02 230628 Why Do People Stay In Toxic Work Environments?

Meredith Holley33min

Megan Goering Mellin

00:04

Today we are going to talk about a common question that many of us ask ourselves, which is why do people stay in toxic work environments anyway? So, yeah, I think again, it's no Go ahead. Question for the world. But I do I will admit like it is also the kind of question that we frequently ask ourselves is like, if this is actually not right for me, then why am I staying here? Maybe it's actually fine. So I think it's very important that we address the range of situations we've seen about why very valid reasons why people stay.

Meredith Holley

00:38

I think it also you see this in relationships, too, like, why did she, why didn't she leave him, if he's abusing her, any kind of abuse situations, it can seem really obvious to people on the outside, that it's easy to leave. But for people who are experiencing it, that is almost never the case, I think the statistics say that it takes about 16 times to leave any romantic partnership. And I think, like 16 times of leaving and going back breaking up and going back. And I think it's sort of a similar experience with jobs for a lot of people that you can try to leave, but then you go back, you can commit to yourself, you're going to this is the last time and then you go back. So I think we can talk about sort of the common dynamics that that we see in those situations.

Megan Goering Mellin

01:36

I think that's great. And I think it's good to just remind ourselves that we need that the more we can embrace the idea of paradoxical thinking, which is that two challenging conflicting things, things can both be true at once. This, there could be both a quote unquote, good job for you, that also happens to be a toxic workplace environment, I think sometimes we fall into, especially under stress, that cognitive distortion of black white thinking, or like, either it's good, or it's bad. And when we, especially when we get into conversation with this things together, and we come back to like a more CO regulated place where you know, we have multiple friends around us who can help us hold the truth, we remember that both can be true at one time. So I think it would be great Meredith to have you share about some of the common types that you see some of the common themes, noting that a lot of these things can be happening all at one time. It might be like, you know, a little of this, and a lot of that, or a lot of this and a little of that happen in different gradations. But you've got some kind of interesting themes of the the tropes or archetypes of toxic workplaces that you see.

Meredith Holley

02:49

Yeah. And so I think the most obvious reasons that people say that they stay or because of money or because they love their work. And I think that those are not untrue. But I think a lot of times the dynamics are a lot more nuanced than just oh, I'm staying for money. And for outside observers, for friends who are watching a friend go through a toxic environment, or like for loved ones, watching someone, you think, well, you're brilliant, just go get a better job, of course, you'll get another job, of course, you'll make more money. And so we can logically also know that that's true that there are other jobs available. And I think that that is easier in a space where, for example, you're working at Burger King, and you can go work at McDonald's instead. Like if you have a job that sort of interchangeable if you're working at Lowe's, and you can go work at Home Depot around the corner like that is kind of an easier space. But I think that the actual dynamics that we see in the workplace are a little more like I say, nuanced than that. So I'm just gonna go over briefly the sort of common types of toxic work environments I see. And then we can go dive into them a little bit more in detail. So the most common types I see I categorize as the big happy family, the gaslighting passion project, one that I call brainwash factory, and the nine to five, and so a lot of times they're just common, like they're interchanged, like you say, like you can have both. These are sort of the common dynamics that I see. So in the big happy family, I think that that is probably one of the most common toxic workplace dynamics that really keep people engaged, because it's so rewarding. And I would say, my most healthy fun job and my worst most toxic job are commonly described as families. Have you ever had this experience or seen this? Yes,

Megan Goering Mellin

04:55

yes. And also one of my favorite thinkers who does the kind of work I think we both love Is Deseret Attaway of the AdAway group, but does a lot of work on whiteness at work. And she is like, have we noticed that in workplaces we aspire to this thing of being a family. But in families, there are adults and children. It is not all adults. Like why aren't we more suspicious of that? Like, isn't that sketchy family, families of origin are the site of so much dysfunction, discontent dysregulation, invisible nation on unseeing? And yet we're not like, Hey, can we check this analogy? Like this actually presupposes that there are people who get to make the rules. And then there are other people who get punished about them without a say, like, why are we aspiring to this? So I a resume completely from where I sit now. But it does, it is one of those slippery things when you're in an environment and it's like, maybe you go to a new office, and there's like a really good sense of team bonding that you see at first, and they're like, Yeah, we work together, and we play together, you know, we're really tight knit, like, everyone here really belongs and you're like, cool, I definitely want to be a part of that, then slowly, like the the more nefarious side, or just like shadows, or, you know, the sketchy toll of what is allowed inside of this family that is actually non negotiable starts to appear?

Meredith Holley

06:17

Yeah, I think it is. Like, I think it can feel I think the wonderful side of the family dynamic at work is that we really are in our jobs for the majority of our day, if if you feel alienated from the people around you, then you're gonna experience a lot of loneliness it throughout your day. But I don't think that the alternative is to have these dynamics where it is like, I am so committed to the people in my workplace because of our interpersonal relationship, that I'm going to ignore dysfunction. That happens that's not productive in the workplace. And so I think on the dark side of the happy family, you see a similar dynamic to what you see in families of don't talk about what dad did last night. Just move on, right to the

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