Housing and Human Services Advisory Board Meeting - February 11, 2021
4:49PM Feb 19, 2021
Speakers:
Keywords:
agencies
karen
brian
liberto
funding
people
fund
program
questions
boulder county
city
folks
pandemic
assessment
meeting
board
suggestion
data
organizations
talk
All right,
I think we are ready to get started. So we'll call the meeting to order. The first item on our agenda is public invited to be heard. I don't see anyone here, but I want to check to see if we're expecting any.
So Nicole indicated that no one contacted her to attend and be heard.
Okay. Okay. Thank you. Yes.
So the next item on our agenda is to approve the minutes from our last meeting on January 14.
Do I have a motion to do so?
And Karen Phillips seconds. Okay.
Any discussion? Okay.
All those in favor of approving the minutes as presented in the packet from our January 14 meeting? Please raise your hand. Okay,
that is unanimous. Okay, um,
the next item is around the electronic participation policy during the city of Longmont board and commission meetings, is there. Is there any information other than what is in the packet? Karen?
So, no. So
what you do have in the packet is because obviously, we've been having electronic meetings, for, what, 10 months now nine months and so. So this is really just to go back and to and to basically all the advisory boards for the city have been asked to review and adopt this policy that makes how we are meeting during the emergency.
Proper,
I guess so. So that we had the two pager policy that was in your packet, and be glad to try to answer any questions that you might have. And if everything is okay, if we continue to meet electronically, according to these guidelines, then it'd be great to have a motion to approve that.
Did anyone have any questions or want to talk about this policy? for electronic participation?
Graham,
do we think that there's
been a reduction in participation because of access, you know, electronic board meetings occurring? And? I mean, since I've been on the board, no public has been heard. You know, maybe once, I'm just wondering if electronic means has reduced access?
You know, what I would say is, yeah, we usually haven't had a large following for, you know, for our particular advisory board meetings. And but I would say, it's not, it's not optimum, actually, you know, for for some to be able to, you know, call in, like, for council meetings. I mean, we still have maybe 510, sometimes 20, we've even had when it was open forum, we had, I don't know, 30 or 40 people. So I think probably for some, it's, it's, it's deterred others, it's more convenient to not have to go down and show up at, you know, to a meeting so. So I would say, probably, for us, it hasn't made much of a difference, but maybe for some of the other boards, and certainly for city council. It's kind of hard for, to kind of do public hearings and have the conversations like they've had in the past would be, you know, my observation. I think we're really and I think many of us are ready to get back into, you know, having real live meetings, but but that's not happening yet. So I don't know if that answered your question, but that's, that's my best guess.
Yeah, that did I was just kind of curious if a trigger should be established for going back to in person.
I think that will be that will be based on the, you know, on the public health, the the dial, and so when, when we can go back to, I imagine it's when we get back to the green dial and you know, so We are at yellow. So we have. So I would say it's really what what happens with CDP Ag and the public health orders is when it will trigger us going back to in person meetings.
Other questions or anything related to this? I had one, the last section says that the city will provide reasonable accommodations, and we'll waive anything here for anyone with disabilities. I don't know, if you if you know, because I'm sort of curious of whether there are folks who are engaged right now, while it's while they're able to attend electronically, who might not otherwise be able to attend in person, sort of what the whether there's going to be a clear policy around like how to request those accommodations going forward. So I can imagine that there are some folks for whom this is actually more amenable, you know, on balance, maybe we get more people who show up in person, but we do we get different folks, for example.
I don't know if you know what, that you're muted, Karen.
There's too many things.
So I was just making a note that, so like for the council meeting agenda. So you know, it does have language, I'm pretty sure it has language that if you know, if members of the public require some kind of accommodation in order to participate in the meeting, then there is there's a person to call a staff member to call, which I think is probably the the city clerk. So So certainly, it is something we'd, you know, we don't have that on our agenda. And that is certainly something that we can add, it is on the council agenda, I'm pretty sure this is if you need accommodation to be able to participate, then and call the clerk's office and we'll make that accommodation.
I'd love to see us included specifically in up to and including participation electronically. For hours, even when we're meeting in person, I think that making sure that people know that that may still be an option, particularly if we've got folks with health issues that want to come. I think that would be great to make explicit that that that of what those can look like. Yeah.
So we can add that to the agenda for sure.
If there aren't any other questions or comments, I don't think I saw anyone else with any we have a motion to adopt this policy.
So moved.
Okay, move by Madeline Do we have a second?
Chiquita is our frickin Okay.
All those in favor of adopting the electronic participation policy? Please raise your hand.
Okay, unanimous.
Great.
All right. The next item on our agenda is downpayment assistance program updates. That is Molly. Maybe
it is Molly, I was just going to remind everyone, especially new members. In case you don't remember that this board does also oversee a couple of programs that we operate the downpayment assistance program, the rehab program, and there are policies and procedures around those that we are required to have advisory board input and approval of so that is why you're seeing this one tonight. They are usually pretty few and far between. So not often, so that's why I just wanted to do a reminder. So Molly's gonna walk us through this particular one, and either one of us will answer questions, but probably mostly, Molly.
Alright, so for the downpayment assistance program, we it's federally funded with home dollars that we've received from the state division of housing. And so the state puts out guidelines and every few years they update them or revise them. So they recently put out new updated guidelines. And so we are aligning our policies to with their updated guidelines. Some of it is just administrative, and some are some different changes, some bigger changes. I think the biggest one is is that they've increased the amount of money that we are allowed to lend for downpayment assistance. Since it had been set at 8.5% of the purchase price, and it's now, they now allow you to go up to 10% of the purchase price, which we are recommending doing and then capping it at a maximum of $40,000 that someone could receive for a downpayment assistance loan. I think the other major one or one that's a lot different from our regular or how we have been operating is that now the deferred loans are set at 0% interest, so that someone will just receive whatever loan amount and that's what they will be paid when they sell or refinance. And then I think the one other thing is in terms of the amount of funding, so it is approved to go up to 40,000 or 10% of the purchase price, we are recommending changing the length of time in which someone would repay the loan. Currently, the loan is repaid over 10 years at a 3% interest rate. So we've broken it down, that the repayment amount will be based on or the repayment term will be based on the amount of the loan. So that will spread out the payments over a longer period of time if folks get a larger loan, but the payment amount will be less. So hopefully that would be more affordable for people receiving the loan. So those were the I think the main ones, I didn't know if anyone had questions on any of the the updates or if you wanted me to go through each one and talk about them.
Deana I wasn't sure. Was there a cap before I couldn't see that there was a cap in there before maybe I just missed it. I know you're proposing a new cap of 40. I
just wasn't sure if there wasn't a one before.
So we didn't have a cap before it was 8.5% of the purchase price. However, the the program home dollars do cap they the amount of the purchase price each year. So it would essentially be 8.5% of the purchase price up to whatever that maximum purchase price is. So for this year, it's it's 411 $411,000 is the maximum purchase price. Okay, so
the cap is pretty consistent with what you were doing before. Right. Okay.
Thank you.
So you think
Kimberly may have had a question?
Yeah, actually have two questions. Um, I was wondering if the funds are typically exhausted every year or if there's remaining funds at the end of the year? How popular is the program? Well, we haven't made alone in a few years. So there there are funds available. I don't think since I've been here that funds I've ever run out. We used to do more loans. These days, I think it's still hard for people even with the downpayment assistance to find a home that they can afford. So we do have available. I was just wondering, because if it if it is exhausted every year, I was just curious if there's any kind of tiered system a sliding scale of what is offered based off of income and the number of people in the household so that the same amount isn't going to every applicant regardless of their need, as long as they meet that eligibility requirement. Yeah, so I shouldn't say that the maximum would be up to 10%. But it is based on need. So all of the borrowers will meet with a housing counselor to do a budget review and look at their loan. So you're not just guaranteed to get 10%. So folks will not not everyone will be getting 10% it will be based on each households individual situation and the underwriting to make sure it's not over over subsidizing them
with the downpayment. Grant Graham,
so if the program isn't, you know, terribly popular, why make the requirements more restrictive? You know, like I see, it excludes properties in the city of Boulder, excluding properties in the floodplain, which is a new addition. You're asking people to spend down their assets to 25%. And what was the other thing that seemed it just seems like you're tightening the perimeter? I mean, which may be fine. I mean, those all seem like smart things. But I guess if it's not being used, then why not reduce the boundaries to make it more accessible?
So the programs never operated in the city of Boulder City of Boulder has its own downpayment assistance program that Specifically for boulder given their their housing markets, spending down the assets was a state change. So the state has implemented that they also implemented the flood plain restrictions. So previously, we did make loans to folks in the 100 year flood plain as long as they received or purchase flood insurance. So that's all a state a state issue. I will say regarding the assets. I don't given the people or the buyers we've had in previous years. I don't foresee that being a huge issue. It would be if they had that chunk of money in their savings account, which most people do not they have they do have retirement accounts, which are exempted. So I'm right now, I don't think that it would be a big issue. But of course,
yet to be seen.
Thank you. That makes sense.
And Molly,
I think that that part about spending down assets, it's actually liquid assets, right? So things like vehicles or things like that would not would also be excluded because they're not liquid, like cash in a savings account. Do you know if that's true? Yes. So
we've never counted cars or jewelry or anything like that. So yes, just liquid accounts.
Other
questions?
Okay.
It sounds like, folks had some questions, but not necessarily changes to this. I want to confirm the folks don't have any things that they would want to see changed on here. Okay, seeing none, it looks like Do we have a motion to approve these changes as it as presented?
So move.
Okay, Brian, and then a second.
Deanna?
Okay. All those in favor of approving these changes, please raise your hand. Okay. Looks like Karen. That's everybody except for Madeline, who is not present for the vote? Oh, there she is. And she's saying yes.
We've got the finger.
Okay. All right.
Our next item on the agenda is the 2021 work plan, review and approval. Set liberto Is that you? Are is that?
I think all of us have a piece of this. Okay. I know Kathy has pieces as well. Okay. So I'm not sure. Karen, how you want us to? How you want us to proceed?
I think it's in your packet. And and so you know, maybe what if you have questions that you would like us, either Roberto or Kathy arrived to, to answer or to clarify, or you if you have other, you know, suggestions. So, you know, so we tried to update this based on it has a combination of things that typically happen, you know, every year. And then also, you know, some of the ideas that the advisory board suggested and brought forward. So we tried to incorporate those. And you might have other ideas and some suggestions about what to what to include on the work plan. So this really is our, you know, our roadmap for what we placed on the agenda for the coming year. It's It's not hard and fast that you can change it, but it just helps us to, to have a basic roadmap and and we certainly make modifications along the way, whenever we, we need to so so I think really, you know, Caitlin, it's a, it's a conversation if you want to facilitate about any questions or additions that the advisory board members would would like to make.
Yeah, absolutely. Um, and as Karen said, we, you know, we certainly have adjusted this. I think last year we had a couple of additional meetings that we added to the calendar to address some things that came up in meetings in the business section. This is not meant to say like this is the only things we ever talked about, but it does give us a sense of what's to come. So that we can make sure that we tackle all the things that we need to. Does anyone have questions or see that there are things that maybe you're not included on the work plan that you'd like to see us cover this year?
Yes, Brian.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to say I really like the work plan. And I'm particularly excited about the training opportunities in here. I feel like this is an ongoing develop a piece of piece of development that is ongoing as our training and our you know, learning to become better board members. So I think it's great. The the I noticed in April, is when we get into the question about city budget process and potentially increased fundings increased funding. And I wonder if there are any opportunities around that to have somebody talk to us about public funding mechanisms or, you know, like, what's it take tissue tax to suggest a tax that would, for instance, increase funding or bonding, or I know very little about public financing. So maybe there's some information we would benefit from, or at least I know, I would. Yep.
Councilwoman Christiansen
I think this is a great work plan. I also think, given that the city is and how, for some time going to be the Longmont Housing Authority. I think it might be useful for this body to understand or for an hour to discuss the relationship between how housing and Human Services and my man housing authority and all the stuff that's gone on, because cat, Cara and Kathy are. And Molly and everybody else in the city has now taken on an additional job. But I think that there are possibilities for how we can work more effectively. And that can include discussion of funding mechanisms, because, well, of course, we can't. There are limits, we can't blend the two. Exactly. So anyway, it would be helpful, I think, for Karen and Kathy to discuss what kind of relationship we're going to have.
So if I can clarify that, so I'm, Am I understanding that, that for sure. We want to include some updates, you know, along the way. And, and and where there are opportunities for, you know, partnerships, and funding opportunities and development opportunities. Is that kind of what you're saying, Polly? Okay. Yeah. So we can add that for sure.
Deanna,
so I'm not sure if this is the right time to insert this discussion, but I'm going to do it anyway. So I don't know if we should talk about the schedule for site visits, given the pandemic and whether or not we want to try and schedule more site visits later in the year in the hopes that we will actually be able to go see these places. I mean, it's nice to be able to do them. So easy to step into my room and do them, you know, over zoom, but I kind of really miss being in the actual physical location. And I feel like that gives you an extra depth of knowledge of the actual site that you don't necessarily get over zoom. So that said, I know, the end of the year is also really crazy for our board, and we're really busy. So I'm not sure if I'm, if that's a good idea or not either. So I just thought I would toss it out for some discussion. Maybe.
I was also gonna say one of the things I think we talked about, maybe last month, I actually am blanking on when it was, was around the idea of also hearing from folks who are served by some of these agencies. And so I wonder if like, you know, if that could fit into how we do site visits, you know, when we're talking about an agency or visiting one maybe, you know, we also have an opportunity to somehow connect with folks who are served by the agency and not just hear from the agency itself,
which I think is useful, but
I feel like there's a missing voice in some of those conversations.
So Caitlin, can I comment on that? So Ellie Berto, and I did talk about that? You know, that suggestion? And it, I'll say is it's tricky. So, so because many of the participants who are served by agencies, there are confidentiality issues. And, you know, and then I think we're just trying to be mindful of it might be great information for us to have, we might be interested in knowing, but the recipient of the service might not think that's a great idea. So, so. So I think we just have to figure that out or have some discussions about that
are,
how do we get that input? And, and obviously, understanding there'll be confidentiality issues, and just being respectful of, you know, folks, rights to some kind of privacy, even though it's not confidentiality, if you know what I mean. So it's just we're not sure how to do that. But But certainly, we'll have a, we'll have a conversation about how we could accomplish that.
Graham,
would it be appropriate to request copies of surveys that those organizations solicit?
Yeah, I think we, we did chat about that. So you know, to find out if a the agencies do any kind of customer satisfaction survey, how we might get a hold of that data. So we were just kind of brainstorming what what are all the different ways, and that was that was certainly one of them, that I think could be possible?
Um, Karen Phillips,
I would think you'd be able to ask the organizations to see if any participant would be willing to, you know, talk about it, because I'm sure some people would be willing to do that. And they could ask their clientele, if they'd be interested. That could be a possibility. And that way, they're, you know, they're not worried about their confidentiality of it.
So I'm not sure if we're getting into item seven. So So yeah, I, I think this is good conversation. And I have some things to add. But I'm wondering if I should wait till we get to seven finished the work plan piece.
Thanks for pointing that out. liberto.
All right. No, that's okay.
Are there other things that folks either don't see or would like to dig into more that we don't currently have on the work plan?
Do we need to formally approve this plan?
I believe so. Yes. Okay. I think it's on here.
We've got a.
So in May, we've got something on the collaborative model and response to the pandemic. One of the things that we talked about it, when we were doing our actual funding round, was wanting to talk further ahead of time this year about what how we were gonna do the matrix of it, to try to address some of the things that we felt like we saw after we approved the funding. So I think it's sort of woven in here a little bit. But I think that that's something that we should make sure we so
Ellie, better. Can you clarify where we were we were replaced that and what we called it? Is it? It's
because we are i think i think it's a couple of pieces? Yeah, I would say it's a couple of pieces. Madam Chair, Caitlin. I think one is is part of the conversation tonight on the discussing because because all these feed into the matrix and into into our funding model. So there's there's a couple of points in this work plan that address what you're talking about. So for example, tonight, we're going to talk about how to further explore data from the needs assessment as we prepare for the 2022 funding process. That's going to be done again, and in April. We're going to talk about the such those suggestions. So the funder collaborative model is a is a really about we're going to present About enlisted by mannequin, that'd be enough. If you think you know different, it's really sharing out with this board. How the Boulder County funded Clara was Karen and I are a part of and so is the city of Boulder in Boulder County responded to the, to the pandemic and how we created, you know, funding priorities for the immediate response. And then we have we've tracked and continued to monitor different needs in the community around funding. And it might, it might give us some ideas for how to address the future. You know, disasters for lack of a better word. And then in June, I think it's really where we start getting into that conversation. It's it's, when we talk about what we've learned from the value from the data that we've gotten, how are we decided today to look at that data? And how do we how does that affect our funding matrix, our activity weighted activities, all of that, that pieces that make up what our funding matrix is?
as well as in August, I believe le Berto there's determined funding allocation approach in August with capture requests and distribution percentage, right?
So yeah, in August, we then we then take what we've learned, and flesh it out into what how we're actually going to do the allocation pieces. But these next few months are really key. And how we, how we decide as we talk through this data piece, how we want to do is is really key to help us on the weighted side. So so just yeah, that's how that's gonna work.
If I may make a suggestion that would help someone like me, who doesn't remember much of anything, you because the that conversation is spread out over a number of months, if we can ensure that it's some of those decision points are really captured in the minutes. It'll be great to be able to go back and refer to those as the model as these pieces are kind of developed. Thank you. Madam Chair, I'd like to move that we approve the work plan as presented. Okay.
Do we have a second? Second. Okay.
Graham has seconded. All those in favor, please raise your hand.
Okay, looks like we are unanimous. So that work plan has been
approved.
So the next item is the site visit schedule and process for 2021, which we touched on a little bit with the work plan. But we'll open up the conversation if there are questions or other suggestions for the site visit process. We had one suggestion of maybe trying to move those toward later in the year so that we can actually be on site. With those it looks like we've got eight. So there's, it looks like eight previous and then two new funded agencies. So 10 total. And typically, we have one board member and one staff member, typically Eric liberto. I believe that will do the site visits. So we don't have to keep it that way. But I think we've done to two folks at some of the site visits, but it's typically been one. So are there other questions or comments about the site visit? process
that we want to talk about?
liberto though,
yeah. Karen, I've been thinking and talking about this. And one of the things that we talked about, we talked about several things. But one thing that we talked about is there was a when we were talking, I think last month about what folks want to hear about the work plan and there's this desire to know if agencies are doing best practices. And I'm wondering if we should so what we so we in 2019 we went one way in the pendulum of the site visit away from a very scripted site visit to much more relationship building and learning about the the agency. And I'm wondering do we want to swing just a little bit back and say we really want them to be able to provide us information on what type of best practice research or evidence based type of evaluation they're doing on their work. And so I just wanted to throw that out there for the board to consider.
Graham,
I think that's a great suggestion. liberto. And I think I'm reminded by something Brian reminded of something Brian suggested that maybe we go to the site visit with some historical data on, you know, what that agency may have scored in the past, and maybe the areas of improvement so we could really hone in on on a productive conversation. You know, what, did we fund them? What did they score low on, so that we can, you know, as a board seem less, maybe disjointed, but have a consistent message to the, to the entities about what would be helpful for the community that make that up, Brian, or did you make
it sounds familiar? I remember that this and i think i think that's a great idea to have some, some level of information that we would, you know, what, as well as around what programs specifically, I'd love to have us highlight what programs they've asked us to fund. Like to bring that with us rather than just the agency as a whole? What are the what are actually the things that they're asking us to support as the city? Because I think honing in on like, how does that align with that human service needs assessment, and where we put our funding priorities can be helpful for us to actually dig in a little bit to those programs. So, Brian, did you have something you wanted to add there?
I just wanted to add that first. If I didn't say it, I hope I did. Because it sounds really good. I like it. And I think there is a really good opportunity to have both a learning and potentially a little bit of a coaching session, if we know what areas they lacked in and can really understand why and what are the plans to improve those.
Kimberly,
I just wanted to go back to the best practices. And I know liberto. Last time, you mentioned that that was integrated into the application process. And I think that's a really important step to something to keep going forward. So you have that starting point for that discussion with the site.
So not not to wanting to add more work to myself, but I have an idea. So so maybe what I'll try and do is create, if this is the board's interesting, create kind of a one pager with the score for the agency, I'll go back and look at the application and copy and whatever the best practice was. And it'd be the program description for what they got funded that year. And then I'll send that to the board member that's going to be doing the doing the site visit with me.
I think that would be great. I, I'd love to suggest I love hearing people's off the cuff sort of presentation of it, I'd love to suggest that as board members that we maybe put together, you know sort of a a handful of bullet points that we think are important to share with the rest of the board about a given agency. So that we actually have something to look at as well that we could look back in the minutes or our pockets about an agency and their programs. Just to distill that would be really, really helpful if board members who do site visits are willing to do that rather than just just presenting at a meeting. I think sometimes we've gotten a little behind and by the time folks present, they maybe don't fully remember it and so maybe something you know, within you know, if we commit to seeing, you know, within two weeks of a site visit we put that together and share it with liberto and Karen to send out as part of the next meetings packet. That would be really helpful I think so that we don't lose the recency of it in terms of helpfulness
Great. I see some thumbs up and nodding there. So all right, Karen Roni, it looks like you have a hand raised, maybe
you're muted again.
And I muted. So. So I guess getting back to Diana's question about when do we want to hold site visits. So, we, a year or two ago, we decided to spread those out throughout the year. So we didn't, you know, have them clumped around the same time that we're doing application reviews. And, and if we want to do those ends in person, we we aren't doing those for a little while. So I just, I just did, I wanted to make sure we didn't lose, we didn't circle back and close that conversation about this the schedule for when we wanted to do these.
Kimberly,
I think in terms of considering site visits, it's really important to follow the dial, as Karen mentioned earlier, and also consider if the site is an essential business. Because we don't want to, you know, expose people at the site and vice versa, I noticed that there's a lot of essential businesses on that list. So taking that into consideration, and then other people's comfort level. And I'm just being really responsible, because I feel like we have to be good representatives of
this board. Yeah, I guess I didn't say much there, but just considering all those different factors.
Yes, Brian, you're muted.
Another factor that I think we can consider is, you know, some of these, these programs are placed based, like the dental aid, you know, there's facilities that are an integral part of their program, and others really are not play space to their,
you know, they
like going to the office May, we may not really learn much like going to bridge to justice, it's a nice office, you know, what can you say about it? So maybe we can take some of those non playspace, and put them earlier in the schedule, and leave room for, hopefully, after we all have our vaccines, we can go see these place based organizations.
Yeah, I think that's a great distinction, Brian, you know, like boulder Valley, women's health, going into their office may or may not be that interesting. And, you know, for, for patient privacy, and that sort of thing, it may be better not to go into their office. You know, whereas like, voices for children, they have the new program that they had requested funding for where they have a place for parents and kids to meet. And so that may be something where we would want to see the place because that is an integral part, and a whole new type of service that they're going to be providing that it might be helpful for someone to see that and how it works. So,
Alberto,
I think I think that that is exactly right. I think there are some that are placed based in some that make it easier to visit than others. And, and then there's some sort of, for example, Colorado, statewide parent coalition, they do most of their work in community, right. They have a small office somewhere in North Denver. The same with Boulder County careconnect. They have a new office in gunbarrel. But the reality is, most of their work happens in community. So I could work with Nicole and kind of bring back now the reality is Nicole's. She's moving. She's moving ahead. He's already scheduled me a few, a few desk audits and site visits in the next month or two. So just be aware of that, that he's already you know, he's gone home just getting it done. But I think we could go we could we could talk about that with her and, and look at agencies that really would make sense to visit.
Great. I think that sounds fantastic. Deana
I guess I was just going to tag on to what Kimberly was saying to that I also, as I'm considering this want to be very sensitive to the organizations so that they don't feel pressured that they have to have us in person, if there's a risk that we may be bringing. So I guess I also would like to just propose that we don't make them when we start going back to doing in person if we're like in the middle of time. They're just We'd like to make sure that they don't feel like they have to let us into their facility, especially if they're dealing with people who may be more at risk. So
I don't know how you figure that out. But just to make sure that the agencies understand that we could continue to do it by zoom probably would be good too. Yeah, I
think it may be helpful, obviously, like dates make a difference here. But also, it may also be helpful for us to break down who's going to do which agency, it's, it comes out to, most everybody would do one agency, a couple people would do to agencies. And the sense there, my idea there is like, we could actually coordinate with the person. So like, some of these community based ones, someone may have something where, in April, they're going to be outdoors for something, and they're perfectly willing to, you know, meet somewhere outside and have that discussion, whereas others may not. But I think we should really focus on what the agency needs and what an individual board member needs. Because I think that, you know, I don't know, anyone's like health or family situations. And I want to be also sensitive to everyone on the board, and what you may or may not be comfortable with. And so I'd suggest that we link those up and actually try to coordinate it that way. So that we can be sensitive on both sides of that equation, rather than
trying to do that
after the fact. So I think it's good that we're having this conversation early. And then she's only scheduled a call because I think Nicole's coke handles most of those scheduling, I just get told when I'm supposed to do what I'm supposed to do. So I think it'll be important to communicate this with Nicole. Because she handles that piece of it. Yeah,
I think that's great. What I might suggest is if if folks would be up for it is to think about, you know, two to three agencies that you'd be willing or would like to visit? And maybe we can pull that information together. I don't know what would work for Nicole, since she's not here to ask, but I'm thinking that if we have a list of a couple, you know, it may just pan out that we can say, Okay, everyone gets their first choice or whatever. And match those up to start with. But maybe Nicole can just do that by email after this meeting, when she's feeling a little better. Yes, Karen. I like these electronic hands. It's really funny. Everyone moves to the top of the list when they raise their hand. You're muted again.
I know. So I think I think tonight, we also could take that opportunity. So you see the agencies that are listed on whatever the heck page that is when we're talking about site visits, so so you know, so So, I think, I think Caitlin, if you wanted to you we could do a straw poll, you know, now and, and see who might have an interest in, in visiting these 10 agencies. And we could get started, we might need to finalize it, but we could at least get started. Okay,
thank you.
Everyone feel good about that. We're not committing to any dates or anything. But the idea then would be we could figure out dates that work and conditions in terms of, you know, zoom in person, what's safe, what everyone feels comfortable with. I'll just go in order from the top. It's on page 41 of the packet, which is out of 50 so it's pretty near the back. So I'll just go in order and we can see who's interested in each Boulder County farmers market. Anyone have an interest?
Brian? I,
I feel organization I don't want to see any other perspective that
this just just to let you know that when, you know, remember Matlin when we went to see we went on Brian's site visit we had a lot of food we ate our way through that site visit FYI. foodie, that's a good one to go to.
You should do that one midseason. Nicole No.
Okay. Anyone interested? And for this, will we you can raise your hand for more than one and then we can figure it out if we need to. Um, okay, so Karen Phillips says she'd like to do Boulder County Farmers Market any other Seeing none. Okay. boulder Valley women's health.
Grant, Graham.
Anyone else? And Brian. Okay.
Um
efa emergency Family Assistance Association. Kimberly and Brian and Karen and Graham are all interested.
You know, would you say Brian?
Sorry, you can take me off of that. Okay. Me as well. Okay,
so that was then Kimberly and Karen. Okay. immigrant legal center. Myself and Deanna and Chiquita
solute Family Health.
Myself and Kimberly and Brian. TLC.
gram and Chiquita
voices for children. Deanna and Chiquita the YMCA Karen Philips, and Brian.
And
then our two new agencies this year, Colorado statewide parent coalition. gram Karen and Deanna. And Boulder County care Connect. cultivates I Madeline and Chiquita le bear tau. Yes.
So I need to check. But I think those two are scheduled, or at least the desk guided me not not that maybe not the site visit I think to the desk got it is scheduled already. So those are coming up soon. Okay.
Thanks. And then Karen, you got down everyone who? Okay. I think the goal would be to have at least one person, I think, you know, if things are virtual, if the agency wants to do virtual, there's no problem in having more than one person. If we have more than one person, then hopefully that gives us a little bit of flexibility to, you know, accommodate when the agency needs to do it and then have at least one of those folks be able to do it. And then, if we need to provide more information for Nicole to set those up, going forward, then we can do that. Okay. Is there anything else we need to determine for this site? Visit process or schedule? Now? Do we feel like we are in a good place to move forward with what we have?
Okay.
Oh, yes, Brian.
Thank you.
Just one question related to this document. Are we still going to go over this site visit best practices? Or is this for reference?
I asked Nicole to put it in for reference, Brian, I'm happy to answer any questions about it. But it was really is just it was just a we did this training last year. And so it was just kind of a refresher. Okay.
Thank you, Alberto. Because I was wondering if we're gonna do a shift in how we approach these if this document will be updated.
We will update it. Yeah. Yeah.
Thank you.
Great question, Brian.
All right. And
then we are ready to move on to our next item on the agenda process for further exploring data collected during the 2020 Human Services needs assessment.
tele Berto did we decide who's doing what
you want to start and then I can jump in
when you've had it. So so the needs assessment, they were completed in 2020. You know, really was it included? It was a kind of a different approach then, then the the data and the information that We collected in 20 2016 2017. So it so it with the needs assessment, what we did in 20, that we completed in 2017, we had some very specific, you know, priorities, we had some very specific programs that made it easier, I guess, for lack of a better word to align our, our funding with those priorities that were spelled out in, in the needs assessment, we found that to be a bit of a challenge in the assessment that we completed in in 2020. And, and so, so what we thought and this particular item on the work plan is, was really what else could we do we need to understand about the data that we collected? So what's the story behind the data? What else do we need to know about the data that will help us strengthen our process in 2022? So we didn't have a lot of time to to work on that in 2020? Because it was the assessment was done. And then it was time to do you know, to do the funding applications. So we just thought it would be it'd be good to just talk a little bit about what additional information are you interested in, in learning, if any at all? So, you know, maybe it's just Alberto and I thought, you know, we probably need to understand the data a little more. But if you're if you're good with with what was outlined, I, you know, that that is, that's quite fine. So a couple of examples that come to mind that came to mind for me is, you know, there was a, there was a recommendation that, you know, that that we should support the No Wrong Door approach. Right. So that so that any, any door any way that you enter in to get services, that there really isn't any wrong door? So it's a great concept, but what what the heck do we do about that as as an advisory board? And how does that translate into? How do we assess that particular principle and practice in how we allocate funding, so that that was that was an example. There was also a recommendation that, that we needed to build case management capacity that the agencies that we funded, that we just did continue to support the capacity of the agency's ability to do case management. So again, that's not a particular program that we fund. So what else do we need to know about that? And then I think the other thing that came to mind was, there was a recommendation about we need to support provide support for employment. And I think, particularly for individuals who had been impacted significantly, by the pandemic, have lost their jobs need need some kind of retraining to get back in the workforce? And, and so that's really a question. So employment hasn't necessarily been something that we have funded. Not not that we can't fund that, but it just hasn't been a significant focus, you know, we have we have workforce, Boulder County, we have a lot of resources that go into training and development that are funded by the state. That just hasn't been something that we have focused a lot on or really thought about what would be our role as a, as a local government as a municipal government to support you know, employment, training and development. So those were just those are three examples that came to mind.
that, hey, it would be great if we could learn more about that. We could understand what would that look like in terms of specific programs and services that we could fund? Do we have a role as a municipality, and as a, as a municipal funder to even get into that particular program or service?
So
those were my questions and those are conversations that Roberto and I had when we were just talking about this and preparing for this agenda item on the meeting.
Alberto
and I might my challenge with it was that so it one, I feel that what Karen just talked about were these very broad important issues, capacity building, no door being the wrong door. But then this, this particular human service needs this has been, also went the other way, in my mind and provide some very micro focus suggestions, right. And I'm pulling up the thing up all of the, what we looked at, but it has things like, very specific, fine some of the list of
so
it kind of went from, here's some big broad areas to hear are very specific activities,
like car repair was one that was right
car repair. And we were kind of missing the middle, right? So it's like, here's a, here's a, you know, here are these concepts in these principles. And then we also got down way into the, the weeds in detail. So it's, so that was the other challenge. I think,
one of the things that, as you said that we're we're kind of missing that middle piece, but it was talking about some specific activities, but also those really broad things as I wonder if that is something we should consider when we're evaluating the agency and the program. So like agencies that have case management as like, part and parcel of the services they provide, even if we're not funding case management,
that maybe
is something that goes toward, you know, the agency evaluation, whereas like some of those specific things around like workforce training, or car repairs, or things with people who have lost their jobs due to COVID. Maybe those are things that we highlight as things that we're looking for, are agencies like the types of programs that we want to fund. I don't know if that's the right way, I would love to, I think the question here was a little around like data and the process around it. And one of the things I'd be curious about is like, how many of the agencies we find like, even if we didn't find them for Workforce Training this year, how many of them do that? How many of them do something that they think like
that?
That is more data that we'd have to collect? That is not necessarily data that we have, but I wonder if if that's one way we could think about those two sets of recommendations is like, you know, the that no wrong door and the case management seems like something that an agency does as a general practice and approach, whereas those activities seem more with, like the specific programs we fund. So maybe that's one way that comes out. And we make that obvious in in some way during the funding round to say like, you know, our human services needs assessment has identified X, Y, and Z as things that our community needs. Brian, I see you have raised your electronic hand. Yes, I have.
Thank you.
So this is a To me, this is like a semantics pretzel. Right. And and part of the challenge, I think, between the the 2017 needs assessment, and the 2020 needs assessment, as you've pointed out, is there they're working at different levels, like they're using fundamentally different language to describe needs. So it seems like part of the challenge is, is there a way to direct organizations conducting these how the city would best like to see this kind of information presented. But outside of that, I can't help but picture matrix in my head because the six buckets that we have seemed like pretty good buckets, right? They apply to even to this year's needs assessment. And there's this idea that some programs are directly under their right in that bucket. And other programs, maybe are more on this kind of vertical part of the matrix, which is our elements of the program supported. Do the elements of the program support this outcome, which is not so much in a bucket. But it's like, if there's a food access program that also supports workforce training, you know, does that get a higher score, it's not a workforce program, but it has an element or it's collaborating with other agencies that supports this kind of any door process. But again, it's there's a fair amount of noodling to do in what these axes involve. But that's how I visualize it.
That's really interesting. Thanks for sharing that. Brian. Councilwoman Christiansen?
Face it Yay.
Well, at least it's not a kitty. That was hilarious. I, God bless that child for leaving that on it made us all laugh frankly. I'm wondering, from Karen and elevators perspective, do you think that there was a substantial amount of consideration of the pandemic in this assessment? Do you think that was different? Because the reason I'm asking is that we actually I, I was at see Colorado Municipal League today. And I also listened to a National League of Cities meeting. And so there are funding there is funding, we hope, coming to help with various aspects of the pandemic, many of which have to do with housing, and jobs. And so I would like us to sort if you think that a lot of the assessment had to do with this specific situation we're in, I'd like us to sort that out. Because we don't want to start gearing things toward an emergency when really what we're trying, we are funding from the city. And we haven't gotten what we'd all hoped for is a bigger increase in the amount of funding the city has. So I don't want us to start funding emergency things. As part of the assessment, if you think that's if you think that's a, an element of it.
So, so I think the answer is yes, that there was definitely a COVID really, you know, COVID aspect to the assessment. And a lot of the initial data was taken before COVID. There are those over 1000 surveys that came in the llama came in before COVID. But a lot of the focus groups that was looking at that data was in the midst of COVID. So of course, I think COVID influenced
how and we purposefully asked, because obviously, we wanted to know so those focus groups were those questions were purposeful about, you know, most of the data we collected was pre pandemic. And so what, what has changed? We did want to kind of know that, so it's it's a combo. Yeah, but I hear what you're saying.
I think, too, and we discussed it at the time, one of the things we that came out was that some of the recommendations, basically, it was, it didn't seem like there were things that necessarily were completely out of left field, but it sort of felt like it was highlighting that some disparities are more pronounced in the the realm of the pandemic, like they, they may have been there before, but maybe come in the pandemic and coming out of it, you know, employment is going to be a longer term thing coming out of the pandemic than it was before the pandemic. It wasn't necessarily solved before, like we still had community members that were struggling with that and with retraining and that sort of thing. And so it's just more than it's pronounced, and it's going to have a longer tail than maybe we expected. Kimberly,
with the suggestion for these
new assessment questions, I
really liked them. And I'm also reluctant at the same time to give them too much weight.
I think these assessments might favor organizations that have greater capacity, and there might be a loss of the diversity of programs
that would meet these criteria. If we're using this as part of the assessment. I can see us favoring larger organizations and really,
maybe some missed opportunities for smaller, more diverse groups. That gram
I guess I'm wondering To what extent the organizations in the community have really reviewed the needs assessment. And if we could, as a board, you know, digest the information and provide a, you know, an executive summary with, you know, and let them help figure it out what these broad theoretical recommendations I mean for their organization. Right. And so maybe we do a long month digestion of it and come up with a page summary about well, here's some of the ideas.
Yeah,
I mean, because ultimately, that's what we hope organizations do is like a needs assessment like this, that, you know, that the city puts together that says, here's where the, you know, the things are shouldn't just be us looking at it, right. Like all of the like these organizations that are help trying to help our community. They many of them may not have the capacity to do this kind of needs assessment. They might in a very small, like niche, but seeing the broader thing, they may see things that, oh, our programs help address, XY and Z. But that's not what we highlight in our application to the city of Longmont, but maybe we should, because that is something that has been clearly identified in the needs assessment. And so providing them with that information, I think could be really helpful to them.
liberto
carrying carrying go first, but I just had
a hand isn't up.
Well, yeah, but you did. When you unmuted that was
a side but my hand wasn't up. Go ahead.
So you know, before I joined the city, I worked for an agency that was funded by the city of Long month. And when we when Longmont did the 2016 2017. Needs Assessment. That's exactly what happens. The city with his consultant brought to us a presentation on the needs assessment. You know, what the data showed what were they had already done? Some of the background work on here are the I think the 2017 was focused more on creating that middle program or that larger buckets. And then, but then they brought it to us as agencies, and said, Okay, so here's what our data tells us. What do you think are their priorities? Or what are you seeing in your agencies? And what are the trends that that we should be considering?
What should we do about it?
Right? What should we do about it? And so we had those meetings I ever was at the library. And we had these kind of, and they also said, we have limited, I remember this to Mr. Curran saying there's limited resources. And so we have to think about trade offs, right. So if we do this, we can't do this. And so we kind of had to choose, as agencies, what we thought we felt was the most highest priority of need. And that's where housing, I think everybody agreed that housing was it. And so that's how some of these decisions were made. So that that's just my perspective as a previous funded agency. Before I started with the city,
Councilwoman Christiansen
um, yeah, I remember having this discussion with the city manager Kurt Hamel doing this. And he's saying, you know, we can't fund everything we have to, we have to fund what we need. And that seemed kind of meat. But it's true. I mean, we, you can have whatever kind of program you want, and provide for that. But we are funding these agencies, through the city and through taxpayer funds. And we have an obligation to fund what we need, not what some people think we need or what some people want. But because they can do that on their own, but if they're asking for public funding, we have to fund we have to prioritize what we actually need. And so I think that's what was going on with the 1617 assessment. And yes, I understand. I mean, horse, horse talking is nice, but
other comments or things that we want to dig into Around the needs assessment. Are there other things that staff would like direction on? Or would like the board's help with?
Like, how can we
support this, I obviously, this is like feeds back into our work later. And you're not doing everything, and we can do some of it. So I want to understand, like, if there's more that we can do to work together on understanding this and moving forward.
So I guess what I would say is, you know, maybe just a, a straw poll, or are you because, you know, Brian made a suggestion, Hey, take the data that we have, create a matrix, you know, use use that data, you know, to help with scoring and priority. And so, so. And so kind of what I took from that is that, we probably don't need to do more discovery around the data, but just look at how we can use that data more effectively to help us with decision making based on what's in the report, maybe that I got it wrong, but that's kind of what I heard a little bit. You know, or do you think that there is some some value in trying to get a little more information about, you know, about the data, so something, you know, so as Graham suggested, sharing some of that information, and, and really coming up with a, you know, a process for how to collect more input on that, you know, the, the city does have a community engagement side, it's called engage Longmont. So as Graham was actually making, talking about his ideas, it seemed like we probably could utilize engage Longmont in a way, right now, at this point in time, given we're not doing things in person to, you know, to share some of that information about the needs assessment and to ask different questions. So it could be different questions of providers, different questions of individuals who might utilize a particular service that platform gives us gives us ways of gathering information and input from the broader, you know, community. And so we might want to, we might want to tap into engage Longmont.
So, so I think we'll probably, unless you say, Don't even think about doing it and trying to gather any more information, I think we'll probably take a stab at it, we can bring that back in to this advisory board. And here's what we're thinking, unless you say, hey, that's really, we don't think that that is needed.
I think that sounds great.
I think if there's a way to add more color to the data. You know, obviously, at some point like data doesn't necessarily help us. But it does seem like that that would be a good opportunity to get some more information that would help us be better stewards. Say, do you think of us as sort of stewards of the city's money in helping make these recommendations? So
Brian?
Thank you. I really like the idea of getting more information and more context around how do these needs actually manifest in our community? So thumbs up on that ice, I still go back to the if I were, if you said, Brian, we're gonna hire you to figure this out. The first thing I feel I would need to do is try to figure out how to run the 2020 needs assessments for the decoder machine and figure and put it into the framework. Right, so we could identify our are we missing some information, so we could maybe be a little more targeted and how either we identify or we organize the information that we have.
So the matrix is the decoder.
It's it's the decoder.
That's right. Thank you.
And Brian, maybe
that is something that you and, you know, maybe another board member, like we could work on. thinking thinking about what you know, high level what that matrix might look like. I don't think the city is gonna hire you to do the decoder. You know, you I I'm okay, with Slatter nagging you
in some of it.
Happy to to lend whatever I can to to lighten the load.
Councilwoman Christiansen
I don't have my decoder ring, I never done the cereal box. But um, I do think is, but I would like to, I'd like us to have a discussion at some point about employment. Because to me, this is something that is very, very scattershot in this town. And the reason people can't afford to live for the, you know, afford housing is because they don't have a job that pays them enough, or they don't have a job at all, or they've just been laid off, you know. And we have, yeah, workforce, if you've ever been to work force does not actually help you find a job, they help you write a resume, but they don't help you find a job, they don't give you any feedback. Long Run Economic Development Partnership looks for large employers, but they don't actually work with anybody on a one to one basis. And the rest of it is all fairly privatized, or scattershot. And I things get started, but they never go anywhere, the police, we're going to have a program of hiring the homeless, but that never went anywhere. And it's just very frustrating to me, because I, we have a community college here, we have very good high schools, there are all kinds of programs that start and then stop. And I just think we could do as a town, we could do a whole lot better. And I'd like to see what other towns do. other towns have not handed over their economic development to a separate entity as we have. And I'm just wondering what their what they do with employment. So I do think that it's worth a discussion. Brian,
is on the fence about whether I was going to add or not I, I think it is a really big issue. And one of the things we would need to decide is to what extent we're willing to sacrifice ascar our recipients to sacrifice some efficiency, because our own experience in introducing employment into these programs is that you don't necessarily get that there's a learning curve, right. So the money isn't always spent to generate outcomes in the same way as if you've got somebody who's been doing it. So just something to think about and maybe how we can incorporate it and what that might involve.
And
I think I think we have a direction to go in Karen
and Alberto. And some more to explore here. I
think there's probably a lot that will continue coming out of this in our discussions. So looking forward to where we head with it. If there is nothing else that folks want to add on this,
going once, twice.
Okay. And the last item on our agenda is other business, if anyone has anything that we would like to add before we adjourn?
Yes. Karen Phillips, you're muted?
Oh, it just occurred to me that, um, you know, on the Sunday paper, there's a there's a whole page of how people can volunteer and for all these different things. Wouldn't it be nice if we could somehow, once a week, post all the things that all these agencies offer? I mean, I've, I've run across to people recently that, you know, one guy was having trouble with his apartment mitt, you know, lady she rented from I said, call the city, you know, and he called the city and, you know, I didn't know anything about it. And then I happen to know, these homeless people. And I had mentioned something about recovery cafe and he was like, Oh, I never heard of that. You know, I mean, the word out, it's just, if we could, you know, like they do every Sunday, they you know, you know, that page I'm talking about they have a whole list of every other organizations, if somehow we could with the newspaper, at least post what some of these agencies do to to inform people because so many people don't know what's offered, right? I just don't know how we get that out. You know, I mean, the needs assessment all that but, but your average guy and I will just doesn't get get the message. So I don't know how we can get that out. But that was just a suggestion that occurred to me, so hopefully that was appropriate. But um, That was something on my mind.
When
along the same lines, one thing I was thinking of is that like,
our,
our board, like web page lists like who we are and our meetings and the agendas and minutes, but one thing that is a little harder to find is a list of community agencies that the city. And it seems like that that should be something like if the city is investing money in those agencies, like putting a link to them somewhere on the city website, in a like, with a list of like, even just a high level, like description of services they
provide
could be really helpful.
Not just for people receiving services, but for family members who go and look for, you know, their senior parent or for their child or whatever, to be able to see those and say like, Oh, you should contact this agency. Maybe that's a good place to start.
Madeline? Yes. Um, I just wanted to this is just an announcement. This is announcement time, right. This is other business. You got other business? Okay. All right. I just wanted to make everyone aware that tonight was the inaugural meeting for the boulder police oversight panel.
And
of which participated, so we'd like passing the one but not totally. No, seriously, they are going to be sworn in. And if they haven't already, they are ready to work. And it's the boulder police oversight panel. And also wanted you to know, if you did not have an opportunity to join us with the Dr. Martin Luther King celebration. On January the 18th. Please go to YouTube, and just pull up Boulder County, Dr. Martin Luther King. celebration, why we can't wait. And finally, black history program will err on the 27th. That's a Saturday at 6:30pm again on YouTube, YouTube premiere, and I welcome you to join us. And Polly just wanted to we've been talking about Juneteenth for a few years now. Well, this year, June 19, we will be so we will be celebrating we will be celebrating cake in a very, very, very big way. Now from the time we started talking about it about things like 10 years ago. I hope everybody has educated themselves on foot. Juneteenth is and if not, certainly by the 27th. And if not, tune in on the 27th. And you'll learn that I just wanted to share those things. Thanks, Madeline, really appreciate it.
Thanks. Can you hear me?
Yes. Okay.
I don't mean to be so Gabby tonight. But anyway, I think Karen's idea is an excellent idea. And I like what you guys said. Caitlin said, I'll ask the city manager if we can do that. I mean, if we can, I know we have to pay the long lead times called it's quite expensive. But since we're paying them anyway, if we could have in the times call a if someone here would write up a list of those agencies that we fund, and just a brief description of what services they offer. I, we there's an argument to be made to the fact that we should be able to post that in the newspaper for not a lot of money. And we could also post it in the long run leader which some people read and we've also posted on our website, because as Karen said, we were funding these that the city is funding these and therefore we should also help promote them.
liberto
but just so the boards where we do publish who we fund, it is already updated on the on the website, I can send that an email to you all we do have a as I wish I had more Description, but it does have a little brief agency description on there. And we don't go really detailed, but there is something on there. Yeah.
Okay. Karen Phillips,
it's just that the newspaper, it would be good to have it every week, you know, a little thing of the volunteers and all that, because how many people go to the city website? I don't know, very many people that do, but
only city council members.
Karen Ernie.
So, you know, I think it is an ongoing challenge, you know, for sure, Karen. And so I, I think we're, we just have to continue to look at how to how do you get the information out? And particularly, how do people know where to go? When they need a service, or they're looking for a service, the right service at the right time for what's going on in their lives. And that is, that's just a, you know, that that's a that's a challenge, and so. So, even Eve, I'm imagining that, that we could publish something weekly in the times call I A, we probably wouldn't get it for free. And be, you know, it would be one avenue. So I think we just want to think about how to how to best do that. There's also you know, a brand new kind of database that's out there, so I don't know le Berto if nowpow was would be a something that folk, so it is an ongoing challenge. And I don't know what the answer is, I guess, is what I'm saying.
So it's
always gonna be the work that Yeah,
there's always be a multiple, you know, multiple avenues. Yeah. You know, for example, that we have this brochure on homelessness resources that goes out every every month, it's updated Karen cazzola, in their day to fix it. We, you know, there is this new program called nowpow, that will have that has 500 providers right now. And we are in within miles Hayden's way operating area so that the 411 or two doing one to 1111 actually works for us as well, you can call 211. And they can. So we're in that we're in that Denver Metro area, so that that's a resource. So I think i think it's it's having those multiple avenues. And in my experience, what happens is, folks don't think about it until they're in the middle. They need it. Yeah, yeah. And the tyranny of the urgent, the urgent and it's hard to, to grasp it. So So I think the best thing we can have is people at the front desk, knowing what what resources are, you know, ultimately, a lot of times, that's the best thing, set them to the city, send them to the front desk, and we'll try and guide them the right way.
Yeah, one of the bad the Senior Center does a great job, I think of advertising other agencies and other resources, because that's what they do. But
they did. So it is super important. So I don't want to minimize the I don't want to minimize that at all. It is super important. And and I think it just, it's it's great that you mentioned it and we can, you know, we need to be talking about how do we make it easier for people to find what they need when when they need it? Because it is not easy? For sure. Right.
Karen Phillips,
I appreciate everybody's conversation about it. It's just it's interesting how you know, we have all the help for for refinancing homes and all that and you said that the money isn't all used up. I mean, to me, because people don't know about it, you know, and that's that. So we can just maybe brainstorm on more and more how we can do that. But but you guys know that page that's every Sunday they list. The whole there's a whole page of volunteers and organizations and stuff like that. So that's all I was thinking about. Thank you very much, everybody. Great.
Anything else? Otherwise we can entertain a motion to adjourn. Deanna
was just gonna move to adjourn.
We have a second. Karen Philips is seconding. All right. Thank you all.
