Hello, everyone. Welcome back. Thank you so much for joining me for the first episode of season two of the more than you see podcast hosted by me, actor, filmmaker, mental health advocate Deborah Lee Smith. Every Monday, I come to you to share some resources, have a conversation, and generally just dive in to all sorts of topics around mental health. And guess what? This season I've got some really exciting interviews and different formats that I am excited to share with you.
FYI, I am not a licensed practitioner or therapist, but just a woman exploring my own mental health journey and sharing it with you, my listeners. My hope is that this podcast brings you some joy, some understanding and some tools so that you can build your own mental health toolbox.
Season Two! I am so excited to start off season two with you all today. Thank you so much if you have never listened to this before, welcome. And if you are one of my regulars, thank you so much for all of the ongoing support and love. I know that I got some messages about how you guys missed me over the past month and I will have to tell you, I really missed you guys too. This podcast really brings me so much joy. And I'm really excited to introduce some really incredible guests to the podcast this season that I think are going to elevate our understanding around all sorts of topics around mental health.
I am really excited to start Season Two of the podcast with Liana Nielsen. She is an Integrative Nutrition Health Coach certified through the Institute of Integrative Nutrition with specializations in both gut and hormone health. She has a BA from George Washington University and also studied personal leadership and development coaching under Kathleen Schaffer, founder of the Human Being Store.
Liana was inspired to become a health coach through her own healing journey. In her 20s, she developed an undiagnosable autoimmune condition. After seeing countless unhelpful doctors which inspired a lot of her own research, she discovered that she could heal her body through food and lifestyle interventions. Liana combines both her health and coaching and leadership and development training with her own healing journey to teach people to listen and connect more deeply to their own bodies, creating health, vitality and clarity. She has a holistic approach to nutrition and strives to create balance in both the physical and mental health, which leads to alignment in all other areas of life.
Obviously I just read her bio, but I am so excited to have Liana here today and share this interview with you all. We really dive into mental health in general, the mental health struggles that she had as a kid, how they really came to a head when she was in college. I think that there's going to be so many different elements of this interview that are going to resonate with you all. I certainly know that there was many times when I was listening and going, oh my goodness, me too. And I really feel like this is the perfect way to start this episode. And this season as well as Mental Health Month, which is May, because it's so important to look at a holistic approach to mental health. You all know that I'm a super proponent of that. And that's definitely something that Liana really gets into is the idea that our gut health, our body health impacts our mental health in such a strong way. And she really dives into the science behind it, the reason behind it, and I am sure that you will take something important from this episode, I know that I have really come from this episode with a whole new understanding of my own body health and how that relates to how I feel. So without further ado, let's dive in, shall we?
Thank you so much Liana, for being here today. I am so excited. You are the very first interview guest for More Than You See. And I could not be more pleased that it is you. So thank you for being here.
Thank you so much for having me. I'm really excited.
Yeah, of course.
So obviously, this podcast is all about mental health. And I also, because I'm an actor and have a like public facing life, I think that it's really important for me to interview people who have had that experience as well. Because I think that you know, when I created More Than You See, one of the reasons that I created it was because we all have these external faces that we wear and these masks that we hide behind. And yet I feel like actors and public figures kind of know that more and are more willing to like take off that mask and kind of be vulnerable and open. So I'm, I'm really excited to have you here. Because you were an actor, are an actor, we'll get into your background a little bit. But you know, you've had that experience as well as you have a lot of experience in the mental health field, as well as you've been diving into nutrition, and how that affects your body and your mental health. And I think that all of that is just so incredibly important. So I'm really excited to dive into all of those topics today.
So to start us off, I mean, if you just want to give us a really brief background, about you know who you are, as far as what your actual life looked like, of course, because this is a mental health podcast, if you want to talk about you know, just how that affected you as a person, throughout your entire experience. I think that would be really beneficial, and how you're doing today in the pandemic. So let's let's just dive in. So who are you and what do you do, all of that jazz?
Sure, sure. So I grew up acting a little bit and dancing, but I never really thought I had permission to do it. And then fast forward at the end of college, I kind of picked it up again, then moved to New York City, went to Atlantic's Conservatory, and then was just auditioning a bunch ended up doing a lot of commercials and worked. I had a couple of films, little ones that went to Sundance, David Cross' directorial debut was the first one was really exciting. And then I ended up doing sketch off and on, on The Tonight Show with Jimmy Fallon, and then auditioning for like, every show in New York City a million times and being on hold, you know, that whole thing? Yeah.
And then I did a lot I was doing stand up a bit, I was doing a lot of improv, I went to UCB all that, so I was in comedy. And in my 20s, after Atlantic in my mid 20s, I started well, I probably started a little bit earlier, in college, you know, I never had any mental health issues growing up, never had - totally healthy kid. And then I went to college, and started drinking too much... and stress and staying up late eating crappy. And all of a sudden, my body just like, revolted. I started, you know, I did the freshman 15 thing. And then I became bulimic. And so my struggle with mental health definitely started in college, and sort of ebbed and flowed, and you know, anxiety attacks, depression in and out of that, and then got really bad by my mid 20s.
And then I was having a lot of other health issues then as well. But I was bartending I was auditioning all the time. And it's so funny. I don't know if you've ever heard this, but they talk about the the physical experience in your body of an audition is that similar to a minor car accident, in terms of adrenaline. So if I here I am already very sensitive person, like staying up late drinking lots of coffee, drinking too much alcohol, and then having minor car accidents. My body pretty much fell apart. And it got to a point where I was just having like, my hair was falling out, my period stopped, having a lot of bleeding in my intestines, I was having a lot of food allergies. And I was just like, very emotionally flat, seeing a psychiatrist who wanted to put me on meds, and having really intense panic attacks, where I would like have to call my ex husband, my now ex husband was my boyfriend at the time and be like, Am I dying? What's going on, and he definitely talked me down.
And it was unsustainable, obviously. And when that was happening, my acting career was like at a standstill, because, of course, when you're not feeling good physically or mentally, you're not walking into an audition room and nailing things. So that's when my sort of health and nutrition journey started, just because I was seeing a number of different doctors, and no one was really giving me answers. They all wanted to give me a different patch or a pill or, you know, whatever. Everyone's looking at me in pieces. And I got to a point where not to be gross, but I was having a lot of bleeding in my intestines every day. And I thought I had colon cancer.
I went to Dr. Google. And I was, like, 26 years old, I have cancer. And so I got a colonoscopy, and I remember the doctor being like, well, you're definitely gonna develop like any number of these autoimmune diseases. You don't have it yet. Come back in a year when you do, and we'll put you on steroids for the rest of your life. And even though I was like, I'm in New York City, I'm seeing a specialist. I am not, I'm not even 30 and you're talking...like, I'm bleeding out of my butt every day. And I'm supposed to go get worse. Like, are you kidding me?
So I just took matters in my own hands. I got a second opinion. Same thing. And I led me to this book by this doctor, Dr. Raphael Kellman called The Microbiome Diet, and it was all about rebuilding your gut health. And I was so desperate, I just felt so awful that I was like, I'm just going to try that they sort of Yelp review them and he sounded pretty good. He was way too expensive to actually see. So I guess I guess I'll just try this so much was just diet related. And within 12 days of doing this health protocol, my depression and anxiety that had been troubling me since I was 18, was gone. Like 100% it, I it was like someone took some sort of like shitty Instagram filter off my life.
I like remember just getting out of bed. And it was like, colors were brighter, food tasted different. Like I had this new lease on life that felt like it happened overnight. I felt like I was like, 16, again, and what I hadn't realized. And I think what a lot of people don't realize is that we all have this baseline of health, as a kid growing up, that's pretty high. And over time, when you experience stress, and you're not sleeping enough, you add coffee and alcohol, whatever else, it just gets lower and lower. And basically what I did without realizing was press reset, and sort of rip this crappy band-aid off, and I felt so good. And then and there, I was hooked.
I was like, wait a minute, I'm healing my gut. And it's changing my brain within 12 days. How is nobody talking to actors about this? And I knew, I feel like so many actors are these sensitive people, artists in general, who we rely on our bodies, they are our businesses. So it's like, I don't understand why no one told us to do this before, I don't understand why it's all these doctors, no one told this to me. And within six months, everything that was going on with my body, including what was happening in my intestines reversed.
And I, you know, was able to clearly heal my body. And I was like, I have to learn more about this. And I was thinking of becoming like, you know, as much as I still loved acting as pursuing that - I was so fascinated. And then, you know, I think this happens a lot in life, I started to attract all these people with similar issues. And I was like, I don't know, read this book. I'm like giving, you know, non-medical health advice. So I was like, Okay, I maybe should get some sort of certification. So, I ended up at the Institute of Integrative Nutrition, which was the only place I could find that was actually talking about your microbiome and your gut health and the gut-brain connection. And the crazy thing, too, is once I healed my gut, and started healing my body, my career - I got a better agent, I was auditioning all the time, it just completely went a different direction.
And part of the reason was because you know, you feel better, you have such a deeper connection, you can, you know, feel good in your body have a deeper connection to your creativity, to your intuition, essentially, all of a sudden I had a lot more confidence. And, you know, my take on the character, or what I had that was special to me that I could bring to the table.
So I ended up going to the Institute of Integrative Nutrition for a number of years, was teaching workshops to actors so I was like, we need to know that like, you should know, if you're someone who's a little bit more anxious, you shouldn't be drinking coffee before an audition, you're going to spiral out of control, you need to balance out like healthy fat and protein. So it was like helping people in that way.
And then and one thing led to another someone came to my workshop, I ended up getting hired at Maggie Flanigan, which is a conservatory in New York, and for a number of years was teaching nutrition classes, specifically to actors, which was so much fun because you empower these people to like, use their instrument in a different way. And then that sort of led to just a bunch of speaking - different speaking opportunities. I was guest lecturing at NYU and their performance department, which was really cool.
And it was this funny thing where, you know, my acting career would move ahead, and then something would happen in my health coaching career and acting and health coaching and acting and health coaching, and fast forward to the pandemic, I had just moved to LA to sort of pursue both because I, you know, I sold representation, so going out a lot. But it was this funny thing, or was like that whisper that you have in your body that sort of like do this other thing. And I was like, No, I went to school, I'm an actor, I'm going to do the thing. And with the pandemic, everything being put on pause, it was the, and then so many people needing support with like physical and mental health. I started getting all these clients, this influx of people that needed support, that I had this moment of like, this is my purpose. This is what I need to actually listen to this because like, yeah it's cool when I shoot a Buick commercial, but like, what's really cool is watching someone heal and transform their life and then be able to live their dreams.
And once it's already gone to that perspective, I was like, I will always be an actor. I always love acting. I always love comedy. If someone wants to give me a roll, hell yeah I'll do it. But you know it, feels it - I got to the point where I'm like, this feels like my purpose. And then you know, what's so fascinating was, it took me until probably the beginning of this year to really give myself full permission to step into my creative voice within this work. And as soon as you do that, it's like, all of these people are showing up. All the more money is showing up. And I've never felt more creative or connected to my creative voice or in my body or happier as like an artist. Even though it's not traditionally that sense, where it's like I'm writing different things all the time - I'm contributing to magazines and I'm speaking I'm you know, I'm storytelling. But I was like, once I was allowed to reframe that for myself, I'm like, No, you're still an artist, you're just an artist who does it a little differently and helps empower other artists. I was like, Oh, that's cool. I'll be that kind of artist then.
Yeah, that's awesome. I think it's so incredible that you've like really built this community around you. And I kind of want to go back to like, when you were having all of your health issues, you know, were there people that you could really, that could help you through that? Because I think that that's one thing - just mental health in general - I talk a lot about how mental health is like a multi-pronged approach. And you really need to look at like all of the different holistic aspects of mental health. It's not just medication, it's not just your, you know, social and physical environment, it's not just your physiology, and how you've talked to yourself, and how your parents have taught you to talk to yourself, it's not just your spirituality, like, it's really all of those four things. And it's so important to like, look at all those four things.
And I think that one of the best things that we can do for our mental health is to kind of build our community that, that hits on all of those things, you know, like, find someone who really connects to you like spiritually, and you have that alignment of a community and that kind of thing. And of course, the brain chemistry very much relates to what you're talking about, you know, because obviously, we all - in a previous episode, I talked about brain chemistry, specifically, and how we all are born with a baseline, like we all have a baseline foundation of how we relate to the world, chemically. And I think that - I agree that this is so important for this to be something that we talk about that like what we put in our bodies, so strongly affects those chemicals. So yeah, I'm curious, you know, if you had a community that kind of helped you realize that or if it was really just this book that kind of blew it all up for you?
You know, it's interesting, I didn't and, you know, it was really frustrating was like, I was doing everything that my peers were doing, like I you know, my circle of friends, like we ate the same, we drank the same. And I was the only one who's having all these physical problems. Everyone else was like, well, what's wrong with you? Why are you so hungover? Why are you - they're like, Why? Why can't you eat this? Why are you allergic to that? And it was really, it was a little bit like, what's wrong with me? That was a big part. Like, that was sort of a narrative for a little while.
And I was very lucky to grow up in a house that was like, my parents were total hippie dippie. I, like grew up in Maine, eating organic food running around barefoot, so my mom was very was one of the first people when I was having all these issues to be like, okay, let's like, look into something else before we put you on tons of medication, because like this could be there could be other things going on. So she really empowered me and supported me to make other decisions. And my boyfriend at the time was really supportive. But he didn't, you know, and he had had anxiety attacks previously, he's pretty sensitive. So he was so so supportive in that arena. So I could call him like a lawyer, I'd call him up in his law job, I'd be like, I'm not gonna die right? And he'd talk me down. And it was really great.
But a lot of my friends sort of looked at me like I was an alien. And then once I did this, this protocol is healing protocol. My regular doctor in New York thought I was kind of nuts. And they were like, well, if it's working, like we can't really tell you what to do. So I remember I sought out this naturopath, I like just was googling other people. And I went to Brooklyn, and I found this girl and it was so interesting. I remember walking into her office. And she was around, you know, she's probably like, around 30 - glowing skin, beautiful hair, energetic, you know, proper weight. And then I was thinking about, I'm going to my general practitioner, and like Midtown, who's like, in her 50s, overweight, grumpy, wrinkly, she's like, seems not vital. And I was like, oh, yes, I want health advice from this woman. She knows what she's doing.
So here and there, and then going to the Institute of Integrative Nutrition was a big community. But you know, it's interesting. It was like, once I and I truly believe this, I've gotten a lot more spiritual on my healing journey. I definitely wasn't, but it was interesting, like adopting meditation actually really helped me heal. But once I sort of stepped on that path. People were slowly showing up, and I was creating a community. But initially, no, I didn't and it was hard. And then that's why I think I had so much success, especially with my class when I started teaching these things, because all of a sudden actors were like, Oh, wait, I have those issues, or there's a place to go. And there other people that experience it? But no, not that I was like, totally a pioneer, but in my own life, I definitely didn't have that.
Yeah. Yeah, I think it's I think it's really fascinating. I'm curious, you know, like, as you were starting to make these changes to your gut health in order to transform your life in this way. Did you immediately - like, were you tracking as far as like, I'm eating this and it's causing anxiety, I'm not eating this, and it's, you know, where are you doing that kind of tracking? Because that's where I think, you know, this is something that I've talked about on a previous episode - is our patterns are so important and so affect our mental health. And I have encouraged people, I usually leave, like give people little bits of homework at the end of episodes. And on one of the episodes, I suggested writing down three things that make you happy, that made you happy that week, and three things that did not make you happy. And over the course of a month or so you'll really start to see that the things that make you happy are often the same. And the things that make you unhappy are often the same. And it's just about like, just those tiny little changes that you can make to your life that will just like, improve your whole sense of self and being in so many ways. And I'm sure that it's the same when it comes to nutrition and food.
Absolutely. Oh, yeah. No, I was on a very sort of strict Whole Foods, no processed food, no sugar, no dairy, no gluten, no caffeine. And once I started to add that back in, it was like, Oh, yeah, that doesn't, that hurts my stomach, that makes me feel crazy. And it's interesting. A lot of people don't know this. But like, most people don't do well with gluten in the form that it is in, especially the United States these days. And if you're someone who's predisposed to anxiety, gluten can exacerbate that, as well as depression here, it's like it's, you're not maybe going to have a stomach issue, but it's going to affect your mental health, or may give you brain fog, or something like that. So like paying attention to those things.
And it was funny, I was working with a client who's an actor in New York recently. And I do, essentially a version, a much shorter version of the six month protocol with a lot of my clients initially, that essentially is detoxing off of anything that behaves like sugar, or that's inflammatory in your body. And it's like, basically, like a Whole Foods reset. And he again, suffered, like a lot of people suffers from anxiety, especially these days. And it was so interesting, because he was saying, because he cut caffeine out as well. And he had this two week period where he felt really good. He felt a lot more creative, he had all these new ideas for things he wanted to write. And he said, it was so funny, he calls them the Gremlins, which I kind of like, yeah, those those thoughts in your brain that are always like nagging everything. And he was like, you know, so interesting. My Gremlins were gone. And all of a sudden, I like wanting to write all these new screenplays. And there was like, no one telling me not to do it. And then I introduced caffeine. And they came right back. I was so proud of him for that, for realizing that. And then the same thing was he was like, but I want to keep caffeine anyway. And I'm like, Okay, we've seen let go of it for him, because he's seen that you know, the difference.
But it's often, you know, the awareness is one thing, you know, really making that connection. But then beyond that, so many people fight for their limitations. It's like, "No, but I love coffee." And it's like, you just said that it affects your mental health negatively. And like you want to continue to put that. So it's it definitely can be a process. And it was hard for me to like, actually, because I'm someone who just does a lot better eating really cleanly. Like without a lot of alcohol, without caffeine without, you know, all the fun things. I thrive when I don't have them in my body. And it took me years to actually get to a place where I was like, No, I actually value my mental and physical health and like my performance and how I show up in life without it.
So, I love what you said about how we fight for our limitations. I think that that's really profound, and definitely resonates with me as well. And I'm curious, you know, with your clients, if you've seen a pattern as far as why they're fighting for those limitations, like what is the reason for it?
Well, I think that, well, it's proven. I've read articles and books about this, where, you know, we get really accustomed to even like, a set of emotions, like three or four emotions, and they don't - often aren't necessarily positive. They're anxiety, longing, sadness, whatever it is, but because we've been accustomed to them our entire lives, that's what feels safe. So with a lot of limitations, whether it's coffee, whether it's alcohol, whether it's feeling sad all day, whether it's a negative relationship, we've created this situation that felt safe for us. So going outside of that, even though it's something that's probably going to make you feel better, that feels scary, and our brains like "no, no, no, we're gonna die, we're gonna die." It's like, no, you're actually not gonna die, you're gonna feel better, be more proactive in your life or whatever. But it's getting over that fear hump.
Yeah, that's really fascinating. So if someone wants to start looking at nutrition and how it affects their mental health, what would you say is the first step?
I would say, well, depends how much you want to go for it. I think it goes elimination diet is a really good idea doing at least 10 days where you're just doing Whole Foods, you're taking away things like caffeine and alcohol and processed foods and added sugar. Because what happens when we're having things like alcohol, processed foods, all kinds of scary things in them, you know, excess sugar caffeine is you're kind of all over the place in terms of your cravings, your emotions. And what you end up doing, when you take all that out is like you sort of calm yourself down and get a lot more connected to yourself. So then it's almost easier when you add things back in. But you could even just start slowly and cut - you know, most people know - and this is the biggest thing I do in my practice at this point, is teach people how to listen their bodies. Which is really kind of brilliant to do with food, because food gives you really obvious signals, when it's not for you.
The cool thing about learning to listen in this way, it not only affects what you eat, but the people you surround yourself with and the jobs you say yes to - all those things. It's creating a deep connection to your intuition. And so just cutting out caffeine for three weeks or so, and just really paying attention how you feel, and then bringing it back in and just really listening. You know, what's my digestion like? How's my energy? How's my focus? What are my thoughts doing? Like, you could do that one at a time. And you know, whatever it is, if you really get quiet and check in with yourself, ask the question, what is the thing that is not serving you? Your body will tell you. You just have to be brave enough and quiet enough to listen and trust it.
Yeah, absolutely. That's really cool. And, you know, you said that meditation was such a huge part of your own practice. Do you? Is that something that you kind of guide your clients with as well?
Yeah, I'm a huge, huge, huge - because once I said I'm very nerdy about science, like I could read about, you know, your neural pathways...
Same. I think it's so important to like, know that stuff about your brain. It's really cool.
So badly. It's like between your brain health and gut health, which are still connected. I could read about that stuff all day long. And that's when I started to realize maybe I probably should do this, instead of acting. I just want to beautify your microbiome all day. And I'd get like an audition like a 10 page script. I'm like, Ah, this isn't about gut bugs. I don't want to do it. It's like what is wrong with me? But meditation, I mean, if it were a drug would be like a multi billion dollar industry, with how amazing it is for our bodies.
And for me, so much of because I had chronic inflammation for such a long time, it ends up raising your cortisol levels. So my adrenals were a mess. And I had adrenal fatigue, and introducing meditation, you know, lowered my cortisol and lowered inflammation, allowed healing tap into my body. But, you know, and lowers blood pressure and blood sugar. And, you know, you I'm sure know, this, you know, you create new neural pathways. So you're priming your brain to be calmer, more empathetic.
But why I love it, especially, you know, for all of those reasons. And the fact that you become aware of how your own brain works, how you speak to yourself. And the more you start to get quiet and pay attention to that you create that space, between cause and reaction where you you have conscious choice for the first time where you can make a different choice. And that is true, even about thoughts. And like you said, it's so important how we talk to ourselves. So once you start to meditate, once you start realize how you're talking to yourself, and now it's not great, you can, you know, slowly get out of those patterns simply even by noticing the crappy thing you say, and then turning it around, and making that an exercise you do over and over again. But I love it just for the awareness aspect of it. And I think it gives you more conscious choice in all areas of life, and allows you again, to cultivate that deeper sense of listening, which, you know, our wisdom is in our bodies we have our entire nervous system is in our gut. And arguably is more reliable than our brai. The more we can get connected on our bodies, the more your life is just going to flow.
Yeah, definitely. So um, what does taking care of your mental health mean to you?
I think it is sleeping. That's one of the most important things when anyone comes to me to fix anything. I'm like, okay, that's top of the list. You can't do anything if you're not sleeping correctly, especially - it affects your brain. So sleeping seven to nine hours if you can. Quality sleep. Eating real food, because again, our bodies - food is medicine, food does information for our cells? So if you're, you know, do you want yourself to be made out of Doritos or you know, grass fed beef? I was reading an article the other day that said that I was like, that is so brilliant. It's the truth and that's true for your brain. So you know, the quality of what you put into your body affects the quality of what comes out.
Movement. Any sort of movement is so good for brain health. Meditation for sure. And then positive connection. I think we have to have those connections to like you said, people - were so community oriented as people. So having that really healthy community of people around you.
Yeah, absolutely. How have you been able to maintain that community aspect through the pandemic and isolation and all that?
It's been interesting. It's been difficult definitely, through things like this, through zoom. And I actually, when I joined clubhouse, like a month or two ago, and that actually has been really good for my mental health. I'm an extrovert, and I, you know, here I am not - I'm in England right now. So we've been in lockdown for months now. Yeah, I'm seeing like one other person. Yeah. And you know, the, you know, the outgoing actress in me is like shriveling up and dying. And so I found cause I was like, Oh, my God, there are places where you can have organic, authentic conversations with people you don't know, this is amazing - about topics you care about. So really making sure that I am, you know, having interesting engaged conversations with people who might meet up or inspire me. Stuff like this, like this actually really feeds me and feeds my mental health. And connecting to my mom and dad. And you know, I have two best girlfriends who I make sure I'm facetiming with here and there.
But it's yeah, it's definitely been a challenge. But also a little bit of a relief. I think I needed a little bit of a break after 14 years in New York where it was just go, go, go, go, go, go go. So initially, the first half of it, I think I was better than most people because I think I just needed a break. I had gotten divorced. I was exhausted. I was like, Oh, I get to read quietly for a while. But then six months into it, I was starting to lose my mind a little bit, which is why I ended up going to stay with my parents in Maine which is like super safe. And then, weirdly enough, ended up like being able to social distance hang out with like two of my best friends from when I was like two years old. So just trying to find community and connect wherever I can.
Yeah, absolutely. And what do you think? Is there any practice that you've developed over this past year that you're going to bring into your post pandemic life?
My morning routine has gotten like ridiculous. But everything's zoom oriented. And it's gotten so indulgent, but it's been so like, it's obnoxious. Like I'm meditating for, I stay in bed, like doing morning routine stuff for like, sometimes two hours. And it makes all of the difference. It is like create - it helps me know what I'm posting about, it gives me ideas for my business. So really allowing myself the opportunity to indulge in, like at least a half an hour, if not an hour meditation. Reading stuff that really inspires me every day, whether that's intellectually, whether it's spiritually, I always have like five books going. So like allowing myself like 10 to 15 to 20 minutes of reading, at least a half an hour of meditation, and then at least half an hour of yoga. And then I get out of the bedroom, like yeah, I and it's so obnoxious.
Like this is the annoying thing that people say that everyone gets annoyed by. But like, truly for me, as someone who has I'm, I don't know if you're into human design, but I got into that during the pandemic, and it sort of unlocked a bunch of stuff for me. But as someone who doesn't have a ton of energy all the time, it was inconsistent energy, it allows me to start my day in a really, really connected way. And I've become more of its like, I almost want to call it like intuitive entrepreneur, where I've found it's just been a lot easier for me to just flow with what makes sense and connect to different people like you - like my business has grown that way. And the more I'm able to really connect to myself in the morning through meditation, through reading, through writing, through yoga - and I've obviously a much shorter version of that if I have stuff earlier in the day, I'll just try to meditate for like five minutes and then get out of bed. The more time I spend really connecting and getting clear about what my intentions are on my business, the better my business does. So I guess permission to really luxuriate for an hour. I'm going to really argue for that because it really makes me feel good. Yeah, I'd be curious to hear about what yours is.
My morning routine?
No, or what your or what your lesson that you're taking out of the pandemic.
Oh, that's a wonderful question.
Or morning routine, whatever you want.
I know. Well it's funny because I mentioned on a previous episode how I don't I don't like, I don't love the idea of a like strict morning routine. But I kind of have a morning menu that there's like a like a bunch of different things like maybe 15 different things that I know that I like to do in the morning and so then I kind of pick and choose that. I do have to say that yeah, allowing myself space to exercise and like move my body in multiple ways for like more than an hour is really important to me and it's something that I definitely have not given myself permission to do previously. And now of course that I'm home and not going to the gym, it's actually really great because I am not traveling. So it's, I'm kind of allowing myself to have that, you know, extra time, like, I'll, I'll walk my dog for at least 45 minutes and then do something else that's, you know, more rigorous for at least 45 minutes. And that's been really important.
I think the thing that has made - that I'm focused on the most is, is that social aspect. And as far as my community and how that affects me - I have been really... I love I'm also definitely an extrovert. I like to say that I think I'm a extroverted introvert and, and I, I love people. I love helping people. I love giving of myself to people, probably more than I should. But I have really, throughout this year, focused on the people that I allow into my space, even digitally. And if they are not serving me, knowing that that's maybe someone that I don't want to connect with in the future, you know, and so you know, as things are starting to open up now in LA and now that I'm fully vaccinated, which is freaking amazing. I, you know, am starting to see people but I'm being very selective as far as like, who I will - and I mean, this is even even just like going for walks like outside still masked up. And I'm like I, if I don't actually want to, if doing that drains me or makes me feel ichy or something, I'm just not going to do it anymore. And I'm really going to try and hold myself to that as much as possible. I think that - I think a lot about the difference about being "nice" and being "kind". And how, you know, we can always you should always be kind, but you don't don't always have to be nice. Like, it's just it's really important to, for me to stick to my guns as far as who I let into my, into my physical or digital space.
I love that so much. And I completely agree. And I remember, I think it was last summer when I got home. And I would think it was around one of my, like, neighbors or something. And I realized I had such a lower tolerance for people. Not that I don't like - that don't resonate, you know, and it was so interesting, because I was like, wow, I feel forever changed by the fact that like, I can't, I don't have time for this. And I don't have space for this. Like, it feels like itchy - almost like a reaction. So I completely - completely that resonates with me. And I think that's so beautiful. Because I think especially like you were saying, as being people who love to help and probably do it too much. Sometimes we don't have the best boundaries, where it's like, that is such a really good boundary to put up there.
Definitely. Yeah, I mean, that's and I was gonna say that something that I that I work with my therapist on a lot is boundaries and in every aspect of life. And I think that that relates so much also to what you do, as far as you know, just building boundaries around, you know, what we put in our bodies.
Yeah, what I was gonna say was, I also really, really loved what you said about your morning menu. Because that is, in essence, what I teach people, it's like, what you're doing is you're listening to your body, what do I feel like doing today? Right. And that's the number one thing that's going to lead you to like health and happiness and success. So I love that as an idea. And I think we should be teaching that instead of morning routine. It's like what's on your morning menu? What do you feel like doing today? Because that I think that's the key with anything really. It's like what's on your food menu? What's on your friend menu? What do you actually feel like showing up and doing today?
Right? Yeah. And I think the important thing is, is to kind of take it a step further. It's not just like, you know, what, the, what the immediate feeling as far as like, Okay, I'm putting this in my body, because it's delicious. And yes, I want to eat all of the chocolate bars. But also, you know, tracking how your body reacts to that and how you're going to feel after and I think that that applies to people as well. Like I certainly have in the past said yes to certain, you know, situations or relationships or whatever. And then - and it's purely because I'm like, I'm going to be good, and I'm going to like do this thing for other people and it's been wonderful. And then like two days later, I'm like, why did I do that? That was not - that was not beneficial for me in any way. And it actually did not make me feel very good. And I think it's so important to like, then track that and, and then set that boundary for the future and be like, even though you want it to do it right now, it doesn't necessarily mean that that is going to be beneficial in the long run to you.
Absolutely, absolutely. No, I think it's really important. It's really important.
So just to, you know, cycle back to what you were talking about bulimia, I'm curious what, when you work with people, how you relate to people that have like body dysmorphia, or just like their, you know, because there's something about nutrition, and then there's about our relationship to our body and ourselves and how we show up in the world. And, you know, and so I'm curious how you kind of bridge that and, and help people through whatever they're struggling with?
Well, with most people, with everyone, I try to get them to focus inward instead of outward. So no calories, no scales, no, like everything is based on how you feel, yeah, like you come to me, you learn how to how to feel good in your body, and how to listen and how to navigate life through listening to, you know, your internal directives. So getting the emphasis on the inside versus the outside is incredibly helpful in a lot of those situations. Especially, you know, throw the scale, I don't ever have people weigh themselves, I don't ever, like that's not something I'm interested in. It's it goes from, and I'll work with people who want to lose weight, but I will emphasize, like, I'm going to get you healthy, we are going to focus on your gut health and your mental health. And losing weight might be a byproduct of that. But like, that's not our goal. If you come to me, it's like, you're gonna learn how to heal and optimize your body.
And beyond that, what I noticed for myself, and what I noticed for a lot of people is that eating disorders, obsessive thoughts about food, and calories and weight and your appearance are often not the actual problem, they are some solution that you had to avoid some other problem. Like for me, it was really powerful to learn. And I actually learned this pretty early on with my bulimia, I am just so incredible. I'm like empathy, a sponge of like, empathy, and I just am the most sensitive person. And going to college having so many things happen and living in a space with other people's energy, there was a lot for me, that wasn't the most positive environment, it was a way to control emotion that I didn't know how to - I was overwhelmed by. So sort of stuffing them down and then getting out of my body.
And once I sort of realized that later in life, and through - I went to therapy, I you know, I did a lot of things to work on that. But whenever I would have those thoughts start to come up, I would realize those were just signals that there was different, there was an imbalance somewhere else in my life. Maybe I wasn't sleeping enough, maybe I wasn't being heard. Maybe I wasn't connecting to the right people. Maybe I was spending my time doing something I didn't, you know, I didn't enjoy. So with a lot of people, I really I offer them that as an opportunity to be look at, you know, these obsessive thoughts or, you know, the, the urge to throw up or restrict your food. It's like, what are we trying to avoid? What are we trying to control what's underneath this, because 99.9% of the time, it's a deeper emotional thing that really, really has that much to do with your body, its control, its sadness, its fear.
So then getting under and really working on reprogramming that or, you know, healing that. And sometimes it's outsourcing to therapists and other specialists. And other times, it's just doing, you know, really focusing on creating balance in life. And what I see nine times out of 10 is cleaning up some of the diet, getting them sleeping correctly, creating balance, there's this one concept and you said something about this earlier, that made me think of this, that I learned which was the idea of primary foods versus secondary foods. And your primary foods are your relationships, your career, spirituality, whatever that means to you and exercise. And your secondary foods or food, drugs, alcohol, anything you ingest. The idea is that if one of your primary foods is out of balance, it tends to manifest itself as a secondary food craving. So I tell people when you're having these crazy cravings, or obsessions, like let's go back to your primary foods. Where are you out of balance, and most of the time, it's in one of those areas. And then we go and try to create, you know, healing or balance or connection.
So it was very interesting for me because at first I was like, got into this so, so fascinated by the nutrition, but through the education I got, it was much more general coaching. So my first year I'm like coaching people in new careers or getting a divorce. So I ended up working with this woman in Ojai for a while, who has this company called The Human Being Store. She had studied with Deepak Chopra for a while and it's sort of spiritual leadership and development, so teaching people essentially how to listen. So I have this interesting background where it's like very nutrition and science and coaching based but also in terms of life balance. And then really getting people tuned in to listening to, you know, not only listening and trusting to their body, but like, what's my purpose? Why am I here? What brings me joy? What are my sort of like talents, strengths and skills.
So I brought both of those together. Finally, to create this thing where it's like, inside out - outside in. Where, especially with things like eating disorders, it's really incredibly helpful. Because when you remove things like gluten, another example with gluten, it causes binge eating in a lot of people. And that's just a side effect of it. So if that was someone with a binge eating disorder, we remove things like that, that trigger binge eating, great, you're not going to be triggered physically. And then we look at the rest of your life and we create balance there, then you're not going to be triggered as much emotionally. And we're giving you tools on both sides to go out in life and notice when you're getting triggered, and to be able to have that space for conscious choice to be like, "Okay, I know that I just want to eat a bag of cookies, but like, what just triggered that? What could I do? Maybe I need to like call my boyfriend back and tell him that hurt my feelings, whatever it was."
I think it's, I really liked that you just brought up triggers, because I think that that's, you know, one of the things that we need to be aware of is, is how we're being triggered both by food, but also by external situations. This, this is where I think that figuring out what those triggers are, and then setting boundaries for yourself to try and mitigate those triggers is really valuable. I mean, even so much as especially this past year, the news is so - has been so triggering, and I think that there's been, I think that everyone's awareness of that, like one positive side of the pandemic is, I think that everyone's awareness of how triggering the news can be and how much the media controls the narrative and, and how we're feeling about ourselves and how we're feeling about society. And it's really important to be able to kind of step back from that and say, "Okay, this thing is triggering me, let's look at why. And is that something that I need to remove from my life", because it is going to just keep causing these triggers over and over and over again.
And the other, you know, side of this is I was speaking on something the other day where I was talking about triggers, and I was talking about how triggers can be positive or negative. And I think that we often look at triggers as negative, but there also could be positive triggers where it's like, you know, you're, I don't know, going this isn't really a trigger, but it's like, if you're going for a really long walk, and then you're like, really want water or like really want lemon water or something like even though that's, you know, also you're like dehydration levels and your thirst coming into play. it's still a trigger. It's still like one thing that, you know, catalyzes into something else. And I think that that's also about building these habits that are that are positive, that are all related to those triggers positive.
Absolutely. No, like hearing a song that you love. I mean, triggering like a nice emotion. Absolutely. I think it's all related. And it was funny with a client recently, we were talking about, he was sort of reintroducing a lot of things. And had had this weekend of just debauchery in terms of - he like, got really drunk. And then the next day is hungover , he said that he got drunk again. And then it culminated with like eating a box of Girl Scout cookies. And he was like, but I know that if I hadn't gotten super drunk on Friday, I wouldn't have eaten those Girl Scout cookies on Sunday. And I think it's the same thing with health and wellness. It's like, I know that, like, if I spend even five minutes in the morning meditating, it's gonna affect the rest of my day, in terms of how I show up to my clients how the food choices I make, it's gonna be and then it's like, then it'll make it a lot easier for me to do yoga. And then when I do yoga, it's gonna make it a lot easier for me to make better food choices. So it one triggers the next. And being mindful about - Yes, that getting super drunk Friday can trigger a bender all weekend, the same thing, you can do the same thing every day where it's like, "okay, I might not feel like meditating or doing yoga or going for a run or whatever it is. But I know if I do this one thing, the cascade of positive effects will be so much better." And that's again, like you were saying earlier, where awareness and sort of just having that menu of items that make you feel good, that trigger other good behaviors, is so important.
Yeah, absolutely. So just to start wrapping things up here. Um, so obviously, you've talked quite a lot about, you know, what you do with people, but I'd love for you to, you know, go into that a little bit more in case anyone wants to - is interested in working with you.
Sure. Thank you for the opportunity. Yeah, so I do one on one. And I also do - I I'm really excited because I just find really put together this group program that is, I feel like this is gonna sound silly, but it's like a culmination of my life's work. Everything I learned from like acting like going to a conservatory, and then studying nutrition and healing my body for the past 10 years, plus the Institute of Integrative Nutrition plus The Human Being Store, plus teaching in New York for a number of years, where it's this sort of, like I was saying earlier, like an inside out - outside in approach. And basically, it's a three month program that starts with really optimizing your body, like cleaning out the junk, putting a lot of great Whole Foods in but doing it with a lot of awareness. So what we're doing is creating a very individualized lifestyle plan for you. So you understand what makes you feel really good. And then going beyond that to sort of ingrain those habits, and figure out what comes up for you sort of mentally emotionally that gets in your way, and then unpacking that and doing a lot of neural reprogramming stuff. And working on the sort of triggers underneath and the blocks that get out of your way. And then ending with sort of getting a lot of mental clarity on what the next step is, and getting support in that. So the idea is you come out of it, mentally and physically optimized, but also really clear on what your next step is.
And it's I already have, it's about half full. And I'm really excited, because what I loved, I've been doing individual coaching mainly for the past six years. And it's just beautiful. Because what I end up doing essentially, is I'm just teaching people how to listen to their bodies. So much of what I do is just give, you know, science based information around nutrition. And we sort of play that do this dance of - do you think this would work for you? What do you think? What do you think? And I, my clients really lead the way with all of it. And what you see is once they start to sort of trust that judgment, you watch their life open up. And truly, it's so cheesy, but it's like the partner comes, in the raise comes in. And here I am just watching people really fall back in love essentially with like their humanity and who they are and connect more deeply to themselves, take much better care of themselves. And then their lives sort of like explode in this like fireworks, it's beautiful.
And what I really miss about what I when I used to teach in New York was there's something so beautiful about a group setting where people are committed to transforming and improving together. And so this is an opportunity to put those two things together. Because I think together, we can just go so much further. And the biggest thing too, is when I would teach in New York, people would come in and I would use there's always a sharing section, everyone a different homework, you had to give yourself homework, and then report back. Because it was always weird - some people were sleeping more some people was like calling your mom's, like cutting out gluten. And they would come in with these amazing sort of discoveries about their body. And once one person has this, this triggers something else, you know, you're teaching everyone else. So not only am I here to guide you, but you have this group of other people who are having this profound experience that is influencing yours.
So yeah, I'm obviously very nerdily excited about it, it started this starts in May. But I'm going to be doing it twice a year. And the coolest thing is, and I just say this to hopefully be an expander for others. It was this weird thing that I had like whispering in the back of my brain for a while where you know, one of those ideas, you're like, Oh, I don't know, that's kind of weird. And I finally this spring sort of was empowered to do it. And again, I was like, this is so specific and kind of random is anyone anybody interested? And I put it out on Instagram, I got a big, large amount of feedback. And then I'm doing these calls and this woman and it was like, she showed up and was like, this is what I've been looking for. And I was like, I had this moment where it's like, Oh, right, we have to listen to those little whispers that we have. We have to like trust your creativity, like whatever your urges are to do that weird thing that you think is totally random. We have to do it because there's someone there who's dying for the thing that you thought was totally bizarre, and no one was going to care about. Very like validating but also like, I just say that they like do your thing that you love. Yeah, we need it.
Yeah, there's a, oh gosh, I don't remember who it was. But there's some quote about if you've been given a dream, like if you have a dream, you have been given it on purpose, like by the Universe. So you need to follow that dream, otherwise you are going against the Universe, like the Universe would not give you something that you that you could not handle in whatever way positive or negative. And I think that that's, I definitely think that's true. So that's really awesome. I think that's really, really incredible. And just you know, because this is a mental health podcast, I've two final questions for you. So in like two sentences, how does your body relate to your mental health?
I think that you cannot be mentally healthy if you're not physically healthy. So I think Taking care of your body is one of the number one things you need to do in order to have proper mental health.
Awesome. And then final question, and this is a question I'm going to ask everyone. You know, as I said, in the beginning, More Than You See, I created because I do think that we all have masks that we that we were around people, and I'm curious if you, if that triggers anything for you, or if there's any mask that you have started to take off, or if there's any situations that you feel like you need to put a mask on. And if you just want to share that experience with us.
I feel like in stepping into honoring that, like this weird form of art, or becoming a health coach, whatever I've created with my business here, fully stepping into it, and I think I well, I know, I only did fully this year, the spring - was the first time I think I've taken my full mask off, since I probably was a teenager. And in doing so I have had the most beautiful response from basically everyone in my life. And it's allowed my business to, to expand and grow. It has allowed me to attract the right relationships in my life, it was so scary to peel it off slowly. But in doing so I worked really, really hard because as an actor, I never felt like - I guess I never felt - gave myself permission to. You know, it never felt fully right. I would book roles. But I would just always feel like there was a part of me that was trying to do it right, or be the good girl or be directable. And it didn't allow me full access to you know, all of my gifts. And feeling newly in this place where I'm like, naked, is so scary, but the most alive and the most proud of myself I've ever felt.
And I just share that to encourage everyone else to continue to go and become as authentic as they can. Because it only leads to beautiful things and like this stuff that we want to hide that we feel like is weird that we feel like is embarrassing, is truly this stuff that endears other people to us, or you know, attracts those specific people into our lives that we need for the right reasons. And in showing up more fully on my stories and like actually writing posts that I care about where I share things, I'm attracting the clients that I just didn't even know it was like you're we're meant for each other. This is so fun. So, I feel naked for the first time.
And then the only other thing is the one thing I haven't been able to figure out since getting sick was getting melasma - hyperpigmentation all over my face. And that is the only place that is an ongoing battle of like, I'm trying to love my face without makeup exactly how it is. And I've gotten a lot better during the pandemic. But it was like, no, I'm gonna wear makeup for this just meet you for the first time. Sometimes I'll filter my stories lately on Instagram just to like blur them a little bit. And I know that it's not a big deal. But to me, that's the one area where I still hide. I still feel shame. And I think it's related to acting sometimes. Or it's like you weren't you were supposed to be perfect forever. But I'm outing myself on your podcast for you in that in that sense, because I know that like I could love myself more.
Yeah, I mean, we all have things that we need to work on for sure. So thank you so much. I could not ask for a better first guest on this podcast. It was such an honor where can people find you? Obviously all the links will be in the show notes but if you want to give a shout out.
Sure. @HealthybyLianna on Instagram, healthybylianna.com. Either one I hang out on Instagram, more often than not. But with good boundaries. DM me, follow me, or you can email me through my website.
Awesome. Well, again, thank you.
Thank you. Oh my gosh, this has like, been so much fun. You're such a light. Your energy is so beautiful. Thank you for this opportunity to connect.
My absolute pleasure. Thank you.
Wow. Oh, my goodness, what an interview. I hope that this interview resonated with you as much as it resonated with me. There are so many different things that I have taken away from my conversation with her. Please be sure to reach out to me and let me know what are things that you learned about yourself, about others things that you're going to take away from this. I really do love to be connected to the entire community. So please reach out to me. Please be kind to yourself this week, try and figure out if there's something that you can do to align your physical health and your mental health in just a tiny, tiny little way, I guarantee you that it will help some greater understanding of your own body.
I want to give a very special thank you and shout out to Liana for coming and talking with me today. And I also want to introduce you all to my amazing new editor, Jennifer Lincoln. Jen, thank you so much for being part of this podcast. I am so excited to have this help for this season. And really enable this podcast to continue to grow and change the lives of others the way that it has changed my life in so many wonderful ways. Please remember that you and everyone around you is More Than You See. Thank you so much for listening. I will see you next week.
