The Trevor Project: LGBTQ Advocacy and Suicide Prevention - Muneer Panjwani

2:49AM Oct 5, 2021

Speakers:

Julie Confer

Becky Endicott

Jonathan McCoy

Muneer Panjwani

Keywords:

people

trevor project

lgbtq

organization

companies

create

nonprofits

lgbtq youth

campaigns

conversation

feel

person

understand

trevor

partnership

pause

story

support

world

queer

Welcome back to Mental Health Week presented by give butter. It's day two. We're so glad you're here.

Hey, I'm john.

And I'm Becky.

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Hey, Becky. Hey, john. We have been waiting to talk to Muneer for months. And today is the day and we are so psyched about it. So before, before I introduce Muneer, I want to give a little bit of context about how we found him. But we were, you know, attending the virtuous, responsive giving summit and we're in one of these sessions, and we hear this man talking. And what he is saying is so evolved, it is so kind it is a it is an affirming way for to see all people, and it's instructive. And we were like who is this man? And how do we befriend him for ever I tracked him down all Yes, not creepy at all. So it is our pleasure that today we get to introduce you to him and Muneer Panjwani is the Vice President of foundation and government and corporate partnerships for the Trevor Project. So many years team focuses on building impact centered around this long term partnership with some of the world's largest companies and foundations to help in LGBTQ youth suicide. And I think the Trevor Project story is so interesting, we're going to be going into it. But I also want to highlight the new near secured Trevor's first seven figure partnership that launched this incredibly new, holistic corporate partnership model for the organization. And in three years that model six times the corporate revenue, and established all these partnerships with 150 plus national and global companies. And when I think about the ripple of that, and the community that's been built, I just think it's extraordinary. And the last thing I just want to say about me near so you understand his heart, and what an extraordinary human he is. He's an avid traveler that lives in New York City, but he is often found planning his next trip abroad. We missed him last time because he was in Italy. And he's trying to reach a goal of exploring 40 countries by his 40th birthday. Ministers pronouns are he him and I think that's important as we have this conversation. So, Muneer, we are delighted you're here. Welcome to mental health week on the weird for good podcast.

Thank you so much, Becky. It's wonderful to be here.

Well, we're very curious about your story. And I want you to kind of take us back a little bit and tell us about little Muneer growing up. Tell us about your journey and how you kind of got led to where you are today.

Oh, wow. How far back can I go? I'll keep it brief. But I was I was born in India. But I moved to the US when I was 12 years old. So I moved to a very, very small town in Connecticut called weathersfield, Connecticut. My egos out there, if you're listening to this, he goes, you know, it was a very interesting experience growing up in a small town and coming from a large city in India as a ground person as a Muslim person. And for for the first time, realizing that I was very different from other kids around me. And of course, that's I had my challenges in middle school in my high school. But I was very fortunate to have come across lots of amazing teachers and mentors who sort of saw something in me and took me under their wings and sort of pressured me into taking on lots of different extracurricular activities, which led me to doing lots of social justice activism. So I was a volunteer for a local activist camp called Camp Anytown. That helped me understand the world around me and the reasons why I was feeling so different, and made me believe that the difference was not my fault. It was actually the societal structures that were were empowering some people to feel better than me, and also giving them the power to disempower me and make make me feel like I was a little bit different. Fast forward a little bit. I ended up becoming the director of that program. A few years later, I ended up being hired by that organization to run that entire program along with other programs that are running with young people within Massachusetts and Connecticut. So I went from somebody who was trying to be a doctor because that's what I was expected to be good then becoming a youth programs director, running antivirus and anti racism workshops in western Massachusetts and Connecticut with middle and high school students, as well as teachers and administrators and middle schools across the region. So that really sort of made me really passionate about creating change and community and it gave me a lot of access to to conversations that were really meaningful. You know, you know, it's one thing to have a conversation with an adult about racism, but it's very different type of conversation with a teenager about racism and about sexism about homophobia, there are a lot more honest and their perspectives, they are not as polite as adults might be sometimes. And they're also incredibly curious. So I got to really experience what it felt like to have all kinds of conversations and get people to understand. And for me to understand their perspective on how do you how do you take this theory of racism and actually apply it to your life? Right? How do you take change? And how do you empower yourself to think about what change you can make happen within your community, if you are trying to be anti sexist if you're trying to be homophobic, if you are trying to create safe and inclusive spaces for for all kinds of people. So anyways, from there, I moved on to an organization called do something.org which, which is, which was my first foray into fundraising, I kind of fell into it, because the person that hired me, said that they didn't want me for a program's position. I don't know why. But I'm glad that they didn't want me because they said, we'll we'll we'll teach you how to be a fundraiser. And I thought, Oh, my God, I'm gonna have to ask a lot of rich people to give me money. And I'm not I'm not gonna be good at that. So we

all felt that the first time in their

lives is easy, right? Yeah.

Yeah, exactly. But But my job ended up being actually building partnerships. So the job that I was doing before, which was having conversations with young people, now I was required to have those difficult conversations with corporate leaders who wanted to create change, but didn't have the formula or, or the the best practices to do it the right way. So I could use some of my charm, as well as some of my, my directness, to get them to understand that if you want to create meaningful impact in the world, using your corporate dollars, you have to do it in some really meaningful and authentic ways. So my job there was building corporate partnerships with companies who wanted to use cause marketing as a way to communicate not just to the consumers, but specifically to young people to take some action on a cause that they cared about. So we build campaigns around climate change, we build campaigns around texting and driving around cancer around anti bullying, lots of lots and lots of lots of different campaigns that really helps to create meaningful, measurable impact. That's kind of where I learned and wrote got really excited about the kind of seat that I had at the table to make change. In college, I was a bit of a radical. So I was always sort of protesting and I was out there trying to be as anti corporate as I could be. But then I ended up going to business school for about a year trying to understand what what it felt like to be on the other side, and I hated being on the other side. So it's kind of ironic that now I've ended up in this side of the aisle where I'm really working hand in hand with companies and corporate leaders, to help them to be more impactful, and to do more social good, and to do it the right way. Fast forward from there a little bit, I was approached by the CEO of the Trevor Project to come and run their corporate development team. He was recently hired, I think about six months before he hired me. And I was really excited about the mission. So the mission of the Trevor Project is to end suicide among LGBTQ young people. As a queer person, as once a queer young person, I fully understood the importance of this mission, right? I remember growing up and thinking about how lonely it was that I couldn't see anybody that looked like me, that was also queer. I didn't know where to go. And those nights where I wish that I could wake up straight. I didn't know how to even understand my experience that my that my experience was normal, that what I was feeling was okay, that I was still lovable, that I would have a life that my parents imagined for me. All of those things felt so so, so foreign to me, because I was starting to realize that I was gay. So when a meet, our CEO told me about his vision for the organization, which was to completely over Hall, its operations to scale it so that we can reach more and more LGBTQ young people in crises. I was like, Yes, I want to do this, I really, really want to do this. So he convinced me to leave this startup that I was trying to do to work on at the time, I was trying to start a little diversity inclusion consultancy, working with tech companies, and I had a couple of clients and I was about to sort of invest a little bit more into it. And he was like, do you want to do this and I said, No, I want to do this for a couple of years, I can always go back to my startup and a three and a half years later, I'm still here. And and the work has not stopped. We are you know, we are doing more and more than we have ever imagined. And a lot of that is in in in response to and because of the amount of funding and support that we're getting from companies and individuals who really care about our mission who are really inspired by my feeling like they can they can see the little them by giving to the Trevor Project. Right. And I think and I think that's a really important mission to be a part of, because all of us know what it feels like to be alone, to feel like we're not worthy of love, to feel invalidated, to feel lost and to feel invisible. So what the work that the Trevor Project is doing is really about making sure that every LGBTQ young person has the opportunity to live a life that is full of love, and care, and validation, and affirmation. So I'll pause there for a second but but that's that's a very brief history of where I'm coming from.

Okay, this is when we pause, and we reach across the zoom and give you a hug, my friend, like, thank you, for, I see this alignment happening so much in this season, but people leaning into things that may have been painful in their past, and really using it to point the purpose and kind of all their lived experience and channeling into something that's a force for good. And that is very clear to me and your story. And I just love seeing how the dots kind of came together over a period of time and said, Thank you for kind of walking us through that I just feel so inspired, you know of how you can take all these nudges and all these expertise and really serve and lift something that's so close to your heart.

So yeah, and I would also say this is the point in the conversation where my heart is completely shattered on the floor. And I know we're going to build that back up, because I'm thinking, I want to start a hug program with the Trevor Project where I can just hug, like anyone who feels like they don't have a future that they don't feel like their life matters. Can you imagine feeling that way? I mean, I want everybody listening to pause and think about them because I I've seen the film The the Trevor, like the Trevor Project film, I mean, it was Trevor. It's an Oscar winning film. And as I was watching it, I mean, I just felt so crushed from the inside for this child this Trevor and, and there's a really the way that they've story told it is so interesting and evolved. And I hadn't seen something like this. It really it was really ahead of its time and, and he narrates it through his diary. And his diary is what he's feeling and he's expressing his emotions. And so, Munir, I just my hat's off to you for being so vulnerable and sharing what you shared here. And thank you for feeling safe to say it here, because we are so grateful that you're here. And we want everyone to feel seen and affirmed. But the other thing that I love about you is how well you know yourself, you have an incredible sense of self and the fact that you hated corporate america yet you're in the space right now reimagining what corporate America can look like when it's more inclusive. And never before has there been a time where it feels like companies and and consumers are demanding, you know, inclusivity and purpose in their products and the things that they want to chase. And so I'm glad you're in there, it feels very much to me, like you were fighting for the one. And I love the fact that you say someone can save a little them. I want to save a little Becky Becky had pain points when she was growing up. Everybody had pain points when they were growing up, we should be pouring into those things. So thank you for sharing that.

Absolutely. I think one thing I'll add is I think when we think about corporations, it it almost becomes like this big, evil, bad guy. Right? And yes, companies have done terrible things. But the good thing that that I get to do is work with people within those companies who want to do good, right? So companies are not a monolith. Yes, there are many facets to a company. And I think it's important to remember for us on the social, social justice, social impact side is that there are lots of lots of lots of incredibly inspirational, motivated people in those companies who are doing what they can to create change, yes, there are limitations to what they can do. But that's where the fun comes in, right is when we sit at the table and say, here's what I want to get done. Here's what you want to get done. We have shared alignment and our vision and our goals. Here are the resources that we need to get there. How do we combine all of those things, and do something amazing together. And I think I think when we look at that perspective, we start to see that that there are tools in the toolbox for us to use to start to support identities and communities that have not been supported in the past using corporate dollars. And in corporate efforts. I mean, I can give you many, many examples of in the way that Trevor Project has benefited from taking corporate dollars. But it's less about the dollars that are coming in. It's more about the commitment to our mission that the companies are giving to us and saying a lot of companies come to us and say we have money to give you but what do you actually want to do? Right? And we'll try to give them all these benefits. And sometimes they'll say, these benefits are great. We absolutely want those because we need to show an ROI to various stakeholders. But also a lot of companies will say yeah, those benefits are great, but like what's actually going to make you be a better organization what's what's actually going to make you so There are more people, right? Those are the colleges that are hiring people who are senior executives at these companies. So I think it's important number that there's a human side to corporations that we sometimes forget when we talk about corporations as a monolith. Okay, that

is the perfect teaser for why the way you approach these corporate partnerships is so evolved. And I want us to come back to that. But to give a little more context to the conversation, the Trevor Project, and we're so inspired, but he kind of alluded to the founding story about the film. What drew me in about the story, and I want you to tell the story, if you wouldn't mind to, is that there was this clarity from the beginning that, yes, amplification of a story is one thing, but to put it out there without a call to action, and a direct line to hope, would be a huge missed opportunity, and maybe even dangerous, you know, and I think that the commitment to that from the beginning was really powerful. So would you kind of share the Trevor Project story and tell us how it's evolved and how you're serving today?

Absolutely. So so the the movie that Trevor actually came out in 1988. And the really interesting and sort of funny story around this is that the movie is incredibly empowering and powerful, right, I think is one of the first times a gay, a gay young person was exploring suicide ideation in such a public way, and it became quite big. And HBO bought the rights to the movies, because they wanted to air it as widely as possible. When it came time to airing the movie, the producers of the movie said that we can't hear this movie until we know that there's a resource at the end of it, because now we're reaching a much wider audience. And this movie may be triggering to people, but also may inspire people to call somebody and talk to them. And we need to make sure that they have somebody to talk to. So they went out looking for an organization that existed, so that they could have a number at the end of it and found that there was no organization at the time for LGBTQ people that that they could reference so they asked HBO to pause airing of the movie and said, why don't we start an organization before we go this movie, and we can launch the organization when we hear this will be on HBO. So a short while later, Ellen DeGeneres introduced the movie on HBO. And after the movie aired at the end of it, they said, if you are in need of help, call the Trevor Project. And here's the phone number and that number. For the first time, we started getting calls that very night, and the calls haven't really stopped since a call on is the longest active line we've had on our service. But since then, of course, we've expanded our work significantly. Now we have a crisis intervention services 24. Seven, that is free, it is confidential. It's available over phone, text, and chat. So young people can reach out to us through three different ways when they need support. That sort of core service right, then we, about 10 years ago, we started to look at what are the other things that we need to start doing because part of the work is of course, making sure people are supported in their moment of crisis. But the other part is making sure that people don't enter a crisis in the first place. So we started looking at what is the ecosystem of suicidal suicide prevention that we need to be working on. So we invested in various programs are one of one of those programs is advocacy program, which is helping to make sure that there are laws and policies that are not harmful to young people, and to make sure that we're passing laws and policies that are supporting safe and, and affirming environments to LGBTQ young people everywhere. So one of the things that we work on is conversion therapy. For those of you don't know conversion therapy is a discredited practice that aims to change a person's gender or sexual orientation, using pain or shame, or any number of discredited practices. This is done often by licensed therapists in states where it is still illegal to provide this sort of therapy, it is not banned. So the Trevor Project has been working to ban this practice around the country so far, 20 states have banned it, but they're still 30 states that that have not banned it. So we still have a long way to go. But Trevor Project is one of the organizations that is leading this effort. Aside from this, we do lots of other work at the local and national level to make sure that their policies are not harming LGBTQ young people, specifically. Our education programs, help to train adults and youth serving allies to be better equipped with language to support LGBTQ young people, particularly thinking about suicide and empathy. And how do you support somebody in a crisis? Most people think that, you know, they know how to respond to somebody when they say that I'm cutting myself or you know, I don't like to get up in the morning or I'm feeling really depressed or I've stopped eating, or you know, I'm harming myself in X y&z ways or I'm taking a lot of drugs, whatever it may be. These are things that young people sometimes say to people that they trust, and they really need to have somebody in their life that that they feel they can have a safe space with. So our trainings actually provide that those tools for adults to be able to Be that safe person in their life. Our research, for example, has found that having one supportive adult actually decreases the person's chance of suicide by 40%.

Oh my gosh.

Which is incredible, right? Yeah. So. So knowing that stat, it is so important for us to make sure that young people actually don't come to us, if they want to come to us, they absolutely can. But they should have somebody in their life that one supportive person that they can go to. So our education programs help to create that one person in their lives. We also have a social media platform called Trevor space. This is the only global platform that allows LGBTQ young people to find their community. We are growing this program rapidly because through COVID, people were young people were pulled away from their safe environments in school and work from their friends from their mentors, and coaches and teachers. So Trevor space became one of those places that people turn to, because it is a place that is incredibly affirming. It is malware moderated by by Trevor staff, and volunteers. So we have a no hate, no hate speech policy, like like all the other ones, but we really, really, really enforce it, where if anybody use it any hateful language, they're banned immediately. And they're not allowed to be there. It is also a place where we share a lot of crisis intervention resources. So if somebody's sharing something that's really painful and personal, and somebody's having a really vulnerable conversation, we want people to have those conversations there. But we also want them to know that there's support for them. Oftentimes, we'll share a crisis services number for them to reach out to we'll share other resources on that site that people can reach out to. What's interesting about this program is that is a global program. So we have members from literally every country in the world. So when you think about countries, we're still illegal to be queer, where there are laws that criminalize your queer identity, which means that they probably do not any organizations that they can go to the couple who don't have a GSA, sometimes the websites that are that are for LGBTQ people are banned in those countries, terrorist space is not bad. Right? So traverse, which is accessible to a lot of people. So people who go there to essentially for the first time, ask questions like, I think I may be gay, is that right? What does gaming mean? Well, because the first time a trans person may go to that, to that website and say, My name is Becky and not Michael. And everybody will say, Hi, Becky, how are you immediately, there's no questions about it. So for the first time, people are being seen as how they want to be seen and recognized and affirmed. So that's why the program is really, really important. We have a research program, which is growing every single year, the reason why research is incredibly important for this population is because first of all, research on LGBTQ people is very, very limited overall. Research on LGBT young people is significantly even more limited. But then when you look at intersectionalities of LGBT young people and, and and, and black LGBT young people or LGBT young people from urban or suburban environments, or LGBT young people who are from immigrant environments, those that research doesn't exist, and in a very diverse young population, we need to make sure we understand what's happening in the daily lives of young people so that our programs reflect their reality. Every year released our national survey on LGBTQ mental health. That releases unique data that allows us to further the conversation on LGBTQ mental health for a variety of interesting intersecting identities. This helps us make sure that we are top of mind for reporters for researchers, for their organizations, but also for our own programs, our own programmatic strategic needs so that we are serving young people in the way that they deserve to be served.

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I mean, wow. There's so many things I want to say about this. One, I am in awe of the fact that a story inspired a nonprofit, and the nonprofit has served so many people who felt unseen completely not affirmed and were scared to death. That started with a story I am, I am so in awe of the fact that you did tie your action to this story and you understood the ripple that it would create. And I just think the impact is limitless. So that's amazing. But I think I want to pivot a little bit and kind of get into this value based fundraising and partnerships. So your team is really focusing on building this impact centered partnerships that are long term, and they're with the largest companies and the foundations in the world. And I want to just share your wisdom around partnership building, because we think this is a new way that nonprofits need to look at fundraising, it's no longer about going and soliciting, and saying, Would you give me you know, a gift for this, it's more about we have a dream and a vision, do you want to lock arms with us and be in partnership. And so I would love to hear what your thoughts are on approaching that and how our nonprofit listeners could adapt some of these principles that have clearly you've had such incredible success with,

I think the first thing is to look at companies as partners, and not just donors. And I think the nonprofit ecosystem has positioned companies, rightfully so for many years, because that's kind of what the business model was, which is, we're going to give you some money, we're going to, we're going to take your logo, we're gonna talk about you in a tour args and also put it up, put it on your website, that we are good social citizens. Now, because of pressures from consumers, pressures from employees pressures from just our culture, companies are being held to a much higher standard to actually show their authentic commitment to issues that they say they care about. Right? The the conversation on authenticity has gotten bigger and deeper over the years, that puts nonprofits at a much much, much, much powerful table to have have this have this discussion on because we now control not only the impact that a company can see that it created, we also control the way that they can say that it created it, but also who they work with to create it. Right? That's a lot of power, that nonprofits have to be able to walk to the table and say, we can give you all of this, if you lock arms with us and become partners with us. And companies understand the value of there's enough data and research out there that talks about how much consumers want transparency in their giving, but also how much consumers are looking into the organizations that are giving to so there's there's a lot of research that shows that there's there's a business benefit to supporting nonprofits in an authentic and a deep way. But also there's a very real employee benefit as well, right employees who happen to hold that entities that are connected organizations that they give, then companies can say that, hey, we really care about LGBTQ employees, because look at how much we're investing in the Trevor Project. And if these employees also want to invest in the charter project, we have ways that you can support this organization because we are so close partners with them. Now, if that company only gives $50,000 a year, but never talk to us, the other, you know, let them out of the year, we will not be able to build out any programs with employees to work with us. But when companies come to us and say we want to do this, this and this, which includes employee engagement, which includes cause marketing program, which includes some sort of a panel or a conference, which includes having the leaders talk about our mission in their in their, in their monthly or weekly meetings, there's all the ways that we can work with a company to really combine our brand identities and say that our values are aligned. Once you start from that perspective, from a partnership perspective, then the rest of the conversation is about execution. And I think that nonprofits are a little afraid to ask for those things. So that's why I always say come from a place of power, know how much power we have in today's world as an organization that is literally creating impact. And we can say you can create this impact with us and be able to own the story with us.

Okay, remember when we said Munir is the most evolved? Oh, my gosh,

the power shift dynamic is fascinating.

Well, I see like three core cogs that I think everybody could implement of what you're saying, and one is that you're seeing past the company to people. And that realization is huge, because there's people that may be giving to you or they could give to you. And that's a disruptive way to look at this. The second thing that I've pinned down, is that you have something to offer. You know, I just think that's a powerful thing. You've created this report, because it does a lot of powerful things for you. But I just think walking into a boardroom with the C suite, having data is only going to help close some of these deals. And I think I combined my two and my three but there you have it, manure, I mean, it's just thinking of thinking of not the old school way of partnering of Kumbaya table at our event, to let's align on values and how this can help push your company in a much deeper way and allow us to accomplish so much more as an organization to like it's a win win. It's not once bad once good. It's coming together and it's a powerful

And one thing I would add to that is value is is is a very broad and vague term, right? I think it's really important for nonprofits to really understand what their value is. And oftentimes one thing that's forgotten in that value conversation is expertise. Right? This company's core business model is not your social impact organization, it's not your mission, their expert on selling lipstick, they're expert on selling clothes. They're an expert on building airplanes. They're not an expert on ending suicide, they're not an expert on ending climate change, or they're not an expert at ending homelessness. They're not an expert expert on providing shelter. So when we walk into that room, and they need some supportive and find how do they combine their business goals with our goals, they need our expertise to do that work, right. So when companies can work with us to to engage their employees on LGBTQ youth mental health, we can say we have expertise not only on how to create ally, ship, and adult so they can support LGBTQ young people. But because we understand the LGBT young person's mind and the daily lives, we can actually give you strategic guidance on a number of different things that you're working on, where you're trying to reach this audience, right, then we become a business partner with them, rather than just a social impact partner. So there's so many companies that we've started with working with, for one campaign or two campaigns for a couple of weeks to a month, we're now working with as a year round, because they don't see us as something that like, Oh, we have $100,000 left over at the end of the year. So we're going to give it to you, they see as they see us as is January we're planning or annual expenses, we want to our budget to be part of this budget. That's where the mind should always go. And we can get there by clearly defining your value and the expertise that you can provide as a business partner to these organizations.

Okay, go back and rewind that, about two minutes, listen to it on repeat, and get that into your head, because that is some evolved thinking. And that is the way of the new partnership of nonprofit, I am so geeked out about this money, I do want you to be my friend, forever, you're such a good person.

We're talking about values in two lanes, it's like the values that are choosing your core ethos, but also the value you add to the company. And I think that is a very evolved way to think and the way that you're making these connections is is really second to none.

And I also think the opportunity to find rabid fans, we talk about rabid fans all the time within these corporations employees is it is a next level pro tip. Because there are certainly people within these organizations who are going to align with your values, they are going to be so jazzed that you have partnered up, we need to provide opportunities for them to pour into the mission. And it doesn't just have to be a financial gift for them. How can they give their time, their testimony, you know, their service in some way. And so I think that that would be a second layer that you could add to this kortner partnership. And I think businesses would jump at that at opportunities to make their employees feel like they're pouring into the things that they're passionate about at work. That's awesome.

Munir? I know you believe this and hearing your story. Philanthropy has a special sauce power, you know, it has the ability to transform people that you're, you know, trying to impact in the world, but also, at the donor level at the act of giving itself is so transformational. Is there a personal story you'd be willing to share of how you've seen philanthropy, you know, really changed something and stick with you.

One moment that really sticks out for me as, as something that truly inspired me, and truly reminds me of why I really love this work is was last pride. So pride of 2020 for those of you don't have pride is a huge, huge, huge fundraising moment for the Trevor Project for literally every LGBT organization. This is where we raise nearly 30 40% of our corporate goal, corporate revenue goal for the year. So it's massive, we start planning pride six to eight months in advance and priority planning prior 2022 right now. So we've been planning about 60, a little over 60 partnerships, starting in 2019. So the day before our partnerships are supposed to launch, which was on a Monday. That's Sunday, before that Monday, the Black Lives Matter protests broke out around the country. And I remember thinking this is incredibly powerful moment for a country that this is happening in at this scale. It is about time. This has been happening for a long time. And finally it was happening with this level of passion and motivation and power. That it felt very uncomfortable for me to know that there are going to be all these happy, joyous, colorful Salvatore campaigns launching the next day with 60 plus of our corporate partners, right lots of things. One says lots of positivity, it felt just misaligned from our values as an organization. So I emailed our team and I said, we need to figure out a way to to pause our campaigns, because we can't, we literally cannot show up. The day after this massive protest for racial justice is happening, and then say, you know, here's an entire population that is celebrating something that, that that, you know, not everybody can join in on. So when we look at Black LGBTQ youth, what are they going to think about when they see these campaigns launch? Like, will they feel good about this, they probably won't. Because they're in pain, they're angry, right. And we're also angry with them as allies. So our team, our entire team got together and said, we're going to make a values based decision and pause all our campaigns. So we email them and share with them that we're going to pause our campaigns and inform them that they don't have to pause our campaigns, but we suggested that it's actually in their best interest to not run any campaigns right now, because it will not look good. And also the right thing to do is to give space to the black community, to really, really take advantage of the moment that they're having in our culture, by launching the celebrity studded campaigns by taking over digital ad spaces by taking over social media accounts. By having all these videos launch and having all of this marketing go out. At the same time, we're taking the digital space away from a movement that has been begging for their time in the moment for so long. And we just we sent that email out. And I was very, very surprised that literally every partner came back and said, Absolutely, completely understand. We're not going to launch or campaigns, we're pulling everything from the market right now anything that we can pull pulling in. So pretty much every single major partner said, we're not going to do this. And that was such a beautiful feeling to have, knowing that these are companies right come to the big companies who really understood what we were saying. And it was a whole team of surprise. And we're so inspired by the the commitment that all of us had the values that all of us have. But this was the right moment for us to pause and give the stage to a community that really, really needs it in this moment. So we paused it for three weeks to and after three weeks. We also during this time, worked closely with our partners, because they said it actually doesn't feel good for us to launch a campaign at all, can you advise us on how to change this so that it can be a little bit more responsive to the current tone of the country? It was absolutely so a couple of our bigger biggest partners, they literally pulled all the work that we do in the past six months, and came out with a very new campaign that was acknowledging what's been happening in the country, while also celebrating pride at the same time. So there was a lot of Congress's conversation about intersectionality partners who said to us, hey, we want to donate money to a black racial justice organization, can we do that? And like you can absolutely do that. And they said, We don't have the budget for it, can we take some money out of your pocket and do that? He said, Absolutely. That's the right thing to do, please do so. Right. But ultimately, they ended up finding money to like, give us, you know, give us what we were expecting to get, but also give money to other organ organizations. So there were so many of those little moments where organizations just came out and said, We want to do the right thing. How do we do it, please support us, please guide us. And and we connected with people that are activists with other organizations. And it was truly a movement making moment where we all knew we were in this together, and they were not competing interests that were that we were trying to negotiate when it was an easy process to get people to pause, give space, respect the space, and then also acknowledge that we have some work to do, and then really committed that work together.

Munir? Do you remember early in this conversation, I said, My heart was shattered. You just like put it back together with that story. I want to say something about that. Because I think sometimes nonprofits struggle in pivot, we move so slowly, you know, we have to run things up and down the chain. But this is the difference between empathy based leadership. And you've said this phrase many times in the story, and I'm glad that you did, because I want it reinforced, it was the right thing to do. And when you understand what your values are, and you understand the weight of pain, you move into spaces where you can eliminate that at any level. And I love that you saw this moment was bigger than your moment. And you understood that if the roles were reversed, you would want black lives matter to pour into pride if it were the same movement. And I love the ally ship of this and I love the way it it. It it created a self awareness in everyone about what is important and how do we pivot slightly. How do we we're not going to be tone deaf in this moment. So thank you so much for sharing that story. It is a case study and beautiful, beautiful way to to shift just a little bit. And I can tell you people notice those shifts. They appreciate those shifts and it makes you a more trusted organization. And it ties back to they are someone who truly live their values, no matter what is going on in the world,

or movements are connected. They're not separate from each other. And what I mean by that is when when we were having conversations about what is our what is what is our role in this moment in time when Black Lives Matter movement is, is having has the attention of the country and of the people. And what is the history of pride. There's a deep connection there, right? pride was started by trans women, trans women of color, particularly one of whom was black, who was fighting against police riots, right, it was fighting against police raids in gay bars. So it was was fighting against the violence that they were daily inflicted on because they were queer. So when you think about the similarities between the things that black people are fighting against in this country, and the things that LGBT people have been fighting for a long time as well, they're the same thing. So for us to say that we're different than them would mean that we don't understand our history at all. So a lot of the conversation was around by us actually taking a moment, to to, to pause and to step aside, we are actually working together in this move in this movement for all of us, right? We're all against violence. We're all against unnecessary police surveillance and violence against our communities, and particularly the people who have been most marginalized, particularly people who don't have as many resources and have historically been oppressed in significant ways. So, for us, it was very easy to say, Hey, we're literally just going back to our history by saying we're going to go March and the Black Lives Matter parade. You know, and not our pride parade, because it's the same thing in many ways we're fighting against the same injustice is created by the system. And I think that realization helped also our companies and or partners to just see their role in this movement, as we're not just pausing pride, because we don't care about Black Lives Matter. We're causing pride, because now we can pay attention to another movement that also deserves attention and resources, share

your space, it's just like kindergarten folks. We want to all play in the sandbox together. And so I love that point very much. And those values Oh, it's fantastic. And you know, this is Mental Health Week on the podcast, and I just think this past year has been incredibly difficult for so many, but we know that lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, queer and questioning youth have faced all these unique challenges. What can you tell us today about what we need to know about their struggle and how we can help them?

Yeah, LGBTQ youth are suffering on a daily basis, right? We know this is a fact they, lesbian, gay, bisexual youth are four times more likely to consider suicide on their street peers, nearly half of all trans and non binary people have attempted suicide in their lives, many of them before the age of 25. When we think about the the amount of stress that LGBTQ youth who have multiple identities face on a daily basis, is significantly more than white LGBTQ youth. Right. So all the all the experience that people are having are, are creating an environment where the mental health is challenged on a daily basis, but little under half of LGBT youth told us that they want mental health care, but they can't access it. Right, which is, which is incredibly sad when people are people know they need help. They know they want to get help, but they can't get it. So this is what Trevor Project is so important, because we are at the end of it when people are feeling like they have no other option. They come to the Trevor Project, when people feel like they can't go anywhere else they come to the to the Trevor Project. So the first piece of advice is if there's somebody in your life that is struggling with with mental health, and they happen to be an LGBTQ young person, please send them to the Trevor Project, we will, we will talk to them, we'll listen to them, we'll be there for them, we'll be non judgmental, we will care for them, we will help them create a plan of action that is safe and affirming for them. Second thing is you know, learn more about how to support LGBTQ young people learn more about how to be empathetic. One thing about empathy is that you don't solve problems for another person. You listen you understand their feelings, you create space for them to share as much of their feelings as possible. But you don't problem solve until they ask you to write and put is really about understanding a person's perspective and their and their reality. So I think a lot of people need to need a little bit of help in that I certainly did when I started at the Trevor Project, I didn't know that I was being empathetic when I was like well maybe you should get up and like, you know, go to the gym in the morning or like you know, yeah, I know you like cookies, I can get some cookies. You know, like those those things are not actually helpful in those moments. what's helpful is listening. And one last thing I'll say is that I think there is there's a need for kindness in this world, right? This sounds very cheesy, but I always say this, which is we need to do more things that make people feel validated, acknowledged, seen and affirmed, and particularly LGBTQ young people. One of the things Things that we often say on a crisis hotline is that you are loved and you're deserving of love, which is something that LGBTQ people have never heard in their life before. And that's a really, really sad reality. So you know, be cheesy, be vulnerable. Tell people that you love them to tell young people that they are that they matter or that they're perfect that the way they are. These are just daily, very easy things we can do to build a culture of support and of love and affirmation.

Thank you and veneer, I just really appreciate you sharing all that.

You've given us a lot of things to process through. I thank you for all the vulnerability you've shown us today. minear, we ask all of our guests this kind of a closing question. What's your one good thing? What's something that people get implement today? From your perspective,

do not be afraid to exercise the power your seat at the table gives you I was afraid for too long to see the things that I was feeling. Because I thought my voice didn't matter. Or somebody wrote somebody else's voice was more important, or experience was more valid than mine. But the more I understood my own story, the more I understood that what I needed to say nobody else was saying. And the more I regretted not saying something that I wanted to say, I realized that the more of my voice does matter, in that I need to speak up, I need to share my perspective because as a person who holds intersecting identities, I have a unique voice in in conversations that I'm in. And I think people actually want to hear my voice. So there's a way to do it with an honest with honesty with directness, but also kindness. And so far, I found that, that me speaking up and saying what I needed to say, has led to some really meaningful conversations and allowed me to live more authentically myself. And you know, sleeping better at night to when I know that I've said what I want to say.

Amen. And if I could add one more, one good thing. If you are someone right now that wants to that wants to pour into this, please learn more, please look for resources, we're going to link up the Trevor film into the show notes, we're going to link up to this survey, go look at this data, get informed and if you do nothing else, find a young part be that one supportive person, for a young person, if to the back to the stat we can decrease a chance of suicide and a young person by 40% by being somebodies person by being supportive. Everyone in life deserves to have a future and feel like their life matters. You can do that for someone be like Thank you, Munir.

It's been amazing. Yep, we

positively love you. We love the Trevor Project. I'm so glad you're in the world. And I hope that this conversation really creates some self reflection. And not even just that, but action in people. So thank you for your time.

Thank you, Becky. Thank you, Jonathan. This this is a wonderful conversation. So thanks for the opportunity to share my story and share a little bit about the Trevor Project.

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