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The Key Ingredients for a Lucrative End-of-Year Campaign - Caroline Fothergill | Otter.ai

The Key Ingredients for a Lucrative End-of-Year Campaign - Caroline Fothergill

Julie Confer34min

Jonathan McCoy

00:01

Hey, I'm john.

Becky Endicott

00:02

And I'm Becky.

Jonathan McCoy

00:03

And this is the we are for good podcast.

Becky Endicott

00:05

nonprofits are faced with more challenges to accomplish their missions and the growing pressure to do more, raise more and be more for the causes that improve our world.

Jonathan McCoy

00:14

We're here to learn with you from some of the best in the industry, bringing the most innovative ideas, inspirational stories, all to create an impact uprising.

Becky Endicott

00:23

So welcome to the good community. We're nonprofit professionals, philanthropist, world changers and rabid fans who are striving to bring a little more goodness into the world.

Jonathan McCoy

00:34

So let's get started.

Becky Endicott

00:36

Are you Becky, one of my favorite people is on the podcast today.

Jonathan McCoy

00:39

But he was just doing the robot dance.

Becky Endicott

00:41

I was doing the robot because sometimes I tried to like get john off kilter. And he tries to get in the zone. And then I just tried to make him laugh. But I'm worried today. Energy because we have our friend Caroline, Father, Gil her today, and she is the marketer on a mission. And I will tell you what people we met Caroline several months ago, she was literally moving hurt. She was just like chillin hanging out in her RV going across the country, helping nonprofits, with their digital marketing all along the way. She is one of the kindest, most pure hearted humans, I feel like that we have met in the last year an amazing teacher. And so she really kind of hangs her hat on helping social impact businesses and organizations, invest in digital marketing. And I love that she has taught me that there are 1000s, if not millions of people out there who care about what you do. They want to get behind you. They want to support your mission. They just don't know about you yet. And so this is the time in history where we need to be investing and how do we introduce ourselves, growing a relationship with people online, because we want to channel their generosity in a really intentional way. So Caroline is the queen of setting up those digital campaigns. She's a solopreneur. And she has got so much game in digital advertising, website, email, social media programs, search engine optimization plans, and she's just been in the social impact sector, her whole career and she's dedicated herself to it. Good human alert. Caroline. Father, Gil, welcome to the podcast.

Caroline Fothergill

02:18

Hi, thank you so much. It's very cool to have someone else say that you've got game I feel like you can't say that. I'm gonna take it.

Becky Endicott

02:26

I felt like that was just a 90s phrase I just pulled back into 21. You do have game though. And I just I love that you have this heart for justice and for growing impact in our sector. And you just have such an interesting story of your winding path. And so I wonder if you just kind of give our listeners a little bit of background into your story where this heart for justice comes from, and how you ended up traveling the country in an RV during a pandemic. We want to know about all the details.

Caroline Fothergill

02:57

It's definitely been a journey. It all started in the quaint little village of maple corner of Vermont, where I thought I was going to be a Broadway star when I was a kid. My own heart belting out showtunes standing on the kitchen counter. And my mom is a social worker and she ran a treatment program in our home in my hometown for 40 years. She just retired this year. So she absolutely instilled in me this desire to want to help others. And then I also have this love for the arts and creativity and I knew that I wanted to to do that to help in some sort of creative way I just didn't know what that meant. So I went off to college in the big city and then I volunteered with AmeriCorps did some nonprofit internships worked in house with a nonprofit for a little while and I was loving it I was loving being a part of the sector but I was realizing the marketing piece was missing for a lot of organizations they were really focused on communications messaging branding button marketing was like a dirty word that you weren't supposed to say for whatever reason and so I decided you know I'm gonna go get a master's degree in marketing work on for profit case studies and capstone projects and then be like a robin hood and bring this knowledge back to the nonprofit sector and apply some of those for profit best practices so that's what I've been doing I went agency side for a little while there and now I'm I'm doing that as a consultant and Freelancer so that's how I got where I am and I are beat around the country during COVID in between.

Becky Endicott

04:41

She makes it sound so breezy,

Jonathan McCoy

04:43

so breezy, and I love that your organization's name is literally marketer on a mission unlike that has been part of your story for you know, such a long time even though you're so young, you know, at the same time and I just love it so much that you've dedicated your heart to this space and you're showing up authentically in really serving, both with education, but also just like what's relevant now. It's just you have a gift of being able to really take people step by step through something and break down the scary that feels really overwhelming. Becky, and I love marketing, we could geek out on the, you know, the deeper aspects of marketing. But I know a lot of people feel really overwhelmed by it. And I love that you have been on a mission to make it really accessible for people. And so that's what we love to camp out. Next is, let's talk about indivior campaigns. everybody's thinking about that. And if you're not thinking about that, these are your friends sitting around the table, saying it sounded Think about it, it may be a little past time to think about it. But would you give us kind of a snapshot of year end campaign planning and what should be a good starting place for organizations today?

Caroline Fothergill

05:45

Yeah, I love this time of year, because it's such a fun time to create campaigns, you can infuse your end of the year campaigns with so much joy. with humor, everyone's in the spirit, everyone's feeling disproportionately generous. So it's just it's an A really opportune time to try new things. And yes, to light a little fire under a ruins bomb. Now it's definitely the time where to begin, I would say we still have two to three to four weeks here to be developing something that you've never tried before, that's going to delight and surprise your existing donors and fans and also bring new people into the fold. It's an awesome time when people are in the spirit to find some new fans and say, Hey, if you're feeling generous, or you really care about this cause, come on in, right. And you don't have to have a lot of money, or a ton of planning or a big team to do that. In fact, when I was in house with a nonprofit, I was the marketing and comms team of one, I had to fight and make the case for every marketing dollar that I got. So I've been there, you don't have to do something massive, you can have a small ad spend or a small amount of money to spend on an artist or to create a video asset. And that can go a long way.

Becky Endicott

07:10

So I love that so much because it's really tone setting for looking at the campaign is not just like this one thing, I think back in the old day, we used to think of it so statically as if we send out our direct mail, and then maybe there was a trigger after that. And it's really just a series of events that happen before year end, that happen as Giving Tuesday launches, and then cascades into the next six weeks or five weeks, or whatever that is, which we all know, is the biggest part of the biggest time of year forgiving. So talk a little bit about goals and where can somebody set up? You know, the quantitative goal? What is the call to action? How does it all meld together?

Caroline Fothergill

07:53

Totally. I am typically a proponent of having one goal, one specific goal for every campaign. I think if you have the bandwidth, end of year is a great time to actually do two things at once. The first thing is uplevel your existing donors and fans and give them a very specific opportunity to do that, whether it's really hammering why they should start giving monthly to you and be a monthly donor starting in 2022. Or maybe you're asking them for a specific dollar amount that is a bump up from what they've given in the past. So communicating with those folks is kind of its own track, right? That's a little different from Goal number two, which is how are we going to introduce ourselves to new folks who are interested in what we do, who are feeling generous in in a really fun or unique or surprising way because it's a crowded time. People are bombarded with sales and deals and asks, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't be right in the mix playing the game you just have to think of a way to stand out a little bit.

Jonathan McCoy

08:59

Well, I think you saying that. I think a lot of times we picture ourselves as nonprofits only like in our own world. And the reality is you're literally in the inbox in between to bed and Bath and Beyond. Or whatever. It's hard. Yes. So I think like just naming that and understanding it gives a different context. And so Okay, give us some examples like how do you surprise How do you delight? How do you not be so gimmicky? Or maybe gimmicky is what you're suggesting here? How do you kind of stand out in the inbox teach

Becky Endicott

09:29

us Yoda? Yes.

Caroline Fothergill

09:33

You too, I will. Okay, so a really small example. Last year, I ran an end of your ad campaign for an Antarctic conservation client. And it's hard to get people to give to something as big as climate action, especially around the holidays. So what we did is we played on traditional holiday songs and stories for our copy, so We created little carousels. I think one was, if you're making your list and checking it twice, then you scroll. Don't forget about the penguins. They're on thin ice, right? Oh, my gosh. So simple. But it's like a surprise people because they know this, they know the line, they scroll, and then they get something different, it flips on them. And then they feel like oh my gosh, I care about penguins, I have to help. And those were just simple. Some simple carousel graphics write some simple ads with this fairly small ad budget. And a went a really long way. Another example, in something I think nonprofits forget about is the principle of reciprocity. So we're so focused on asking, asking, asking, How refreshing to show up in someone's email inbox or their DNS, giving them something that solves a holiday problem for them. Maybe it's a sustainable gift giving guide. And one of the gifts is donation to your organization. Maybe it's a holiday playlist, a recipe book, a video or volunteer activity they can do with their kids to teach their kids the true meaning of giving. Like, there are so many things that you can offer to rope people in and make them feel good before you ask them for money.

Becky Endicott

11:19

This is something I feel like we have hammered home so much on the podcast is it's a complete mindset shift of the way that we show up and partner it's no longer about solicitation only and asking someone to give a gift. It's acknowledging and understanding that you have value and expertise that you can bring to this relationship. And so think about the symbiotic process, I love that you call it the principle of reciprocity. That's super cute. And it's so onpoint because there is something that we can put out there that really would be helpful to someone that really does make them feel seen and connecting it back to giving to your mission is just next level marketing. And I don't even think it has to be super involved, I think the simplicity of it would probably be even more effective, because you're trying to get that message across so quickly, again, in such a crowded and noisy environment during the holidays, that's a really, really great tip.

Caroline Fothergill

12:18

And it can even just be entertainment that you're giving people. Maybe it's a fun video, they can sit down and watch with their kids for five or 10 minutes and have a laugh or, or something that you can share out to your co workers or do as a workplace. Because companies are desperate for opportunities right now to virtually get their stuff, feeling involved and connected and doing charitable things. So the possibilities are endless. And you're right, it doesn't have to be anything huge.

Jonathan McCoy

12:46

And I think it's good advice that it's like we can get in the zone that it's only these like weepy stories and sad moments. And it's like, there's so much heaviness in the world. So to create bright spot is value and creates humanity and connection that can help you break through. Like I just love that you're counseling people to do that, because there's not enough of that happening in the organizations. And I want to go back to the goals that you stated. I mean, one of them is to get in front of new audiences, right or to endear them maybe in this opportunity when they're feeling more whatever that were they good vibes at the end of the holiday season. So meeting people at different levels only makes sense. They're not to step 10 of being so intrinsically bought into your mission, maybe, you know, throwing them an easier softball to engage with is just such an easy way to engage. So I really appreciate that.

Caroline Fothergill

13:36

Yes, humor is the humor is like the greatest tool that too many nonprofits are leaving dusty in the shed, I think a lot of causes are afraid like, I bring that up, and they're afraid that they're going to that's inappropriate, or they're making light of a serious cause. And that's gonna rub people the wrong way. But I believe that you can apply humor in a really tasteful way to any cause or, or social challenge.

Becky Endicott

14:03

I love that so much. And I just think that what you've said about having one goal, but you didn't just keep it to one audience, which I think is smart. And it's a challenge for segmentation, to your urine, giving, make sure that your goals align with the with who you're talking to. And so I also want to talk about not just diversity of your audience, but diversity of platform. So can you talk about how can nonprofit show up at your end, you know, in a social setting through DMS, through Facebook, through Instagram stories, what are your tools and what would you recommend?

Caroline Fothergill

14:38

Yeah, I would encourage everyone to think about showing up like a friend, especially during the holidays. Everyone's pumping out emails which you must do and posting on social which you should do, but can you like, record an audio message of your team and send it to your Instagram followers as a DM they're going to be so surprised by that and amazed by that they're going to listen to it. And it's going to make them feel a friend connection to you that they don't have now, maybe it's a Facebook message. Maybe it's just creating a piece of video content or Yeah, using Instagram stories or reels or Tick tock, if you're on Tick tock, in a fun way, like a friend would instead of just posting over and over again, donate forgiving Tuesday?

Jonathan McCoy

15:29

Yeah, so good. So okay, can you kind of let's connect some of the dots, we've got the goal, we've talked about some of the strategies, what is your best advice of, you know, really powering through the campaign? What are the things that need to be in place to really close the deal? If you're trying to raise donations, what are the next steps to get your website ready, or whatever the next steps are,

Caroline Fothergill

15:49

I am so jazzed these days that donation platforms are finally catching up to ecommerce. It's like the time is here. I'm a big fan of fundraising up I know you guys are too. And there are other platforms too, right on that level that are very easy to install that integrate with your donor CRM, whatever that is, that will truly double or triple the donations you're receiving just because it's a better user experience. So if you're putting all of this effort into an awesome campaign, emails, ad campaign, whatever it is, but people are hitting this clunky, long donation form, it's like you're throwing money into the trash can. And there are free tools you can plug in to get so many more gifts, especially from new people. And it's it's not hard like you could set something like that up in the next two to three weeks, you still have time.

Becky Endicott

16:46

And Caroline, help people feel comfortable with that. One. I think when people think about integrations or automation, they think that it's going to be this incredibly long arduous process of getting on boarded onto the tech understanding what it is. But these are like, I just think of like two Legos coming together. It could actually be such a simple connection point. Can you talk to people about those integrations?

Caroline Fothergill

17:10

I swear I'm setting fundraise up and other platforms, like get up for clients in a day. And I'm doing all the testing, and it's all done within a week. It does, yeah, it does not have to be scary. I think it used to be I think integrations used to be clunky and horrible. And that's why we're all traumatized. But these platforms are getting so much better. It's getting easier not just to donate, but for you to manage and set these things up, which is really exciting. So I just like to put that out there. Because I just think it's a shame when organizations put so much good that into a campaign or to getting people to their donation page. And then there's a drop off because the experience doesn't match the level of the content that they were putting out.

Becky Endicott

18:00

Such great advice. Yeah, and we I love that you brought up fundraiser because it's such a great and free tool. I think pledge is another company that does it so incredibly well. And I think you can't look at integrations just as like the tech that's helping I mean, the user experience you brought up I think the the ability to storytel to make it very user friendly. So if somebody wants to go crowdsource or crowdfund, or something like that, I think that's also I mean, you think about the ripples that these integrations can have, it's more than just transacting the gift. And that's where our mindsets need to go.

Caroline Fothergill

18:35

That's a good point. I know fundraiser is one that has a peer to peer tool right in it. So people, you can ask your board members and your volunteers to host fundraisers, or you can have them host, Facebook fundraisers for you. So that's another creative way to ripple out, engage your existing base and capture some new folks at the same time.

Becky Endicott

18:57

So we want to know some examples of who's doing this really well. You have such a good lens on and your finger on the pulse of who's just really succeeding and leveraging these kind of tools. So can you share some examples of maybe some innovative or creative indivior campaigns you've seen? Whoo,

Caroline Fothergill

19:16

that's a great question. One organization, you'll have a hat on the podcast that I love that I'm watching really closely is new story. And they're what they're building around their monthly giving program. The branding is really strong. They're just always trying new things on social. I think they're a great example for folks to follow along. And I'm really excited to see what they do this end of year.

Jonathan McCoy

19:40

I agree. It's the people, the organizations that are brave enough to just try things, you know, find some areas to tweak and optimize or change that giving page checkout because what I love about online is you get to see the results pretty quickly. You know, it's like you can change things on the fly and if you realize it's not converting, you can continue to look at it and make adjustments so Okay, all this has been so great. I know one of the scariest things for organizations can be pressing the button to buy some actual digital ads, would you kind of break down that scary complex for us talk about smart ways to invest your own ads for the holiday specifically,

Caroline Fothergill

20:16

totally. First of all, I will just say I believe every nonprofit should be advertising period. So for one, if you're not using the Google Ad grant, which is free money, lots of free money, you should sign up for that. And you can run some ads around the holiday season, see what people are searching, and set up some creative ads to capitalize on holiday, and end of year related search terms. So that's one really cool, free thing you can do with ads. I'm also a huge proponent of social advertising, Facebook, Instagram, YouTube advertising for fundraising, the ROI can really be incredible. Especially if you do a little bit of learning. And now I know the basics. And you can start really small, you could spend a couple $100 and have a very specific audience in mind, and see your positive return on that spend. And then once you know what's working, you can feel comfortable putting in a little bit more putting in a little bit more. But it's totally a trial and error process. It requires tweaking, I think that's very fun, I think you just have to realize that you can do it, you can figure it out. And once you shed the fear, you may actually have a lot of fun with it. Because the instant gratification is thrilling in my opinion.

Becky Endicott

21:41

And I think it really puts the onus on you to be looking at your data. And I will give you a plug Caroline, because you are a Google Ad grant master. And so if you want to if you are looking for somebody to help get you educated and acclimated, please go to Caroline's website, she's got some great courses, or you can talk to her directly about Google ads. But I think what I'm saying is, before you start any of this process, get into your Google Analytics, look at where you are right now look at where your website is, look at what's converting Are you getting more users from Instagram, you know, by double, then Facebook, then that's where you need to be pouring some of your ads. And I would say you need to be looking at that those Google Analytics throughout the campaign pivot, shift a little and it's going to tell a very vibrant story. At the very end of the campaign, something that you can report out in the engagement numbers will speak volumes to your organization. So also start there. So thank you for all of that. Carolyn, that was such good advice.

Jonathan McCoy

22:43

So I wonder if we transition to just after the campaign? And what are just some really good ideas for how do we keep people engaged, because, you know, we don't want to do a put all this momentum and then not do anything with the new people that have come into our joining our list, maybe they didn't even make a gift. What's the last kind of next step looking into next year?

Caroline Fothergill

23:04

Yeah, I'm so glad you asked that, because it would be a shame to welcome all of these wonderful new people into your organization. And then it's January 1, and it's back to whatever the tone of your end of your campaign is, if you're producing humor, joy, whatever, making a fun video, carry that through, carry that through your thank you through January, and then that should feed into these, these folks, ongoing experience with you. So if you're a big piece of content at end of year was a really fun video, create a similar video for January, thanking everyone because you know, they liked what you gave them. That's why they came in. So just give them a little bit more of that. And then you can sort of transition them into learning more about your organization and getting more involved.

Becky Endicott

23:57

JOHN, Julie, have you ever known a campaign that had a strategy for posts your end? I mean, I don't know that I could think of more than five ever in my life that I've seen that was a pro tip that I think can be really revolutionary because you're right. I feel like nonprofit goes silent a little bit in January and I get why people I mean, I remember the fatigue of trying to get put the urine push, then you're trying to get your annual letters out for tax purposes. It's a stressful time where you're doing a lot of things. But if you could just show up with a little heartfelt video, whether you're admitting joy or humor, or whatever it is, I think that could really cut through the noise. That was an excellent last pro tip.

Caroline Fothergill

24:43

You can even play on that like your content in January could be were napping. Great. Thank you so much. We're recovering from what you did for us and now we're doing all the kind of dirty work behind the scenes but that's because of you. You Let people in a little bit because you know what nonprofit life is and they might be interested.

Jonathan McCoy

25:06

No, I love that. And in you said some of the things smart too, it's like, the type of content that engage them on the front end, like use that data and continue to create that type of content, and you're going to keep them engaged. So very, very smart. Okay, your story has, you know, from your mom, all the way to today, you've gotten to be part of so many different missions in philanthropy, and I know you believe in the power of philanthropy, what's a story that's really moved and resonated with you in your life that you would be willing to share today.

Caroline Fothergill

25:36

So I did a year of AmeriCorps volunteering out of college, I really wanted some direct service experience before I went back to, you know, sitting at a desk and helping kind of from behind the scenes. And I was thrown into teaching a classroom of 45 high school juniors, with no teachings to help to help first generation students who wanted to get into college, apply, prepare, select schools go through that process. I had no idea what I was doing. I was in so over my head. But my students were incredibly resilient, amazing humans, I, I learned so much just by doing that, and I would recommend that experience, really to anyone. But I had one student in particular, who I knew was brilliant, she was quiet, but she was testing. She was testing like a 34 out of 36 on the AC t without ever practicing, it was insane. But she was sitting quietly in the corner. And when I had them write their first draft of a college application essay, she wrote about a science teacher she didn't like, and how she had to struggle through science class. And I just sat down with her and I was like, I have a feeling you have overcome some kind of adversity in your life. That's more than this story. And I challenged her to go home and start starting again. A week later, she hands me a second draft of that essay. And I was sobbing reading it because it was about how she was homeless and had been living in and out of homelessness, living in a van living in a hotel room, she wrote about the paint the blue paint color of the hotel room that she was living in, and how it reminded her of the sky, and the fact that she actually did have an open future of possibility ahead of her Despite living in those circumstances. Like who. And all I did was give her a little nudge. And then she got the Bill Gates scholarship, she had her pick of a free ride at like five Ivy League colleges. She's studying public health, we actually met up in Ireland when she was she was traveling around Europe when I was there getting my grad degree. And it was I think about her a lot. Because when I went into that, that teaching opportunity, I felt like I don't have a lot to give, I don't have a lot of hard skills or a lot to offer these, these kids. And I realized that sometimes all you have to offer people is just a little put, like just a little bit of encouragement and a little push. And that could totally change their life.

Becky Endicott

28:31

And to think did this come from a mother, who lived an entire life seeing people who were largely unseen. And you grew up with this kind of periphery into that world and for you to be able to see through the thing that could not be seen to create a future. That is the that is the feeling all of us want to replicate whether we're in a mission, whether we're in the social impact space. This is I mean, I think people may be wonder why we tell story so much on this podcast. But to me, that is the great anchor of why we do what we do. Because when days get hard, and when projects get very difficult. And when we're feeling such incredible fatigue, from pandemic and social injustice, we can go back to the anchor of that moment. And remember that the college essay was not just a college essay, it was a launching pad to the next big thing and how do we to your point, listen to the nudges, how do we use the story and use that as a way to fuel the good work that we're doing and how does it challenge us to listen and look for the person who is unseen who needs to be seen. And to me it's such a good metaphor, Caroline. For what we're doing with our donors, we have donors within our organization who want to rise and be the great change agent. But when they, we haven't seen them yet, and they haven't seen our vision, and they haven't seen the thing that they want to glom on to communication, being able to express who you are authentically what your needs are. And being able to have a heart of empathy is going to be able to lift those people up. And to me, that is the great catalyst of philanthropy. What a gorgeous story and what an amazing human you

Caroline Fothergill

30:35

are. Thank you so much. I mean, I that was so well. I think really, that is the thing for nonprofits and for every individual is realizing, you have a lot to give, and giving other people the opportunity to feel that feeling. That's huge. And that's a gift as a nonprofit employee. And it's refreshing when we feel like we're just asking, asking, asking all the time to remember, you're doing other people a favor, you're giving other people a gift by giving them ways to feel that feeling.

Becky Endicott

31:09

Caroline, you've given us so much incredible content and strategy today. But I just wonder, when you go back to the simplest form, what is a one good thing that you would offer to our community today,

Caroline Fothergill

31:22

Inc, like we talked about earlier, marketing is very scary. And it's often presented as something that you unlock, or you figure out and then it's done, then it's one. And I just want to remind everyone that that's not true at all. And I've worked with, you know, some huge for profit brands, they don't know what they're doing, either. They are just trying things every day and seeing what sticks. Nobody knows if it's going to work. And if we can just think about marketing as this ongoing experiment. How do we want to say hey, to new people today? How do we want to tell our existing fans that we love them today? You know, it's just it's just a fun experiment. It's not something where everybody else holds the key, and you haven't unlocked it yet.

Jonathan McCoy

32:11

Marketing is an ongoing experiment. I am fully geeked out on that. And it's a it's a sandbox, we always come back to kindergarten so many times, but I'm like, we got to move out of the space that we're afraid to try things. And I think this conversation today has definitely grown my mind and my heart. So be watching the weird for good Instagram and LinkedIn because we need to try some stuff around here too. But I just love where you've kind of led us today. I think there's so much actionable for everyone that's listening today. Okay, how can people connect with you? How can they go on a mission with you marketers on a mission, please point us all the ways to find you online.

Caroline Fothergill

32:50

I would love to hear from any of you. I'm on LinkedIn, shoot me a message on LinkedIn. And then I have a monthly newsletter, the good stuff. And I have some free tools on my website, including a campaign planning workbook. So if you're not sure where to start with aveer, download that fill it out. And that might give you some good ideas.

Becky Endicott

33:11

We love freebies, thank

Jonathan McCoy

33:13

you so much all that'll be synched up in the show notes.

Becky Endicott

33:16

Yes, and go find Caroline on LinkedIn. That is literally how we met her is we just connected on LinkedIn and just became huge fans of each other. Anytime you slide into a DM amazing, incredible things can happen through humans. And this is a beautiful example of that. Thank you, my friend for coming. I feel like I have grown my brain on your end to a bigger place. So thank you for kind of elevating the story for us and giving so much to think about this has been

Unknown Speaker

33:41

Caroline Fothergill

33:42

thank you so much. And I wish everyone the best of luck with their end of your campaigns.

Julie Confer

33:47

Hey friends, thanks so much for being here. Did you know we create a landing page for each podcast episode with helpful links, freebies and even shareable graphics. Be sure to check it out at the link in this episode's description. You probably hear it in our voices but we love connecting you with the most innovative people to help you achieve more for your mission than ever before. We'd love for you to join our good community it's free and you can think of it as the after party to each podcast episode. You can sign up today at we are for good comm backslash Hello. One more thing if you loved what you heard today, would you mind leaving us a podcast rating and review? It means the world to us and Your support helps more people find our community. Thanks friends. I'm our producer Julie Confer and our theme song is sunray by Remy Boers boom

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