Hi, everyone. Thanks so much for joining me again today on the universe is your therapist Podcast. Today we're talking about communication. And particularly, we are discussing the concept of chaining. This is a concept that was introduced to me, probably about 15 years ago, when I was doing some training around conducting high conflict, co parenting counseling, usually court ordered. And I remember learning from the trainer, the concept, which is when I bring up something, and somebody that I'm talking to then brings up something else. And then I go on to that and then bring up something else. And so pretty soon we've got this chain of communication that has nothing to do with the initial thing that was brought up. So let me give you an example. If I say to my husband, honey, I thought you were gonna take the garbage out yesterday, then my husband, who is maybe not in a good mood, or is very stressed or is very tired says to me, Well, I thought you were gonna do the dishes yesterday. Cake. Now we're off to the races. We've got the great a great start to the chaining. I say, I don't know why you can't just take responsibility for for not doing something you said you would. And he says, Well, you didn't take responsibility last week, did you when you forgot to bring home the milk? Then we changed into something different. I say, when What are you talking about with responsibility? You're the one who's always deflecting and not taking ownership of things that you do. He says, Well, what about the problem you have with being on time, we can continue that way of communication. Lots of us do it. In fact, I would say most of us do. But what we've done is we've created a pile upon pile of dissatisfaction and complaints without addressing the original issue or the original statement. And the way chaining can apply when we've had trauma is that trauma creates a tremendous amount of shame for us. It is typically related to the misconception that we should have known we should have done something different. We shouldn't have gone to that party, that there's something wrong with us. And that is why really horrible things have happened to us. When that occurs, when someone brings something to my attention that I'm uncomfortable with, it's really easy for me to deflect, and to say something about something that they didn't do, or something they screwed up on. And while this is really common, it is exceedingly unhelpful, so unhelpful. Because what happens is, we then end up with a result where we storm off sleep in separate rooms. And it all started with one comment, I thought you were going to take out the garbage yesterday. There was no criticism or judgment. In that comment. It was a statement about what I thought was happening. And so when we recognize that this is a coping defense, this is a coping mechanism where because I have a sense that there's something wrong with me. When somebody is unhappy with me, or when I make a mistake, I cannot tolerate taking ownership for that thing. Because that means that I'm wrong, I'm bad, that I'm terrible, I'm not good. And that is something that our brain can't tolerate. When you're communicating about a difficult topic, it can be helpful to preface it with I learned about this concept about chaining and I want to explain it to you and I want to see if we can work really hard not to do it. You would then without sarcasm and without judgment, explain the concept. And then because you can't control the other person, you can make your own commitment to avoiding chaining. One way to do this is when we start to get off topic or deflect or bring up other things we can say to our partner or loved one. I know that you're really upset that I didn't get the milk last week and for right now I just want to problem solve getting the garbage out on time. That's it. Just a few words, not not an explanation about how distressed you are about the garbage, no conclusions about what, what they're willing to do and not willing to do. You just returned to right now I'm hoping we can stick with problem solving, taking out the garbage. And if your partner or loved one says, Well, I want to resolve you're not picking up the milk, then you can say, I can see that that's really upsetting to you. And I would love to talk about that. Can we do that in 15 minutes? And then you go back to how can we problem solve getting the garbage out on time. Now, if you have a spouse or partner or loved one who's extremely defensive, know that that's usually because of abuse or trauma, then this can be a very difficult thing to do. I do believe it's worth trying, because it starts to shape the way we communicate about challenges. It keeps us focused on problem solving without blame, judgment or criticism. And it allows us to not get tangled up in all the discomforts, the dislikes, the complaints that we all have in our past in our relationships. I encourage you to give us a try. Chaining can be something that can lower the emotional temperature of your communications, whether it's with your child, another family member, a partner, a spouse, when you keep practicing this knowing that you can't control the other person. When you keep practicing this, you are going to get better yourself at staying on topic and not including irrelevant past events that have occurred that don't contribute to the problem solving of the issue that's been brought up. I wish you luck in this. Thank you so much for joining me today. You can find out more about us at mending trauma.com We have a great monthly membership with lots of great advantages and live events every month. And I hope to see you there. Thanks for joining me today.