S11 E9 Inclusion in Early Childhood Education with OSEP Director Valerie Williams

11:12AM Nov 16, 2023

Speakers:

Tim Villegas

Jani Kozlowski

Keywords:

inclusion

inclusive

early childhood

disabilities

resources

kids

work

technical assistance

valerie

support

inclusive education

information

technical assistance center

parent

williams

educators

students

cta

down syndrome

place

Hi friends I'm Tim Villegas from the Maryland Coalition for Inclusive Education and you are listening to think inclusive. Our podcast that brings you conversations about inclusive education, and what inclusion looks like in the real world.

Valerie C. Williams is the Director of the Office of Special Education Programs OSAP at the US Department of Education in this role, she is responsible for overseeing administration of the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act, ide a, which authorizes formula grants to states under IDE A, Part B, and to lead agencies for the infants and Families program under ide a Part C. Ida also authorizes discretionary grants under ide a Part D to institutions of higher education, and other nonprofit organizations to support grants for State Personnel Development, technical assistance and dissemination, technology and parent training information centers. She has extensive experience in federal public policy, regulatory affairs, and budgeting, as well as disability policy and civil rights. She holds degrees from UC Berkeley, and Johns Hopkins University. She is also the parent of a son with Down syndrome. For this episode, Valerie Williams discusses the importance of inclusion in early childhood education. She shares a personal story about finding the right preschool for her son with Down Syndrome and emphasizes the need for a mindset shift among educators, Valerie highlights the lack of knowledge and resources available to support inclusive practices and calls for better dissemination of information. Director Williams and I also talked about the promising initiatives happening in different states, and she encourages educators to be bold, brave and urgent in their efforts to improve inclusive opportunities for all students. This week's episode is brought to you by the Early Childhood Technical Assistance Center in the Frank Porter Graham Child Development Institute, and will be the first episode in a collaboration between the ECA and the think inclusive podcast on early childhood inclusive practices. After a quick break, we will meet two people from the CTA, who are very passionate about early childhood inclusive education to preview my interview with Director Valerie Williams. We'll be right back.

I'm Jamie Kozlowski, and I'm a Technical Assistance Specialist with the Early Childhood Technical Assistance Center at the University of North Carolina Chapel Hill, Frank Porter Graham Child Development Institute.

Hi, I'm Natasha Williams. I am one of the CO leads for the inclusion work group and topic team. I also serve on the leadership team for the E CTA or the Early Childhood Technical Assistance Center.

So for those that are listening, that are not familiar with EA, CTA, what's the best way for our listeners to understand what is EA CTA and what does it do the

work of E CTA were funded by the federal government and our work really is to provide high quality technical assistance to early intervention and early childhood programs, specifically Part C and Part B 619. coordinators across the nation and in territories we do that by way of partnership, we feel very strongly that our work cannot be done outside of the context of relationships and responsive relationships that that so we hear directly from those who are leading early childhood work and and what their needs are in the field and we are able to be responsive to that in a way to really support children with disabilities in their families and access to services. Yeah,

it has just been such a growth experience for me as a professional to be able to work with the team at ACTA, very passionate group of professionals. And, and Katusha and I have had the opportunity to do work together on the inclusion team at the Early Childhood Technical Assistance Center and so together along with a team of of professionals and leaders, we provide technical assistance to state leaders, we host webinars, we produce resources. There's just a lot of great work that goes on at CTA and

have monthly virtual meetups, is that right?

Oh yeah. So we have Have an inclusion learning community. That is it's meet six times a year. So every other month, and listeners are, are free to join. If they're interested, just let us know. And we'll add you to the list. But we have conversations with state leaders on the learning community, we bring in special guest stars. And, you know, I think also they might be interested to Katusha about the inclusion Institute. And Natasha is one of the leads on that effort.

Yeah, we like to call it a premier Institute, we believe that it is we've reached international audiences now. And it really is a way for professionals to come together. And think about practice and systems level support and change that's needed to really support children in inclusive environments. So yes, the inclusion Institute is held each spring, and we would love love to have you. So please check. Check that out. You know, as I was listening, and just thinking about the work that that we do, it really is about developing this more equitable and effective and sustainable systems supporting the access and participation for children with disabilities and their families. And that is at the core of all of the learning communities, all of the products that we develop all of the relationships, it really is about those those equitable practices for children.

Yeah, you know, and I think, I think your audience would need to know that less than half of preschool aged children receive their services, special ed, early childhood special ed services, in regular early childhood programs. So even at the preschool level, even three through five year olds are not served in inclusive settings. And that's what sets the trajectory for children and when they're included in the early years that leads to inclusion in elementary school, which leads to inclusion in middle school, high school, and life.

What are you excited about? For this conversation? With Valerie Williams,

I think it's the message from our federal leadership from the Office of Special Education Programs. That inclusion in early childhood matters, that it's important, sometimes it it feels like early childhood is an add on to the work and to have Valerie come out and speak about these issues. I know that she's also herself a parent of a child with a disability and also struggled with finding childcare for her son. So having that voice from the leadership level, about inclusion in early childhood is just so so powerful, and a great opportunity for us as a early childhood field.

I completely agree Valerie brings her full self and perspective to this. And it's very genuine, really, like you said, to hear from leadership that this is a priority and important but also that perspective as a parent of a child. It makes it real. It encourages us in the field to know that there is support administratively around these issues that are so vital and important to the trajectory of a child's full experience.

Jamie because Lasky and Natasha Williams, thank you so much for joining us on think inclusive to preview, Valerie Williams and the Early Childhood series that we have.

Thanks for the opportunity. Tim,

thank you

so much.

When we return my interview with Director Valerie Williams.

Director Valerie Williams, welcome to think inclusive.

Thank you for having me.

I'm really excited to have you on I don't think I've we've had anyone from OSEP on on the show before so this is this is something new and something really exciting. So Janee Kozlowski is actually who connected us and she is, you know, fantastic, a fantastic person. From ACTA. I think I'm saying that right, ACTA the Early Childhood Technical Assistance Center. And she is really passionate about early childhood inclusion and she wanted us to have you on because inclusion is important to you? Right? It

absolutely is. Actually, I just met her two weeks ago in Montana in person for the first time. So this is very timely.

Oh, fantastic, fantastic. I've never met Jenny in person. So we've only communicated over, zoom in the email. But I'm wondering to start us off in this conversation, because you and I don't know each other. I'm wondering if if you could tell me why inclusion is important to you.

That's a big question of big loaded. Question two. Sorry, no, it's perfectly fine. So let me let me tell you a story. Let me do that. So to try to, please realize everything I'm thinking. Um, for those that don't know, my husband, and I have a 12 year old son who happens to have Down syndrome. He's only 12. But he thinks he's 30. And he's everything you expected to have your oil to be. When we were looking for a preschool many years ago. We were perplexed and not quite sure what direction to head in. So we investigated three different places. Because I think as parents of kids with disabilities, we want the same thing that all parents want for their kids, which is someplace where they feel like they will be loved, and they will belong, and they will have fun, and learn and grow. So we decided to visit these three locations, these three places, we made it a point at the time if of taking our son elsewhere. And my husband and I would just go so that, you know, our son would not be a distraction to them or to us, we could get our own ideas of what we believe was happening, whether or not it would be a good fit, and then we will talk about it afterward. The first location that we went to was a home based location, which we were not opposed to. The woman had been doing the work probably about 20 years had schedules activities, you could tell she knew what she was doing. For something completely unrelated, we just decided not to go with her, which was fine. The second place we went to was a chain of preschools, whose name I will not mention, the location was just about to open, we take the tour, it felt a bit sterile in terms of, you know, it didn't necessarily feel like a place where kids would have a ton of fun. But the woman who was working in the room that our son would have been in was a previous teacher. And we could tell she really knew what she was doing. And we did like her. But we're taking the tour. And at the very end, we are talking to the owner. And so we're looking around having these conversations. And the very last thing we say is Oh, and by the way, our son happens to have Down syndrome. Now my husband and I always make it a point of doing that, because we want to look people in the eye, when we tell you what's going on, we want to see your reaction. Because that gives us an idea as to what type of person you are, what type of facility you're running and whether or not it would be a good fit. So we tell her that. And after we tell her that there is a very awkward silence that probably lasted about 10 to 15 seconds. We were not in a hurry to fill that silence, we decided we want to wait to see what what she came up with. And she eventually got herself together. And she told us that we would have to meet with her instructional and enrollment folks to determine whether or not it would be a good fit, quote, unquote, as I use those words. And so what that told my husband and I is that this is not the place for him. Because you're unsure. You're unclear. You're not sure if you want him and you want us to go another route. When it was clear based on previous conversations. He didn't have any medical needs or any anything else that would warrant that. But she was fearful. And so we decided this is absolutely not the place for him. The third place we go to walk in, take the tour, everything looks great. We're talking to the woman who runs the facility at the end. Oh, by the way, our son happens to have Down syndrome. She didn't miss a beat. She smiled. She said, I have been trained and I have worked with kids with all types of disabilities and special needs. And he will be okay. We will love on him. We will teach him and we will we will teach him and train him just like everybody else that's here. And that's when we said yes, this is the place for him because they want him and they understand that he's just another child that might need some additional support in some places, but they were perfectly okay with that. And so, I tell you that story to say that inclusion is extremely important to me, as I think it should be for for all of our kids, we know that when inclusion starts early, inclusion tends to continue. And when our kids are in self contained settings early, that tends to continue as well. And for the most part, there's no reason why our kids can't be included. Other than sometimes the adults aren't quite sure what inclusion should look like and what they should do. And so that's the part that we need to deal with. We need to deal with the mindset shift we need to deal with, what are the resources that would help people in the way of doing more work around inclusion? What do people need, because the issue is not our kids, the issue is the adults. And so how do we deal with that, to expand our inclusion efforts? So I know that was a long answer

to you, oh, man. Listen, some people are driving in their car during their dishes, doing their laundry, and they're clapping. And they're saying preach. I think that I like how you, I love that story. And I like how it really cuts to the heart of the matter, that the experience of families just enrolling their children in, you know, preschool, pre K programs, early childhood programs, they have they have a child with Down syndrome, they have a child with autism, they have a child with, you know, whatever, whatever, disability, whatever kinds of support that the child needs, and the staff is like, Oh, we don't know, we don't have we don't know how to do that. We don't know how to do that. You know, and it shouldn't be that you had to have gone to three different places to get to a place where they wanted your child. And that is that is just, it's it's so common for families to, to experience. And honestly,

I think I think it probably happens every day. And what concerns me is, what about the parents who might have stopped at the first facility, or the second facility, right. And so knowing that there's somebody out there that would love to take your child and have them there and knows the benefits of inclusion, not just for kids with disabilities, but kids without, and there's plenty of research to show that there are benefits for all kids that there are evidence based practices and resources. But we've got to get all that into the hands of the people who need it most otherwise, it doesn't matter.

Do you think that the I don't know what to call, I don't know what to call it. The federal government OSEP. Our national how we how we support early childhood education programs, just in general at the federal level. Do you think that it's a a messaging issue? Is it a? Is it a technical assistance issue? Like why aren't more programs set up to really teach all learners?

So that's a big question. I think part of it is a part of that answers in your question is that they're not set up from the beginning to teach our learners, they're set up with certain kids in mind. And then when kids with disabilities come along, then they're trying to figure out how to retrofit our kids into what they've already created, instead of creating something from the very beginning, which will take into account the needs of us, our kids. That's one thing, I do think some of it is mindset. And just thinking that when you see a child that has a disability, that they will automatically need something or more, and you're not quite sure what to do with that. So I think some of that is lack of knowledge. And that breeds, people aren't confident in those situations. And when you aren't confident, you tend to kind of push away any experiences that could cause you to be uncomfortable. Because I think as adults, we have a tendency to want to be comfortable. But we're not here for our own comfort. We're here in service to our kids, right. So we have to kind of get beyond the mindset that keeps us in a place that's not productive. I do think that there are people who want to who want to do inclusion work and they just might not know where the resources are or how to use them. And in that those instances, I think it is a technical assistance issue. On a bigger level. I think we have broadly speaking information to some The Nation problem, because there are a lot of federal resources on literally just about everything you can think of in relation to kids and students with disabilities. And they're all free. But as I go around the country, and I talk to people in various states, and I've probably been to at least 2025 cities in my year and a half, at OSEP, it is amazing to me, how many people don't even know that our resources exist. And so clearly, we need to do more in the way of outreach. And it can't just be outreach to the states, which is what our mandate is, we also have to do outreach to districts, too, if you're talking about, say, for example, if we were talking about the school setting, it would need to be with principals, we need to do outreach with people that do early intervention, we need to do more outreach with teachers, who are the people that are closest to our children? And how can we get the resources into their hands because they're the ones who need it. As an aside, because I love stories, and they tend to illustrate a lot. I son has a tutor, who is a third grade autism teacher, and she is dynamic, she she really knows how to accommodate, modify and do everything that kids need. And she tends to have kids in her class that have a lot of behavior issues. And her school is putting more people more kids in her class because she knows how to deal with kids that have behavior issues, and everyone in her building doesn't. And so I was explaining to her about some of the guidance that's been put out by by OSEP, and how it could be helpful to her but more helpful to the other people in her building. And she said, I didn't even know that existed, can you send it to me? And that makes me sad. Because if the people that are literally the closest to our kids don't know that our resources exist, then what are we doing, we need to take a step back. And there are always more resources that we could create. But how do we make sure that they're getting into the right hands, and it's not just Part B school age, we also have a plethora of resources for, for people who work in in early childhood. And so we've got to figure out how to engage and push those out. And so we have a information dissemination initiative going on in OSEP. Right now, which I believe will continue for quite some time, where we're bringing together our technical assistance centers, and we're discussing who is your audience? How do you disseminate your information? Are there metrics that you're using just kind of sharing information? Is it social media? If so, what are the platforms? Are you doing blogs? Are you like? What are the range of options? What are you considering? What have you done? How is it working for you? Does it vary based on the state or the district or those type of questions so that we can do better with getting the information into the right hands?

Well, you know, we, this is a podcast. And so we have principals, school leaders, educators, families, that have children with disabilities, these are these, this is our audience. So as far as if someone was, let's let's just target school leaders for now, because I do know, a number of principals listen, you know, and maybe they are in a, in a district, or in a school that has an early childhood education program, or maybe, you know, maybe that is, those are the people that they serve, and they're just looking for some guidance. So what are some documents or resources that are available to them that you could point them to?

So one thing I would suggest is that sometimes it seems like there's so much to do, and there's so many resources that people kind of get overwhelmed and don't know where to start. And so I would recommend picking those one, two, maybe three things, tops that you want to make some headway on, that you're working on and kind of dig into those so that you go, you go deep enough to have an impact, but you don't stretch yourself out too thin and go too wide, if that makes sense. And so there are a lot of different resources. And I think probably one of the best things I could do is to point you toward our technical assistance centers because they have a lot of, well, a couple places actually. One is me Every state has what we fund a Parent Training Center PTI. Most of the time information, it's usually educators and parents that call the PTI that ask state specific questions, they can get resources, they find out what their options are specifically based on what's going on in that state. But we have technical assistance centers that have information, no matter who it is, whether it is a parent, whether it is a teacher, whether it's a principal, some specifically for early childhood, some specifically for teachers, it could be dispute resolution, there are a whole host of things. And so what I would like to do, because I don't want to skip over any of our valuable resources, is to be able to provide you what we call a placement. And there are links to it. And so in those links, there's a list of every technical assistance center that we have a link of how to get to it, and a quick description of exactly what they do. And that way, it'll kind of narrow down because I'm afraid if I start listing technical assistance, one and then as soon as we're done, I'll say, oh, I should have mentioned. Right, that next one that came to my mind,

so and, yeah, we don't want to leave anybody out. No, and

we have so many resources. And, and a lot of them are not necessarily just in print, there's also a lot that's on video, and we make it a point to make sure that our resources to the maximum extent possible are not 500 pages long, that you don't need a law degree to read it and understand, right, so how can we easiest and best explain what is going on with whatever said topic is so that someone can spend a few minutes reading it, they have a general idea of where they want to start some questions they want to ask themselves, it could be a self assessment, and they have some information that they can move forward with that would be helpful. Yes.

Let's talk about what's happening right now in different states to move inclusive practices forward. So here are just the things that I'm aware of the state of Washington has the inclusionary practices professional development project, which I believe at the time that I was researching in, and I visited Washington, there was I think, 16 demonstration states demonstration sites across the state moving towards inclusive education, and it seems like the Office of the Superintendent of Public Instruction, it's a priority for them. Okay.

So that's one,

the Department of Education in Nebraska, put out a brief about their journey to inclusion. And, and how they are moving towards inclusive practices, the state of California, had some legislation, it actually was vetoed by the governor, by Governor Newsom. But I ended up talking with one of the legislators in the state legislature about what the bill would have done, and it would have basically helped district leaders in their education program to become more inclusive. And so you also have different states offering professional development, like an organization in California called supporting inclusive practices. That is, you know, run by a certain, you know, counties and offices of, of education in the state of California. There's been a long standing, there has been, you know, grand supporting inclusive education in Maryland. As for the Maryland Coalition for inclusive education, you know, we have been funded by the State Department to work with districts in Maryland to be more inclusive. So there's a lot of things happening all across the state, you know, and that I didn't even mentioned the Technical Assistance Center that we have. That was with the Thai center and now with Swift center, on on inclusive practices for learners with extensive support needs. So there is stuff happening out in the world, out in our in the United States. Are you hopeful as we move forward that we are really going to see, learners be more authentically included? And is there anything that I missed?

Um, so I am hopeful. I'm optimistic by nature. And so I prefer to think that people want to do the right thing, and they want to do what's best. And I just approach life from that perspective. So I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt. So there are a lot of promising things that are happening. But honestly, wish it You mentioned a few states, we should be able to see efforts from all states because there is a ton of technical assistance available. And, you know, I DEA, the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act, the LRE provision for at least restrictive environment has a couple unique provisions as it relates to State Department's of education because it requires state department's of education to monitor IDE A's LRE requirements and provide technical assistance on them. So we really should be seeing not just, you know, a little change here, a little change there, we should be seeing change everywhere. And one of the challenges we know is that I DEA never mentioned the term inclusion, or things like regular class or regular education environment, right. I will say that based on data that we received during the first year, let's say shortly after the pandemic, we have seen an increase in states that are reporting that children with disabilities are receiving instruction in the regular environment, more than 80% of the time, we're seeing more of that there's an increase. But honestly, I think we'll have to take a look at that data over time, and kind of see how it plays out because COVID presented a lot of challenges, but also a lot of opportunities. So and it was it was an anomaly in terms of our data. So I think that's something we're going to have to keep an eye on. I think that there's also a lot of work and technical assistance and similarities in our work, as well as with Headstart. So the collaboration that's needed between educators and taking those deliberate actions that we talked about before, to improve inclusive opportunities, because they are there, we just need people to take advantage of them. And so I'm hopeful that over time, what we have seen, will continue and that we'll see a real desire for people to want to move that forward. Because inclusion, along with good instructional practices is what moves our students forward and improves outcomes. And so those are two things that we really, really need to focus on.

So Ida has not been reauthorized for over a decade. And do we do we does it need to be authorized reauthorized? Or

do we

need to be intentional about

holding systems accountable? Yes, so

what's in the law? Yes,

so you hit the nail on the head, I'm not going to say that Ida doesn't need to be reauthorized. But what I am going to say is that we have got to focus on implementation. Because if the, if the law is written nicely, and everything makes sense, that doesn't necessarily translate into good implementation. And so to the extent that we can act on what we know as law right now, and making it as robust as it needs to be, how can we do that in the absence of the actual law being reauthorized? And so that's what we're focusing a lot on. We put a lot on the AP team, we put a lot on teachers and all of the the CES, the specialized instructional support personnel. And there are a lot of issues at play in relation to say shortages and a lot of other things that are going on that we're that we're dealing with, but implementation is going to be key because if we change the law, but it's still not being implemented properly, that doesn't help our students in the slightest.

All right, this has been a really great conversation, anything that anything that you wanted to leave, you know, families and educators with as we wrap up.

I think that I want to acknowledge probably for literally everyone that's listening, particularly if you work in our education system, that your job is hard. I'm not going to say or allude to anything else, the job is hard, right. But I think that what one of my overarching thoughts right now, particularly as we're coming out of the pandemic, and we're seeing what it did to our students in the way of what they lost, during the time when some of them were not in school at all, we've got to figure out a way to be bold, to be brave and to be urgent, because the kids and the students that we serve, do not have another generation to wait while we figure out how to get this right. We had to be more flexible during the pandemic. We had to be more intentional and more thoughtful, and all of those things that we were doing that helped create a better system, we have to hold on to that, and use that to propel ourselves forward and resist the urge to go back to what was going on in 2019. Or to become complacent, let's use what we've learned. Let's figure out what were the lessons that we've learned. Right? How can we help more students get better outcomes and continue to consider the needs continue to not necessarily do the same thing that we've always done, sometimes we just need to get together and have a conversation and throw the spaghetti against the wall. And in sometimes in some harebrained ideas, there is a nugget of gold, but we don't consider doing it. Because we haven't done it before or something like that. There's no reason why we shouldn't consider doing new things. We're in a new time we're in a new space, our students need more than they have ever needed before. And so what are we going to do to help bridge that gap and to get our students where we need them to be? And it starts with inclusion, inclusion and good instructional practices. And if we can build off of those two things, it will help our students tremendously going forward.

Stay tuned for the mystery question right after this break.

So what or who has made the biggest impression on your life in the last year? What or who has made the biggest impression on your life? In the last year, um,

the last year, I would probably say I've done a lot of traveling in the last year in this position, and I've been aggrieved, New York, Florida, Phoenix, Montana, California, Guam, I've been all over. And I'm talking to people that do the work, talking to parents, being in classrooms with teachers and seeing inclusion work, seeing our students learning and happy to be in school that has made probably the biggest impact on me. And just because I think that in our roles at the Department of Education, we are far away from the kids and classrooms, right? But but when I leave the DC area, and I get out in the field, and I do listening sessions and town halls and that talk to people and I see kids that energizes me and I think that has had the biggest impact on me in the last year.

Oh, wow. Great. So as you were talking, it reminded me that as a as a podcaster. I've had a very unique experience in the last year because I have been working on a podcast series called inclusion stories where I was able to visit inclusive systems. So I was able to go to Maryland and Washington. And I've been talking in producing the series and very similar to what you were saying, you know, when I was in the classroom thinking that inclusive education was the right thing to do that had benefits all learners, you know, I was never able to see it. Right. You know, like, I knew that it, I knew people were doing it. I knew that it was happening for learners across the United States. And that's what I would tell people, but I didn't have the experience of being there. And this particular year over the last, you know, since last August, being able to visit classrooms and to see it working, and to see systems that are fully committed to inclusion, as it's just strengthened my resolve, I guess, yeah, you know, so very similar to what you were saying. It just reminded me that that's why we that's why we do what we do. Right. That's why we get up in the morning. Valerie Williams, thank you so much for being on the thing conclusive podcast, we appreciate your time.

Thank you for having me.

For more information about inclusive education or to learn how you can partner with MCIE on school transformation, or professional learning opportunities, visit MCIE.org. Thanks again to the E. CTA for their collaboration on this episode. Love thinking cluesive Here are a few ways to let us know. Rate us on Spotify, or leave us a review on Apple podcasts. It doesn't have to be anything long. It could just be I love thinking inclusive, become a patron like these fine people and get extra stuff. thank you to Aaron P. Jarrett T joiner a, Kathy B, Mark C, Gabi M. Kathleen T. And Paula W. We appreciate your continued support of the thing conclusive podcast. For our bonus episode this week. Director Williams discusses her journey from a career in finance to becoming the director of the Office of Special Education Programs. And I talked about what it was like to transition from a special education teacher to a career in communications. Think inclusive is written, edited, designed, mixed and mastered by me to Vegas, Original Music by miles credit. Additional music from melody. Thanks for your time and attention. And remember, inclusion always works.

Do you have any questions before we get started?

I do that I'm just making sure I have everything up on the screen in front of me so that I'm not staring around in random places

that you may be seeing me look over here because I've got two screens. So no,

it's perfect. I have multiple screens too. It's one of those things we're trying to like let people know I'm not ignoring you. But I have multiple screens and so Exactly.

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