it, I think so, so, so, you know, we, like lots of architects, I think we started using Vex works at a point where, you know, producing drawings was, was, was really a sort of trying to replicate as closely as you could what used to on a drawing board and and so Vex works felt like. The software that could deliver that, you know, 25 years ago, you know, you could make a beautiful, two dimensional, really nicely cross hatched, you know, drawing that mimic, you know, what you what you produce on a drawing board. And we all, we all liked it for that it was very different to, you know, other other softwares. And and, you know, and we carried on with that sort of process of designing for quite a long time. And in fact, there's still an element of that that we really love about the software, you know, you can do a very quick set of presentation documents from it, you know, for example, but, but, but over time, you know, we and we resisted the sort of shift to the sort of BIM, you know, whatever that is, because we felt like we were delivering good buildings. You know, let's look at the let's be outcome based what are we doing? We're delivering great buildings. Does it really matter how we're doing that we felt confident we could get there in a two dimensional environment, but there was an obvious need to change. And so, you know, over the over a period of years, we sort of tried to shift our processes. And I think we felt like we we would be better off trying to take a piece of technology that we felt we knew inside out and and try and get the results from it, than throwing away everything that we knew and starting from scratch. And I think that was born out really, because what became quite clear is that is is the software that you're using is important, but but getting your modeling conceptually right is even more important. So what are you actually going to model, and what are you not going to model? And so that that became evident to us, that we Yes, we could give we could give people information in a format that they need from vector works. We could deliver that in IFC, we could deliver it in Lyd, DWG. Can actually deliver Revit files directly from vector works now, so we could once we convince people that we could give them information in the format that they needed. The most important thing was then to make sure that your model is actually giving people information that they need, rather than just vast amount of data that you can put into a model, because you can, you know, and so I think, I think on the successful projects, it's where we've managed to convey that, that actually you're just saying, Look, forget about how we're doing it. It's what we're giving you that's important, and it's our again, it goes back to this idea that we as architects should understand fundamentally which bit of information you need to give to which person, rather than producing just going, here's a model, you know, and giving a model to the exactly with all of the information that a structural engineer might Need to the to the person who's doing the irrigation system for the landscape, you know, and so, you know what? What became fundamental was not the software, but in that shift from from doing things in a traditional way to a to a BIM modeled environment, was actually just under, just, just getting understanding what needs to go into the model so that you get the input right, then you've got a better chance of getting the right output. And so we put our time and our efforts into understanding that, rather than in tackling a new piece of software. And actually, it's been great, you know, and, and there are, you know, there's been some really great things that have come out recently. So, you know, we vector works, implemented a embodied carbon calculator built in to their software. So very, you know, very simply enables you to give. Give, assign materials to objects, components, etc. And within those materials is a, is a embodied carbon measure, so a measure of kilograms of embodied carbon per either meter cubed or kilogram or whatever. And you can embed that in your model. And obviously the thing that the model is great for us is extracting quantities, you know? So you can very quickly extract those quantities and apply through the calculator, apply, apply the materials and the and that level of information to it, and very quickly get, get an idea about the impacts that you're making through your design choices, you know. And that's just, you know, it's just been a really simple integration in the software that you know by understanding how to model things properly, and with a little bit of information, you know, knowledge about how to read an EPD. You can suddenly get some really high level, quick results to, you know, to to inform some of your design choices. So, yeah, you know, I, I feel like it's a, it's a conversation we have less and less really about about what software you're using to do something. Just demonstrate to somebody that you can do it. Give them the file, give them the give them the model, share it with them, let them interrogate it. And sometimes, you know what, if, if you're working with the wrong people, you're never going to change their view. Because if they've got to do more than just click one button, they'll, you know, and do something that they've already done. They're maybe going to be unhappy. But, you know, I'd like to think that that the quality of information that we're giving to people means that it doesn't matter whether it's whether it's come from Revit or it's come from anything else. You know, it's a fabulous data, really