Recent studies show the average person spends two hours and 23 minutes a day on social media platforms. So imagine the power of capturing even a fraction of your dream customer screen time, and diverting them from mindlessly scrolling to engaging with your business by turning your content into an off social destination experience. In early 2022. Megan Sumrell, time management expert and founder of The Pink Bee launched a branded app for her business in the App Store and leveraged it as a top of funnel strategy to convert cold leads into her signature $597 paid program. Instead of paying out of pocket for leads, Megan is getting paid to add new customers to her ecosystem.
Today's case study takes you step by step through Megan's hyper efficient funnel that generates hundreds of new leads every month on autopilot while generating multiple six figures and back end revenue. This interview immediately cemented its spot as one of our most unique customer growth strategies shared by a CEO on this podcast.
Welcome to Cubicle to CEO, the podcast where we ask successful founders and CEOs the business questions you can't google. I'm your host, Ellen Yin. Every Monday go behind the business and a case study style interview with a leading entrepreneur who shares one specific growth strategy they've tested in their own business exactly how they implemented it, and what the results and revenue were. You'll also hear financially transparent insights from my own journey bootstrapping our media company from a $300 freelance project into millions in revenue.
What would increasing your current yearly revenue by 40 times look like for you? That's exactly what happened in Nikki's business after applying her own circuit sales system. By the way, Nikki didn't build her company by selling a course on how to sell courses. She had a course teaching people to become professional copywriters, and then she developed the circuit sales system to sell it. Now she's teaching you how to replicate this same system. No matter the topic of your course or program. Circuit sales system combines the excitement of live launching with the predictability of evergreen without their respective downsides like chaos and low conversions, head to circuitsalesystem.com/ceo. To watch Nikki's free training on how to scale and sell your course or program on autopilot every single day. Again, that's circuitsalessystem.com/ceo, or click the link below in the show notes to watch this eye opening training right now.
Hey, everyone, I am joined today by my new friend, Megan Sumrell, who I am so excited to chat with because I told Megan, before we hit record, I have like two pages front and back notes with questions. And that really is a testament to how prepared she showed up for this case study interview with all of the data. So you guys are going to absolutely love our conversation today. And it's a really, really unique top level strategy that we've truly never covered on the podcast. So before I tease that, Megan, first I'd love for you to share your Cubicle to CEO story. I know you were just lamenting. You were in a cubicle for far too long. So tell us what-
It was.
Yeah. Tell us about that. And how you made the leap into entrepreneurship.
Yeah, so I, I'm 50. So I started my first cubicle experience in the early 90s. And I worked in the IT space for over 20 years. So I'm old enough that I worked in a cubicle with a landline phone. And I know some of you guys aren't able to believe this, but we didn't even have the Internet back then.
Shocking.
Shocking, right? Eventually, over the course of my I spent over 20 years in corporate did manage to you know, elevate myself to an actual office and get out of a cubicle. And honestly, I loved what I did, I spent the last seven to eight years of my time in corporate in the aviation space. And basically my job would be to go into software teams and create harmony out of chaos, where I would go in and pull like throw away all the systems and processes that they would use to build their products and then help them redefine and build new ones better, faster, cheaper.
So background with a bunch of super nerdy letters behind my name. I was like to say I was a big fish in a really small nerdy pond, like corporate life. But I got married later in life started a family later. And when my daughter was born, I was juggling, work, home life, all of that when she was about two I had a just very interesting encounter with a woman at the park one afternoon, who very innocently asked me what do you do for fun? on. And I didn't have an answer. And that kind of rocked me to my core that night, I was like, I was taking a look back over the last several years of my life and realizing I was just like walking through the motions day to day task list, do it, you know, I looked super, quote, productive to other people. But I was sinking into a pretty bad state of depression and exhaustion.
And I just was like, something's got to change how I've how I'm managing my time is not this is not sustainable. So you know, the irony of it is, this is kind of what I did for a living. So I thought, Hey, Megan, take yourself on as a client. But let's figure out how to how to get new processes in for our calendar. And for our time, and long story short, that launched me into finding my passion and purpose in life, which is helping women get out of this state of overwhelm. So I actually created a proprietary time management and planning framework called the TOP framework. And I now run a company called The Pink Bee. And I'm on a mission to teach as many women ways to control their time and calendars so they can actually have harmony in their lives again.
That's incredible. I love the direct transfer of all of the skills that you spent decades building in your corporate career directly into a business. And, you know, I feel that many women listening to this podcast can probably relate to that moment of, I don't know, like a little bit of an existential crisis, where you're like, oh, yeah, what do I do outside of my professional job? Or who am I outside of my family roles as a mother wife, or whatever it may be? So I'm sure you are not alone in that. But I feel like I now have to ask, what is one thing that you do for fun these days?
Well, you're gonna love this. About a year and a half ago, I was like, I've always had this dream of wanting to learn how to play the cello. So I started taking cello lessons a year and a half ago. And so I have pockets of time every day where I get to go practice. And that's just one of the things that I've brought back in my life that I do just for me for fun.
That is amazing. My sister, one of my sisters played cello. So our house was always filled with like cello, violin, piano music growing up. So I love that for you. I'm so excited. Such a beautiful instrument. Alright, let's get into the case study, Megan, because I have so many questions to ask you, I don't want to waste a minute of your time.
So for our listeners, today's case study, we're going to be talking about how Megan launched her own branded app in the App Store. So that's the app store on your iPhone. Or if you have an Android, that's the Google Play Store. And she used this app, The Pink Bee app as a top of funnel strategy that gets her paid for new leads, instead of her paying for new leads. I know that's a little tongue twister. But basically, imagine getting new leads injected into your business. But they're paying you to be added as a leader as a customer into your ecosystem instead of you going out and paying money through Meta ads, or whatever it may be to acquire these customers and leads.
So Megan, I hear the genesis for your app was actually from a late night scroll in 2021. Right. And ironically, this is the funny part. Ironically, you were focusing at that time in your life on finding new ways to generate leads outside of spending money with meta, so Meta being Facebook ads, Instagram ads, any of their associated platforms. But it was actually a Facebook ad itself. Right? For a software that allows you to create your own branded app that came up in your feed one night, and it gave you this aha moment. So what caught your attention about this? And if you can share what's what's the software company called that you used to create your own app?
Yeah, so it was I remember, it was over Thanksgiving break. And I was having some, again, I'm older, I was having some hot flashes. So I was kind of awake. So I'm scrolling. And I caught an ad for a software platform called Passion IO. And they said that you could create an actual branded app in the App Store. Now, my background was in technology. I actually co founded a software company years ago. And I had gone through the rigmarole of building and getting an app out to the app store before I tell you it is not trivial.
And so when I saw this ad, and they're like we have a software platform that's essentially going to widgetized this and make it where you don't even have to build your own code, but get your own branded app. It caught my attention initially, just from a technology perspective. I'm like, how are they doing that? And the ads were really geared more towards the fitness industry coaches, where they were promoting the app for people to you know, there's lots of platforms course platforms out there as well, but they were really promoting it as more of an all in one business platform like build your fitness routines, and people could come subscribe and watch their exercise videos on your phone.
And I instantly thought, hey, if I could have something in the App Store That's where I could centralize all of my really juicy good free content. Because you know, I mean, think about you go live on Instagram or on facebook or you know, you do a webinar, this and that. And it's scattered all over the place. So someone's trying to be like, Oh my god, I learned this thing from Megan, right. And they don't really know where the video was, and it's lost in the scroll. So that was my initial thought was, what if I could have a centralized little content hub of all my free goodies that I could push out into the world where I am so easy for people to find, because it's I tell them, it's like having a time management expert in your pocket. So right there on their phone. So that was really what got me interested in kind of checking the platform out.
So smart, pausing this real quick to let you know, if you want to build your own branded app on passion, you can check out the free trial link below in the show notes.
So it's really a destination experience, right? Like, unlike social, where you're flooded with all of these different distractions as you're scrolling. People are going to your app specifically for you. But of course, that begs the question like, Okay, if if you're centralizing all of your free content in this app to you, what is the primary difference between doing that and let's say, centralizing all of your content on a landing page on your own website, which is still a destination experience. So what specifically about the app is your you know, you feel like is your advantage and using it?
Yeah, so there's a couple things here with it. One is I get to leverage SEO in the app stores themselves. And especially because I teach on time management and productivity, there's a clear win for me there because people are searching for productivity apps. And I have, you know, using zaps and whatnot, I can tell when someone joins my email list, because they found me from the app. So I can see that people are finding me first on the app, creating an account on the app, and then we can automatically zap them over on to the email list. So the SEO is working right there. Whereas you're not necessarily going to have that experience on a landing page, per se. Also, when you think about putting it all on a landing page versus an app, people forget the URLs, right? I mean, and sometimes an experience on a mobile device for landing page, there's a lot of scrolling, it can be difficult to work through all of that.
So the fact that when people download my app, anytime they're pulling up their phone, right, they're gonna see that pink bee right there on their on their device. And it's going to be a reminder of the content, the courses, and ultimately the business as well. So it's very subtly front of mind in them where I'm, I'm pushing to them, they're not seeking me out on a website or on a landing page.
That's brilliant, especially the constant visual reminder of your brand, right? That that subtle feeding of that consciousness around your branding is so smart. And you're right, very difficult to do through other avenues. You did also mention this idea of pushing out to them. One of the things I personally think is most advantageous about having an app branded obviously being better, but even an unbranded app is the ability to send push notifications, right?
Yes.
Have you? Have you found that to be extra impactful or effective and getting people to actually engage or take action on a CTA?
Yeah, and the way I really leveraged the push notifications is one of the things that I one of the little mini courses that you get inside the app is teaching a very basic weekly planning process. So we can just send push notifications every week, don't forget to do your weekly planning, get yourself ready for the week. So if they almost feel like they already are my customer, I'm talking to them as if they are I'm sending them reminders and providing them value in a way that's different than a purchase this or login over here. And again, I just feel it keeps me very front of mind with everyone that has downloaded the app.
That makes a lot of sense. And a moment ago, actually, you mentioned something that I wanted to circle back to because I think it is important for I mean, even clarity for myself, because I don't have a branded app in the App Store understanding if someone downloads the free version of your app, because there's that free version, and then the option to upgrade to a paid user for $4.99, which we'll get into in depth in just a moment.
But if someone's just a free user, when they download the app from the App Store, do you get some sort of notification from the App Store that gives you their email a name that you can then like you said, create a zap to send over to your email list or what is the level of transparency around user data before they become a paying customer that you get?
Yeah, and it's all you know, that's all run by Apple and Google Play as well. So we're you know, we have to we're we're playing by their rules because they own that data initially. So when someone downloads the app, downloading it, I get no visibility but In order for them to see anything in there, they have to create an account with a username and password. So if you download the app, you do have to actually log in like, I mean, we do with most apps today. So as soon as someone creates an account on the app, even though they haven't paid any money, depending upon their setting in the app store, it will we have a zap set up, so it will put it on my email list. And if they have that privacy setting on, it's an encrypted email address, so I can't see their actual email address, but I can still send them emails.
So if you've ever set up zaps with app, like if you have that thing set on saying, No, I don't want them protect my privacy, I don't want people to see my true email, you're still getting on their list, but your email address is going to be like 36 characters from both just characters and numbers. Yeah, so I can't see their first name, I can't see any of that. But I can still email them. And then if they choose to unlock all the fruit, you know, all the training in the app and pay the one time fee, then we have another zap that updates my system to let me know, hey, this person is now converted to a paid app user. And they're no longer just a free user.
Got it. And at that point, if they do convert to a paid app user, does that give you the ability then to require them to enter? Like their actual, so it could still be an A not essentially an anonymous email to you on your side? But you're just continuing that relationship with them by sending that email? Yeah. Okay. Interesting. Very interesting. So I do want to get into the numbers around, you know, the the actual conversions, and obviously, also to, you know, how much revenue you're generating from the paid users versus people who actually upsell into your own programs.
But I do want to first cover the launch process of this app, just because it is such a different strategy than we've ever covered on the show. And so I'm sure people have lots of questions. I know I do. So you mentioned that use the software passion to IO to help you do this. And it was way easier than obviously custom coding your own app.
Yeah.
But walk us through the actual process, like the build and launch process from start to finish, how much time how much energy and how much money? Did you sink into this app before you launched it in 2022?
Yeah, and I will say their, their process now for launching into the App Store is far more improved than when I went through. And I was one of their I was not one of their early software users, because they have a full web based platform. But I was one of the first ones to actually get the branded physical apps in their stores. Okay, so the investment for me up front, I just went all in and did the 12 month and it was $1,000.09 97, then I know their pricing has changed. But I went in and I'm locked in at that rate, which is really nice. So every year, I just spend $1,000 to host everything on on passion IO.
Thats a great Deal.
Second. Yeah. So I mean, it's a steal, especially when you hear how much money I get back out of it every day, guys. Yeah, so I made the decision to do this, as I said, it was over Thanksgiving. And that would have been end of November, and I launched the app in January. So the turnaround time for me to get this thing launched was very, very quick and easy. I actually didn't create new content, I just centralized content that I had all over the place. And the way I chose to build it is it set up, they have three key features in their platform.
One is you can have all your little mini courses or big courses, I just call them mini courses. So I was able to pull like I do a couple of free workshops every year. So we just took the last recordings from the old workshops, and then put them in as to each individual courses in the app. They have a community feature where you can actually people can engage and comment. I don't use that very heavily. But I do get a lot of people coming in and introducing themselves, etc on the app. And then again, there's the notification aspect of it as well. They have some gamification in there, that just wasn't a great fit for my brand. So I'm really not doing much with it today. But my hope is that they'll you know, blow that up a little bit more, because I would like to be able to have challenges where people can you see how long of a streak they can keep where they log in and say Yes, I did my planning each week and things like that. It can be a lot of fun.
And what a way to build a habit to with, again, engaging with your brand on a daily basis if you were able to do that. But continue.
Yeah, so the process for getting it into the App Store. The software is very easy to use. It's very widget based, you know, you're uploading things and putting your content here and you've got your own images. But I did have to go through the process of creating a developer account on Apple and a developer account on Google so that it is me, you know my business, my name, etc, pushing my app out onto the platforms. And I think in the app store, it's $99 a year to keep your account so very little and Google, I think it was free because I don't remember getting recurring fee to have stuff up there in the App Store.
The initial process for getting the app launched back in the day when I was when I was first doing it passion, I actually got on the phone with someone from their support team. And we did screen shares, and they walked me through all this weird stuff to get it pushed out. And it was about a 45 minute phone call. And I was very fortunate that usually, the very first time you go to push an app out in the App Store, by default, it always just gets rejected. It's just part of their process. And then you you resubmit it, and then they're like, okay, you're accepted. Mine, actually, we went through that we didn't even hit the rejection on either one.
So it got approved into the App Store, and then it's live instantly. And now they've streamlined it so well, that every week a member of my team just logs in to passion to see are there any software updates? If there are, there's a big announcement, and all she does is press a button that pushes all the new updated code out. Like that's literally all we have to do to get anytime they make big changes to their code base pushed out to the App Store. So it's very easy to maintain.
So convenient. I love that even like you said back then. I mean, 2021 was really only three years ago, right? But like saying that even then when maybe it wasn't as refined as it is now. You were I mean, like you said, you you saw this over Thanksgiving break, and you had it out by January 2022. So I mean, it was really less than 90 days. And I I'm sure for people-
And I don't work that many hours every day either. So it's not like I was pushing, you know, burning the midnight oil to get it out. I only work four to four and a half hours, five days a week. That's it. So I was able to do that, while still doing all my other usual stuff.
Oh, wait, that's excellent context. So for anyone listening who's like, oh, I might want to explore what this looks like from a top of funnel strategy. Hopefully, that's really affirming, right? Like, you could potentially get this out, I'm sure today, in the current times, you could probably get it out in like 30 days or less, and not-
Especially if you have the content, right? Like, if you're having to build content from scratch, well, then you may need to plan in more time for that, but I'm just gonna have to do that.
So good to know also to about the app, potentially, you know, going through rejection, the first round, and just to know, that's very normal and to resubmit. Is there any other hindsight that you want to share with someone who might be considering creating their own branded app?
Yeah, I would say the the thing and we we didn't nail this the first time I push the app out, right? We're always refining and learning, we actually just kind of gave a facelift to it at the beginning of this year, where I was like, alright, I got better camera quality and things like that. So we kind of re recorded some of the courses, but be very have a very clear strategy for yourself of any of the content in the app. What is the purpose for it? Where are you taking them? What do you want their next step to be?
And maybe it's just, you know, nothing, maybe it's just informational. But when you go through and look at all of the many courses in my app at the end of every single one, it's what's next. And so then I tell them, like, here is your next logical step. And everything points into my main program, it might be a little bit of a roundabout way, right, depending upon where they are in their journey. But I'm not sending people to 12 different programs and 15 different assets in a unit. It's all going streamlined into my one main funnel that sells my signature program.
Do you have visibility, by the way into user behavior on the app? So like consumption rate of, of content, watch time drop off? Can you see any of that information on your-
Not today? Now, I believe there are some other I think now they have ways and I need to check into this, of where you can have your videos hosted outside of the app so that you can get better analytics on your watch time. But today, I don't currently have that information.
Okay, that's good to know. Because I was going to ask if the answer had been Yes, my follow up would have been and this might just be an interesting data point to track for anyone who does create a branded app is once someone does ultimately upsell into your primary program that you're trying to drive them to, does their app activity then kind of fall to zero because it's almost like they've completed the mission and they no longer need to utilize that you know that free or or micro paid content. So anyways, that's that's just something that was top of mind for me, but like you kind of already previewed this app.
So just to re walk our listeners through the through the user journey, this app is free to download in the App Store and people can have access to some free content. And then to unlock all the content on the app. A user pays a one time fee of $4.99. So just about $5
When I launched it, I started it at $1.99.
Oh Wow.
Okay, initially just just to test this thing out, right, yeah. And what's crazy is we just upped it to the $4.99 in January, and we're actually getting more
than when it was 199. No way. I wonder what the psychology of that is?
I don't know. But you know, sometimes that value, right, right? Well, there must be. But you know, I did some data research on like, how much can I stretch that without it making people go? And basically, I was like, oh, anything for 99, or under the App Store, people don't really hesitate to purchase, if it's something that water.
That's fair, I'm thinking about my own app behavior. And, I mean, I've definitely purchase apps that are like $19.99, or like, you know, a little bit more. But I will say even those incremental changes like that jump from $4.99 to $9.99, does give more pause, and you're like, do I really need to spend the $10 today? So yeah, I can see how, at a certain threshold that kind of get diminishing returns. So anyways, if someone if someone purchases the paid access, so $4.99, they have access to all the content on the app, but like you said, you're ultimately driving to your top program, which is $597. And is that 597? A year? Is that 597 lifetime? For a course?
It's a one time it's a course that they get forever? Yeah.
Okay, awesome. So I wanted to know, then, if you're thinking strategically through, okay, the free content is gonna lead people to find the paid version of this app. And the paid version is leading people to your paid program of $600, or a little less than that. What content do you delineate is like, making it two different areas, right? So for example, like just the free content upfront that people get for downloading the free version of the app, what kind of content do you put there versus the content that you put in the paid version of the app? Can we start there?
Great question? So the way I've designed it is, I think, right now, we've got either five or five or six mini courses in the app, okay. And so I have a video for each one of those that you get for free. So it's basically me telling them where I'm saying, hey, this particular course is going to teach you X, Y, and Z, here's how it's broken down, I tease it out a little bit, and then let them know. So if you want access to this course, you know all the information and everything else, it's $4.99. So the free content they get is a little background information about me along with a intro to each one of the many programs so that they really can understand what am I going to learn out of this is it worth paying the $4.99.
So that was very, very easy. And so it looks like when they open up the app, they see all the courses right there, and they see a video waiting for them. And each and every one where I'm where I'm introducing the content to them. And the other way that we're leveraging the content in there that I love, is I hold three kind of fun free events every year that are, you know, the very traditional join me for a five day challenge kind of thing. And two of the big ones that I do every year one is called the one notebook challenge, where I teach you how to stay organized with one notebook.
And one is called the bad morning, where we learn how to create morning routine based on our personality type. And both of these upsell right into my program. They are free live challenges. I run them for five days, 30 minutes or less each day. And of course, what is the number one thing that everyone asks it before they sign up for anything is will there be a replay, like, oh my god, I could have a nickel for every time someone asked me will there be a replay. So the way we position it is, hey, you can come join us live. But when the workshop is over, we are we package up all the replays and we put them in my app. So if you miss it live, you can pay your $4.99, you can come take the one notebook challenge today, for $4.99 Knock yourself out.
And it's a really easy way to keep those live high energy events in an evergreen style, right. And so every time I do when we refresh it in the app, because I always tweak them up a little bit. So even the current app holders feel like they got something new when we release the new version of the you know, recorded OneNote book challenge. And I keep the sales pitch in there as well. So anyone who misses the challenge, their friend tells them about it. Well, then they go download the app to watch it three weeks later, that's selling right into the program as if they were joining me live for the challenge.
Got it. Okay, so brilliant. So essentially, the free version to recap of your app is basically one big trailer for all of these other individual I mean, you're calling them mini courses, but really like any workshops or webinars or things that you've done, and then also replays of the live challenges. So they're kind of teasing what they can expect if they join the paid app. And then for your I mean, do you have any regular freebies in your business that you host on your website like PDF downloads and whatnot? Are any of those included in the app or are those totally separate?
No, there is one that It's in there. So I have, I have a couple of freebies, and I use many chat a lot on Instagram. So I've got a lot of many chat funnels, you know, the traditional drop the whatever, and I'll send you over my thing, right. So one that does has done really well since I first launched the business is called My ditch the overwhelmed cheat sheet. And so inside of the app, I have the three step ditch the overwhelm process with the little video training, and then they can click to download the PDF. And it's just repurposing the exact same. I have ads that run to the digital world cheat sheet and have a mini chat funnel that you can grab it and but it all on the back end feeds into the exact same email sequence, nurture, but I'm getting people coming in from all different ways all into the exact same stuff. So I try and take one thing and then go, how many different places? Can I put this?
Yeah-
To, you know, attract, attract everybody on all the different platforms?
That makes a lot of sense. Now over the course of the lifetime of your app, so at this point, what, like three years, maybe two years, right, or in two years? Oh, no. Two years? Yeah. What what is the total number of users that you've acquired, that includes free people? So just total number of people that you have somehow gotten opt in information for email name?
Yeah. So I was actually looking this morning. So like, I know, when I pulled my data for you before, and like, right, we've had a couple more months over here. So we're at just over 7,000 app users now.
Wow. Okay, amazing. Do you remember back this might be too difficult of an app? But do you remember back to your first seven days like the week of the actual app launch in January of 2022? Do you remember how many people you got in those first seven days? And then-
I track everything.
Oh my gosh you're amazing. Okay, so the first seven days, what were those numbers? Like?
Oh, I have the first month, and the very first month was 112 app users that came in on that first month?
And was that in any were-
Almost all existing students?
Okay, I was just going to ask, like, where did those people come from? Okay, good to know.
And I kind of soft launched it to people that already knew me.
Yeah.
Purposefully, I didn't do a big push until I got to see how it worked for a little while with people that were already students of mine, then we're going to give me a little leeway if things were a little bumpy. And I actually gave it to them for free. So I'm like, Hey, you're already student's mind, I'm not gonna make you pay the buck 99. Let me know how it goes for you. And so we really didn't do a full push towards like cold traffic, new people until February.
I mean, I think that's really smart, too. Because if you have people who are already Megan enthusiast, The Pink Bee enthusiast. Right? Let's have your advocates built into the community on your app. So I'm sure even sometimes, like you were saying, when people ask questions in the q&a that some of your existing students are jumping in and being like, Oh, hey, she go check this out. Or like, you know, Megan said this in a training. So I love that you kind of seeded that with people who already trust you and are going to be your best advocates in the app to begin with. So 112, you said first 30 days, what is your average acquisition rate today? Like how many new users per month?
Yeah, so today, we're getting upwards of about 350 new paid app users per month.
Wow, that's incredible. So and and how much of that would you say, is true cold new traffic versus people from your community who are driven to the app from other places, like your email list or your social media channels?
Yeah. Now, you know, attribution is always so tricky, right with anything. So we've set it up on the back end, where if I am through zap, if I'm putting someone onto my email list, we're checking to see does this email exist in our system? If it doesn't, then we're adding a tag saying they found us through the app.
Okay.
So, you know, assuming people aren't having duplicated emails, and all of that, that's kind of all we can assume is that that number is there. And right now, I'm just looking at my numbers. On average, we're getting about 60%, cold traffic coming in from the app. So people are first getting on my list through the app. And I think that has, which is great. And I think that has to do with the fact that usually when I'm a guest on podcasts, and people say, you know, where can they find you? Of course, I always tell them about my podcast.
Yeah.
But I always say, Hey, I've got an app in the App Store. Because it's different. It's not one more funnel to go down. It's not one more PDF that you know, it usually catches there like you have what? Like, oh, my God, I'll go check out the app. And I tell people, it's a way for you to see if, if my style of teaching resonates with you, right. Does this work for you? And so I think that's where the bulk of our cold traffic through the app comes from is when I'm on other people's podcasts and things like that.
That's really interesting. I would have assumed falsely that most of the cold traffic to your app was coming just through native search within the app store or within Google Play Store, you know, the discoverability piece that you mentioned, where you can kind of rank for certain keywords like party-
They could be, you know, it's my guess. But I'll we'll go in and look and see if I've been on a podcast, you'll see a site a large reach, we'll see a spike. I'm like, oh, that's probably because I'm hot right.
No, that makes complete sense. Is there anything else that you do besides mentioning the app at the end of interviews, and also just depending on SEO searchability, in the actual app stores to drive new users to the app?
Yeah, I try and keep it that most people, a lot of business owners will have kind of our core key things that we teach or talk about when we're interviewed, right. So I have a couple of key processes that I have a very clear division on, here's what you can learn from me for free. But here's, here's what you have to pay with. So all the things that I know, I am willing to show up and talk about and teach about for free, I have covered in the app.
So that way, if I show up on someone's podcast, and I'm teaching them, okay, let me give you an introduction to what I call basic weekly planning. And I teach very happily, the free version of that. At the end, I'm like, Okay, now, hey, don't worry about taking notes, I want you just to listen to absorb the information, because I've got all this broken down for you with videos in my app in the App Store. So you'll be able to go back and get a refresher there. So I'm always ceding people back to what I just taught you here, go grab it in the app, and you'll be able to, and I tell them, you can actually plan right alongside with me because it's broken down into the step by step process.
So I very intentionally try and keep what I'm showing up and teaching and presenting as something that aligns with content in the app as well. So people are just naturally, you know, if they liked what they heard, they're going to want to go grab that there. So they have it again.
Super strategic and very streamlined for you to not to have to always come up with new content, right it is that that true repurposing of your core tenants? I also saw that when you had submitted your case study for today's interview that you mentioned, you had tested Pinterest ads, is that correct? Can you walk us through how that's been going for you?
Yeah. So I still want to run ads to my app on Meta. So if you're listening, Mr. Zuckerberg, for whatever reason, we're having technical challenges where their team can't get-
Oh no.
My app connected. So I was like, oh, that's alright. But what I've done on so I get leads at a really low cost on Pinterest. I'm much lower than I do on Meta right now. So I have a number of pins, where when you click on the pin, it goes to I have a landing page for the app. And on the landing page, the button to download the app is smart enough to know what device are you on, and then it sends you directly, you know, to open up and download the app. So we've got ads on Pinterest, running to You know, hey, let me tell you about here's everything in this great app. And then so then when they click on it, it's just a to tap for them to be able to download the app. And we're getting conversions into the paid app right now, at just under $4. Or no, I'm sorry, that's what we're profiting. So we're getting our paid app, I'm just getting our latest data from yesterday, right now averaging out about $1.11. So, you know, incredible, I'm paying $1.11 for them to unlock it at $4.99.
Oh my gosh, that's like, that's like what we-
They're like giving me money to get on my list. And these are people that have already self selected. I want to learn this content. And I'm willing to invest a little money to do that. So they're just better quality leads as well.
100%. And I mean, that's like my version of a dream. Unlimited ATM essentially Right? Like imagine every time you put in $1 you get $4 out I mean, if that is a true scenario and that scalable it's like at that point it's it's becomes a game of how much capital can I find to feed into this ATM right to pump out four times as much so that is so cool. Is this something that you're just beginning or have you started to see the same numbers hold true at scale? What what's the vision?
So I am a super risk averse person. So as is like gives me heart failure which is why I want to have so many other ways right people in my world and just not rely on them. So that was that's been a big focus of mine on 2024 is to level up my scarcity mindset around marketing ad spend. And we have now consistently seen this rate for five months so we have really started jacking up the ad spent that we're that we're putting out there towards it.
That is incredible. If you feel comfortable sharing What is the average monthly ad spend that you are paying into Pinterest ads right now?
So you're gonna laugh when I first started, I was like, I'm willing to spend $25 a day. Right? Like-
That's actually, that's a very healthy budget. I mean, that's what like, almost $900 right a month. That's that's not, that's not
Yeah, when I see month after month after that these people are like it is consistently happening. So we're now scaling it up upwards of more like two to $300 a day on Pinterest, and I, I am being gently nudged like, we can do more. But I was like, I just have to do this in my own time where I feel comfortable-
100%
Because I'm also spending, you know, I'm also juggling ad spend over on Meta as well, with kind of that balancing act.
That's so interesting to me. Like, it's just nice. I mean, that's a cool thing about I think Pinterest is, it's very unpredictable sometimes. But when you have a pin that just hits it off, you can really I mean, it has a very long cycle. Like we have this one random organic pin running to our blog that is like a curated list of books written by female authors. And for whatever reason, like we created this pin back in like, I think 2021 And then in 2024, it just like, popped off. Yeah. And we are getting like thousands of clicks a month to our site from it. So anyways, I don't play that-
Yeah. And it's, you know, planning, feeling overwhelmed, like, yeah, people are on Pinterest looking for solutions for that. So it's, it's a really smart play for me to have that there.
Right, really, really good audience match for you. Okay, thank you, by the way for being so transparent. That's really helpful. Because I know sometimes people hear these really great, like acquisition costs, and then they're like, but what, what kind of budget does that require to really see that. So I do really, really appreciate you being willing to share that. Let's talk a little bit about the funnel side of your of your stats. So you said about 7000 lifetime users who have downloaded and opted into the app in some way, whether free or pay, what percentage of the free users convert to paid users on the app?
We get about 80% that will then convert to the paid, which is great. I mean, if Yeah, don't do anything, they're still on my list. Yeah, as they've created the account, so you'll still be able to nurture them there. Yeah. And then the last time, you know, again, if attribution is right, right, we are then seeing of those paid users, we're having just under 8%, that have eventually turned into full program sales of the 697. So you know, when I was doing all my little number running, that's it's around 300,000, in revenue from people through the app over to the program.
Amazing. $300,000. Wow. And-
It's I mean, it's hands off, I get truly and I know you had a while back, you had Nikki on as a guest. Well, I actually have I've built I went through her program and built a circuit for my program. So the app ultimately feeds people right into that circuit, as does basically, anything I put out there all comes back through there. But the fact that we can see, we've had about 300,000 in revenue from the program from the app feeding in but then we also have revenue for the program feeding in through other points of entry as well.
And it's so cool to see how someone who paid you $5 Essentially, can upsell into a $600 program like that. Like it's it's such a huge leap when you and-
It's not a stair step I don't I don't value ladder them, I'm just here's the program. And then I have physical planners that usually when they buy the program, they usually then go over and get the physical stuff as well.
And I think it's really just a testament to it's not so much about how much someone transacts with you on that first purchase. It's more So building that trust of if I give you any amount of money, whether it's $1 $10 $100 Are you going to actually deliver on what you say you will deliver, can I trust you and your teaching and your credibility. And I think once you have that on lock, it's so much easier to then upsell that customer to a second purchase, even if the second purchase is, eons and leaps in in investment compared to that that first transaction.
And so for all of our listeners, just keep that in mind. The best thing you can do is like get a buyer on your list early and whatever that amount has to be for that first entry level purchase, even if it was like Megan started with $1.99 It's not about the money that you're getting on that front end. It's about getting that customer relationship so that you can then sell a better fit solution for them on the back end. But I mean the $4.99 is still nothing to laugh at right? Like you've still made a decent amount of money from just the front of the app. Do you know your totals to date?
Well, I when I was pulling together the latest numbers we have actually had over well now it's actually increased now to over $35,000 of revenue, just through that app over the course of just over two years. Again, if you'll be like, Oh, that's, I mean, think about I'm not spending $35,000 I am getting a feel like I'm being paid to get people on to my list.
That's so cool.
And they're people that want to be there they are opting in to learn from Yeah, so it's, uh, I know, they're a good fi.
Huge win, huge win. I mean, yeah, imagine getting paid an income stream of, I mean, $35,000 was like, I think what I made out of college, my first job, so like, imagine getting paid an annual salary more than I made.
And that's and that's funny. Like, I remember my first college job was $16,500. That was my starting salary. In the IT space, but again, I'm old.
But still, but still, yeah, like, it could be like a full time, salary, right? And depending where you live and whatnot, and where you are in your career, but to get paid that to, like you said, add 7000 people to your email list, add 7000 people into your customer ecosystem is just such a cool strategy. I'm blown away. Honestly, this is this is a really, really interesting top of funnel strategy.
I love that you wanted to talk about it. Because I'm always sharing with you them like, are you gonna get an app? And then he's like, no, like, I don't really see it like, Oh, you're missing out?
Wait, just wait till people hear this episode. You know what next time someone gives you that reaction? Just wait, just go listen to this, this interview. And then you tell me after if you still don't want to give this a try. But
Well, it was interesting, because the CEO of Passion Itself, reached out and interviewed me because I'm using their app not in the way that they designed. So even they were intrigued, like, okay, so how are you using this thing? Like you're missing the boat? Like, I think they ought to start talking about that, as really a cool top of funnel strategy.
So, so cool. And thank you again, Megan, for being willing to share this case study.
Absolutely.
That's my favorite part about the show, honestly. And you listeners, you already know this, but we love how our guests CEOs, like Megan are willing to come on and give us a peek behind the curtain that their own strategies that they're using to grow their business. So even though Megan is a time and productivity expert, you know, she was willing to come on to our show and talk about how she's growing her business with this top of funnel strategy instead of, you know, spending an hour talking to us about her signature framework around productivity or time management. So I know that's a huge ask of our guests. And I again, really appreciate it. So Megan, I probably already know what you're gonna say here. But where? Where should our listeners-
You know I'm gonna say to go download the app. But truly, I want you all to download it to put on your marketing hat for yourself in your own business and go okay, how could I play this out? But also, if you're listening clearly, you're a podcast listener as well. So I would love for folks to come join me over on Work+Life Harmony Podcast too.
Love the use of the word harmony over balance. You guys know how I feel about that. So anyways, all of Megan's links will be below in the show notes. Make sure you go check that out. Go send her a DM today. Say hi. Say thank you if you plan to test out this strategy in your own business, Megan, thank you for your time and we will catch all of you in our next episode.
Thank you.
Also a quick reminder that if you want to test Megan's top of funnel strategy for yourself and create your own branded app on passion, we have a free trial link below in the show notes. Check it out.
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