October 10, 2024 AZBSN Digital Access Task Force Recording

8:56PM Oct 10, 2024

Speakers:

Steve Peters

Ilana Lowery

Nicole Umayam

Mark Goldstein

Mala Muralidharan

Lucy Howell

Drew Garner

Gordon Fuller

Moosh Ansari

Jamie Garrett.

Keywords:

broadband office update

market sounding

digital inclusion

cybersecurity pilot

hotspots program

school bus WiFi

E-Rate challenges

digital equity grants

tribal grants

USF funding

Supreme Court case

alternative technologies

Starlink

federal budget

workforce development

So bear with me while my dog's bark hope he is not disturbing too much in the background, he's not too happy with having visitors. So anyway, good morning, everybody. Glad to see you again. Let's do some quick intros. So Jamie, I think you've been here before, but a long time ago, so you want to introduce yourself, and then we'll get back to you to do the update with broadband office.

Sure. My name is Jamie Garrett. I work at the Arizona Commerce Authority state broadband office. I am the senior Broadband Program Manager. I've been on board for about six months. I specialize in permitting and infrastructure side of the program. So nice to meet everyone. If I haven't anyone here yet,

well, actually, you've got where a lot of the action is right now, so it'll be good to hear from you.

Yes, yes, we are in the middle of market sounding and collecting feedback on our proposed project areas right now. Yeah,

so we're going to ask you to do a little more update in just a little while and get more details about that. So

sounds good.

Give me a second here. There we go. Okay, so couple of things do we have? Anybody else that's new this morning?

Anybody Good morning? Steve, this is moosh.

I'm sorry, it's too good morning. Steve,

can you hear me? Oh, oh, good. Yeah. I'm having trouble with the link for some reason, and i That's why I was like, Well, let me just call in. I don't want to be late, but if you could resend me the link, that would be great. So I could actually, you know, get on the Zoom, and I can't see who's on it. So I did invite our Deputy General Manager. First of all, my name is wish man, sorry. Call me mush. I work for the Navajo tribal utility authority.

Okay, in just a second, moosh, I'll try to resend that invite for you so we have somebody else who's having trouble getting on today. Anybody else have trouble joining this morning? Okay? So give me just a second motion and I'll get that off to you. Thank you so much. I'm sorry I just said thank you. Okay, no problem, Steve. This is Brian Thomason. I'm the individual that moosh invited. All new to the call. Really excited to be here. I really appreciate moosh to extend the invitation to join. I've been with the NTUA now since December of last year. I have 44 years in the industry, and my role is Deputy General Manager. We're a communication systems division for NT way that takes in microwave fiber data center knock in it. So first of all, do you want to just tell people who NTU NTUA is? I'm sorry, novel tribal utility authority. It is the entity that provides utilities to the novel nation. We're owned by the nation. We're an entity of the government there on the nation. And NTUA provides not only broadband, middle mile type of services, but we also provide gas, water, electric and gas, if I didn't mention that. So those are the utilities and what we do here on the Navajo Nation. So Brian, I had talked to Moo she may have told you that we're going to have you guys do a presentation to our meeting sometime in the next few weeks. He did mention that, Steve, that sounds great. Okay, so give me just a second. I want to get this off to moosh. Moosh, I'm going to resend the meeting announcement, and hopefully you can that that'll work. Let me know. Give me Just a second here. I

in here, find your email real quick. Moosh, i.

Okay, moves, where Is your email? I

I wonder if musha's associate could just email, I just put the chat, put the Zoom link in the chat.

Can't see it. He can't see it in the chat because he can't get logged into so he's only on the phone.

Yeah, no. I mean, like his, his buddy could email it, could grab it and email it so you can go on. Yeah, okay,

it's M O, O, S, H, right, moosh. I

Well,

my email is, it's actually M, U, J, T, A, B, A, A,

at, let me try that.

It might help if I just try to re register again.

Yeah, why don't you? Why don't you try that, and then, if you don't get in,

perfect, yeah, and

I'm going to resend this to you anyway.

Okay, sorry about that. So let's move on. Mala, Are you online yet?

Yes, I am good.

So, so first of all, a couple of announcements. I want to acknowledge Mala, who all of you know as our E Rate administrator for public libraries, who has received a prestigious award from Shelby schools, health and libraries broadband coalition. So Mala, you want to tell people about that? Oh, my goodness.

I don't know what to say, except that I was totally surprised, taken off guard. Didn't expect it. The middle of stuffing my face with the dessert. We were gathering back after lunch and they and John went House and the President announced it. I you know the the award is for excellence in broadband work and in digital inclusion work. So and like I said, I was I was totally speechless. I didn't expect it. So this was the first time that they have constituted that award. That made it even more surprising, because they had the world to choose from, and they they chose me. I couldn't imagine why. Maybe because it was my birthday that day. That's that's the only reason I think they could have, they would have selected me.

Well, I think it's more than that. You have been tirelessly working, not only with us, but certainly with Shelby and all the the great work. So you it was certainly a well deserved recognition.

Thank you. It It's my 50th year working in libraries. So I've been working since 1974 Yeah. So yeah. Many of you on this call may not have even been born by then.

Well, I think most of us have been around for a while, but anyway,

we've got a lot of younger folks on the call Steve, thank you. Thank you. Anyway,

you bet so I'm not seeing Kelly. Mukherjee, Kelly, are you there? He's not there. Well, so is there somebody else from. Uh, from Hayden, who can talk about the T shirts

I can? Steve, okay, go ahead. Elena, yeah, so happy Digital Inclusion week, everybody. Um, let me turn my camera on. Um, we oh, yeah, Nicole, and the only reason I don't have mine on is because I already wore it earlier this week. But we have these great T shirts that Kelly worked on getting designed with state 48 I'm sure all of you know are familiar with state 48 they worked with us to design a digital inclusion shirt that is not dated, so anybody can wear it anytime, every year, and as Nicole just modeled, it's a it's a beautiful teal color on the back of it, it has the state. It even has a QR code for those that you know may be impaired and want to be able to have somebody maybe take a shot of it so that they can order it, etc. We have a order form that I will be happy to drop in the chat, yes. And Nicole, the sixth C of Arizona is connectivity. So that's kind of the theme of the shirts. Oh, thanks, Jamie. And I know Erin, we had a pre order before any of us saw the shirts, so we did a pre order to see how much interest there would be. And there does look like there's a lot of interest. So we're going to be ordering more of those. And everybody here is welcome to order them. I will drop the link in. There's also a there's a picture where you can see the front and the back of it, and I think that's it. We're going to also try to sell them at net inclusion, which is here in Arizona, in 2025 but it's in May. So we will have an opportunity for Aiden to raise some funds, which we have not, you know, tried to do yet, but this is a great kickoff and a great way for the coalition to get some money in our coffers. So, Nicole, Did I forget anything?

They're going to be able to order it in perpetuity?

Well, that's a great question. I'm not sure, and by the time we meet again, I should probably have some answers. Or Erin will be on the call, or Kelly will be on the call. I think the answer is maybe yes, or at least through net inclusion. Yeah.

So Elena, if I'm not mistaken, though, that people have to pick up that shirt somewhere in Phoenix. Am I correct about that?

Well, no, that was just the first round of orders Marianna, who's not on the call that, she's with AZ strut, and she was doing us a favor and picking them up and trying to distribute them as best she could to those of us who ordered them. So we had them for this week. So and Erin wanted to wear hers in Greece,

so she also mailed some too,

if you paid her or paid for the shipping.

Yeah, thanks, Sharika, mail them out, but I'm sure if we have a lot of orders, we can figure out how to distribute them.

Okay, thank you. Elaine, I appreciate that. Sure. Yeah, good work. Aiden, they did a great job on those T shirts. So moving on quickly. So want some updates from the Arizona broadband office. And Aaron is not here. Some of you may have heard but Jamie Garret, who we have not seen in a long time, is here. And so Jamie, I'm going to turn it over to you. Do you have any sharing or not?

I don't know. Well, I could share the broadband navigator website, but I think most folks may be familiar with it from when we were doing the challenge process. So we did release our draft project, areas for the market sounding phase and broadband navigator users have until about November 7 to add in feedback, and we want to hear, you know, what do you like about the project areas, what don't you like? So feel free to share your thoughts in there. And you know, we worked on it pretty hard, so hopefully it looks nice, but we want to collect as much feedback as we can until we open up applications towards the end of the year for sub grantees. And that's a little specific, because that's that's my corner that that I'm working on there.

So Jamie, can you just explain a little more for people who may not know about the market? So. Sounding exercise and the project areas. So the will people have a little more background about that? Please, absolutely.

So the project areas are essentially the on the map. You can, you can click on them to provide feedback, but they're essentially where potential ISPs or local governments or tribal nations can give feedback based on if they want anything changed, if they have concerns, because we do care about what the community thinks before we release those and we wanted to be a collaborative effort, and to go into what the application process is that will be when there's going to be, essentially, I might, I don't know if I want to call it a quiet period, but you want to get your questions and concerns And now, because once we open up applications, you'll need to have all your items together, essentially, because we can't really interfere with the application process for internet providers. But this is for bead, and we're hoping to have all of that completed and started before the end of the year. I So

essentially, market sounding is feedback from from anyone that's registered in the portal, which would be local government, could be nonprofits, could be potential bead applicants and internet providers.

Do we have any questions about it that I could help answer

any any questions for Jamie,

just Steve Mark, I did put the link in a brief description to the landing page for that and where the resources are in the chat. Thank

you, Mark. And just a reminder that I do include all of that in my newsletter with all the links and contacts and stuff. So just a reminder that you can find that stuff there. Oh, come on, hello, Gordon, you need to yeah, sorry

about that. Okay.

I'm trying to find you here anyway. Okay, any questions for Jamie? If not, let's move on. And as always, we're well, we welcome Nicole, who you all probably know is the federal program officer with NTIA, very expensive mark, you need to mute. Okay, so, Nicole, you're on anything. Yeah, go ahead, yeah,

I'll drop a couple links in the chat, but I won't need to share my screen, okay? But yeah, I'm Nicole umayam. I'm the federal program officer for Arizona with NTIA, if we haven't met yet, so I'm the grant administrator for the bead and digital equity work here in the state, connecting the federal level with the state level and stakeholders on the ground. Just a little bit of additional context to what Jamie had shared. The project areas for bead are they're veritable draft project areas, and the state is soliciting feedback from all sorts of stakeholders, including eligible applicants and community members. But what we will also see shortly is the final posting of the challenge process results. If you recall the challenge process from earlier this year where all of the eligible be locations were validated or challenged or substantiated, and then providers had a chance to to review that evidence, that process and those data sets were submitted to NTIA for final approval and verification of that process. And then the state is required to post those before they officially open the project areas as part of their round one or sub grant applications. So the you know, Arizona is kind of unique in soliciting feedback this way, before that posting is that final posting is out there. But if you're curious about confirming that. Status. We don't expect a whole lot of changes, but that's where we are in the process. The other piece right prior to opening the round one for applications is what's called the pre registration phase, or pre qualification phase, that will open prior to round one. That's where it's actually required, where applicants submit financial data, prospective project areas, prospective technology types, they're able to ask questions of the broadband office. It's kind of cuts down on some of the lengthy review, as well as gives the state time to go back and forth with applicants and clear information as needed. And it's also that pre registration is kind of a required part of the of the application, so gives you a little bit of lead time as well, if you're if you're considering it. I did want to talk a little bit about the digital equity grants, because it is digital inclusion week and hot off the press. You know, I know this group has focused a lot on the digital equity competitive grant, and that application just closed, and NTIA actually received over $6.5 billion in funding requests, which is significantly more than the, you know, 1.25 that's available for grant funding. But it really speaks to the importance of this work and the interest, and I think a lot of the really great, great job that a lot of our national partners and local partners have done to spread the word about this funding. And so now we've got the fun task of going through reviews. Yep, Drew, I see your hand is raised again,

yeah. Would you remind me again how much was offered in this first round? It was like 700 million,

yeah, so 1.2 5 billion for the administration and to be made available. And then let me just confirm my numbers, because there is a 5% set aside for tribal entities as well. So confirm how much we had available there for this this round, so 800 million, and that includes the native entities set aside. Okay,

so that, so that's for Trump one with the understanding there's going to be like, a second and maybe third round later. Yeah. Okay, so 6.5 billion applied out of a pool of 800 million. Okay, dang.

Best of luck. Yeah, best of luck to everyone. You know. We are expecting those awards to to be issued on a rolling basis over the next few months here as at the same time, we are wrapping up and making award announcements for the state digital equity capacity grant as those applications go through the process. So the Arizona, we're not quite, not quite to the to the award stage yet with with Arizona, Paul, I do not have the number of applicants from Arizona. I'm, you know, we're not sure yet if we're going to be able to post all the applicants. But I think amongst this group, and Aiden, and I think the broadband office, they were collecting information on who applied. You are, amongst yourself, you're able to kind of share about about some of those numbers, but we are not able to post all of the all of the applicants to this program, unfortunately. But

we will Paul to try track that down about who actually applied from Arizona.

But that does bring me to my my last point in the nature of digital inclusion week, where we celebrate some of the wonderful work going on in the ground. Paul's work with Phoenix College was actually highlighted recently by NTIA as an outstanding as an outstanding example of digital equity work, especially for training the future workforce. So this is their work as part of the connecting minority communities pilot program, which is another digital equity grant program of NTIA. And I think this was a really nice, a really nice feature on that work. And I was able to attend one of the roundtables earlier this year. But hats off to Paul, and I think, you know, he's a really great resource for all of you who are thinking about, you know, really, the long term impact that this can have, and working within a higher ed setting, as well as some, some really careful and intentional. Work around supporting the community. So really impressive work there from from Paul and Phoenix College and yeah, disrupt the link here in the chat, if you want to take a

look. Okay, any questions for Nicole, where we move on, going once, going twice as always. Thank you, Nicole, always glad to have you participate in our meetings. So Jamie, do you know is the broadband office still looking for a budget and compliance manager, or has that now been filled?

They have been going through interviews, but it is not officially filled yet. Okay, the I'd like to mention the tribal liaison position at ACA looks to still be posted as well.

Okay, is that already posted?

Yeah, it looks like it's on the zip recruiter page.

Okay, website that's been open for a while, has it not?

It has so I was, you know, mentioning it again, because, well, good.

So I will, I will get that link and send that out with our newsletter. Thanks, Steve, sure. Okay, moving on. So we have some updates today. There's lots of stuff happening at the federal level, and of course, this is election time, and so who knows who's doing what with elections. But first of all, I want to start with Mala, who you've already met, to talk about the, excuse me, the cyber security pilot program and other schools and libraries initiatives that are going on. And then we're going to hear from Drew Garner and Amelia day Jesus about what other kinds of federal issues that are going on. And I don't think she's here today, Judy soltrip with the Senator Mark Kelly's office. So Mala, I'm going to turn it over to you to kind of give us the latest on what's happening with that cybersecurity demonstration project.

I'm not going to share my screen yet for this. I am working on a presentation for acla, and as soon as I finalize it, I'll send it to you, Steve, maybe in the next day or two, and then you can share it out, but I've got a draft format that I'm not ready to share yet. So let me, let me walk through this with you, and I'll take questions if there are any, the FCC Chairwoman announced the learn without limits program at AZ at ALA last year, last June. And there she wanted, I mean, the whole, whole idea, was to, to quote her say at FCC one what we want to make sure that everyone everywhere has access to high speed internet service, and they had just defined that high speed. But we know that millions of people in this country are on the wrong side of the digital divide, and libraries fill that gap. So that was the reason why she wanted this to the learn without limits program to be to set it up. And there were three programs that were born out of this, the cyber security pilot project, the hotspots through E Rate and a Wi Fi on school busses. So those were the three. And I'll, I'll walk you through each of these programs quickly, because I in the interest of time and feel free to ask questions at the end, FCC adopted the report in order of June 6, 2024 for the schools and libraries cyber security pilot program. It is a three year pilot program and has $200 million from the Universal Service Fund to support it, to support the participating, eligible schools, libraries and a consortium of schools and libraries. This is for cyber security services and equipment, and the pilot program will actually evaluate the effectiveness of using these funds to support the services, to protect the broadband network. It is also to determine whether they could fund it on a permanent basis, and if so, how so? It's a two. Step process. But before I go into that, let me talk about the the eligibility. The schools and libraries are eligible. Tribal libraries are eligible for this, and they they are look participation in E Rate. Prior participation in E Rate is not mandatory for those who are applying for this program, and so those who have not applied for re rate in the past can also apply for this pilot program. The application process is a two step process. They first fill the form, the applicants will have form 484, the part one of the form is to express interest. It's a it's a primary expression of a gender. Level of interest for the cyber security pilot project, you do have to mention why you are interested in applying, whether you've had any cyber threats. So that's kind that's the initial application. FCC selects participants from the initial application, and then you do the actual application. The actual application will be kind of similar to the E Rate application process, where you have to do a form 470 where that that form calls for RFPs, for the various components of the eligible services. The eligible services are already up on the website in and it is, it is distinguished from the eligible services list of the E Rate program with a P dash ESL, which is pilot ESL eligible services list on the USAC site, and I can drop those links for you after I'm done talking. So if selected the to participate in the program, the participants will be required to provide more detailed information about this, their cyber security, cyber experience, for example, in part two, the participants would be required to provide information regarding the current cyber posture, including how they're currently managing and addressing those issues, prevention, mitigation tactics, and a history of any attacks that they have had in the past. Now there was a lot of pushback on this during the NPRM time, because it kind of putting that data out exposes you to more attacks. But I think they said the FCC plan is not to publish with names, and they will, they will detract whatever information they need to and make the rest of it public. The application window opened on September 17. It closes on November 1, and this is the initial application. After the initial application, there will be a selection process. Once there's the applicants are selected, then you will have to do the more detailed application. The Of course, they're going to base it on diversity. That's what they say. FCC says that they will award support to a combination of large and small urban, rural schools, libraries and consortia with an emphasis on low income and tribal applicants and diverse applicants. So let me see I it again, all of the E Rate rules apply the process of the competitive bidding process. The they will get the the fcdl, which is the funding commitment decision letter approving or denying their application. And then once they receive that, then they can go ahead and order the services. So I urge you to stay informed. There is, there are lots of tools available on the pilot program, both on the FCC website as well as on the E Rate website. You will have the applicants will if they are not already E Rate applicants will have to create an E Rate Productivity Center, the EPC portal. This is the portal through which the Applications are accepted. You also have to have an FCC registration number as well as. Register on sam.gov on the US Treasury site, so that ensures the FCC that you are in good standing with the Treasury. And that's how the process works. The second program on the Yes, well, excuse

me, just a second. So can entities like the State Library or the Department of Education apply for grants to support smaller school districts.

They can, they if they have a consortium of those that they would like. They can build their own consortium as well. You don't have to be a registered Consortium. You can put a consortium together of school of libraries. You can put a consortium of schools and libraries together too, and apply on their behalf.

Department of Ed is spreading the word or not?

I'm not quite sure whether they are. I think it's through us that we need to push this information out as much as we can. And I will be doing a presentation, a more detailed presentation at azla on this, that is our local library conference. We do have school librarians attending. Acla, it's not just public library librarians. We have School Research Library librarians, all you know attending. So I'm sure the word will get out. If not you are it? Steve, okay, so the next program, and I'll be really quick about the next two programs. One is the next one is the Wi Fi on school busses through E Rate. I'm not actually going to go through all of the application process through it. FCC approved this, but there has it's there's been a lot of pushback from several Republican senator lawmakers. Chief of them being, you can guess Senator Ted Cruz and the and McMorris Rodgers. They have a lawsuit challenging FCC doing this Wi Fi on school busses. Their main objection is that the Wi Fi hotspots would it's it breaks the long standing precedent that the Universal Service Fund is used for in premise funding for schools and libraries, because it's going to be a mobile service outside of course, we have always been using it for bookmobiles before, but you know, that seemed to be ignored in this protest. They talked about also the use of this on busses unsupervised, that children could go on sites that were not really conducive for them. But again, you know, Kajeet and others have stepped in to say that if they're using their hotspots, the hotspots are filtered. There's also a pushback about from from libraries and schools, about the fact that if they were used on devices that were that are not the devices themselves are not given to them by schools or libraries. They don't have to be filtered. The Internet access could be filtered. But the device if it is their own personal phone, or if they're using it on their own personal Chromebook or tablets or whatever. The Chromebook or tablet does not belong to the library or school and does not have to be filtered. So those you know are still contentious. They talk about that there is very little evidence, you know, in those states or libraries and schools that have already adopted the Wi Fi on school busses on their own dime, that they don't see that there is much improvement or in their learning outcomes. And so, you know, it's kind of putting the cart before the horse. But if you don't do it, how can you be sure? And these were not done with the intention. I mean, the schools and libraries that put this on put Wi Fi on school busses did it for a totally different purpose, and that was to keep the kids occupied and prevent and and have the retention of school drivers, you know, school bus drivers, because a lot of them, you know, had to face all this. Of face issues of misbehavior on busses and just kept them quiet. So it's it's like giving a candy to the little kid just crying. So that's that, and that's what the protest was all about. So, and it's still still under contention. So it'll still be you know, the program has has started. 66% of the schools and libraries support the effort, and this is through a survey that was done by funds for learning last year, even before the program was approved. School superintendents also support this proudly. They say the Wi Fi on wheels allows children without internet access at home and who are on a long bus ride to do their homework. And this is this levels the education play playing field, according to them, there may be some who play games and there may be some others who are watching YouTube videos, but by and large, the program is meant to help with education. Let me go to the next one. Oh, the one more thing, there was a study done by the school superintendents on the number of hours that the children spend on a school bus in a year, and they talk talk about it being 20 instructional days per year. That's as much time that kids spend on a school bus every year. So the school admin, the school superintendents, also talked about keeping track of, you know, the filtering, the reporting requirements, the coverage, what area, what websites they are, they are going, they're what they're going through the data, whatever data they can gather, and the connection and speed of the broadband that the children are receiving on the school bus. So all of these they would like to gather data on. It's not quite sure that they are gathering data on, on this, or able to do it, but these are the things that the school superintendent said that they would like to gather information on. The last program in the list of limits without learning is a hotspots, hotspots through the E Rate program. Now this hotspots were given out during the pandemic through the emergency connectivity fund, the ECF and a number of libraries did not participate because of the reporting requirement, the fact that they had to keep track of who borrowed. Of course, the libraries always keep track of who borrowed. Borrowed their material, but they don't. They keep track of it until it is returned. They really don't want to retain libraries don't like retaining that kind of data on a long term basis, and because this is through the E Rate program, there's always a 10 year retention. You know, of all of this data, the and libraries said that they could not lend it out through their their loaning software, and mainly because it does not retain that kind of just not programmed to retain that kind of data. So they had to set up something separate. Some of the libraries were able to do that, especially the larger ones that had IT staff capable of doing this. But the small rural libraries, I mean, they had to, if they really wanted to do this, they had to figure out a way of maintaining some kind of Excel spreadsheet on who borrowed which hotspot at what time, what dates. And then the other issue that they that they faced was FCC wanted the data on which not they didn't want the data they wanted the disconnect of all of those devices that were not being used for over a 30 day period. Now this is a problem because of the administrative burden that it creates on, you know, loaning it out, and then, you know, tracking it and seeing whether it is used or not. Sometimes, the your service provider can tell you that data or what is not being used, and then making sure that those. Are returned, or making sure that they are disconnected, which means sometimes your devices lost forever, because the person who's not using it is not likely to come back and give it to you and say, Hey, here's your device back. I haven't used it. They're more most likely to disappear, which means that you have to stock up on more devices than you actually loan out because of the loss factor. So all of these are things that need to be addressed. And there are and there is an NPRM, or what they call an fnprm that is further notice of proposal for the it's open up to the 25th of October. So you can actually make comments. The comments I see on it as present are that they would rather support a supported embedded device like a school's Chromebook,

which is easier to manage than an extra hotspot device. You know, if the service is embedded in the Chromebook, that's easier to manage embedded device. Also they reduce the administrative burden, but the problem is that the connection cannot be shared with members in the family, as you could share a hotspot. Once you turn on a hotspot, several members in the family can actually use it, but in the case of an embedded embedded Chromebook, you cannot again, the SIPA filtering issues. SIPA filtering is only valid on end user devices that are owned by anchor institutions, but not on personal devices. That was again brought up in the comments, the needs of different applicants are diverse. They do not serve equity Well, there is a need of flexibility in the program. The pricing was an issue because right right now FCC is reimbursement. Says it's $15 per month for the recurring service, and the hot spots at $90 a piece, and the way that is calculated, it is a complicated process. The there are 20 hotspots per 100 students times their NSLP discount times $630 that's for schools and for libraries. They base it on the square footage. It's 5.5 hotspots for 1000 square feet of a library multiplied by their NSLP discount multiplied by $650 so that's the calculation that they base the hotspots on the number of hotspots that you can actually ask for. The other comment, another comment was on the hotspot devices are not are of variable quality, their memory, their cache, their processing power. They're all, you know, they're not the same, not not, not up to a standard. And there is no standard that FCC has laid out. So those are, in a nutshell, all of the comments that are currently on, and there are more coming in as we speak. The last thing that I'd like, at last thing I'd like to mention is the the future of the Universal Service Fund. There is the the Fifth Circuit appeal right now they found, they find that the USF funding is unconstitutional because they think it's a tax, and taxes cannot be levied by anyone other than Congress, and this is FCC, and they have FCC sub delegated it to USAC, which is a private corporation, and they, in turn, rely on the telecommunication companies to determine how much they would charge the American citizens who pay for their phone bills. And again, this is based, of course, on the other hand, if you look at it, the the amount that the contribution factor has really gone up multi fold from the 1996 when it was first started, because of the decrease in the pace of those who have landlines.

And it's almost hitting for. 40% if it continues at this rate, the sixth and 11th circuit, of course, upheld it constitutionally so because there is a split. FCC has appealed to the Supreme Court, and they will take up. They will have to take up the appeal. But again,

it's all taken a backseat because of the elections, and we'll see what happens once the elections are done. Back to you. Steve,

thank you. Thank you, Mama. As you can see, this good reason why Mala got the award she did for keeping up with all of this stuff. So thank you Mala for giving us a good update and drew we're going to get to you in just one minute, but Matthew is still there? Matthew sukadowski, or do we just lose him? Okay, so Drew, so I want to introduce many of you who know Drew Garner. He's been involved with us, and first of all, Drew, as you know, congratulations. He just recently has a new addition to his family, and so congratulations and having great fun with that. So anyway, Drew, Drew's going to give us more of an update on what's happening, particularly, federally. So Drew, you're on.

Thanks, Steve, and thank you, Mala, that was super valuable and comprehensive. I look forward to the, I think the presentation that you mentioned, maybe giving on that information, because there's some good there's good data in there. And then I, as Steve said, I newly appreciate the need to pacify children. So I'm sympathetic to those school bus drivers giving the kids whatever they need, even quiet, but I'll be quick with federal updates. Nicole got the big one, 700 apps, 6.5 billion requested. That's awesome. I forget if Nicole covered this too. But there's also the tribal competitive grant, which is open until February 7, so there's still opportunities for tribes, tribal entities, to apply. Also at this point, I think 53 of the bead initial proposals are approved. 53 out of 56 so almost everyone is in that 365, day shot clock for when they have to complete their final proposal by so people are busy, and if you're interested in like the who's leading the charge, you probably know Louisiana is the one to keep your eye on. Their final proposal is due by December, so they'll be probably starting to build or the granting process next year. Few quick updates the excuse

me, drew before you go on. Can you just tell people who you are? I should have done that. Yes, I'm

Drew Garner with the Benton Institute for broadband society. I'm based in DC, but work with Elena and in Arizona a lot. So that's how I'm why I'm here. Steve asked me to come on and talk about some of the federal issues for hurricane Helene, the FCC has temporarily granted an expansion of the lifeline benefit to go to FEMA recipients, because when people are displaced, keeping them connected is a core goal. So we're keeping an eye on that no as Miles sort of said there's no real updates on USF or ACP because of the election. Kind of the one deadline to keep in mind is that the current federal budget will expire on December 20, but during the lame duck period, and that's when we'll have a shutdown fights, or a potential opportunity to to make some progress on federal, federal budget issues. Um, the final thing, I think, to note, or the final two things for the data people out there. NTIA recently launched Project Laya Leia, which is a new in partnership with the Census Bureau, which is a new, more granular analysis of the digital divide. I forget the I forget the level of granularity it gets to, but it's is a cool project. So if you're interested in really understanding the local connectivity issues, project layout is an interesting new tool. And then the final update you've already all know this, but it proposals for net inclusion are due by Tuesday. So if you're interested in presenting up in Gila River, May in, may get your proposal in soon. That's all from me. Steve

So Drew you mentioned the USF, and if I understand correctly, is there still I thought there was a bipartisan there is Task Force. Is that still happening? Are we expecting? Anything will happen now till after the election? Not

till after the election. I mean, if you ask them, they're working on it, something will happen soon. But no, we don't expect anything till after the election, for a number of reasons, but the one interesting one is it's, it's being led in part by Senator Thune, who's in contention for Republican leadership in the Senate, and so it's just unlikely that he's going to do anything until the leadership, Republican Senate leadership issues are settled. And then also, there's still a lot of lot of core fundamental details that I don't think have been squared away yet. So yes, they the Senate is working on it, but no, I don't think there's going to be any progress anytime soon, especially with the USF court case, uh, complicating everything. So

you might want to explain that real quick.

Yeah, it's that's what Mala talked about. The Fifth Circuit ruled the USF unconstitutional. So that's going to be going up to the Supreme Court. I think arguments are going to be in December, so the supreme court's going to hear the arguments in December and then probably issue a ruling late spring, early summer next year. So that's when we'll know about the constitutionality of the USF program and all that stuff that Mala was talking about. That's all USF, all those great programs, those are all things that are on the line.

So so this may be to you and Mama about the timing, so right now, we're just moving ahead with he rate and all these programs that we talked about until we get a ruling from the Supreme Court and decisions from whoever from Congress, which, as you were saying, won't be till next year,

sometime. Yes, and for I, a lot of rural ISPs rely on the USF to for their to operate, to pay for the OP the operations of their existing network. Because the goal of the USF is to keep to try to achieve some level of parity between urban broadband rates and rural broadband rates. So the USF subsidizes rural networks to keep those rates to consumers lower, and those rural ISPs rely on those to operate. And I think I have heard at anchornets that a lot of the bead applicants are eventually going to rely on USF too. So like a lot of the networks we're building now, are going to rely on this ongoing USF subsidy. So this court I'm sure you all know this already, but like this court, case is a huge deal, so it's something Benton we're watching very closely and participating in as a Shelby, as I'm sure are a number of you on this call. So Right? It's huge.

And as you say, rightly, the high cost, you know, areas and the rural health are all subsidized by the USF one. So, you know, there, the only thing that I think might, that might come out of it is that FCC has a more formal kind of relationship with USAC and sets, set something in statute that that Congress cannot go back on, you know, in any, any time in the future, you know,

so I'm,

I'm hoping that there would be some kind of more former relationship that is transparent between FCC and USAC.

That's part of the working group. I

apologize I may have missed it. You may have already discussed this. I try to keep track of other things going on. So have you talked about the exactly what this Court case is about, that people were saying that it's unconstitutional, and can you explain that a little bit more.

Yeah, Mala, I think Mala did a good job there. It's, as she said, it's, it's kind of hinges on if it, if the USF fee is a, is a fee or tax? Yeah, is, well, that's what they say, as you Mala, as you know, as you heard everyone say, there are good arguments why it's a fee, and the distinction between a fee and a tax, they're like legal definitions there. So it's not the colloquial term, it's like the legal term of what versus a fee versus a tax. And then there's also the Fifth Circuit ruled. They have a really fuzzy ruling, and John widhausen at Shelby a lot. Lot of people just found flaws, like factual inaccuracies in the ruling. So it's fairly weak, and it rests, in addition to the fee and tax, it rests on the delegation of authority from Congress to the FCC and then the FCC to USAC. So it's a dual delegation that is at issue. It has to do with Chevron deference and just the whole this, what I've heard this USF case is sort of the tip of the spear that some of the more libertarian and conservative groups are using to really make their point about Chevron deference, which is to say that the federal government, the Congress, really can't delegate, or really has to be specific when they delegate, our two federal agencies. So they're using this as an example for how to take control away from the executive agencies, unless explicitly given by Congress. So how's that, Steve,

so we've got thoughts to keep our eye on after the election, and what's happens with the court cases and the Supreme Court and all kinds of good stuff. Oh boy, yeah,

the then the the election is going to have a big impact on a lot of these, a lot of the IDA programs and stuff.

Yes, indeed.

Okay, did? I? Did? I cover everything Mala

you think about,

I think you did. Thank you. Thank you. DREW You really did an awesome job summarizing. Mala

and I were in the same room at Shelby when a lot of this was talked about. So it was, yeah, so we're drawn from the same source.

So one other issue, and drew, I don't know if you want to talk about this, it looks like Nicole may be gone. Is the issue about alternative technologies, and also in related to that, is Starlink. I don't know if you want to talk about that at all.

I don't have much to add to that, just that NTIA or the bead infrastructure program, fairly recently released guidance for how states like Arizona can incorporate these alternative technologies such as satellite like Starlink or unlicensed fixed wireless, I think, into their bead process. So as you know, bead is primarily fiber first. So first grants are supposed to go to fiber projects. But if you don't get fiber projects, or if you start don't have enough money to find fund fiber to every home, that's when you're maybe allowed to start considering these alternative technologies. So I forget where that guidance is. They took comment on it. I think the comments are closed. Think they're considering, and I think it's up to the states as to whether or not they want to implement it. So that's a good question for the broadband office. And so, yeah,

so Jamie, can I put you on the on the spot here whether you want to talk about that at all?

My understanding of that release was that wireless essentially wouldn't be considered reliable technology, and it will, if they're proposing for it to officially be alternative. As far as the position of our office goes, I don't have comment on that, other than what our volume two says. So it's true that round one is going to prioritize awards to fiber, because it's in alliance with what a reliable high speed broadband entails. And then from there, we will assess how to handle alternate technologies, because there could be several options. That's why market sounding is important too. It helps us understand what we might expect so we know how long we'll have to go through round one, and if, how much, how many bsls, if any, left over for alternate technologies. So as far as our office stands, our volume two is still, is still valid from, from my understanding, um. From that guidance.

Thank you, Jamie. So I hope you didn't drop. Oh, there he is. So just a couple of quick things Drew. First of all, thank you. I'm glad you're here. We're here today, and I'm glad to hear you're enjoying being the new father. So thank you. And then, Matthew, are you back? Do you want to just you put some information in the chat. You want to talk about the funding opportunity that you mentioned?

Are you there? Matthew,

okay, well, apparently he's, he's there, but not there. So we, you know, there is information about a funding opportunity through USDA in the chat. And, by the way, mentioning the chat, and I always try to remind people, and I should have done this earlier, that you can download the chat if you go to the chat and at the very top, you'll see an ellipse, three dots, and if you click on that, you can download the chat to your computer. And then, of course, I do send that out also as a summary. So anything else that people want to share, just a reminder that the Arizona Technology Council is the in Tucson next week, is hosting their tech and business expo. Here in Tucson, it's a half day event with an expo, and you're all welcome to register and and attend that event. Any other announcements that people might have, anything that people need to know that we haven't covered today, Gordon, my apology that I overbooked today and and we definitely want to hear about the the project that you suggested. Oh, so, Paul. So Paul, just FYI, I'll be in touch with you. I am starting to work on a panel to talk about workforce development, and so we need to include your project in that, in that discussion, and so I'm sorry, Gordon,

okay, and thank you so much. Look very forward to visiting with everyone at a later date. No worries.

Sounds good. Anything else going once, going twice? I'm going to stop recording.