What is Imposter Syndrome and how can you deal with it_
11:10AM May 13, 2023
Speakers:
Keywords:
feel
talking
impostor syndrome
people
important
mental health
feeling
managers
finding
necessarily
coming
working
reinforce
transitioning
happening
question
individual
system
experience
critical
Hi everyone, I hope you having a fantastic Saturday. And we're delighted to have you join us whether you're joining from tapping, whether you're joining from the health collective, you should be able to watch this across social media platforms. I'm Amrita party, the founder of tapping a new initiative for women, women in leadership, and the editor of the health collective, which is an initiative I set up to talk about issues of mental health and mental illness from an India lens. Definitely many of you and especially our health, collective family know our guest Kamna Chhibber very well. Kamna is a clinical psychologist, the head of mental health for the Department of Mental Health and Behavioral Sciences at Fortis healthcare calm now, welcome. It's another lovely Saturday, it's great to have you with us.
Thank you so much Amrita, it's such a pleasure as always to be here, always looking forward to our conversations and interactions and talking about mental health and well being on this platform.
And I will give a little tiny plug for those of you who want to support us Kamna and I co authored a book called The Age of anxiety, we'd love for you to pick up a copy karma is actually a prolific author. So you can actually literally Google her and get get one of our books, if you enjoy this conversation, especially. So Tom and I have been talking a lot about mental health in the workplace. Kamna, it is still one of those things that you know, people don't really like the label. But more and more people are realizing that there are many, many issues to consider when you come to the sort of corporate work environment. Non corporate says, Well, of course. And today, we decided we'll talk a little bit about impostor syndrome. This is something Kamna, that's really been picking up in terms of media coverage, and otherwise, over the last several years, it seems to have first been, you know, noticed in the 70s. Actually, though, where they were looking at impostor syndrome and women, but for those of you who are listening in, if you've had these feelings of self doubt, or felt like you're a fraud, and someone's gonna catch you out, or you felt that, you know, you're just constantly an imposter that you don't belong, where you are, especially in the workplace, too, as we're going to talk to Kanye pops up in other areas of our life as well. You know, you're in very, very good company, I would say, because apparently, this does affect perfectionist. This affects hard workers, high achievers, and karma. There's some debate also about just telling women they have impostor syndrome, you know, that I will tell you this Harvard Business Review case was saying stop telling women they have it, because there's often systemic bias and issues like that. So what are your thoughts? If we frame this conversation from an India point of view? What do you think about impostor syndrome? And how do we define it?
You know, I think a lot of times when people come up with some labels, it facilitates conversations in its own way. Unfortunately, what also ends up happening is that somewhere we pathologize, something which can also be normal experience, and which is why I think the Harvard Business Review study also really helps to highlight the fact that you don't necessarily, and you absolutely should not be labeling people with having illnesses or problems without necessarily knowing what is really going on within the larger context of where you're working, where you're coming from, who you are as an individual. And what's characteristic of imposter syndrome, which is the anxiety or the worry, or the feeling that, you know, you may get caught out or you're just not necessarily feeling as equipped to be able to handle some of the challenges that a workplace may posit or situations of life may pose it towards you. These can be fairly normal experiences also for individuals. And a lot of times we end up apologizing that and making you feel almost as though there is something very drastically wrong with you to experience it. The reason to highlight this aspect is because a lot of times people then start questioning their own selves, their capabilities, their abilities, wondering about what is wrong with them? What may have gone wrong in the years growing up? How is it or why is it that they may be different from others, and it leads to a whole different set of mental health related aspects, which could compromise an individual's well being, it's very easy to get caught in this entire debate around feeling like I'm having an impostor syndrome and then as a result, judging your own self experiencing impact on your moods constantly having anxiety being extremely preoccupied feeling as though you know, you're not being able to do your work well. And this is something that we end up seeing with a lot of people, people, like you mentioned could be high achievers, as well. And what ends up happening is that people in the minds associate the fact that you okay, if I'm not going in with confidence, maybe it reflects that I don't have the competence whereas the two may not necessarily have that kind of an interlinkage. People who are constantly they're just able to essentially put themselves across in the right Leave. But that in no way means that you necessarily have the skills and the abilities that are required to do a particular job very well. Someone who is under confident or less confident can equally do a job pretty well as well. But we don't necessarily foster that understanding, reinforce that to individuals, and which is where this comes into play or your larger leadership's come into play, where we need to start bringing in that acceptance to say, there are different people who will have a range of experiences. And they would have their own sets, skill sets, which they would be be bringing in their own personalities, which would be coming in. And we need to start embracing that entire gamut of differences that people bring in with them. We don't have to necessarily just reinforce that this is one set format in which every employee or person who's in a leadership position should be possessing, we don't need to reinforce that. But somewhere we have over the years done that. And this is where, you know, this entire conversation about impostor syndrome has been gaining a lot of traction as well over the recent years.
Yeah, and you know, coming up, we were talking about this, there was this recent study that KPMG report. And it'll thanks for sending that to us. It was saying what 75% of executives, this was looking mainly it looked like corporate America based on the the survey that was there, they seem to feel that they had impostor syndrome. At some point, it was really interesting, because 85% believe it's a common experience. So there is something to be said for knowing that it's not, you know, it's not just you who's going through this 47% of those said results, they think it results from never expecting to reach the levels of success they have. So I just want to unpack that with you a little bit. Those of you who are watching, we're talking about impostor syndrome, which is kind of that feeling where you think you're a fraud, you think you don't belong, where you are usually where you're working, that's how it shows up as an Karnas talking to us about how we can unpack this, how we can acknowledge those feelings, but also what the workplace can do. And karma will come to advice for managers as well. When we talk about stereotypes and conditioning, for example, I do want to mention that, you know, I didn't know that imposter syndrome, but I also didn't have it as a journalist, as a journalist, you're kind of you are very tangible, you know, things that you measured on right, your byline, your stories, and the nature of the job is you have to constantly go and keep learning. I think moving to the corporate environment where sometimes the you know, the OKRs, or KPIs are not as tangible. That's where it started. And Kanye was interesting, because I think having somebody in a leadership position like one of my managers who literally just said, you can't evaluate yourself, the same way you were doing it as a journalist write something as clear is that the goalposts have changed the way you're evaluating yourself as change. So can you give us a few tips in terms of how you deal with it once you know that it's something that's creeping up and like you said, perhaps impeding other areas leaching in new areas?
See, I think a few things that people need to start keeping in mind when you are beginning to feel that kind of anxiousness and you constantly are reassessing or re evaluating or looking over your shoulder and wondering, did I do that right, there are a lot of doubts, which are coming in, I think some of the things that you will have to try and find a hold on or grasp of is one looking at who you are. Having a great, or a better understanding of your own self is something which is very, very critical. So that even when you're finding yourself in situations where you may not be getting reinforcement from the outside your entire internal understanding of your own self, that self awareness piece can contribute towards ensuring that you feel more positively about your own individual self. I think the second aspect is somewhere in your own mind, you need to start busting those myths about feeling that you need to be only a certain way or certain types of people are the ones who are going to be associated with certain positions or certain achievements that we can have. Somewhere breaking that mindset is extremely important. And you need to start reinforcing to your own self, that I may be different from another, or my expectations may have been different from my own self. But if I'm finding myself in something, which is new, which is different, I would have gotten there because I had a certain skill set or something was noticed within me and I need to be able to trust and believe in that and move forward with that belief system to say that you know, what, I will keep on building on that. That reinforcement from within the self is something which is very critical. And another rule which is extremely important is that of the people who are around you, your support system tends to be extremely critical. If you have family members or friends or colleagues who are constantly pulling the carpet from under your feet will always making you rethink what you did why you did it raising questions or you know, raising an eyebrow in concern saying that, you know, maybe you didn't think this right. And not necessarily giving inputs on saying that you know what you did do this trade but for Have this could have also been a helpful approach. If they're not coming in with that problem solving approach, but only highlighting where are the problems, maybe you need to just rethink those relationships and how you are engaging in them. Because that is also something which is constantly going to increase those self doubts. And I think the fourth piece also is sometimes we have to also accept that the standards may need to be the perfectionism that you were referring to is something that we need to start really looking at and seeing that you know, what, every task, every aspect cannot necessarily be handled perfectly your intent counts, the effort that you put in comes, the outcome is not the only thing that you have to look at. The outcome A lot of times may not fall into place, not because of a lack of intent, or investment or effort or ability, it sometimes things just don't come together. And that is an experience that we have to learn to deal with, without casting that excessive self blame and experiencing that guilt. And then wondering about should I even be here? Yeah, analysis has to be not just about the self, and what could I have done differently, but also about what was it within the situation? Who were the other stakeholders? What was everyone else's growth? Could there have been if certain things within the situation or position differently, maybe the same approach would have worked? So you have to take a more holistic perspective on things which I think goes missing when you're experiencing this impostor syndrome? Because your focus is only inwards? Where am I going wrong? And what am I doing which needs to be now changed, because I am feeling as though I am unacceptable in the settings.
That's fantastic actually come as always, any of you watching this actually very clear, clear guidelines that come as laid out. One is have a better understanding of yourself, so that validation can't keep coming from outside. I think that's really critical coming out. Also, when we're talking about transitioning jobs, transitioning roles, because that's when we tend to be harder on ourselves, I'm going to pop in some of these comments as well, which we will get camera to address. She's saying, also to start busting the myths that you need to be a certain way. And I love this, that leadership or certain roles are meant to be held by a certain kind of person, because that's also conditioning, we need to unlearn stereotypes come in there, we need to accept that there's a lot of effort, we don't always have control over the outcomes. And then my favorite is the support system coming up, because we always talk about the support system as a net net positive, but as you just said, they can be our most critical stakeholders. So we need to also have that balance. When you look at some of these comments that are coming in which I'm also going to pop in to the to the chat Ritesh, thank you for this good morning to you as well. British saying a sudden change in working environment effects our mind and thought process, if we are comfortable with the existing working style, and suddenly the change comes in, how do we overcome that and accept that change that those changes come?
So I think two pieces are very important one, we tend to forget that if you are going through the transition and you move into a new place, please understand the system is also going through a transition because they are also bringing in a new person. The ownership is not on just the individual, but also the system, which is bringing in the new person to undergo through that mutual change process. I think highlighting that mutuality is something which is extremely critical, so that you're not again, internalizing too much of the responsibility and taking ownership of pieces which are not yours, which allows you to be a little more relaxed and comfortable within your own self. I think the second aspect is that often when we are finding ourselves in these situations of transitions, we expect ourselves to move from being A to Zed automatically, very quickly. That's not how it works. You have to allow yourself a substantial period of time. One of the things which I would always share within therapy when I'm working with my patients is that if you're going through a new process, whether it is a transition in a relationship, whether it's in your workspace, whether you're moving to a new city, give yourself at least the next six, eight months, before you think that you should now have a great better handle or a grip on things. If you're expecting that from day one, you will be able to do things you know, in a different manner completely adapted to the system that can't happen because you don't know the new system. So you have to give yourself time, face yourself in a better manner. Understand that you will go through your own change processes at a slow, steady rate. The slow and steady part is extremely important so that it's not too jarring for you and you're able to sustain those transitions for a longer period of time. Your role is to absorb your role is not to just keep on pushing and pushing your own self but absorb, understand, and then start bringing about the shifts in the systematic manner. That is something which is very important. You need to be open and receptive to feedback to inputs, have more conversations with the peers, with the colleagues, the new people that you're engaging with, share with them, where are you finding it to be a challenge, because they cannot mind read and understand that you would be experiencing a difficulty somewhere that would enable a process of communication to get enhanced, which could get you some more critical inputs on what could you do differently to be able to enhance your own adaptation. But most importantly, give yourself down and talk about your experiences, these two are very, very cool.
Give yourself time and talk about your experiences, sometimes karma it does feel, you know, we get embarrassed to share that where it's see we're lost. And it comes back to our parents. And we were talking about where we can't just look at success on one set of parameters. It turns out when we do open up, and I've seen this in corporate life as well, or when somebody you know, whether it's me personally, or somebody on a team, saying that I don't get it, you know, I need help or reaching out in whatever way you want to reach out. That sounds like something that is good advice for all of us. Because it also enables people to know that you're, you're kind of exceed. So it's not just when you're transitioning roles, though, right? It's also when you're in a leadership role, when you're, you know, maybe it's, maybe it's months and months after a promotion. I do see some people, for example, you know, questioning, like, why am I feeling this doubt, you know, maybe I shouldn't acknowledge it, because, you know, it's a sort of dog eat dog world out there. But do you think the pros of sharing, or at least finding that safe space where you can share getting that kind of peer support that outweighs the cons of feeling that you're going to be found wanting or lacking?
I think it does help a lot more. And see, it's important to understand, if you're experiencing that kind of anxiousness, it is also transitioning into this entire space where you're feeling that, you know, if I share something, the other person will rethink or reevaluate their assessment of me as an individual. That's also you, your anxiety, getting the better of you, which prevents you from sharing things in that moment. And that's something that you will have to find a way to put on the side. Even if you think you cannot be speaking to the people who are there in say, your current workspace, there will be other people that you've had in your life who will mentors or advisors and you should reach out to them. But blocking yourself out and getting yourself into this silo where the only voice that is resonating is your own, that does not tend to be helpful in that moment, because it's going to only reinforce everything that you've been thinking, you're not getting any other perspective which is coming in. And we need that to break in that moment where you're feeling that, you know, okay, maybe I'm not doing the best over here, maybe something else was required. And I think the other piece also, is that somewhere, need to start looking at what am I really expecting from my own self? And could there be a mismatch in what my expectations are and what may really be possible and what is really the meat of the situation. Sometimes that entire mismatch also creates its own pressures on us. And we start judging our own individual selves, instead of recognizing that this may not be a scenario where you need to reassess who you are as a person, or as a team leader or manager in that situation. And you could have a different approach altogether, which is not conforming to what you may think the ideal standard is being differences, okay? So long as you've been able to utilize that being different in the context of what you're seeing in front of you. And that's where creativity happens. That's how like reality happens. That's how growth happens. So we don't all stick to that one set standard of doing things. And we need to become okay with that. And somewhere I feel that growing up this is something which needs to be repurposed to write from a very young age to say that be different, understand yourself, have a set of values, a set of guiding principles, so that you can have greater belief and confidence in the approach that you're taking in your day to day life.
Yeah. And also, like you've said in the past, like, you know, we have so many different identities. It's not that just one should be defining who we are how we see ourselves. Reducing. Thanks, ma'am. That was very useful. Thank you. redish. For the question, Rita, thank you for that. She said our one the support system is so important, but this is critical governor, it's hard to fight being a perfectionist, and shadow preta is a co founder of tapping in a very accomplished, you know, professional with 20 years of experience more than 20 years of experience. It is hard to finding a perfectionist, where does that come from? And how does that tie into what you've been saying about tackling impostor syndrome?
No, I think perfectionism ends up being a trait. It gets reinforced over a certain period of time in our life, especially growing up as a young person. This becomes the expectation or the norm, which has probably been reinforced to you as an individual that everything that you're doing you need to do during a certain standard way, there is an expectation, you need to be able to ensure that you're getting the best outcomes, there can't be any variance in the way you're doing things. These are reinforcements, which happened growing up usually. And somewhere, it's also linked to the fact that, you know, we are not able to accommodate the understanding that you can think of perfectionism as doing something in a certain set standard way. But what you're not recognizing is that an alternative way could also be an Okie, or in fact, an even better way of doing things. And when you get too rigidly stuck in these frames, they tend to impact you. Because what it does is that when you're not achieving that standard that you thought you need to accomplish, it makes you again, go into that loop of feeling worried feeling concerned, getting anxious, getting really worried, wondering about your own ability to really do what is needed in a situation, and you start judging your own self, and the skills or the capabilities that you're demonstrating in those situations to say, Am I really good enough? Perhaps I'm not and which is why I'm not being able to do it in this certain way. It's also about who are the role models that you're looking up to. And there is a lack of flexibility. In our approach to say that, you know, que, I only thought that this is the best way of being or doing things and I'm not being able to bring in that flexibility, in my own mind to say that the different way of being can also be okay for me as an individual. So these are some of the things which I think are extremely important and critical, which we need to keep in mind when we're looking at impostor syndrome. And when we're looking at perfectionism in the context of impostor syndrome, that it's something that we would need to keep on working on within our own self, by reinforcing the ordinary ways of being can also be acceptable.
And, you know, before we come to camera a little bit about what you were saying about the environment around you, whether it's your team members, your managers, or your support system. So when we talk about overcoming some of these feelings of self doubt, you've talked about how important is to express ourselves, talk to others. There's also this, this point on you can, as an exercise, separate out your feelings from what actually has been happening. And this is something we would advise in a workshop as well, which is, you know, take a piece of paper and write down for example, your achievements, accomplishments, and these are like not, these are these are actually tangible facts, right? What should be evaluated on what you would consider your achievements over the last six months to a year, and sometimes seen that does help, would you agree?
Always does, because I think what ends up happening is that when you are in that emotional mindset, at that point in time, the lens that you're wearing is a very critical one. And if you're wearing that particular lens, and coming into that scenario in front of you, what you end up missing out is on every other information that could be completely to the contrary, as compared to what it what it is that you're focusing on right now. And I think it's extremely important to start recognizing that we can all develop that tunnel vision where you become narrowly focused on only two or three or four pieces within a situation which you are focusing on. And you are feeling extremely negative about what is it that you are bringing into that scenario. So your perspective has become very narrowed down, you're not taking into account all the information, you're not looking at the rest of the evidence. So for instance, if you thought that you ended up, you may come out of a meeting, feeling that I completely bombed that particular presentation. But it's quite likely that it may not have really happened in that way that there would have been moments within that same presentation, where people may have appreciated the foods that you were given, but your mind is so focused on the fact that you gave there were these one, two or three instances where I could not handle that particular comment or question very well. And you construed the entire experience as being this extremely negative one. And this can happen to us not just in the context of one situation, but across multiple situations. And the whole evaluation of yourself can become extremely negative. So getting that evidence to the contrary in place is very important. Sometimes you need to do it consciously. And you need to remind yourself that you know, segregate the facts from the emotions and how am I looking from it, looking at it, and if you're not able to do it yourself and taking input from people around us that 360 feedback concept is something which can be very helpful to be able to realign yourself to what may really be happening in a scenario
that's so interesting is resonates on multiple levels. PETA says thank you so much. Absolutely come as you were talking about that presentation comment. It reminds me of a friend who actually does not realize she's an ace presenter, I was telling her you should do a session with us on public speaking and presenting and she probably was thinking about those two or three points that she had made me fumbled, you know, an over like, several years. So I think that's so, so pertinent. Shraddha Gautam, thank you so much for this ashadha scene camera. My team used to look at me funny when I would ask them to explain something which I didn't understand. It took a while for me to convince them. It's a genuine query, and I'm not testing them, or the corporate environment is something else. How do you How would you react to this?
That, like you said, we raise it the corporate environment is something else. And again, I think a lot of times, unfortunately, raising a question is seen as something which is not necessarily encouraged. You're expected to know things in a certain way. And if there is someone who's willing to raise that question people around them, a lot of times give them those physical looks to say that really, are you asking me this question? And it may not necessarily be because, you know, they find it that raising that question isn't necessarily the issue. I think sometimes they're just surprised. And I do feel that this fits in so well with this entire stereotype way in which we tend to operate a lot of times where we feel that there is a certain normative standard to which people need to be operating. And if you're not operating in that particular way, it's looked at as being too different. And as a result, something which which can feel like it may not be the most acceptable way of being. But I'm so glad that you know, show that this is something that you've not let go off instead, you persisted and foreign for another individual in the same situation, it would have made them feel that you know, they're doing something differently, and they may have withdrawn. And if you've not, then this is kudos to you. Because this reinforces that if you keep standing by your beliefs, and by your understanding of your own self, you can actually circumvent a lot of the stereotype ways in which people expect you to be or the way they expect that you know, you're going to be fulfilling your role. So this is actually really wonderful.
Kudos, Shraddha and thank you so much for that question. And for sharing that. Come I do want to ask you now when we look at ensure that profits are brilliantly when we look at the team, when we look at the workplace, we look at the team, we look at the managers, of course, it's easy to say the managers need to be supportive, you know, as leaders, you need to have a more empathetic style. These are all you know, the new guidelines everyone's trying to follow. But what are the actual, you know, tips that can help managers who a may not have heard of impostor syndrome in the first place, do not think it's a real thing. And three might still want to do best by what's, you know, by the team members, what are some tips for those managers?
I think, a few basic things to start with. Somewhere, it's important to start accepting the differences in your own mind when you're entering into an engaging conversation with another person coming in with an openness and flexibility is important. This is something which is critical for individuals, for managers in particular, because often we, we've also gotten used to being doing things in a certain way. So if someone comes up with a different approach, if you approach it with more openness and flexibility, you may be able to also discover that there could be alternative ways in which things can be done. Now that entire openness and flexibility as a result can also empower you to be more encouraging towards the younger people, or your team members who are coming up to you with different ideas, or a whole lot of times feel have come across as being very shaky. Oftentimes, we find ourselves as managers in situations where you may have team members who will be more withdrawn a little more quiet. And sometimes they need that extra push in a more positive way. And starting with perhaps encouraging them to speak in one on one settings and then encouraging them by sharing that, you know, a lot of their ideas could be good, new and novel. And something which could really contribute positively to the team and to the work can be very helpful to them in bringing those even to the fore in team interactions. But that process of affirming, and ensuring that that feedback is reaching this particular person or people is going to be the responsibility of the particular manager. And a lot of times I think as managers, it's important to not get stuck with only one way of giving feedback to people, you also need to understand that there also needs to be flexibility in the way in which you approach different people. I know it feels like a lot of work to do when you're looking at, you know, working with big teams, multiple people, but honestly, this is something which is very, very critical and can improve performance and productivity by such a large margin, that it is beneficial for everyone concerned. A little bit of investing investment in understanding the people who they're in teams, giving them the right support, pointing out to them where they're actually good, what could be the spaces where they can certainly make some improvements, but using a more encouraging and affirming way of speaking with them and communicating with them and they then getting them to start also engaged with larger teams is actually the right approach, you know, and give them the credit, give them the credit and the encouragement, they can really do wonders. But it starts with us maintaining that openness and the flexibility as managers or mentors, in systems, that's something which is very, very crucial.
And understanding that there are different styles of work that different styles of even leadership that show up, I have two more questions for you Come on. One is, you know, at tapping, what we've been trying to do is really focus on building out a community building out a network when it comes to peer support. I'm a big fan of, you know, the buddy system. As you know, we've talked about that within the workplace. And shout out to Sydney for suggesting it's peer to peer and peer plus one, which may be very helpful for, you know, mid career women, for example, sometimes you will have people who won't feel as comfortable, let's say, even if they have a mentor, who's the CXO, they might not want to share some of these, you know, day to day challenges, because they feel like in the bigger scheme of things, that's not what you want to focus on. How important do you think that is, and sneak peek? I know, you think it's important, because we've talked about this, but how you look at a buddy system that's not necessarily within your workplace, but finding it as a safe space. How important is that?
Very, very essential, because I feel that, you know, if you're only going to be looking and getting that input from one space, you're also restricting the viewpoints, which are reaching you, the more people that you do connect with on different platforms through different mediums, it allows you to be able to build on a lot of perspective, if you and I are talking and we add one more person and one more person, the perspectives just change significantly, because everyone is going to bring in their own unique experiences and understandings and ways of looking at things which two people may not be able to come up with on their own. And I really feel that you know, pure support, pure moderation, pure intervention can be so helpful and so valuable, because at the end of the day, all of us don't need to start going to therapists and psychiatrists or, you know, finding counselors and or talking to different people, sometimes just those conversations within that small group or a slightly larger group can be very helpful in offsetting a lot of the doubts and the challenges of, you know, the things that we are feeling stuck with as well. And they can just help resolve a lot of the difficulties and the stressors that can meet mental health and well being compromised over time. So I feel it's extremely important to lean into and build your support mechanisms, whether through friends, whether through workspaces, whether through new communities happen Papin, deep love, there's so many different platforms, which are coming in which bring people together professional, to be able to exchange ideas and share their thoughts and experiences and support each other in multiple ways, which I think is fabulous. And there's so many people who are willing to do that, which is the best, you know, and I think that should be utilized and capitalized on the role. If you're willing to support each other, then why not?
The more the better, I think, actually, for sure, because I think if we can have that support system in place, I'm just putting on the topic, email and our website. You know, for those of you catch up on this later, if you want to look at tapping it is for working women in India to start with if you have five years of experience, you're eligible, please log on for more there. Camera, I will come to a final question, though, as you said, we don't all need therapists, psychiatrists or support in that sense, especially if we have a solid peer support system. But when would you as a clinical psychologist and had you know, mental health over their 40s? When would you suggest in this context of imposter syndrome? Because you did talk about how it can you know, trigger anxiety and so on early in this conversation, when would you suggest we do reach out to a professional? When is it you know going to be something that does require a little bit more structured and professional help?
See, I think at any point in time in your lives, if you find that moods are getting impacted, thinking is getting affected, or your work is getting affected relationships are getting affected, it's becoming hard for you to manage your sleep, your routines, the functionality is overall getting impaired. And you're seeing consistently despite the fact that you're talking to people trying to share experiences, you can feel that you know things are not getting better, with things are not getting better. And you are seeing that there is an impact on the ways in which you think feel and behave three aspects. And your functionality is getting affected. That's when you reach out to an expert because that's when perhaps it has moved from just being an aspect which was impacting your well being to it becoming something which is significantly compromising your mental health. And before it reaches that point where it transitions into becoming a full fledged mental health related illness, it's important to seek intervention. early interventions always help we don't Keep telling people that you know, you have a small concern you run to a therapist, we all will have stressors in our lives, we will all have challenges, most of them get resolved. And you would find that, you know, even if a few days have gone by and you were struggling with something, you were able to work through it either on your own or with the help of support systems, and then it does not affect you. But if things are persistently affecting you, you're not being able to let go of them. They are sticking with you. Affecting, like I said, your thoughts, your feelings, your responses, your functionality is getting impaired, please reach out to an expert that is something which is extremely important to ensure that you can take care of your own selves in the long run.
And yes, it's an important message, Carla, because, you know, we also need to, you know, one on one, or one to many one in a group, kind of do away with that fear factor, I think that does tend to creep in, right. When we say that, Oh, you know, if I reach out to someone that means it's a big problem. No, it's the other way around is commencing, the earlier you look out for help, the better. And I love that we can all actually, you know, take part in this together, whether we're, you know, working freelance in corporate environments, whether we have access to a peer support network, or we want to create our own as always, camera. Thank you so much. It's been lovely to chat with you. And I've learned a lot. We're going to put some emails and resources together for those who watch and catch up later and hopefully send you some more questions. But those who have thank you so much for watching. Thanks, Cameron.
