be bringing this back to you on May 23, to adopt the suite of building codes. With some clarification after this evening, all of the information is going to be available in the clerk's office. So any member of the public that may want to come in and learn more about those codes. We invite you. They'll have all of that information. All of the code looks will be there. We are always available in community development, pardon our mess upstairs to answer any questions should any of the public need to get with us and then we're also planning on a discussion with all of our contractor is prior to May 23, so that we can answer questions and clarify any confusion that may be out there, because I'm sure there is. So, in your memo, we actually had four different options that we laid out that we would like you to consider. And really, this, this discussion is going to be about that as well as the discussion about sprinklers that is located in the IRC. We were directed to leave it as we had presented it to you in a study session, gosh, two sessions ago. But we are coming back because we want to make sure that we have that clarity from you. And if you want to go in a different direction, that's fine. We do have some folks that would like to speak on that. But those are really the issues that we wanted to talk about tonight is just addressing the energy code. And those appendices that Christine really helpfully brought up to us in the last discussion, our staff recommendation based on researching all those various options, and then answer any questions that the Board may have. Okay, thank
you. You're welcome.
Okay, so what I'm going to do, I'm going to, these are the appendices that we were talking about, that are sitting on the screen. And there are essentially four that Christine mentioned to you. And what staff is presenting to you at this point, are two appendices that we find the most useful with respect to the energy code, the 2020 2021 energy code. So there's appendix RB, you can see all the language there. This is solar ready provisions. And then appendix CB, which is solar ready, zoned for commercial. So basically, the difference between these two are residential and commercial. So hopefully, that's relatively clear. The board may, obviously you have lots and lots of options. What we're hoping to do is narrow this down a bit that have these particular appendices. We also have another option, which is the board could choose to say, Okay, we're we'd like to adopt the 2021 Energy Code. With these two appendices, Appendix RB and Appendix C, B. Or the Board may choose to say, let's adopt the 2021 Energy Code and the Colorado model electric ready and solar ready code, which is essentially supplanting those two appendices. It's there's so much overlap between the two that staff felt like it was, it would make more sense to go with one or the other. So we are also here today to answer any questions that you may have about that. That was all in your packet. Christine is here. Also, if you have any questions, as well as Gary Rusu, who is our Chief building official? I'm going to keep going. If you have any questions, please stop me. Staff does not recommend adopting appendices RC and CC. I'm not going to get into too much detail about this because I'm learning about them as well. But generally speaking, what from what we are aware of there, there's only one municipality in Colorado that has taken on I believe, only one of those appendix appendices. So we would like to take a little bit more of a conservative approach and go with the other two appendices or the Colorado solar, I can't even say the entire code. The previous page, I'll arrow back to it. And now arrow before that, are next to it. Okay. The other options that we have that are in your staff memo. Before I continue, are there any other questions about those particular appendices? Because we can go back and address them right now.
I have a question. Can you clarify, go back to the previous slide, please. So I'm confused as to what number two is, if it is, if it has our B and C V in it. So they
trust young one day, they they this Colorado model electric ready and solar ready code, as I mentioned, would actually be it would supplant them. So it would it would be the substitute in lieu of those two appendices. This would replace those we feel like there's enough of an overlap between all of these things that we feel it addresses all of the issues that those two appendices actually cover.
So there's really no no significant difference.
I will not go away specifically, but I will lead back towards my colleagues and say come on up if you would like to clarify that but to my knowledge, it is not significant enough for us to point anything out of note
in in within that question, that does not require solar to be installed, which I believe a CD that's that's an important piece of that, I think. Okay, okay. Thank you.
You're welcome. Yes, Trustee cineq.
Just I think it's pretty obvious that I'm usually into less regulations and more um, So if you just remind me again, because it got so confused with the Arby's and CBS and IECs and you know all these letters. I know we're required to kind of accept one of them, because then if not, we're going to accept the building code that's farther ahead eventually and get all that. But why are we plussing? The appendices? I mean, why couldn't we just go the I the 22,021 IECC, and not add more regulations on to us, then the not
so trusty, you might have you skipped ahead in my presentation. So I will get to that the board has discretion over what you would ultimately like to adopt, we are bringing it to you. And also including it as we set the public hearing, because that was requested by the board at the last meeting that they wanted to see all of it. So it's really a question of after tonight, if you have any questions about it and would like to clarify, we can provide that information. And then what we're hoping to do is take your direction, we will prepare our ordinance to reflect that direction. And then we will bring that back to you in a public hearing on May 23. Okay, thank you. Yeah,
absolutely. And something I kind of liked to just remind because I looked into this a little bit more. And on the solar ready provisions, I was concerned how much money does that add to the cost of building homes, particularly if we're also using it for our housing, homes. And my understanding is it's really running a conduit to the electrical hookup box. And being sure there's enough open space that if someone wants to add solar, they can. However, most solar companies, which happened at my house, they come in, and they just do an external plugin to the power box. So this is something that seems like it's really complicated and wonderful to do. But it's at this point in time, it's not because they don't have to use the conduits that are put in and it adds a few $100 to the cost of building the home. So I think a lot of us don't understand you think they're going to run lines all over the house? And they're not. But the important part is I understand is it allows trusses to be installed that would support the solar panels, and that part's probably more important than the conduit, I would think is that correct?
Mayor? I am not going to answer that question. I'm going to let chief building official Gary Busey to speak Okay, thank you, as
far as the location of solar panels, it will require when they submit their plans to build a home, that they designate the area the solar panels will go. And in that design is when they'll beef up, basically, the trusses to handle any extra weight. It's not a lot of weight, I mean, we put on there putting them on roofs now that are, you know, 2030 year old Roos, without having to do that the panels aren't very heavy. So that's that's that part of it. The other part, like you said, is the conduit and stuff. The idea is to encourage the solar companies to use what's available. But we have found in a lot of jurisdictions that are just running them upside up the side of the house over and, and so but it's it's available, and leaving that extra spot in the panel box for the breakers so that the cost down the road is not there for them.
Thanks for clarifying that.
So I have I tried to read this stuff. If I were quizzed on it, I would fail and there's no question about it. But and I won't ask you to do this. I'm sure you'd rather pass. But I would just be interested in hearing some of the very major differences between the Colorado model electric ready and solar ready code versus C. RB CB, did I get that right? Yes, you got
it. Well, how about this? Why don't I I'll run through the presentation. And then we'll ask Christine to come up and she can provide that kind of okay, I think she's going to, she's going to do so much of a better job than I could. So, but we'll, I'll just get through this just so you have kind of the fool. And if any other questions come up, we can just, we can just get them all taken care of at the same time. Okay, so we already talked about our C and C, C. And then what we're at now this was in your in the staff memo. These are the various options that we presented. And there could probably be more but we were just trying to kind of refine this based on the conversation we've had. So the first option is that we just approve the adoption of the 2021 IBC and related codes with amendments that we're going to be presenting on May 23, including the optional energy codependency, CB and RB, the section sorry, the second option is to approve adoption of the 2021 IBC and related codes with recommendations, I'm just going to skip that part, excluding optional energy code, CB, and RB seems pretty simple. Next one, option three. And you'll notice this is bolded. And highlighted because this is our staff recommendation to approve adoption of the code, with amendments presented, including the Colorado model, electric ready and solar ready code, and schedule a study session to discuss the possibility of adding appendices RC and CC, as well as electric preferred provisions presented by sweep and that was Christine at a later date. And this is really based on what we know of what the looming deadlines with what we need to address and what we would like to address prior to July 1. And then what gives us a little bit more flexibility after we've been able to adopt all of the all of the codes. The fourth option is really providing that leverage back to the board. And to address trustees the next question, the Board of Trustees, you can postpone adopting any of the codes, you can direct staff to revise any portions of these codes. And I just want to say that is obviously we would ask you that for any if there's anything that comes up as you review. We're happy to make any amendments. Okay, so that those were the that was related to the energy code. And then my last slide is really just addressing the IRC a code language that addresses sprinklers. So it requires all new single family homes, two family homes, duplexes and townhomes to have sprinklers installed throughout the residents. I will repeat this all new construction. Should the board decide to revise this requirement staff can make the amendment prior to the public hearing on May 23. Currently, with our IRC, we limit sprinklers to two family homes, duplexes and townhomes. So the change would be that we are adding single family homes. That is the distinction. And that was my last slide. So that really concludes our discussion. I can go back to any of the slides that you need to I will invite Christina and also chief building official Gary Rusu. Again, and we're happy to answer any other questions, especially with respect to CB, RB, and how it interacts with the model, solar ready, model electric ready and solar ready code I'm going to have to create like a song or something because a lot of works. So thank you.
Thank you one quick question as it relates to the IRC and the sprinklers and single family homes. How does this impact and I see what I'm reading here? And how does this impact future adu development? How would this impact single family homes if an attached adu is attached to a single family home? Does that definition change? Is that all of a sudden have to be retrofitted does only the new construction need to be sprinkler does now the entire home needs to be sprinkler because there's shared walls between those two structures or two living spaces. I'm just thinking how I mean sprinkler systems can be cost prohibitive. I know that construction is only getting more expensive moving forward, not cheaper. And I'm just really interested specifically in the adu or the adu part.
Okay, thank you Trustee marching for your questions. I will ask Gary Rusu to come back up and answer that for you. That's a good one now.
Okay, I'm gonna answer the same question I have with yours. That's okay. I'm gonna add a question that's just gonna go to yours. With that, if we decide as a board that you say we decided, we may have talked about this last time, we talked about so much stuff, if we decided that, you know, we would adopt it, except for say, we didn't want a little like we didn't want single family homes to be required. Does that have any problem with the state? Or is that so we could decide that and not be a problem the state to decide that? Okay,
the state's really only involved in the energy portion of the building portion. Okay. And to answer your question, any new construction, so if they're building a new adu unit attached to the Home and the Home is sprinkler, then it needs to be sprinkler. It's a home currently is not and it wouldn't need to be. Same way it would not need to be sprinkler. So if you did an addition to a home that's on that's not sprinkler, you wouldn't have to sprinkler, the addition because the rest of the home is not so it's basically a new home from the ground up as well.
So is that inclusive for the entire property? So if an adu was a detached Adu, so,
if it's an adu that's built as a new Porsche Have the new home
be a detached adu detached, detached, right,
it would still need to be that will be new construction. So, you will have to have that as a single family.
Okay. So even though the initial residence did not have a sprinkler system and
NO NO NO NO NO only if the exists if the new structure has a sprinkler system than the adu would need to be sprinkler,
I just want to make sure that very, very clear. Okay.
The purpose is if you're going to have an adu and your home sprinkler, you would want that also. I mean, it just wouldn't make sense that it's not a requirement.
Okay, so back to the question. So if you have a house that's not sprinkle whenever you decide to build an adu you don't have to worry about even though it's a single family home but because it's called an adu. It doesn't have to be if we pass the say this is one that getting if we does if I got this. You said lesson
if you have a single family home that is not sprinkled in your building and attached adu. It does not have to be sprinkled because it's attached to an unsafe wrinkled single family home. If you have an unsafe wrinkled single family home and you're building a new detached Adu, it has to be sprinkled the ad you have to be sprinkled. It's a new structure. But the home the original home does not.
Exactly that's what got me confused. It seems opposite. Yeah,
it's a new structure.
I don't like it, but I got a
new standalone structure.
Okay, thank you. Okay, can we have her come up? And
so I, I will go back to the appendices, and then I will turn it over to Christine.
Hi, Christine. Thanks for coming up on kind of a stormy night.
Sure. Yes. Thanks for having me. I'm glad we get to dive into this a little bit more very good questions. As I recall, the question was about the difference between these two between the appendices and the Colorado model, like the gradients already code. The Colorado model electric radiant solar code essentially contains appendix RB and CB, almost identical, it tweaks a few things here and there, but nothing huge. And so those are in the Colorado model, electric ready and solar code. One difference is that the Colorado model electric radiant solar code had an additional filter that the appendices were developed at the national level through a three year process, involving literally 1000s of building officials and construction industry trades. And then the Colorado energy board took that and took it through their own Colorado specific filter to develop the bottle code. So that's one difference is that it was just tweaked and customized a little bit for Colorado as opposed to national. The other more major difference is that not only does it contain the solar ready appendices, it also contains electric ready language, which means that each water heater if it's a gas water heater would have a little plug near it where someone could plug in an electric water heater in the future if they'd rather have electric. And then there's also room on the panel similar to the solar situation. And then the same for a stove. If a new house has a gas stove, they would also have a plug that could support plugging in an electric stove, whether that's a conventional one or an induction when it doesn't matter, but the plug would be there. So you can plug it in and then room on the electrical panel. And as far as cost of those costs vary, but they they're saying around $300 each. There would also be panel capacity for the furnace if someone wanted to put in an air source heat pump. But if they're already putting in air conditioning, that's electric anyway, so that's not necessarily an extra cost because a heat pump would replace the furnace and an air conditioner. So that electrical part is already there. So that's why I started with just the water heater and the furnace. So that's a major difference is that is is in the MA Not all electric ready and solar ready code. And then also in there, even though it's not in the title are some Eevee ready requirements, which is for a single family home, again, an outlet in your garage, where you could plug in an Eevee, not the actual charger, because you'd have to buy that if you buy an Eevee. But at least a place where you could plug it in. And that's even though you can plug it into any outlet you want. It charges a lot faster if you have essentially a dryer outlet where it could charge it in a few hours instead of many hours. So yeah, so those Eevee ready requirements are in there as well. And so that's the difference. These appendices up here are just solar ready, that Colorado model code is that plus some basic electric radiant Evie ready components.
It seemed to me that the Colorado data data was easier to read was that just because of what we were being fed, or was it actually more? Well, I'm sorry, that was in the packet. Is it? Is it actually a little bit easier for a layperson to kind of get a handle on or as a dumb question?
Um, good question. I don't know. I think they're all interesting personally. So it's hard to say which is easier, which is not. Yeah, I'm not sure. Yeah.
You had mentioned 300. A piece is that four? Can you clarify what your what you mean by a piece?
Yeah. So according to the cost estimates, your mileage may vary. 300 for water heater, 300. For a stove, three to 400 for the Evie. And, and adding they don't usually count anything extra for the furnace. So that would be 900,000.
So this is just electrical for Dummies, you say don't count anything more for the furnace. You mentioned about air conditioning? Well, a lot of our houses don't have air conditioning. So if you weren't putting an air conditioner in, would it cost more to do the electrical for the heat pump?
Right? If if it's a brand new house and it does not have air conditioning, and then late, then they would Yes. Put in a plug and panel capacity for a future Air Source Heat Pump. Yeah, yeah, yeah. When you say 300 Mm hmm. No, I
trust you snack here. Your mic is
Oh, okay. So my issue is this isn't really an issue, it's more of a question. And when we say 300 is, is that? How sad is that number, because I can tell you, when I get an electrician out to my building or my house, it's always more than 300. I don't care what they're doing. And that's putting in a plug or whatever. So I'm trying to figure out where that 300 Number is coming from. And if it is, maybe I can get the number for the electrician.
Right? Right. Good question. I think you you hit on a very key point. And that's if you're calling an electrician later to retrofit in these systems, it is a lot more complicated because they have to go through walls, they have to rip up walls, you might need a new panel, you might need new breakers, it is a lot cheaper and easier to do it as you're building the house itself. So that's why the price seems lower than what you'd expect if you were just calling an electrician to come in later. How solid is
numbers from builders? I mean, that's what I'm saying is, and I get the thought that it should be that much. But we're actually building a building and they give you the build, you're like, well, right. It's like $60 more. So yeah, how solid are the numbers? Are we getting those numbers from our local builders or is like a national builder amount? I mean,
if I had to characterize it, I would say it's in the middle. It's not pulled out of thin air. And it's not drawn directly from Estes Park builders. But it's numbers that have been circulating widely, without mass opposition of pushback saying they're completely unrealistic. So I'd say that they're kind of in the middle as far as solidness,
and I trust that you that that's your thought process. But I guess before I want to really make decisions I'd like to know kind of in this area, right. So why build a house in Podunk West Virginia? I brought that pick on West Virginia put up anywhere. It's gonna be generally cheaper than Estes Park, right? Right. So I just if We're gonna go by numbers and costs. I don't know how could we do that if we just even ask builders? What they think what the average? I don't know, but it would be helpful for me if I'd know what here that cost would be and not a national or what we think and it might be even more. I don't know, right? If you get that somehow that'd be easier for me. Right. And we talked about even even the ER stuff. RB CB so Oh, it's just a conduit. Every time I was building my building, it was just a conduit all of a sudden was $1,000. More like I grew by kind of $10. Why is it $1,000? More? There was super glue. So I just kind of get you I get nervous about those things. Sure. When we just say, Oh, it's only about this much. Right, really? So if we could make these as builders for that average, that would be great for me. I don't know anybody else needs that. But I kind of need that.
We could ask builders, for instance, what it cost for them to put in a dryer outlet since that might be similar. And something like that might have less. Bias. I guess since everyone, almost everyone wants a dryer?
Yeah, no. I mean, that's it's perfectly I just would like to know that I'm making a decision based on prices here. And yeah, sure. You came up with an error. But you know, average is definitely not maybe our average.
Yeah, exactly. That went one more addition on that, the Evie one where we said 300 to 400. That one is more solid, because that one has gone through several other cities processes where they got local estimates. The 400 was from Fort Collins, and the 300 was more from Denver. So I feel more solid on the Evie, one than the furnace, water heater and so on. So
it's helpful for me that it's not, you know, you're not saying oh, there's a range from 200 to 2000. I get that. It's yeah, $50 difference here and there, that's fine. But it was a lot different. You know, yes. Nice to be and make that decision
that definitely well. And then with the electric vehicle, I have an electric vehicle, we had the outlet in the garage, but needed to convert it. Because my husband turned to it. So we had lots of higher voltage ones. It was $2,100. Just so you know. And that didn't have very far to go, it probably had 30 feet to go through the garage. So getting it done earlier, I don't think you'll find something approaches. You No,
no, I get that. But it's just thinking, thinking, yeah, the
car. That's all? Oh, no,
it's perfect. I just, you know, that that's the difference. It's what we find arguing I agree. I wouldn't have taken on that army because I'd lose it. But no, I just it would just be nice to know what locally is, that's all and it's not blasting anybody, it's just if we're gonna throw out numbers, it would just like to know if that if you're talking to members, that's, that's great. That's what it is.
Sometimes you gotta you gotta realize the cost is depending on the size of the house. So if you have a 4000 square foot house, and you have to run conduit all the way across the house to get to the kitchen, it's on the other end of the house, why that's going to be higher. So this is based, basically on an average 2000 square foot house. Normally, your furnace, your water heater, that's all in the same room. Now there are mechanical rooms. So the distance from the panel is a lot shorter. Just so you know, most places that have gas appliances, do run a receptacle now for an electric range. Along with that that was done prior to any of this. Take the high side take $500 instead of 300. You're talking $1,500 $2,000 upfront, as opposed to maybe 5000 10,000 later. So because it's being put in when the house is being built. So just running an extra wire and conduit and it's not only conduit, you gotta realize that because it's a residential, it's not required to be in conduit. It's a Romex wire commercials a little different. So.
Okay, any other questions? All right, let's give the public a chance to come up and ask some questions. If I can on this. I think we're pretty well through this. We have any questions from the public that you'd like to ask just occur? Anyone? All right, let's go ahead and move forward with this now. Yes, it's time to request a motion. And a second related to these changes. What direction would you like us to go in
I'm not really proposing a motion, but I am not convinced that I would like to see the sprinklers in the residential, single family residential. And as far as the RB and the CB, I feel that just going with the straight code, we can always add those as well as the Colorado at a later date. If if that's correct. If we if we just passed the 2021. Without the RB or CB or Colorado portion, we can always add that is that correct? Yes. Or would that thing is be I'll defer to
the attorney, Trustee onland. So the the one advantage of going with the 2021 Energy Code and the Colorado model code is that that's what's going to be required anyway after July 1. So we can make any changes after that date at that point without worrying about it. If we were to adopt the 2021 energy code, and not adopt the Colorado model code, then if we were talking about making changes, any changes would have to involve adopting the Colorado model. Okay, thank you.
So really the decision is now or later?
Yeah. Yeah, a few months, right. It's a few months. Yeah, a few months. So with that clarification, then I think it's a kind of a no brainer for it to be included, in my opinion with the Colorado code, then that I'm not wanting the sprinklers in the single family.
So I am opposed the sprinklers in a single family. But I have a question about that. If I can ask real quick and it might be better for Chief wolf answered. It may not whoever can answer this is fine. If if you have a sprinkler system in your house, and say you burn something or stuff, just for clarification, and the times whatever he's done it you had to open all the doors and your alarms are going off and everything else. Well, that set off a sprinkler system.
No. So sprinkler heads are activated by heat. So they either have a bulb that goes off at a certain temperature or fusible link that melts at a certain temperature. So typically, to activate a sprinkler head requires direct flame impingement at the head and only that had activates, unlike the movies where you hold a layer up to one and they all go off. That's not how it works in reality. So only the head that is being impinged by heat, and sprinkler systems, both commercial and residential, are typically not designed to put the fire out. But more than 90% of the time, they do put the fire out at a single head or in a commercial occupancy depending on the occupancy type multiple. So to that the other piece I would add on the residential sprinkler piece understanding some of the concerns. The the residential code as written is written as a complete package where the fuel load assumes it's protected by sprinklers. So as the residential code is modified to allow for lighter weight construction, glue Lam some of those types of construction techniques that allow for cheaper construction. The code was designed assuming that that lightweight construction would be protected by sprinklers. And I think a slight tweak on a phrase that was said earlier, I would not consider this adding the sprinklers back in this would be replayed, returning it back in it's always been there right single family dwellings, having sprinklers has been in the code since 2009. We've chosen to remove it specifically since then. So this would just be no longer making that exception. It's not an additional requirement that's unique to our community. It's how the code is written.
Well, thank you for the help on the sprinkler system. I was thinking the movies Yeah. I would still probably be against in the single family, you know, are adding it back in. I can see connection. I can seem duplexes, because I do think that there is more chance of a fire in those. I think with the expensive building and all these things we're adding adding adding adding expensive building going up and I understand the value of life was not getting to that discussion again. But I just think that too for single dwelling. That wouldn't be my preference either.
Just I just want to clarify if if we don't have it in and people that have contracted to have their belt house built, they could put it in if they want to. So that's yeah, so it doesn't make it so it can't be put into the building.
question actually is related to that as well, and has to do with a pretty similar scenario. But let's just say a kid kicks a ball and the house goes up in smoke sprinkler head. Those do activate, they can activate. My question is really, on the insurance side, is that all of a sudden, some kind of add on? Or what what? How does that ultimately work out? If there's some kind of incident. So, yeah, activation of the sprinkler system, and it causes significant water damage to the house.
Yeah. So on that, I would say that's a conversation between the homeowner and the insurance company more specifically on that, I can say that some sprinkler systems are designed in such a way to help avoid things like that they can either be recessed with a cap that falls off at a certain temperature so that they're protected. And which is why usually, if you go to a hotel room, and they're all sticking out, they have all these things of don't put your hanger here, because you can set a sprinkler head off. Residential sprinklers as well do not have the same kind of flow rates as commercial sprinkler heads. So again, when you think about the volume of water that's coming out in the movie, it's typically not that in a residential system, you're usually looking at between seven and 11 gallons a minute. As opposed to the hose that we're bringing in. That's 150 to 180 gallons a minute.
On that note, while you're up here, Chief Well, I think I'm sorry that I can't find it in my notes, I was combing through the many discussions about this and the long sets of notes that I've taken. But we talked a little bit about houses that are on a well, if you could talk about that, and you just mentioned how much water goes through. And that being a problem for a house that's not on down water, for example. And then the cost of a residential sprinkler system on and dependent on the house. I know there's like a million different factors. But in general, how and especially has that that compares to commercial sprinkler systems, which I think we often default to thinking about.
Sure. So first on the residential piece, that can be done without being connected to a municipal water supply. Because of the requirements of the 13 D system, it's typically adequate to have somewhere between 305 100 gallons, which is a not a not a small tank, but uh, you know, can be managed off well. So right now, we already use that in more rural parts of the district where we're unable to get the access and we can't get a driveway the fire truck and get up, then those are typically required to be sprinklered. As is. And so as of right now, we are we're putting we're seeing those start to occur with higher frequency around the district. As far as cost, I don't have those numbers for the Estes Valley, I think depending on where you are in Front Range numbers are probably in the dollar $52 a square foot on a new construction, not a retrofit new construction. With the mountain discount, I just assumed double it. So we're probably looking in the three to $4 range per square foot. So again, for you know, a standard 2000 square foot house, we might be in the $6,000 range. But that's going to that'll vary by contractor and complexity the house and how the house is laid out as well, because the sprinklers are based on compartments. And so the more compartmented your house is, the more complicated the sprinkler system is. So so that's one of those that makes the cost hard to estimate. I think one of the other pieces on the cost that typically gets ignored in these conversations is as they become more common and more people are doing them that will actually help with some of the costs because there'll be more options for contractors, and it'd be more standard practice. As long as it's a one off that also helps keep some of those costs high.
Thank you. I'm an option three dowel myself. That's what I'd like to see. And I'm probably going to be out ruled on this from the board. But I'd like to see sprinklers and single family construction. Residential please.
I have a question for you, Mr. Wolf that the does the fire district can the fire district impose a requirement of sprinkling single family over
Archer jurisdiction or
I was thinking special
districts? For example, if the town chooses not to could the fire district Yes. So the way that code adoptions are done for special districts is that after our board adopts a code, a code through resolution, that code has to be ratified by both the municipality and the county that we cover. So even if our our board chose to it would still come back to this board for ratification. And as well as the county and that's where when the the county chief building official was here, one of the things that he spoke to is the the way it could work is that if the town was to adopt sprinklers that would they county would allow the fire district to adopt sprinklers district wide, not just within the town. So we would put sprinklers into the fire code for outside of the town. If the town already had sprinklers to keep the entire valley consistent, but if if the town board does not choose to include it, we, we wouldn't be able to do it without town board's blessing. So no problem. And just because there was another question on it, single family dwelling fires make up 70% of structure fires nationally.
So just real quick, we talked about this 2000 average, is that Estes Park, new build average square footage is 2000 feet. I mean, we can use this 2000s average at just wondering if we get if we're getting that number. I hate to say the wigs. I know y'all are just making these numbers up in your head, I get it. But I'm just gonna say if it's, if that's what the footage was writing that part. But if it's is it that the average new build and ask this for single family is 2000? I mean, not attached,
I would say. Average would be between 2000 Maybe 2500. Because you've got some 4000 square foot, right. And a lot of them are built with unfinished basements. Even though the square footage is there, it's not considered livable space, you know, so. But your average home being built nowadays is about 2000 Square. That's a three bedroom, two bath, you know, family room diner, open concept. Basically,
I just I don't see a whole bunch of new builds going up in Estes. So I always wonder what is the average? Well,
a lot of the homes that are going up are larger homes. Those are the probably the ones that would be an easier sell to sprinkle. Especially if they're unoccupied a lot of the time of the year. That's another thing. What some jurisdictions have done is they've done away with the sprinklers out of the residential house. But they require that the contractor offer it to the builder or to the homebuyer, they would have to sign a paper that states we off, we recommend sprinklers. They're not required by code and get the homeowner to sign off on that. So at least they're offering it to the homeowner. And that could be putting our code that way. If we don't want to sprinkle them by code, then make the contractors at least in their contract, offer it to the homeowner. And then it's the homeowners choice
like that. And I like that we strongly recommend it. I mean, years ago, I probably would have been requiring smoke detectors and houses. Granted, this probably saved a good zillion lives. So I would have been wrong, you know, one in a million times? I could be wrong. But well, you know, but I do think it's important that we that we definitely recommend it. I think that's
recommended, you know, talk to your insurance company and find out if I fly home with sprinkler, what would it cost? What would my insurance could be lower? If you go down 36 in lines right before you get the lines, look to the right. Last week. Yeah, big house burned down on sprinkler.
Well, that's actually interesting fact that it might be nice for us to even know as a board. Honestly, if we can check with two or three insurance companies in the area and see if it's cheaper to insure houses sprinkled. Because that makes maybe make a difference in what I'm thinking about the cost of building a house, if I found out that it's cheaper to insure it that it is sprinkled, maybe that would change my mind as to whether I require it or not.
You got to remember a lot, a lot of stuff that's in the code is put into code from insurance companies. So they don't have to pay all these big insurance. So a lot of them will recommend sprinklers because they understand the concept that you know, as the old one goes off, they all go off. Well, if the fire is big enough, you want them all to go off. And it's in it's to save the people not the house, give time fire to get there and so want to get out of so.
So could we get some of those statistics out significantly before the May 23? Sorry,
I will Yes. Yeah. Yes. Matter of fact, one of the one of our contractors in town, puts them in most of his homes that he builds. And a lot of it is you know outside of town to he told us in our meeting last year, it's about $4 a square foot additional so cheap off was talking about 250. Up here it's about $4 but more people use it, the lower the price is going to come just like solar and everything else demand will drive that market.
So trustee we will do our best to get that information to you.
We have builders that are looking at it, because you know, with the whole code, they were looking at the insulation, everything. So they're they're more on board now than they were at the beginning because they realize it's not that much more expensive for a lot of these things.
As a board, I naturally continue this until we get that information. Oh, yeah, I know what's, what's interesting. You just put it on? No, thank you so much. I think as as a board, we could probably consider tabling this until that information comes in. I think there's enough concern about it. Can we do that?
Mayor, we if the board tables, the public setting the public hearing, you're going to bump up against the deadlines for the July adoption. We won't
we won't have time to now wait, but But what I will do is my darndest to make sure we get that information to you and we'll just include it in it in a board update or weekly update.
That's fine, because we can still change it to hearing Yes, you can. That's fine. Yeah. And I just think if we can even get the insurance information, that'd be huge for me, because it's not like everybody doesn't believe that it's gonna save lives. I think it'll save lives. And I think that's important. But I do think there's the cost effect of believing. Find out.
Go back to trustee Hazel tins comment as far as what option she's in favor of? I'm an option RM I'm in favor of option three as well. But I'm not in favor of currently having single family homes sprinklered. I'm not sure if when we make this motion for to set a public hearing for ordinance, whatever the this ordinance on February 23.
It'll be May 23.
I don't want to go back. Yeah. If we could potentially have at least those two options available option three, but then with and without sprinklers for? It seems like we have some further discussion there. Absolutely. I'd be happy to make a motion to set the public. Okay. Sunday. I sure. Yeah, I was just the main comment doesn't matter. So I moved to set the public hearing for ordinance Oh, four dash 23 for May 23 2023. Second,
it's been moved and seconded to set the hearing for May 23 2023. Is there any more discussion? Let's take a vote then please.
Mayor Pete. Briefly, I just also just need to clarify, do you have a preference for the option? Because I know we've heard from a couple of the trustees, but that will help us to clarify
what I like option three, and still questioning sprinkling.
Okay, so that's part of the motion.
You didn't make it part of the motion.
That's right. And Mayor, those can be separate. There can be a vote on the motion. And in theory, the the direction could conclude after that is figured out or it can happen beforehand.
Okay, well, let's just continue on with this motion. And then we can talk about the other. I think that's the easy way to do it. Now, okay, let's go ahead and vote.
And it passes unanimously, so it's set for the 23rd of May. And now let's talk about the direction.
So I'm also in favor of option three. And I'm a little bit on the fence on the smoke detector piece. Although I'm I think in my heart of hearts, I've sprained What did I say? Your fault. I'm think I'm more inclined to say that, despite everything, I would rather have the in all the houses, but I'm waiting to get some more data. Thank you.
Okay. And I think everybody's commented on that.
So mayor, if I could summarize what I'm planning to bring back and revised ordinance for the May 23 Meeting based on this direction. So what's in the ordinance currently is the kitchen sink, because we wanted to make sure we didn't leave anything out. But we will remove our B and C B from that ordinance. We will remove additional edits to the International Energy Conservation Code that were prevented presented by sweep that we put in your packet for you because those largely related to RB and CB. We will continue to include the collar Rado model code and the sprinkler, sprinklers will remain in the code as they are currently. Although we will be prepared to act on the fly if the board wishes to make that amendment at the meeting on the 23rd, tell or note one more thing, which is a little bit of an aberration. The Colorado code board that puts together that model code has not officially published that code yet, which is why it's in there as the final draft, we understand that there are not expected to be changes of any significance between the final draft and the published code. And if we need to come back and clean it up and change it from the final draft to the published code at some point, that shouldn't be a big issue. But we would have a data set up for adoption as that final draft that has been published online. Okay,
and and to confirm the sweep provisions will consider at a later date.
Correct as I understand it, Trustee Hazleton, not just so their sweep. And Christine, if you'd like to correct me have anything to add, that would be wonderful. But as I understand it, their sweep recommendations, if the town wanted to go in the direction, not just of electric ready, but of electric preferred, we could if we go in this direction, we could consider those at a later date. We would also consider our C and CC at a later date as well. And since if we go in this direction, and do adopt the 2021 energy code, and the Colorado model code, then we'll already be adopting everything the state wants us to adopt at this time, so we could make changes in the future without any significant impact on the existing code at that time.
Okay, great. Thanks.
Sounds perfect. Okay, thank you. And thanks for the additional comments that you all made. It's very confusing. Thanks for coming up tonight drive home carefully. All right. Let's move ahead. To reports and discussion. We have two more to consider the SS Park Board of Trustees vacancy letters of interest. Jackie Williamson, town clerk.
Thank you, Mayor and board. So as you stated, We're here to review next steps in filling this vacancy. I'd like to just take a moment to remind the board and the public. The reason we got to this point is at your April 11 meeting, I brought forward your options to fill the vacancy that we currently have. As a statutory community, we only have two options that the board can consider, which is either appointment to fill this vacancy until the next election or to hold a special election. We received direction at that last meeting on April 11, to go ahead and move forward with letters of interest in order to fill it by appointment. So in your packet, you have the names of those individuals that submitted their letters of interest. I'll take a moment just to read through there. There's nine of them. So by alphabetical order, you have William Brown, Bruce Darby, Nathan Hargrove, Hagar harger, excuse me, John Howell, Frank Lancaster, John Meisner, Ward Nelson, Kurt radish, and Jason Van Tate and joven. So I did want to make sure that the board knew that I did ensure that the minimum requirements are met by all nine of these individuals. So we did check to make sure that they've lived here for the required time and that they're registered voters and such Okay. Also in our April 11 memo, we stated that the board can give us further direction at this time on things such as how you want to move forward, whether or not you want to have public a public interview process, for example, or any other such, I, you know, items are next steps. As a reminder, you have 60 days to make this appointment from when it was vacated and that date is May 26. Okay, so I did put in a little bit of a sample calendar for you all to consider if you did want to move forward with a public interview process, we would probably need to hold a special town board meeting for you all to consider that if you did want to move through that interview process. I did make a record commendation in there that we would maybe conduct a 15 to 20 minute interview process, three, four questions, something like that, that we could put together for the board. And you could hold those as a public hearing, or not a public hearing. But as a public meeting, in lieu of that I did give you one other option that that you can consider, we could also pose those questions and have written responses presented to you to consider and then come together and consider that and make a vote and upcoming meeting, your next meeting is May 9. Then you also have may 23, as your final date to make a decision, I kind of laid it out for you all to hopefully, maybe make a decision by May 9, if it's possible, only, only so that we could have that person sworn in and be at your may 23 meeting. That, of course is is an optional timeline, you guys can consider that. And really what we need tonight from the board is how you would like to move forward. In considering these nine applicants. I'm happy to answer any questions.
Okay. I want to interview process essential meeting. And I mean, my, my what would be I mean, we can make, you know, questions available head times, but I'd like to have also questions on the fly. Because we all know that you get questions on the thought fly, and then like know how people actually think, not how they've prepared answers. So or how somebody else has prepared answers for them, which can happen too. So that's what would be my thought process. 1520 minutes per applicant for nine applicants is a three hour meeting. So it's significant. So we want to probably keep it to a minimum of 15 minutes. But that would be my preference.
That's my preference also. I agree.
Yeah, I think that would be great. I don't know if it's possible. I know this is probably gonna make town staff roll their eyes a little bit, since we just got rid of zoom participation has meanings. But if something like this could be done virtually so that it could be recorded or all zooming in on it, it could be recorded. The public could tune in as a webinar. I think, a big reason. I think Maria's points are great. I think the other pieces of the transparency of that to that it's that the community can participate in a way of viewing it submitting their feedback to us those kinds of things, too. That'd be a valued me if that's not possible, I understand. But I think some sort of way that folks could have an opportunity to tune in. And if it's not in this room, virtually, that has merit for me.
Can I get some clarity on that? Because our meetings are already recorded and are available on YouTube? Is it just so they can watch? Or is there something else that you're hoping to get out of a Zoom meeting,
I'm thinking if it's impossible for all of us to be in a room for a three hour meeting between now and the ninth, if it's possible for people to be in a virtual room that's recorded in a webinar format, so people can understand that we can all engage in a way. That's my thought if we can all get in a room for a three hour span of time between now and May 9. Cool. It sounds great.
I think it's important to clearly be in the in the room. We're here tonight for with the study session that long. So I would like to see us all. And I'd like to see the candidates make that commitment to come into the meeting, because it's important. The question that I have is, it will be a discussion between the trustees and the candidates versus public comment, correct?
Well, that that would be up to the board. But that would be up to the board. But it would be staffs recommendation that it would be more of an interview setting. So for you all, to ask questions and get some feedback from the each candidate. Good. And we would just bring them into the room one at a time. So that they weren't here listening to the other candidates and the other answers.
Mean Difference in direction or?
Oh, yeah, I agree. The public interview process, I think it'd be the best going way back. I mean, my ideal thing to happen, I guess would be an election. But yeah, I think that's obviously we're not going to do that. We're already going down this path. So yeah, I think the public interview just wouldn't be the best, most transparent way to do it. And go from there.
I agree with that. I think the time is going to be the sticky wicket. Oh, it is. So can we address the possibilities on that?
Oh I'll be fine. Yeah, I was just gonna suggest scrapping the next study session, and potentially hosting all the interviews at the study session time prior to our next meeting on the ninth and then taking action that evening. And I do not have the study session in front of me. So I apologize if there's something really important on there. I believe there's the fee
schedule. And yes, something with the NASA
electric vehicle infrastructure and readiness update and the planning fee schedule. work good. Jessica. I'll talk to Jessica, Director gardener tomorrow. And if the consultants need to come to talk about that, we can always tack it on to the end of the board meeting, like we're doing with manager soulsby is item tonight. So we could use that may 9 meeting, study session rather for these interviews without much consequence.
B would just need you all to be present probably around 330.
Yeah. Be
an earlier start than normal. That's me, then we do that.
Sounds good.
Okay, is that that works? Very, very question wise. I just want to confirm for you all, do you want to see questions? I've kind of prepared some based off of some of the application information. I also have about five pages of questions that Northglenn, for example, has gone through this recently. I'm happy I could send those to you all, you guys could pick out your top four or five, and then we could go from there. And we can consolidate those and move forward with some questions. If there's if you guys don't have any lot of input on that or don't have any concern, staff can definitely put those together and bring forward what what questions we think are viable questions. But we'd love to hear from the board.
I still think not having been prepared first is pretty important. All of us had been through the League of Women Voters that have been up here, and we do not have prepared questions. So I think it's kind of important for the candidates to be me. I don't mind there's a prepare quarter, whatever. But I think there should be opening for maybe that list, but questions that are unprepared for the candidates because all of us have been through it. So I think it's kind of important to see how they think and not how they prepared.
Well, I wasn't saying I wasn't suggesting giving them the questions this that you have general questions that you're asking each of them to get a get a feel for specifics. Yeah, specific items that I think the board would be interested in knowing about each candidate. And then you can definitely ask follow up questions from there.
So I like I like having you send us some questions, and we can circle it and you guys can
we can consolidate the topics?
And do we want to have four or five consolidated questions that everybody will be asked? And as well as then our own spontaneous Question four, or four.
We don't have much time. You know, some people go on and on, including myself. So no, I think we need and brevity is always a good deal on this. And if we have suggestions ahead of time as to questions that we think might be relevant, can we go ahead and send those to you? Yes, of course.
I just want to make sure that board has is getting the information they need from these interview processes, so that you can make a decision. Sounds good. Okay. All right. Thank you.
And our final person is Vanessa and she'll be doing the SS transit branding project update.
Hello, okay. Hello. It's working. Good.
Good evening, Mayor and trustees, Vanessa soulsby. I'm the mobility services manager, Department of Public Works. This last item is going to be so fun. So I hope you guys are ready and still awake. I know that was a long discussion. But I'm here this evening to update you all on the process and project to create a brand for SDS transit. This item would have typically come to you at a study session, but you were very busy earlier today. And as it's only I think, like 31 days until Memorial Day. This is a timely issue because we'd like to roll some of these recommendations out this summer. So this particular project to create a new brand for us this transit was identified as part of the 2022 town board strategic plan. We did kick off the project last year we hired a consultant, Slate communications and you'll hear from Ryan Burke. Our lead can Soltan here in a moment, he's actually going to walk you through this presentation. They were hired through a competitive process, and have just done a phenomenal job for us. And before I turn it over to Ryan, I just want to give you guys the really quick version of why are we doing this? Why do we need a brand for us to transit number one, to increase ridership for visitors and locals, we spend a lot of money on transit from a variety of different local, state and federal sources. And we want to be really good stewards of the funds that we're spending on transit. Number two, we want to increase awareness of our transit options. Nobody likes seeing buses without people on them. More than more than I do. That is the thing that I don't want to see, especially with some upcoming years of construction, the downtown parking challenges we have, I want to see full buses, and I'd like to see more buses, and we need to let people know buses, they can get on where they're going and make it a really stress free experience. And then lastly, we need to have a little bit of fun riding transit is a joyful experience. If you've done it with small children lately, they love to ride a bus, any bus, put them on a bus. It's a lot of fun. And so we want to create an experience that matches the nostalgic charm of our community and really engages people to ride transit, not just to get around, but also as part of the experience of visiting our town. So those are the three main goals of this project. And with that, I'm going to turn it over to Ryan, he's going to walk you through some exciting pieces of the process or public engagement, and show you some visuals that we're hoping to see on a bus near you this summer. And then lastly, I want to say a big thank you to our branding committee. We had a really diverse group, we had bus operators, we had several members of tab, including one member who has national branding experience. We had town staff or public and information officer. And we really put our consultant through the wringer. As you'll hear they were very patient with us and included all of our feedback. So thank you to that committee. They've been working since December, on this project. And I know many of them wanted to be here tonight, but are stuck in various transit situations. So not transit bus situations, but in transit. Alright, with that, I'll turn it over to Ryan.
Hi, thank you for fitting me in tonight. Appreciate it, I will try to make this as painless as possible and quick, and then we can just start the conversation if that sounds good. Sounds good. Thank you. As Vanessa said, I'm Ryan Burke, I am one of the founders of slate communications, we have 10 other people on our team that are based out of Fort Collins, we have experience with more than six other transit agencies within Colorado for marketing, communications and branding. And so it is our privilege to work with Vanessa and her team and the brand committee to help really discover what your transit brand is about. And so we'll go over briefly, this is a very short PowerPoint, but just our process, and we want to make sure that there's some clarity around the fact that we did reach out to your community, we formed a brand committee, and we really made sure that we did our research and due diligence to really provide a brand that works for your transit system. So we talked to stakeholders within Estes, we, Vanessa and her team put together a brand Committee, which we've met with multiple times. And then based upon those discussions, we developed the first round of bus design wraps. We met with the brand committee to review those with them. And then at this point, we're meeting with the group here just to present the final selection from the brand committee for the bus wrap design. And what we're going to do based upon that is we're going to further expand and blow up that brand for a new logo, the collateral when it comes to the route maps, the route signage, anything that you see that that pertains to the transit system in Estes Park. And so just to reiterate a little bit, stakeholders who did we talk to, of course, we talked to the brand committee members, these are some members of staff, but also some members from the community that are active in with the transit system as well as people from the transportation board as well. We had a couple of meetings with tab, but the 10 stakeholder interviews. This is the chamber director to Edd, the economic development director, people from Rocky Mountain National Park from the visitor center, lodging, retail, we wanted to make sure that we get a pretty well rounded basis of knowledge when it comes to who is using transit who needs use transit and who your visitors are. So who, who are we really trying to reach out to? And based upon those conversations, we had five, five major takeaways. We really found that residents don't use the transit system as much as visitors do as much as the J one students. People that are coming to us to us they're really seeking out in a salsa experience. So they're experiencing an Elkhorn, they're experiencing that in Rocky Mountain National Park. How can we actually give that that kind of experience as well when they're riding transit? And we have the trolley already, which is a great vehicle, it definitely people are excited to ride that. But how do we actually create this, this more visual that that really entices people to get on a bus. Another thing we want to do is we want get people to park we want them to stop driving everywhere. So how do we get the people that are visiting to utilize a parking garage, stay at the hotel, hop on the bus utilize that to get around. And then of course, as we talked to a lot of stakeholders within the community, we also found that this is a tight knit community. And we want to make sure that as we mark it, and communicate the transit system, that we're doing a lot of grassroots marketing and communications. And then lastly, we know that the J one employees as well as some of the non English speaking visitors really do rely on the transit system. So how do we make it easier for them to actually better understand it. And so that really is one of our our biggest challenges. So we talked to everybody, these are some of the the key words that we had heard, when it came to the actual transit system is that it is really great for visitors, people do rely on it. It has that nostalgic theme when it comes to the trolley. But it's also an experience, I think a lot of people that are coming from the region and around the country don't normally use transit. So how do we actually involve that and make it a little bit more of a journey when they're utilizing the system. So definitely underutilized. But one thing that we heard is that a lot of operators just have a very friendly approach and friendly demeanor when it comes to to the riders into their interactions. So I think the professional level of the operators is also really one of your strong characteristics of the transit system. And so we want to bank on that as well. When we really look at the target markets, we wanted to categorize them the three different markets, we have the primary markets, which are the visitors and the J one students. And so when you look at a majority of visitors that are coming from Texas, and Missouri and California, they're coming from areas that don't normally utilize transit systems. So how are we going to change that behavior? How are we really going to motivate them to utilize buses that they can keep them off the road, keep their cars as far away from possibles from from the park, and Elkhorn. So it's really trying to change that behavior and making it a more welcoming experience for them. For j one students, I also want to kind of put in some non English speaking visitors as well with the J one students, people that are accustomed to using transit systems, but then necessarily don't speak our language. So how do we make it easy for them to associate the routes, the places they need to go with the actual buses they need to get on and you'll see some examples of them. We put residents as a secondary market, just because you know, they're they're definitely they're a little bit more resistant to writing transit, however, that's that we're not going to discount them. We're just going to focus on the two primary markets initially, and then go into a phase two for communications and marketing for residents as well. So as we spoke with the brand committee, we met with tab, we really tried to figure out what is the character and how can we illustrate the character of your town. You know, obviously, we have Long's peak and we have Rocky Mountain. We have Elkhorn, we have the residents here we have nature, we have the recreation, we have trails out our front door. So what we really want to do is we want to make sure that we can actually take these colors, these the feel of of what it is like to live here to experience the outdoors and bring it into a brand. And then utilize this brand this vision board that you see here and be able to emulate that with the actual design of the bus wraps. And then further along the road is actually bring that into the logo design as well. And so if you look at these images, I hope this does speak Estes Park to you. I hope this does look like Estes Park, hope it looks like Park, Rocky Mountain National Park, but also as this as well, your neighbors what you do what you appreciate about living here. So the first we're gonna show two designs, one is the trolley and one is the brown shuttle. And what we wanted to do is we're going to make sure to make it really understandable more than anything that you have a read route, which is the trolley, you have a brown route, you have a gold, you have a silver and you have a blue route. And so each of these buses will actually have the color. And so let's say you're non English speaking and you see a brown bus approaching, you know, that's the brown route. Or if you look at map and you see, you know, an elk such as this one And, and that is part of the key map to the route. And what you're looking at, or if the visitor center guide tells you, hey, just get on the brown shuttle or get on the brown bus, it has an elk on it, it's a little, it's a lot more easy to understand. And as you can see, with this bottom illustration here, this is a brown bus approaching you. Same with the with the red trolley as well, people are really going to understand colors, they're going to understand the iconography of the animals, but also really trying to make that fun too. So if you think about kids who do like to use public transportation, are really excited, do they want to say, oh, I want to get on the red fox, or I want to get on the brown owl, Claire want to get on the mountain lion. And so we wanted to really create this more illustrative bus wrap design and really integrate it into the current design of the shuttles and make it make it fun. And we also want to make sure that we leave enough of the windows free of coverage, so people can actually see outside and enjoy the VISTAs in the area here. With both of these designs here, what we're doing is we're actually trying to create this kind of more nostalgic, nostalgic, vintage route badge. So you can see the brown route here and the red route here. And so this will actually be connected with the route maps as well, it'll be on the route signs. So regardless, if you speak English or not, you see you're, you're you're waiting at the bus stop, maybe you're standing verbo far away, you'll see the brown elk logo, on your bus stop, you know, that's the one you're gonna get on. And when you want to get back home, you're gonna get on the right bus. And so we were trying to think of creating the most versatile brand that we could that fits all these different categories of people that will be utilizing the transit system.
And lastly, we worked with the brand committee on actually create a name for the transit transit agency. And so we went back and forth quite a bit, trying to figure out what is the landmark what is the feature that we can really emulate with the name of the transit Asian so so we had a lot of ideas going back and forth with our committee. And they settled down the peak. And so the peak is the umbrella name of the transit system for Estes Park transit. And within the peak, we have the different members of the animal kingdom in the different colors. So for Blue Route, we have the blue bird, so that will be kind of a larger blue bird on the bus for the silver route, we have silver trout for the in gold route, mountain lion, and so on and so forth. And so we want to make sure that that is there's a good amount of clarity, it feels like the, it really brings that outdoor characteristics of who you are, who your town is, and we're going to be able to bring that into the different bus wrap designs. And so with that, I would like just to leave it open to the floor just to discuss this a little bit and get your thoughts. This is I believe the the final selection for the brand committee out of I think, you know, four or five different bus wrap designs that we hadn't brought forth, and this is the one that they favorite the most. But we'd love to hear your thoughts.
I think it looks great. I do have one question. I noticed that you have Fox prints on the front of the bus. I guess that's the front and you have L clothes on the brown one. What do you do with the bird and the fish?
That's good. I think we could still do most had a joke for the bird one but I think we could still do bird tracks. But for the fish I don't know. You know you could have bubbles. Yeah, that's a great Yeah, absolutely.
And I think it's a great idea. I think it helps people that are colorblind you know they have other things look at two concern he's looking at and this is totally it totally the weeds micromanaging the LP in that dark brown that show up on the black windows, or what it had to be a lighter elk. That's number one. Number two is and this is really picky. But I guess I don't know what a silver trout is.
And so rainbow trout is what we have here. Well, there's
no such thing as a silver trout actually extinct animals. So I'm not saying that's because you're calling it a silver trout. But it is possibly we could be rainbow trout or something or even a brown trout which we have brown, but I get this not same color as the brown elk. But silver trout to me. This looks kind of funny. I'm totally in the weeds there. But it's the first thing I kind of hit my brain is like silver trout is an extinct fish. So when I see the weeds, what exactly they're extinct fish. I'm like, well, it just seems kind of weird. It's like, you know, don't look at me like I'm crazy there, Patrick, I get color. So I looked it up and it's like, I don't think I've ever heard of a single fish and it's So it's an extinct fish now. Just that that
rainbow trout or they have multiple colors on it,
well, that might be the first route that's replaced by another one. It's that route is becoming extinct. But that's a good point, we did think, and we assumed we thought the silver trout was actually still not extinct. So that's good to know. So I would assume that we're gonna have to find some other kind of silver base type of
for sure. I just don't know if the silver is the right color.
Yeah, and I did look it up. And I saw the definition that they're located out here, I didn't know that they no longer existed. That's a surprise.
much wider looked it up. It's not like, we actually fish back over life. Why I never yeah, I've never actually heard the fish. So we're trapped. I looked it up. And it is an extinct trout.
I like just saying the trout route. If you just got rid of the word share.
Thank you, that's a great solution. The silver shark we can get their kids really psyched. Yeah.
About 10 years ago, I was part of a community wide brand strategy project that was really similar to the conversation that we're having now, obviously, not for transit, but getting personal opinions and feedback on it. So I want to say thanks for all your work on it. And I really appreciate that it's come from data. And it's come from community feedback. So to me this, I mean, I'm just going to plant my personal opinion on it. And I'm going to give you feedback at this point. But I like that the process has been followed in a way that engages the community. And that is stays true to our roots, it pulls from data pulls from those things, because it's one of the most impossible things to do can confirm, especially in this community is how to get everyone on the same page. So whether it's trout route, or silver trout, or whatever it is, I think the concept of that you guys are trying to go after. Looks great. And thanks for all your hard work, the cube,
and I think the fox is easily recognizable, because red isn't for colorblind males. So I like the fact that there's a fox on there. And it says
consideration mayor for the Badgers was also for our colorblind patrons as well, because each rep will have a different badge shape.
Yeah, I think that's great. Yeah, I
think it's great. You know, there's a real frontier when it was a decent airline. You know, well, I'll say that until the public input. But I remember where the kids were little, it was always which flame were on. You know, we're on the dolphin menu, all the names. So that's kind of cool. Yeah, that's great.
The other thing that's nice about this is because our parking lot have animals, this is sort of a continuation of the animal theme, which is totally appropriate here. And it's very cool. I love that Fox.
It's great. Just a question that's maybe a little bit out of this. But while ago, we were all looking to be able to put up timing systems, and now that we're expanding broadband, different places, are we ever looking to having a sensor on top so that, and now on the street where they're picked up where they could see the time element? Are you talking
about on Route? Like, yeah, right availability? I'm absolutely so we just on April 6, published in RFP for a multimodal transportation plan and a transit development plan. And that sort of technology improvement is something that will be included in that planning process.
Because of the broadband,
I think that will be instrumental. But I also think, too, we've learned a lot of lessons from other transit agencies that have had vendors come and go. So I think we're as, as have we had a vendor that came and went. So I think we're going to be better positioned with this process to find a vendor that works for us. But Trailblazer has been a great partner for the walk buddy Wi Fi extension downtown for the paid parking program. So I think that everything they're doing is going to support our efforts to increase connectivity, and they're always willing to be creative. So hopefully they have good phone numbers for Verizon and T Mobile. So we can get that cellular piece to but yes, that is on our radar for sure. And will be part of a planning process. Perfect. I
like this. Yeah, I'm
Thank you. Yes, absolutely. And thank you all so much. We will come back again when we finish this process. But the last thing I wanted is for all of you to see these beautiful buses drive by and say wait a second, nobody told me about these. So thank you for your input. We'll share the logo and additional marketing strategies when we conclude our work with this late team. So thank you guys so much for the great job for us. Really fun. Thank you.
Can you remind me that is the thought to put these on buses for this year or for next year for this year? It is yeah, nice.
Yes. We are hoping to run the buses. So we are especially since you know we've got buses Coming and going we leased vehicles. So yes, we are going to try and put them on as many buses as we can. This year. The trolleys in particular, the other vehicles may lag a little bit, but it is our intention to do that and really start to roll out the new brochure, some additional signage to start to connect those pieces together visually for our writers. Thank you. Yes. Great.
Thank you so much. Yeah. Okay. And I think that we should be done with our meeting. Is there anything else for the good of the order right now? Seeing none, we are adjourned. Thank you all for being here.
