The first five years of a child's life are critical for growth and development. Yet services for the youngest Kansans are split between four different state agencies. A task force last year recommended consolidating those services into a single office. And there's a new piece of legislation that would do just that. My name is Clay wire stone. I'm the Kansas reflectors opinion editor. And today, we're talking about early childhood, and making sure that Kansas can be the best place for families to raise young kids. To help me cover that topic. I have two experts in the area with me today, Monica merman and David Jordan. Thanks for being here, guys.
Chatting, thanks for asking us.
Yep, thank you for having us.
So why don't each of you so as a little bit of background to our listeners, not only do I know David and Monica through my work at Kansas reflector, but I also met and worked with them in my previous life, doing communications at Kansas action for children in the child advocacy world. And so why don't each of you tell me a little bit about who you are and what you do and why early childhood is an important piece of what you do.
David, you go. Thanks, Monica. And clay, thank you for having us and spending the time talking about the need to invest in early childhood services in Kansas. My name is David Jordan, I lead the United Methodist health ministry fund. We are a 38 year old Health Foundation located in Kansas and our mission is to improve the health of Kansans. And we see an opportunity to do that by investing in services and programs that improve access to care, support the development of thriving children, and build engaged congregations and communities. A key component of our work is supporting the development of young children in their families to help ensure that they can thrive, investing in programs that support healthy brain development. Quality Early Child Care in safe and stable homes is so critical to the health of young children, and also will pay dividends in the long run helping us build a strong and healthy workforce and healthier Kansans for the long run. So this issue of early childhood care is really important to the health fund, and is the parent of a young child in child care. We know how important quality early childcare is to us as parents and helping us feel safe and confident as we return to the workforce and contributed to the great state of Kansas. Monica
My name is Monique Cameroonian, and I live in Pittsburgh, longtime resident of Pittsburgh and really have been involved over since the mid 90s In of movement here in southeast Kansas that looked at how we could all join forces to address the needs of young children and their families in our region and started that work in 1995. I now find myself as the historian in most rooms that I walk into in articulating what we know that science has proven to us that the brain forms a lot earlier than we originally thought and we should transform not only our systems, but our practices to accommodate for that. So for the last so many years, I've found myself in lots of rooms having discussions about how do we not only simply provide services, but ensure that they are high quality, that they're steeped in good practice, and that they are reflective of the people that they are designed to serve. For a day job. I work at the southeast Kansas Education Service Center lovingly known as Greenbush, which has been a leader for a lot of years and helping school districts provide services to kids under the age of five. And prior to that I worked for 16 years in Pittsburgh with a lot of great people in developing a concept called the Center, which for the last 26 years has been one of the largest childcare centers in the state of Kansas and puts alongside of it many, many different family related services. So the conversations that are happening now in Kansas are extremely exciting to me, as we have not just the standard early childhood communities talking about this, but now we have banded with this pneus with economic development forces, with all the folks who recognize the connection to health and behavioral health care to have this really important conversation about the consolidation and organization of how the State offers that infrastructure to families and communities.
Well, and I just think it's really important to say that, you know, between David and Monica and a handful of other folks, there are just such, you know, dedicated and skillful and passionate people in Kansas dealing with early childhood and in the early childhood space. You know, I think it's, it can be easy for folks to forget that, you know, we have the public school system, which is great. I mean, it's something we've worked on for forever, but I mean, that, that starts at five, you know, five, you know, and kindergarten through 12th grade, and there is really not a, you know, it's it's a, it's a lot of different moving pieces for anything young for any kids younger than five.
It's also what we know for sure, based on a couple needs assessments that have been quite comprehensive in this field. It's also highly dependent in Kansas on two other things. One is geography. A kid in Garnett does not get what a kid in Gardner gets which a kid in Garden City gets. And it's highly dependent. And the second thing that we know, through needs assessments, it also is highly dependent upon the adult in the kid's life ability to navigate multiple systems. And so I think it's a good a good set of meaningful strategies that will guide us towards how do we erase those two barriers so that if you're a Kansas kid, you can have access to what you need to be healthy, and that your folks have access to what they need to work and raise a healthy family.
Yeah, so I think that really gets sets us up pretty well, for kind of the the, the bill that has been kind of advocated for and has had some discussion here recently at the State House, which I believe the number is HB 2785. And it's about reorganizing essentially how early childhood services are delivered in the States. So let's start and maybe David, you can tackle this, talk a little bit about how governance for the system is set up today. And what what some of the challenges behind that are? Sure,
you know, let's take a step back from even sort of how governance is set up today is we, as a state, I think, with the governor's leadership recognize the value to invest in high quality, safe, affordable childcare. And one of the challenges that we see in here when we talk to members of the community is that there's difficulties for families and navigating the current system. There's a misalignment of funding and policy. And there's really a lack of clear authority that exists. And this is impacting how families interact with services, how businesses interact with services, and how childcare providers are interacting with services. So the governor really pulled together a bipartisan group of policymakers, early childhood stakeholders, business and economic development leaders, to look at this issue of early child, that early childhood system in Kansas to make sure our governance system helps support the vision of making Kansas the best place to have and raise children. And the governor made that the first act of her second term and convened this early childhood task force that both Monica and I were fortunate enough to serve alongside the bipartisan group of legislators, Mrs. Leaders and other early childhood leaders. And what we heard was that families are, you know, having trouble navigating the system, that there's different requirements based off of where programs sit in a array of different agencies, and that there's just a lack of clear authority sometimes and as early childhood stakeholders, and also folks that have had kids or grandkids in the system, we know that we can do better so the Early Childhood task force made a series of recommendations to look at how to improve the current system. The current system right now essentially has four state agencies that are responsible for different programs. Department of Health and Environment is responsible for child care, licensing and some home visiting programs. hims Department of Education is responsible for some home visiting programs and other Services Department of Children and Families is responsible for child care subsidies and some Headstart programs. And the children's cabinet is responsible for grant making and other really supporting other really critical early childhood programs. So there's four different agencies that have responsibility for critical pieces of the system. And while they all collaborate very well, and there's a lot of energy and excitement around building a shared vision on how we can make Kansas the best state to raise a family. There's challenges that exist with interacting with the system. And one major challenge also is sort of the the lack of a clear leader who has authority for driving an agenda building and driving the agenda forward in working in concert with any executive in governor's office to do so. So that's what we heard. When we talked to folks through listening sessions that we listened to experts that we had an opportunity to improve the system by revisiting the governance structure states like Alabama, Missouri, Georgia have taken similar steps, instead of that governor's task force led to a series of recommendations on how to improve the governance of the early childhood system, and to break down those silos. And break down those overlapping levels of authority and bureaucracy, which led to the vision of collapsing those services into one unified agency, the Office of Early Childhood, and I'll let Monica address any gaps they might have had and talk a little bit more about the task force recommendations and the vision for the office.
Well, and Monica, it sounds like from what David is saying, too, that this is not just about like, you know, kind of bureaucratic shuffling, there's a, there's a real consideration here about leadership in the field.
It is it is I want to point out something as I'm sitting here and thinking about this discussion, the you know, as as the, I'm gonna rephrase that, as I'm sitting here and thinking about this discussion, oftentimes people think this is a new issue, that we're just now bringing it up. And there's quick and easy solutions to the childcare crisis to changing rules and regulations and investing dollars. But it's not quick and easy. The first conversation that I had in Topeka about this was by invitation from Governor graves, and that was a few administrations ago. And so people have been recognizing the complexity of the zero to five landscape in Kansas for a long time. It's now that we have more information, we have more research to back up what we're doing. And quite honestly, we have more of a public outcry, saying we have got to do something to ensure a Kansas Workforce, a high quality public education system, and that we are investing early to save dollars down the line. So as I think about the task force, another thing that I'd really like folks in Kansas to know is that the task force took their job very seriously. And did months of work in saying, Okay, what are other states doing that we can learn from? What were the what were the great things in the fails in other states, they also, really, they also took the opportunity to hit the road and talk to Kansans, and had hundreds and hundreds of people leave work to come give their opinion on what it feels like to have a child under the age of five in Kansas, what's going well, what's not going well, also heard from people in the field, saying this is this is the reality of day to day if we could just do this or that. And as usual, people in the field have really great ideas that need to be brought back looked at as a whole and then put into the form of recommendations. The other thing that the task force did was they took a complete inventory of what do we have? What do we even have and that's always a good sign. When you start with what do we have? What do we need to keep? What do we need to improve upon? And what could we reorganize to make it easier and more efficient to cut red tape for People back home. And that is where those recommendations came from. The beauty of the taskforce was it wasn't people in administrative agency level positions, making all of these decisions, it was a larger group. And those recommendations, I would highly recommend that folks take a look at that task force report and see the See how it's been laid out. Because here's the other piece of the task force, oftentimes Task Force groups, meet, talk high level and move on. This group outlined a transition plan that could be put into action on July 1 of 2024. That would give a year's worth of transition before implementing the next year. And in that transition is articulated, what are the big things we know that are going to have to happen, but also recognize that this is not completely played out? There will be room for and need for input throughout this whole process. But it's just like anything, that's hard. You gotta get started. So I think this process is different than any that I have been part of. And I have to say, as I'm getting close to 30 year veteran in this world of having this same conversation, I am really hopeful. very hopeful.
So yeah, so that kind of gets to the next question here. For both of you. You know, you have now sat in some settings, some hearings for this bill, I believe there were 150, some early childhood professionals who came to the statehouse for the first hearing, and then it was was put off for a day. But the hearings did happen eventually. So what what are you guys hearing? What do you think the status of the legislation is now? And do you think this is something that's heading on its way to becoming more?
Well, I want to thank Chairman Tarwater for not only a holding the hearing, but doing it in a very professional way. And recognizing it's a big topic, and that he has kept things moving. Having been in the legislature for four years, I recognize that sometimes things get hearings, and then nothing gets happened. But that day, he said, We will work this bill. And I want to thank him for his leadership on this. The other thing that I really picked up when I was sitting in the room is these are the usual suspects that are talking. You know, you're always going to see Monica Moran in the room, right? You're always going to be see Kansas action for children. But other folks are talking and saying we must do something now. And I think that is really important to anybody who is in an elected position to take notice of
David, what's your David, what was your take on the hearings and all that? Well,
you know, echoing Monique has taken I do think that Chairman Tarwater and the entire committee took this issue very seriously because they see how critical it is to invest in early childhood. It's critical to returning parents to the workforce, it's critical to long term healthy development for children. It is critical to make the system work better for providers. So I think that the committee is taking the issue seriously, and sees the potential of the Office of Early Childhood. As a critical first step to building the early childhood system. We need to ensure that every child in Kansas thrives. I think the other piece that I would just echo is that there was over 700 child care providers, economic development professionals feel families that signed on to the ladder in support of the Office of Early Childhood to see that multi sector support in the early childhood space really speaks to the level of interest in this topic in in this particular policy proposal. So I think it's exciting to see all of the momentum behind this proposal. CLAY
I want to bring up one other thing. Well, childcare is a is a to me, the biggest part of the discussion, as it should be it's one that has not had the recognition of importance that it should for all these years. There are other components in here that are critical. that will move Kansas forward as a state home visiting programs are not something that every Kansan talks about every day. But home visiting programs are, are just an exceptional way to ensure health and safety of kids in Kansas. So think about parents as teachers, or early headstart or other other programs, like Part C, which is special ed for kids zero to three, when we think about that level of engagement with families and kids and that early intervention component, we can make some serious strides in everything from ensuring a kid can get caught up if they have a developmental delay, all the way to. I'm a brand new parent, and I don't have a clue what I'm doing is all of that gamut. It's I'm gonna rephrase. And it's that whole continuum. This bill addresses how do we put those under one umbrella so that families can pick and choose what works best for them? Additionally, there's some policy changes. They're rephrasing. Additionally, there is a piece in there about dollars that we received from the federal government, when we look at childcare development. So there's issues of access, is there, is there a way we can incentivize more openings? Is there a way we can train folks better, and pulling down those federal dollars, this reorganization and consolidation will help with that? Also, you know, the things that normal everyday Kansans don't know what happened behind the scenes. But yet, when you're a mom, and you're working part time at the bank, as a teller and you need help paying for your childcare, you can apply to the state and get assistance for that. If we can make those types of systems easier for families. Everybody wins.
And I think, you know, Monica, you started to talk about this a little bit. But, you know, this came up when the Senate was having a, I think, a seven hour budget debate the other the other day. People talk about childcare, there's a lot of talk about childcare supply, and, you know, ratios and licensing requirements and all of that. What is what are your guys's take on that is, is there truly like a, a giant shortage of childcare sponsors are truly a giant supply problem. Or, you know, that could be easily fixed one way or the other? What's your take on here, people over
the last couple of years offer the solution of easing regulations or reducing the amount of education or requirements a provider needs to have or reducing ratio or increasing ratios, actually, for adults to kids. I really look back and say if that had been the solution, we would have done it a long time ago. And it is something that I believe in firmly that the regulations that we have in Kansas, ones that I worked under for years and years, are intended to protect kids. And I think we have to be very careful when we look at anything that removes protections. I am all for streamlining regulations. I'm all for anything that we stop and look at in a concerted way did it but to think there is any one solution to childcare issues is is not something that I have ever been able to find. So I think in my mind, we kind of look at three things. One is their childcare is their access to it. The second thing is, is it an affordable thing for those folks who need it. And the third thing is, is equality. And so anytime we look at one single strategy as a solution, I'm a little hesitant.
Just building off of Monica's point I think the reality is that improving childcare will require additional investments the current childcare market in Kansas and across the country is broken. By changing some regulations. We're not going to address the larger systemic issues that child care. It requires more investments. We know that Kansas is invested in top notch K through 12 schools and are committed to making sure kids have the best opportunity to thrive as a result We have great public schools and our kids have a better chance at thriving than some of our peers states, we must make that same commitment to the early childhood system, we know there are significant benefits to doing so. But we won't be able to get there by, you know, allowing one or two more children to be taught by a non benefited low wage worker, we need to invest in building up the workforce and building up the system and really invest in our children in the dividends are proven and evidence base for every dollar spent on quality early childhood, you will see a seven to $10 return. So this will benefit the future of Kansans, but it's not going to be solved by making childcare less safe in Kansas.
So for both of you kind of as a as a closing question, you know, assuming that this bill and kind of this plan goes forward, where you're able to see some restructuring and state government, and some more leadership when it comes to early childhood programs and other things benefiting young kids, you know, 510 15 years out, what more do you think we need? What other changes do you think, kind of are on the horizon that could, you know, improve and strengthen the system? And kind of the ways that David was just talking about and and I know that you both kind of want to see happen?
Well, I think, a couple, I'd like to draw the thought that has always been helpful to me, as I've looked at this very complex issue and tried to do my very small part in improving a system over the last several years, is when I think about what we've done in higher education in the United States, and the investments that we made at the federal and state level and local levels in higher education, you know, starting with the GI Bill, and looking at how we invest in individual people who are trying to access a system as well as the system itself, and how communities play into that. And businesses play into that. And other pieces of infrastructure play into them. And I see that's what we're experiencing in early childhood. And we're at the juncture where we need those investments in the infrastructure, but also in individual facilities and in the people accessing it. And we need that multi tiered strategy, this Office of Early Childhood consolidation in Kansas, will help make the road smoother to get there. I made the comment during testimony recently, when somebody says, how did we get here? How did we get to such a disjointed system, and I describe it as as well, everybody just looked up and tried to get what they could. So local people would say, we'll go after this grant or this grant, at the state and federal level, we would see this part in this part. And I liken it to, you know, keep an offense up with baling wire and, and a little electrical tape and then you put some rope on it. And then you know, for good measure, let's go ahead and pour some glue on top. And that infrastructure has been built that way. And it's worked. It's gotten us to this point. But yet we know that one more piece of tape on there could break the infrastructure. So now is the time for Kansas to recognize the hard work of everybody who built that built that before and say now, how do we make it easier and more efficient for the next group of people so that in 25 years in, let's say, 15 years, we look at early childhood, just like we do higher education now and say it is a must, and we must continue to invest.
David, your thoughts? Sure. You know, at the end of the day, the first five years of life are so important to healthy brain development and kids. It's critical that we invest in early childhood education, evidence based home visiting programs to make sure all Kansas kids get on the right track. Part of that is looking at ways we can finance services to make them more affordable and more available to Kansas families. That means taking advantage of the child care development funds. That means maximizing other federal sources of dollars. It also means taking a shared responsibility approach I think, you know, what can we do to Advanced support for the early childhood system from government, but also let what can business do? And how can families step up we need to, we need to have a shared approach. You know, beyond investing in making programs more affordable and leveraging child care development funds, we also need to look at things like investments to workforce to make it more feasible to support young children, young graduates choosing early childhood as, as a field, make sure that they're making more money providing services in these first critical five years than they would at McDonald's or Burger King. And that's not the reality right now. So investing in the workforce investing makes slot making slots more affordable and available, and then also looking at other creative ways to get there like business, business tax credits and tax credits for families. I think it's both and approach to early childhood because it's such a challenging situation. And also, it's so important to the future of our state and to the development of young children.
Well, Monica merman David Jordan, thank you so much for both coming on the Kansas reflector podcast this week. We will keep tracking the progress of this proposal with a bunch of interest and, you know, thanks again.