it's Dianne, your sassy, classy badassy Northern Matriarch
and Sarah your anxious feminist Auntie.
And we are representing the Tees Women Poets. Yes, it's all about growing up a girl in the Northeast, We've done Hartlepool, now it's... REDCAR. red-car. red-ca.
And we're getting busy getting together Season Two of growing up a girl. And this time, we're asking the folks of Redcar what is it like to be a woman or girl living in Redcar. This episode is a taster of things to come brought to you by content is Queen, who have been mentoring us for the past month because we won an award.
Hello, it's Imriel, here. the CEO of content is queen, we run the micro grant for podcasters programme. And every year we get hundreds and hundreds of applications from really incredible creators who choose to share their ideas with us. And this year, growing up a girl was one of our microgrant award winners. And we're so excited to be a part of the journey with Sarah, Dianne and kirsten. The podcast is truly unique in that it is chatty and conversational. But it also has like these beautiful moments of poetry, which just provide like just this unexpected relief when you're listening. And yeah, the podcast is really delightful and heartbreaking. And it really just takes you on an emotional journey that you just wouldn't really expect actually from the outset. And I think it's that surprise element of the podcast that really comes from Sarah's editing, that really brought it to life for us. So hats off to Sarah and Dianne who have done a phenomenal job on creating this podcast. We love the use of youth voices, but also the intergenerational aspect as well and bring to life these lived experiences that we just really would not hear from coming out communities that are just often and quite honestly overlooked and ignored. So yeah, it's vitally important that a podcast like this exists, we're really excited to be a part of the journey. And yeah, we can't wait to see where it goes from here. We only hope that this grant gives it a boost to continue.
So if you listened to our first season, you'll know that we are from the Tees Women poets, a writing and performing collective based in the Northeast. And this podcast is a mix of interviews, discussions, poetry and spoken word to cut through the bullshit and ask what is life really like for women and girls in these towns? And although we are talking about a lot of local issues, they will absolutely be relatable on a much wider audience. Basically, these things happen everywhere.
Yeah, unfortunately on some things as well. So poetry, now Don't roll your eyes, don't think you're back at school, take some time to really enjoy poetry. Poetry is an absolute gift. It's not like it was back at school. Poetry has long been a way for people to express themselves creatively. Throughout history, women have played a significant part in shaping the world of literature, from Maya Angelou to, Sylvia Plath to Rupi Kaur, women poets have made their mark on the world with powerful words that speak truth to power. representation matters. Because when somebody sees themselves mirrored back at them, they realise they're not alone. They're part of the bigger narrative filled with individuals who stories matter. Women need to know their stories are valuable, because we're so often not heard, and influence society for all the future generations. And we find that if you give people a space and a microphone, magic happens.
So this is a taster of our upcoming season. Growing up a girl in Redcar. Let's hear a little about the area.
When someone asks me where I'm from, I tell them very proudly that I'm from Redcar. And then I explain to them where Redcar is, and I usually say it's between Whitby and Newcastle on the coast, where we live by miles and miles of golden sons. Even though I'm from Redcar I always have to say I am Redcar born and bred, just don't have the accent. And I love that because I really was raised by a community and it was a very rich tapestry of community.
If you had to say somebody "come to this area because"...
we have a lemon tops and we have goths here
the sun or when it's sunny
yeah girlie we live in the UK. What sun? I would like to go back to the whole lemon top thing and seagulls seagulls. Oh my god. It truly is the land of the seagulls.
amusements. Oh, yeah. 2p machines!
The vertical pier.
Yes. Oh, yeah, the Pier.
I think that we're creative. We're a community.
Seagulls! seagulls! like I'm saying, make seagull the symbol of Redcar!
salty. There's a lot of salt air
There's a lot of seaside shit here. And there's so much ice cream. There's ice cream, Literally everywhere.
Fossils, petrified forests.
I loved growing up around Natural like actual nature. That great. The thought of Growing up in a city makes me want to vomit.
I think the the pride.
Oh yeah. Middlesbrough Pride is so good.
Nooo! i meant like pride in the area, but also Pride, Pride
Bit Gay.
Inclusive diverse. Yeah, yeah,
well most of us are a bit gay...
Last series, we used the indicator set out by plan UK to start conversations with our community. Things like higher obesity rates, teen conception educational attainment and poverty, which Plan UK say can make it tougher to grow up a girl.
Some of the voices that you'll hear in this taster episode came from a Queer youth group with a lot of neuro diverse members. Me and Dianne have had a lot of discussions around gender and who we're actually talking about when we say women and girls. So what we mean is anybody with a lived experience of being a woman or a girl to break this down really simply, regardless of what gender you were assigned at birth. If you have experienced life as a woman, cis or trans, or have had others assume you are a woman or girl, your voice is needed and wanted. So for our next clip, these are some definitions that might be helpful. So, AFAB
I'm so glad that's in there because I did not have a Scooby Doo.
AFAB means assigned female at birth. Basically, the gender that the doctor said you were at birth, based only on genitalia. Another useful term to define is non binary. Okay, so how the National Centre for Transgender Equality explains non binary is that if you think of the idea that there are only two genders, being called a gender binary, because binary means having two parts -male and female. So therefore, non binary is a term that people use to describe genders that don't fall into these two categories, male or female. So for example, somebody who is non binary might feel like a mix of genders, or they might feel like they have no gender at all.
Regardless of being non binary, we still have like, the lived female experience, and sometimes it's, and like, granted, it takes it requires care, and it's not always easy to be involved in those conversations. But it's still important that we, as non binary people that are afab should still get to be involved in conversations about women's issues, because ultimately, as the person who I am most likely to experience, day to day misogyny from is someone that has never met me, and is only really going to take me from face value and I'm not stupid, like I know that. You aren't going to assume "oh yes, that person is non binary", just from looking at me. You're gonna go "thats a woman". And that's, that's sometimes a difficult thing to have to accept. But ultimately, at least how I look at it, I don't mind, I just understand that that's just the way that it is. And I can't really change that. Unless I make drastic changes.. unless I make drastic changes to my appearance, which I resent the idea that I would ever have to do. So I will just take it. But we want our seat at the table when it comes to talking about women's issues and issues that come with the live female experience. However, at
the same time, we still grew up, like, with people perceiving us as a woman. So we have that experience that cis woman do have, and we should be allowed to talk about that, because we have lived it.
So this is always an interesting question. When we ask the community, what are the challenges of growing up in Redcar? It always seems to be there's not a delay, that the community can answer straight away. And they know what their issues are, they just need help to achieve it or make some changes.
Growing up a girl in Redcar in the 1970s and early 1980s. There seemed to be a lot of things that didn't quite add up. My mom and dad were progressive in that they said girls could do anything, just as well as boys. And they won't have the same opportunities for their daughters as they did for their son. Yet the teachers used to ask for big strong boys to help them move the dinner tables. And I played football with the boys at play time in primary school. But I wasn't allowed to play football in PE. Luckily, I found some kind of outlet in netball, but it wasn't quite the same. And the very fact I want you to do those kinds of things. I was deemed a tomboy. And I got the impression that that wasn't altogether a great thing to be.
Do you think it's tough growing up here?
Yes. Yeah, yes. Yeah. And
why do you think it's tough?
People Judge you.
Theres a lot of issues, like drugs. I'm around vaping 11 year olds constantly.
Looking back, I think there was a lot of alcohol and drugs in the area as well. And I know that there was like, drugs on our estate and stuff. But despite all that... Brotton is a part of East Cleveland, So it's about a 20 minute drive from Redcar. Right near the cost. And there is some beautiful, beautiful spaces over in Redcar. my Mam, was awesome with kids. she'd take all the kids off the estate, she'd take with brambling, take us down to kilton woods and explore like kilton castle ruins and we'd go frogs spawning and all sorts of stuff. So despite all of the not so beautiful things in Grotton, venture that little bit further and there is some beautiful, beautiful spaces. Whether I felt like that at the time, looking back as an adult now, as a woman now... Yeah, not not the greatest and quite challenging.
Do you feel like it's safe to walk the streets where you live?
NO!!
where I live? Yeah, yeah, but I go further out, then it gets a bit like... ive got to be careful.
No... but I do it anyway. Because cats live on the other side of the street and i need to see them.
You need to see the cats?
Yea! I need to see the cats! (laughs)
I would say, where I am, yes and no. I wouldn't go for like...i dont know if its just me and my anxiety, but i'd be too anxious to like go for a run at night... In the winter. In the summer, It's light, isn't it?
Another big thing was around sexual harassment, and northern men's views to women.
(Makes vomitting Noise)
would you say that's true of Redcar?
Yes. Yeah, I got a list. I've been catcalled about five different times in my life. And keep in mind, I am 16. So that's not fun. There are there's a lot of misogyny that people just gloss over because like, oh, like it's just a joke. No, it's not funny. It's not funny.
I've been tired for most of my life, emotionally drained from being mentally restrained. Waking up an enemy of my own mind. And I won't do it anymore. I cannot keep fighting. My voice is hoarse from shouting my hands and bruised from writing my letters are not read. My phone calls go unanswered. My emails are hardly acknowledged my ideas quelled as standard. They like you and your preference. But don't be loud or confident about it. And they don't like you when you stand and demand to be counted. You can't have it all. That's what they tell us. Be a mother, or a wife, or a disruptor complete, but don't be jealous. So I'm tired and untested, and I'm sick, but I'm still invested in a world that won't force me to compete with my sisters. I won't do it anymore. Sorry. I will not battle against you. I will support you whether you like it or not. And you will learn to accept my voice. And if you ever have to make a choice between me and you, I hope you choose you. Because I would I choose you every time. And when you need a warrior, I will be there to fight with you. And when you need a torch, I will bring my fire to light with you. And when you need a guide, I will bring my hand and walk through the night with you. I will not take your place I will lift you and be your champion. And I will not take an opportunity away from you and give it to a man because it's exhausting to be a woman and I can't do it every day. But tomorrow is another chance to try and I will find the energy to take up space
keep taking up that space! keep taking it up! that was amazing!
Okay, so something we got loads of positive feedback about (as well as how good the poetry in this podcast is) is how nice it is to hear strong regional accents. And it's not something we hear enough of.
I completely agree with that. I love the sound of a regional accent. In fact, I'm not particular. My mother tongue is Teesside. Pretty canny weather like
that means the weather's quite nice, isn't it?
You're jokin' aren't ya?
Excuse me? Are you joking?
Proper tired me like
I'm quite sleepy.
Devo'd i missed last night
ohhh I'm a bit disappointed. I was not at last night's event.
I was clamouring for a gin ohhhh i'd love a gin
Stotting I had to stop in
im so angry. I had to stay in.
Oh, thank you for being my dictionary. We'd love to know your thoughts on accents so please leave a comment or maybe leave words that you use regionally. Let's just make it a celebration. Let's not try to think everyone has to sound the same as everybody else because we don't do we?
Yeah, so I've never had a strong Teesside accent, which is where I grew up. My dad does, but my mum sounds so much posher than she is
does she? Why was that then?
Because her parents actually met during World War Two. So my mum's mum was German. And my mum's dad was an English soldier. So like the kids, when they moved to England, were really encouraged to lose any trace of German in their accent and not to speak the language. I think probably their mum experienced discrimination because of her sounding German. And she wanted her kids to speak like, you know, "proper English".
Isnt that sad that she had to lose that part of it, don't you think?
Yeah, absolutely. But it was definitely passed down to my mum when she was raising me and my brothers. I remember something that was said a lot in our house. It's waTer, not wa'er.
Yeah, or Teesside - wateeeeeerrrrr. You've got to get your eeeee's in.
I mean, I've also moved around a lot. So kind of picked up of different bits of speech patterns and lilts here and there. Which apparently, I learned during our conversations, Is actually a neuro diverse thing, or can be a neuro diverse thing.
...and they were like, Oh, where are you from? And like people from Redcar, like REDCA, and she was like "where?" and i was like RedCAR. and she was like "edgar?" I was like, no, REDCAR. She's like, Oh. it's really fun that people from here usually will probably just say it like Redca, but like everyone else has like Redcarrrr.
I don't sound like very northern until my O's come out. Like if I were to say "I don't know".
Yeah, that's true. Yeah,
I think I was saying before, I've lived here basically all my life, and I've had people ask what my accent is, I've had like Canadian and American, I've had like, Australian, but I've only just lived in the north, like, that's it. It's a bit of a, like a joke in the community, it's called an autism accent.
So, basically, it's especially a very neurodivergent thing, because, especially with autistic people, because we unintentionally Mimic, because we, quite often, actually, if you get an early diagnosis, you get people who like teach you social cues, like in formal education, and you end up unintentionally mimicking people, because that's the only way that you can talk to other people and then really understand like, what you're going on about. So we end up doing random things, because like other people around us are doing them. So if we are consuming a certain type of media, or were around a certain group of people, then we will pick up on things that they do. Like, for example, if you consume a lot of American media, especially as an autistic person, it will influence your accent and your pronunciation. It will very much do so.
My friend, my friend calls it a Disney Channel accent.
Yeah, There's much that can be said about accents. Like I, maybe I do, I do have the thing where I mimic quite a bit. But I think also what sort of blends into that as well is a sort of a shame thats taught into you around accent.
theres like a classism thing.
There is definitely a classism thing! There's definitely a stigma around having a thick accent, where some people are very, very proud of it. And some people are very, like, some people are very, very proud of it. And some people they do have it does post judgments and assumptions based off of what you sound like.
When I was a child, the biggest challenge I faced growing up in Redcar was not fitting in. My accent wasn't right. My accent wasn't common. And it wasn't just the children at school who didn't understand my accent and why I had a weird voice. It was their parents. I remember distinctly walking home with a friend of mine, a little girl that I made friends with at school. And her dad asked me if I was American. And I said no. And he said, Well, where were you from? And I said, I'm from Redcar. And he sort of went "HA! Your not from Redcar!" And I remember it really sticking with me that the ignorance I was experiencing at school wasn't coming from the children. It it was coming from their parents. And because I was different I wasn't accepted.
Do you think its and accepting area?
NO!
I mean, its gotten better.
Yeah, it's gotten better, but thats just less bad, Not good!
Yeah.
we did a Pride Parade at school, and loads of people were shouting to kill the gays. When I first came up as trans at school, I think it was about a year 8 or something. I got bullied for it. And they told me it was my fault for coming out, andWhat else would I expect? So you know, it's really not good enough sort of sector. You can report but they're not going to do anything.
Yeah, they're just gonna be like, "Oh, can we shake hands or be friends again? We can just shake hands and be friends again." Nooooooo, no, no
Just want to get these thoughts down. So number one is, with the media and everything covering they/them and LGBTQ. I thought things that really moved on. I thought that we were living in an accepting society particularly with young people. What really saddened me was listening to the group in Redcar talking about the homophobic abuse that they have. It just triggered me back to my gay friends that I grew up with and how the North wasn't for them. And they had to move away to London. I don't know ... I just thought we were in a better place, and it actually breaks my heart to hear that kids are still saying things like "kill the gays". Proper sadden me.
What issues could be better in terms of acceptance?
harrasment of people who are queer.
And racism, there a lot of racism here, racism and homophobia, the two biggest ones probably
coz like, majority of people are white...
Oh, and a lot of misogyny, lets be real. oh my god.
also don't care very well to like Neuro Divergent kids. they really don't cater very well.
Yeah, there's a lot of ableism, theres a lot of ablism throughout the entire country, though, So.... There's quite a lot of neurodivergent people here, and not good CAAMHS, So that doesn't really work. That's not a good thing for us, you know?
So to make that better, do you think something like more funding or more understanding or more opportunities?
Training, please, can i please just have more training! help!
I think services as well. Like given the decline of like youth clubs and like activity,
I would encourage anyone who may be struggling with their mental health to reach out for help without shame or stigma attached. Yes, we are currently in a funding crisis. But please don't stop asking for help, don't you think?
And I do worry that when people hear about huge waiting lists, and that there's so much need, it puts them off actually getting the help. And we don't want that at all.
and sometimes it can just be sharing with a friend can make a difference. So going back to the horrendous waiting list, the current plan and funding for mental health does not meet the scale of this country's challenges. And we're hearing this every time we speak to anybody, or within our families ourselves. In the aftermath of COVID and that horrible cost of living crisis, NHS figures show 30% rise in number of under 18's in England, in contact with mental health, learning disabilities, and autism services. And they're just the ones we know about. Minds heads of policy and campaigns, Paul Spencer, was quoted, "we know that 1.8 million people are on waiting lists for mental health support." Scandalous "with a further 8 million unable to get any help at all". I mean, what's that saying about the country and what we think about mental health?
That's absolutely dire.
So yes, communities provide support when individuals fall through the cracks, but they haven't got a magic wand. Like it's been said they need training, they need funding. Let's just hope we get the adequate funding to really make a difference.
And this is something that we heard from our Hartlepool communities too mental health services being so underfunded and overworked that people are turning to, and leaning on their communities, their friends, their families, and of course, that northern stereotype staple, the northern matriarch.
Our Mams
I grew up very working class with a very heads.... raised by a very headstrong single mother, who worked full time alongside raising two children. And so the Yeah, that sort of mindset around keeping going and just sort of kind of like stomaching struggle and never actually like, going actually I just rather just sort of keeping going with it rather than like taking it as it comes rather than like, actually advocating for that to not be a thing.
It's like, you know, the northern matriarch mother stereotype, we often think of her as just like this poor pack donkey on the beach, and people keep shoving shit on her back and just trundle her along a bit more like "Oh, she's so resilient. She can keep going". (claps hands) yeah well, you could carry your own shit too couldnt you!
Yeah, absolutely.
My Mom is like the strongest woman I know. Not only did she have to deal with, like, two abusive relationships while having my brother and me, She also, like dealt with her own mental health issues, My brothers and mine. And I feel like I don't, like sometimes I don't give her enough credit for that. because I mean, I know how much of a mess I've been. Can't have been easy for her to deal with. I mean, at one point, like she would stay up all night with me, and then continue to even work during the day when I was asleep, just because she wanted to make sure that I was okay. She neglected herself for me and my brother, all the time. Even didn't eat so that we could eat.
Yeah. And you believe that, Like, you just go like, "yeah, that's what mothers do. That's what you do for your kids".
But you shouldn't have to
You shouldn't have to, no, absolutely not. And you go, "where is anyone else that could help lighten, whereas anyone else that could help lighten that load. And I think a lot of us as women have become so accepting of that fate that you just don't even like... some woman Barely resent it, and actually, like, resent the women that are challenging of the idea. It's something that I encounter quite often... is that a lot of women... and if you're comfortable within that role, you're like, that's soooo fine.... But there's also there's, there's something quite upsetting to me, to see people that have become so normalised to it, that actually someone then advocating for that to maybe not be the case, it will be that woman that will quite often, like sort of bite back about it. Maybe doesn't see that they're in a system ... doesn't really see that they're in a system that is oppressing them anymore, because they've been constantly ...because they've been oppressed constantly.
Like I don't understand why people are so invested in upholding a system that harms people.
Yeah, it doesn't make sense.
My mom had wrote a poem years ago, I think, in year 2000... so 24 years ago, about Brotton. And I thought it'd be perfect to share this! Mam had lost the poem, couldn't find it, but it was published in St. Margaret's church, parish magazine, so I've contacted them and they've just sent me over the Poem, they found it!
The poem is called Forgotten Brotton. The mattress in the tree, the dog dirt on the path, the substandard housing due to unemployments, wrath, the boarded up pubs, the greengrocers is gone. But spoilt for choice if you want your head done. the lack of community spirit to residents dismay, replaced with housing associations and subsequent Decay, coffee and biscuits at the Methodist chapel, but we want a bit of the council's apple. the closure of the bank, the high council tax, where are facilities that Brotton does lack? The Millennium committee tries their best, hats off to them with their impossible quest, the lack of money and community spirit, the church's resources are stretched to the limit. Southbank and Grangetown have surely had their whack. It is now time for fellow Brotton to jump on *** Back
I love defining what it means to be a northern matriarch. That's a title I wear with pride! I'm a mum of three and a nanny to eight grandchildren. And traditionally matriarch describes a woman who heads the family and is often seen as a bossy figure. Or as mentioned "the pack donkey"
Yeahh... sorry about that.
No...it is valid, it is valid. And I resonate with the reference to "stomaching and struggles". And I wanna reclaimed the term with the understanding that true power comes from being vulnerable and emotional intelligence. It's taken me to my 50s to actually ask for help, like how bad is that? I've just struggled and stomach them struggles. Vulnerability is not a weakness. Being honest about our feelings and experiences allows us to create authentic connections and it shows people that we've got feelings to empathy is not just about being understanding towards others. It's also about setting boundaries and standing up for yourself which is difficult when you've got years of training that you've just got to be that person.
"Keep calm and carry on", bullshit.
Yeah, like "is your glass half full or half empty" that one "you can't pour from an empty glass"... well welcome to my life! constantly empty! So I'm unloading the pack horse, and im returning the baggage back to sender! I'm going to beNorthern Matriarch who knows my worth, and doesn't allow others to diminish my value. I'm going to keep lifting each other up, and I'm going to share my mistakes. Nobody's perfect. And it's not about perfection. It's about progress.
Whoop whoop whoop!
Yes!
One of the wonderful things about the TWP, and about this podcast is how intergenerational it is. And one of the great things about talking to so many different ages is that they have lovely advice for each other.
Yeah
we always ask "what would you say to a younger person growing up in this area"? And it's lovely hearing the answers.
And so the advice that I would give to a young girl growing up in Redcar today, would be don't listen to every word. And always remember who you're listening to. Because your dreams might be in Redcar, your future might be in Redcar, but it might not be. Don't let your dreams and your future be determined by the words of someone else. Only let your future be determined by your own mind.
What advice would you give anyone growing up today in Recar?
Come here (to the youth Group), we're accepting here.
Yeah, yeah, We're chill here. It'll be okay. Because you will have options, eventually, you will eventually have options. And I know that it is really shit now. But keep in mind, the other people also need to go through character development. And the reason why you feel so alone right now is because people haven't gone through maturity yet. And they don't have the maturity to accept you as you are. So and that's a journey that you do not have to be involved in. You do not have to teach them how to be a basic human being. That's something that they can learn by themselves.
Slayyyy!
the advice that I would give is that, there are beautiful things on offer in Redcar and Cleveland but you just have to go find them, go explore and don't get washed away with the not so beautiful things that are around you. And your dreams can come true. You just have to tune into them, and make your surroundings suit them. And one day you can make something of yourself in this place. You just have to know where to look, to explore. Find. And live here as your dreams can come true. be bold, confident, be
Redcar's young people are paving the way!
We really do be!
You are paving the way. But I think that you're all creative and wonderful and have the solutions to so many of our Redcar's problems. And perhaps people don't see it that way.
Right. Redcar's young people are???
SLAYYYY!! (laughter)
Lets be real right now, we're the best. We are the best.
So goodbye from us. Your anxious feminist Auntie
and your Northern Matriarch. And don't forget we're on Spotify Growing up a girl... in Hartlepool. Three episodes, definitely worth listening to.
Absolutely. If you want to find out more about the Tees women poets, you can visit our website where you can find out about all of our events. You can find out about upcoming projects and where to join in.
Yeah, please do. It's a brilliant sisterhood. You won't regret joining us and you don't even have to be in Teesside for some of the events things like the open mic night. Twoomph!
We have a monthly open mic night with people from all over the world. we have monthly writing workshops where you can join on zoom from anywhere.
Yeah, so it doesn't have to be for Teesside, though, please come and visit Teeside because we're Excellent! So we'd just like to say thank you for listening. It's so important that these young people's and women's voices are heard, and we do something about it!
Absolutely. We hope this discussion has inspired you to embrace your inner strength while extending compassion towards yourself and others.
Remember, you have the power to lead with both courage and kindness and slay! thanks for tuning in. As always, until next time, bye
I loved rolling around in the dirt as a kid. That was Great.
I did that I ate mud once.... I think that's why I am...
The way you are?
The way i am, yeah (laughter)
I wanna go "It's goodbye from me, and its a goodbye from"....
me?
You! Your showing your age now! it's the Two Ronnies!
