Are prenups formal legal documents that portend an ugly divorce or are they actually a beautiful ingredient that can enhance romance? We're going to find out on today's lovestruck daily. Hi, I'm Sarah Wendel.
I'm Alisha Rai. Welcome to lovestruck daily where we deliver love to your ears every single day. I'm in love with love with you.
Today we are going to talk about the most important and very sexy topic of money. It's been a while since we talked about money, but it's a very important thing to talk about. Specifically, we are talking about prenups. So Alicia, prenups romantic or not, what's your take, I
am team romantic and necessary. So Kyle and I did our prenups last month, we did them even before we got formally engaged because we knew it was coming. And we just wanted to get it out of the way. We have always been very open and communicative about money and how much money we earn. And what we spend it on were pretty like pretty good about just saying like, you know, what's yours is mine already. I was definitely the one who brought it up first. And I think it's because I am a lawyer and I have seen I have friends who are in family law. And I've seen things go sideways and people change and whatnot. But but more importantly, I saw it as sort of an asset protection device just like a will write, you know, we are creating a unit we hiccup movie or you know, hoping to have children this will protect our kids first. And then us as well. So he was a little bit hesitant. But you know, once I kind of couched it in those terms, he really came on board. I was like I just want it to be equitable. And I want it to be fair, and sometimes the state's laws are not equitable and fair like they should be.
It's also very hard sometimes to talk about money. I was raised in a family where you'd never spoke about money it was it was considered a very taboo topic. And I am married to someone who is hyper attentive to our finances. He looks at all of our accounts every day to make sure everything is in place. And there's been no shenanigans. We have a monthly finance meeting, it is on the calendar on the view. I know on the 15th of the month, easy to remember Tax Day. And sometimes our finance meeting is how are we doing? Good. Okay. And sometimes we talk about what's the next big project we want to do to our home? Do we want to invest in solar? Do we want to start renovating a bathroom? And then we also talk about really big picture items. We talk about retirement, we talk about what happens when we're not working? And what money will we use to support us and we think of things differently because we talk about money on a schedule as often as possible and are very frank about it. But I didn't know how to do that before. I didn't know how
Kai like large sums of money freak him out. So you can imagine that wedding planning has been a delight. Like at one part last night, we were going over the budget and he you know, I could see his eyes kind of bugging out and I was like okay, fine. Well, if you want we can just get married at Taco Bell and be done with it. Like Nah, maybe not that maybe there's like a happy medium we can find between Taco Bell and like a mansion. So we are currently in the middle of looking for that happy medium, challenging.
It is very challenging and money conversations are always so hard but very cool. Today's guest knows how to help people find that exact happy medium and she knows way more about prenups than we do. Lauren lavender is the Head of Marketing at Hello prenup, an agency that drafts and defends Prenuptial agreements with the aim of protecting women's finances through the social and economic changes of marriage in the 21st century. Please welcome Lauren lavender.
Hey, Lauren, thanks so much for coming on. I'm Alicia.
I'm Sarah. I'm so excited to talk to you. Thank you for joining us.
Hi ladies. Thank you so much for having me on. Super excited to be here.
Now first of all, I just want to start by saying that your name is amazing. Lauren lavender is like such a like it should be a stage name. Beautiful.
Honestly, when I got engaged, I was like I either sound like a first grade teacher or like I have after our job. Other than that,
like an actress or something like your version better. And you are the head of marketing and hello prenup an agency that drafts and defends Prenuptial agreements. This was actually so a bit of a humble brag I actually pitched that we should do a story on prenups because I just got our prenup done, and I'm a big fan. I'm also an attorney. So I'm a big fan of Prenuptial agreements. I think that they're really important in today's day and age super important and I actually think they can be kind of romantic too. I wish we I wish I'd known about your service before I went to a local attorney because you are kind of like a Legal Zoom for prenups is that like what it is? It's a it's sort of a online company that can do prenups in any state
totally. To sum it up in all of the fancy words you just use, yes. So instead of having to sit down, go sit with a traditional attorney on your lunch breaks, fork over way too much money to get this thing done, you can sit down in your home, you can log in, it's a typical SaaS product, you create your prenup in the comfort of your home with your fiance instead of lawyers, and you actually build a document that you're pretty proud of, and I went through the exact same prenup process. I wish there was Hello prenup when I was going through my pregnancy as well. And so this is truly a labor of love to be a part of this team and to be building this service for couples that truly need it accessible, affordable and totally approachable for anybody that wants a prenup. And not just the rich and famous, you know, it's not a Kim and Kanye type thing like everyday people want to bring up so this really was born out of necessity and, and another labor of love.
Now, I know the common misconception around prenups is that if you get a prenup, that means you either don't trust the person, or you're anticipating a divorce. What would you say to that,
unfortunately, that taboo is still very alive and well. But there's also this huge desire for people to protect themselves in the event of. And so what I always say is, you know, when you get your license and you drive a car, you get car insurance, when you get married, you should get marriage insurance. And that's really what a prenup is, it's a document that you guys decide the fate of your marriage in the event that it just doesn't work out. And that way, there's no surprises. And I think one of the best things, I think it was Alec Baldwin who said, you know, plan your exit while you love each other and have a shred of respect for each other and not when emotions are running so high and you can't wait to just divide that line so deep into the sand that you really can't see what's fair, right and respectable. So I would say to anybody that still believes in the taboo and the stigma that you know, prenups are planning our do or planning for the inevitable, is it's it's unfortunate because I do think that if you can protect yourself with a prenup, in the event of your future self will thank you in the end.
I love that you reframed it as marriage insurance especially because as I am I am Generation X so I'm a little ahead. But I am in the place in my life where a lot of people that I grew up with are getting divorced and our parents are getting divorced. And when you said car insurance, it made me think, you know car insurance isn't legally required in every state, but it is required in some states. And in many states, the laws about divorce very much favor one party over the other and a prenup is a way of mitigating really crappy archaic laws designed to preserve power on one side of a relationship, especially when you have people coming into relationships with assets of their own.
And speaking of reframing, I think it's really interesting. One thing I remember in law school, one of my professors said people don't realize it but when they get married, there's always a prenup. It's just the state controls the prenup.
Versus Oh, that's so true control true. Because if
you get married and you don't have a write up the state's laws control. And sometimes those laws are not always I think they try to make them fair, but they're not always fair in terms of calculating emotional workload and a lot of invisible labor that I think especially in heterosexual relationships, at least that the women perform. I'm all for prenups. I've always been and I also think that they are kind of romantic to sit down with your partner and say, These are the things that we're going to do to protect each other and ourselves. Do you find that 100%
I look at a prenup, like a dinner date conversation that you should probably have not on day one or two, maybe three or four. And it really is something that you can walk through and say like, Hey, what do you think about this? You know, I think we talk about things like money, like a little bit too late. I think we talked about divorce, you know, way too late. And I think a prenup kind of brings you closer because you are collaborating and thinking about your futures together. You know, a prenup isn't just for the event of death and divorce. It's also about what's going to happen while you're married. And I think a lot of people think, Oh, I planning my doom for something that isn't gonna happen because we're getting married. And we don't anticipate getting divorced. But it's also a document that protects you while you're married as well. And so to your point, yeah, it's super romantic, because it's actually building your life together. You guys are going to get into the nitty gritty like, are we going to have a joint account? And if we do, what's it for? Are we going to have separate accounts? And if so, why are you bringing your house into the marriage that we both live in right now and that becomes community property? Are we going to keep that house separate and Though those conversations can be sticky, they can be hairy, they can get a little wacky and out of control, if you, you know, are offended easily. But to anybody that is having a hard time approaching that topic, I would just encourage you to think about it in the way that Alicia said, which is, it's about respecting each other's wishes, and creating space for the other person to say, Hey, this is really important to me, I want us to work so bad that I'm willing to put all of this on paper and literally get on the same page as us so that we can shove this document into a drawer, never refer to it, and then, you know, gallop into the sunset together forever.
I am fascinated by this conversation. I've been married for 22 years, my husband and I got married when he was in law school, and I was in grad school. So we had like nothing in the way of assets. But we're also over communicators. And we've done our wills twice in our marriage. And it's a very similar process, because not only are you looking at what are the assets that you have, and what do you want to have happen to them, but what do you want to have happen after you're gone? Or after there? It's that same sort of vulnerable conversation, where I wouldn't particularly like to die soon. I'm really happy with my life. It's awesome. I'd like to keep going. But what if it doesn't? What if that doesn't happen? And the same thing is true with a prenup, you're saying, effectively, I really want this to work out. But if it doesn't, I have to look after me too, right?
Yes. And if you can control as much of your future as possible, why not? You know, if you don't like surprises, it's all
communication. Right?
Totally.
I was talking with a friend of mine, and she's about a year or so into her relationship. And she said, Oh, you know, the only thing we fight about is finances. So we just don't talk about finances. Red flag. Well, and I had a mini, not even a mini heart attack. I was like, You keep talking about finances getting deeper.
Oh, gosh, you two of all people.
Because I do think people think like, oh, I don't have a lot of money. So I don't need to talk about finances. Like, you know, neither of us is Kim and Kanye. So what does it matter? But, but the idea is that you don't know what's going to happen in your life. It's just like insurance, like you said, and you know, you got to prepare for the worst. And it's okay to prepare for the worst, because nobody wants to feel like they've been attacked, or that they're, you know, on the other side, your team, you should do it as a team, I think and it's the only way it really works well. So what after they've decided to do the prenup? What is the process for them sitting down? And like what kinds of things would you discuss with your partner, when you are getting ready to do this process,
I encourage you to just walk into it ARM and ARM and get it done. You know, it's it is one of those things where it's not fun, it is like getting car insurance or doing your taxes. But thank God for TurboTax thank God for Intuit. Right? It makes the whole process so much easier. And if it's one of those things, that's such a necessity, you know, I I truly believe let's make it as collaborative and easy for the other person as possible. So really creating that space and giving the other person the ability to say, you know, maybe I don't want you to have my inheritance. And here's why, you know, and not getting super angry at the other person when they're just speaking on on behalf of their reasons. And, and all those things. And
I do think that there is sort of a misconception that people who get prenups are, are just sort of insisting on keeping everything separate. But that's not the case. Right? Like you can have a can run the whole gamut, right people who commingle all their funds, and people who keep certain things separate. And then yeah, people who just want all their accounts separate and maybe they like Venmo each other money, right, like for paying each
other totally split wise. Yeah, yeah, there's a bunch of Yeah, but so
I think I think the idea that, you know, it's only for people who are hoarding their money separately is is a little bit of a outdated misconception that I hear a lot at least.
There's also nothing wrong with that. Yeah. Like I, I think one of the most, you know, archaic, I love your word, Sarah, like, we got to break the archaic traditions. You know, like, one of the reasons why women change their last name was because they were property. You know, and I obsessed with people stepping back and going, do we have to do all the things that are considered the normal when it comes to marriage? Right, you know, it is one of the biggest decisions you're going to make. It's like going into business with the person you love. Let's make sure that we plan it the best that we can. Right. And so I think for people to you know, if they want to keep things separate, that's cool. That's okay. Like there's a place for that and a prenup is great for that. If you want to put everything together awesome. You know, I think it's it's 2020 to make real for whatever works for you and how and don't feel bad about it. I think a lot of people like to compare their marriage to others or what their parents have done or what their sisters yes your best friends are doing the rich and famous, and there's no room for that anymore. Do Do what works for you,
especially now that the the demographic of marriage is shifting to older age that people are finding partners and getting married when they've had a job and built up assets and have retirement funds of their own and possibly multiple properties of their own. These are really important things to consider about your life that you're bringing to someone else. One of my favorite podcasts that ended last year was a podcast called friendship. And at one point, they talked about marriage as I like you so much. I got the government involved. Yes. And like, that's really it with a prenup, like you said, you're pre empting any government rules about your relationship?
If things come to an end? What is the best advice that you have for couples in you know, maybe the early stages of their relationship? Yeah.
What are some strategies to bring up this topic effectively? Yeah.
play to your strengths. So and play to your fiance strengths, right? If you truly know your person, you know your partner, and you know that they are not their best at 5:30pm After a long day of work, and they just had a long rolling day of Monday meetings. Probably not the time to bring it up. No, I know, for me, I, I felt served. When my husband asked me for a prenup, we have a 15 year age gap. It's a second marriage, he had a daughter before. And so I had a feeling it was coming. But the way he approached the situation was very nice. He basically was like, look, let's have a conversation about prenups. You pick the time you pick the place, whatever you need to make this as comfortable for you as possible. I am all about it. And I want this to be as collaborative as possible. So to answer your question, and all the words, if you're on the offense, and you're the one that's asking for it and you're not sure your partner is really going to be receptive, play to your strengths, but really play to theirs.
Yeah. I think that's great advice. Yeah. Lauren, thank you so much for coming on. We've really enjoyed this. We've learned a lot. How can people find you and hello prenup.
So the best way to find us is to just go to Hello prenup.com. You can sign up for a free account and see if a prenup is even right for you and your fiance. We also have a ton of resources on our blog. Again, it's one of the number one prenup resources on the planet. So I highly encourage anyone to check out our blog. And then we also have a podcast the Hello prenup podcast I host that show we have a ton of guests on there all from estate planning to attorneys to other prenup survivors sharing their story. So I encourage people to go there as well. Thank you both so much for having me on. This was so much fun.
During our conversation with Lauren, we alluded to the idea that different states laws regarding divorce and property vary widely. And the default for one state versus another in the United States can be drastically different in depending where you live. And there are some absolutely staggering facts from the Hello prenup website about earning.
Did you see these? Yeah, that so women earn 80 cents to every dollar man makes we know you know that roughly
and it's even less if it's a it's even less if it's a woman, of
course. And then once you have children, it's even lowered. It's like a motherhood penalty. I one thing I found interesting was that there's been a 500% increase in prenups over the last 20 years. And this is not surprising and not surprising because I think you know only 11% of couples according to Hello prenup believe their marriage has a chance of ending in divorce but 40 to 50% of marriages end in divorce in the United States. And second, and third marriages have an even higher percentage. So if you can protect yourself, and you know, if you are maybe not well versed in your state's laws, I think it is worth it to at least have the conversation with your partner.
I have emergency supplies in my house. I have a first aid kit near our bedrooms, I have smoke detectors and homeowners insurance. This is just one more form of protecting against a disaster that you might not see coming. Alicia, do you have a love to go for this episode? But what advice would you give to someone to go out with their day today?
I would say if you are looking to strengthen your relationship, the best way to do it is just by talking to each other. And if there's something that you've been thinking about that, like finances, or like a prenup, just, you know, take them as Lauren said, you know, work to their strengths by men when they're going to be like the most sort of in their best mood maybe if they're not someone who's used to talking about this and approach them and get it out there and you might be surprised at where the conversation
goes. If you would like to tell us your prenup stories or you have a romance you want to tell us about please send us an email at lovestruck daily at Frolik dot media you can send us questions or concerns or thoughts we would very much love to hear from you. You can also follow and interact with us on Instagram and Twitter at lovestruck daily. Plus we've got bonus content in both places. Please leave a review subscribe or spread the word however works for you because we would love to bring more love into everyone's earbuds. Our researcher is Jesse Epstein. Our editor is Jen Jacobs. We are produced by Abigail steckler and little Scorpion studios and Gillian Davis with executive producer frolic media. This is an I Heart Radio Podcast and we wish you and everyone in your world a happily ever after today I'm in love with you. I'm in love with you
