Reverse Your Biological Age - Peptides, Spermidine, NAD, and Other Anti-aging Bi

1:04PM Jun 20, 2023

Speakers:

Angela Foster

Dr Neil Paulvin

Keywords:

patients

benefits

people

peptides

terms

works

ageing

women

red light therapy

mitochondria

alzheimer

higher doses

helps

sauna

health

depends

talk

studies

autophagy

red light

There are so many things now that can we use to optimise that cycle everything from things like red light therapy, which everybody can do to which works like on cytochrome oxidase. You can use things like a product called again Mazzi. I keep bringing it up.

Hi friends. In this week's episode, I am welcoming back Dr. Neil boven to the show. My last interview with Dr. Paul van was hugely popular where we talked all about the best peptide stacks for fat loss, muscle gain, pain relief and longevity. And in today's interview, we take a deep dive into the latest longevity science and the transformational therapies and other bio hacks including things like spermidine Euro lithium, a peptide like BPC 157, how to optimise NAD and a whole lot more. So without further delay, let's dive in. So I'm back today with Dr. Neil Pavan. I'm so excited to have you back on the show. Last time we recorded together it was hugely popular. I know that you have been following into even more things to do with regenerative medicine since we last spoke. Firstly, a very warm welcome to the show.

Thanks for having me again. Glad to be back.

Yeah, it's exciting to have you here. Let's talk about what's kind of new you you share a lot of content on your Instagram. A lot of the latest kind of scientific research one thing that took my eye recently, was you sharing some some research around rapamycin and how it's being studied to improve ovarian reserve and also potentially slow down ageing. I think this is a big thing. For many women. You know, a lot of women are having their first child later, but certainly, many women are looking to add to their families in their late 40s. Mid to late 40s. Tell, can you tell us a little bit more about that and how it might impact women and improve fertility for longer?

Sure, yeah. I mean, rapamycin was initially founded as just a cancer immunosuppressant higher doses multiple years ago. And now it's become pretty much in vogue for a lot of protocols. biohackers are just trying to, in theory, prolong life, improve longevity. And then as their people were using it and they were research went in specifically in terms of rapamycin ageing. And also that kind of now LinkedIn with is such a huge investment. Now, in trying to improve female, the duration that females can have children that were the only you animals out there, we only were females can only reproduce for pi, less than half their lifetimes. So a lot of research has been going into that that's now kind of messed with what the research was with the longevity part of rapamycin. And now there are studies being done at a Institute here in New York City, where we're using it to help fertility. And that's, that works out a couple of different ways. So first of all, because of its anti inflammatory, and its effects on toffee G, which is the body's ability to kind of recycle its own cells get rid of the garbage that may be part of the, they're now finding that mitochondrial and autophagy is maybe one because it was never really treated for women not being able to come pregnant, or maintain good egg quality or both. So that became kind of the initial entry into that. And now we're also finding that it may help initially initiate the body's ability to produce the eggs and they improve the quality and also improve how quickly and the quality of how well the egg matures. So it's working on numerous levels. Right now it's being used, I think this days, about 50 Women now who are waiting for an egg donor who just don't can't produce quality eggs. I know there are some patients abused on the kind of behind the scenes, and it's produced some really good results. The goal now is to try to figure out the appropriate dosing. And is this something that is going to really develop into something that can be used for a lot of women worldwide in terms of who are dealing with infertility? It has based on the science that's underlying it, it looks to have great potential, again, as we're just trying to figure out the dosing and how often a woman would take it. But it's something that is a really huge excitement right now in the medical infertility world.

For sure, for sure. And obviously, you're talking now about improving quality. For example, can it impact the number of eggs in any way? I know that there there used to be a theory around the fact that that was fixed originally and number one, it was the research showing that

I mean, that's that's very limited. Now this is the first one of the first major stages of rapamycin and a production in humans and other animals that has improved a egg. Egg number Hopefully there'll be be reproduced in humans. But again, we're now just entering the the human rapamycin fertility trial. So we'll know more, hopefully a year or two, we'll know a lot more than we do. Now, again, there's great potential but in other animals had shown that possibility.

And what about for women, for example, who have completed their families, but they are in perimenopause? Would there be potential benefits to them? Trying something like this to actually delay menopause? And some of the because obviously, when we look at menopause, it brings with it potential adversities in terms of health, like increased inflammation, increased stress, you know, bone density issues, sometimes blood sugar regulation, if people and obviously, we'll talk about the lifestyle measures, but do you think that there will be any benefit to women deliberately trying to delay menopause in terms of ageing,

using wherever motion or just in general using anything?

I think, I think in general, kind of leading out from that rapamycin but also how rapamycin might help with that. Would there be a benefit to women in doing that?

Oh, definitely. I mean, definitely. That's like getting that that's where a lot of research is going in terms of optimising how long women can have optimal hormone production. I mean, women need oestrogen, women need progesterone for new for muscle building, brain health, cognition, energy, all and more in terms of the benefits of anything from hair scanning and electrical, the list goes on and on and on. So is it something that all the things that we're using now to potentially maximise women's health and, and, and increase their ability to have a normal menstrual cycle and normal female hormones long as possible is something that I would definitely recommend for most women in conjunction to whatever again, with discussing with their healthcare provider, but again, things like we already mentioned, terms of mitochondria health, dealing with autophagy dealing with inflammation, and then maximising hormones are all going to be big components of how women can prolong normal menstrual health. And that's now corresponding with the ability to do deeper dives, lab, work wise, inflammation wise, and potentially into even autophagy and things like that. So I think it's, it's the next couple of years, it's gonna be a lot more prominent. And the last thing I'll say is that the problem was that and it's been around for a while now is that a lot of things weren't done on females because it couldn't veer away around way of doing going around. Women have hormone cycles, and they're not set like men are. But now again, there's a bunch of money being poured in a lot of stuff going on, it gives a lot more deeper dive into that.

Detoxification is so important now more than ever, with the number of toxins we are exposed to daily in our food, water, personal care products and environment. No matter how careful we are, it's impossible to totally get away from the chemicals. And we also have to think about detoxifying the toxins we produced through cellular respiration and clearing excess hormones like oestrogen. Our skin is one of the key ways we detoxify. And that's why I love to include sauna as part of my weekly routine. But going to a facility with a sauna can be time consuming, and investing in one yourself has been expensive in the past. That's why I love Bong chargers sauna blanket. It has so many benefits from raising your heart rate to that a physical exercise, so you burn calories whilst you relax, you can burn up to 600 calories in just one session. The sweating helps flush out heavy metals and other toxins and the infrared light which heats the body directly rather than the air around you mean you get the same benefits at a lower heat. On charges sauna blanket is easy to set up taking less than a minute. It heats up rapidly and you can enjoy a session for 30 to 40 minutes whilst relaxing, reading watching TV or even meditating so you can truly stack your hacks. Bong chargers sauna blanket is also low EMF compared to other brands on the market, and it's the quickest on the market to heat up. So it's an easy thing to fit in. When I'm not working out in the morning you'll find me meditating in my bond charged solar blanket with a red light therapy mask on my face boosting collagen while I relax and bond charger giving listeners of this podcast 20% off their sauna blankets, red light therapy devices and other wellness products. Bond charts ship worldwide in rapid time with free shipping on every sauna blanket and 12 months warranty. Simply go to bond charge.com forward slash Angela and enter code Angela 20 at checkout that's B oncharg.com forward slash a n g e l a and use code Angela 20 to save yourself 20% What would you say then? I know a lot of listeners of this podcast are kind of in their 40s they're looking at optimising healthspan alongside longevity What are some of the key things that you think are important for a woman to be thinking about?

Sure. I mean, the key thing I tell everybody, it's the core four, no matter what sleep exercise, diet, stress, I mean, the main things we now know especially I mean, sleep and exercise are the big to maintain that normal circadian rhythm, we know there's effect on the immune system effect on the hormone system if you don't have a good circadian rhythm. And as well as we know, sleep is when you recycle your hormones and increase your numbers of the hormones that you need. And then we again, every day, there's a new study that shows how important exercise is for maintaining hormones and health and bone strength. And to limit sarcopenia, which is the breakdown of muscle, especially as females get older, but men as well, those are the big two. And then the other pieces are kind of beyond that it's optimising hormones, making sure that you're discussing things with your doctor and getting a getting tested and getting evaluated. I'm not sure how controversial statement will be on this, try to avoid going to have a birth control if humanly possible, because it does deplete your hormone levels. And then there's again, those other quick things that we always know. I mean, gut health is still obviously important in terms of maintaining got bounced, you know, the gut brain axis that there's issues, the gut, we're doing more and more with the microbiome, butyrate, and things like that are gonna affect the brain as you get older. And then probably the other big one is mitochondrial health, which has become a really big push for me and other people out there that we're gonna get into this thing a state comes out every day linking my problems, the mitochondria healthy, pretty much every illness out there at this point. And we knew about five or six main processes that go on with the mitochondria that are going to affect health in general. And also, in terms of specific in terms of females specifically. And it's working on from different aspects from everything from doing red light to some of the peptide called mod c to a product we discussed before your licencing and might appear which induces my toffee G to dealing with oxidative stress, which is helping a body control what are called free radicals. So those are probably the core ones. I mean, I could pipe goal is a 10 more things that are out there. But those are kind of the big ones that I struggle with my patients and this new growing research behind.

So if we look at that, obviously the let's assume that people are working on those pillars in terms of like managing their stress, getting the right exercise, the right sleep and the right nutrition. You mentioned quite a few things that I want to pick up on, first of all, in terms of mitochondrial health, and I think this is a big issue. It massively affects energy levels as well. And I think that if you look at and this would correlate with my own experience, if you look at women in their 40s, I think that as a decade, it's an extraordinarily busy decade, for most women, they tend to often be raising families, if they've had children, they're pretty advanced in terms of their career. So the demands on them in terms of leadership positions, and things that build that up can be quite high. If they're still working often they're having to couple into that mix. Maybe they've got ageing parents they're looking after I think they are being pulled in multiple different directions. So I think that the energy demands are very high. And then they have these hormonal disruption that's taking place a little bit like when puberty happens, right? We're sort of exiting out a little bit. The other end mitochondrial health, you said that there are five to six main processes in terms of are enhancing the health of mitochondria. Could you elaborate a bit more on what those are?

Sure. So the one thing I mentioned was definitely the body issues with my toffee G which is the same as autophagy, just for the mitochondria, where the buyer is able to recycle, replenish and replace damaged mitochondria. The second one would be the one that most people are you mentioned energy is the electron transport chain, which is the most the body's ability to produce their energy. If you're old enough to remember Pac Man, it's like you're producing ATP just like your little power pellets or you're plugging into your socket. There are so many things now that can we use to optimise that cycle everything from things like red light therapy, which everybody can do to which works like on cytochrome oxidase. You can use things like a product called again Mazzi. I keep bringing it up and I'll probably bring it up again one other couple times might see or another peptide called SF 31. We're using a product called methylene blue which works on boosting ATP and again on cytochrome oxidase. So a lot of different entities and people know NAD or even things simple things like magnesium or coke YUTAN all those different things can be used to amplify energy and mitochondrial health. Again, inflammation inflammation is everywhere. We want to do what we can to decrease inflammation. I mentioned oxidative stress, which is the by by no matter what it does, it's going to create like anything else it's gonna Create a few sparks or a little bit of dust, the bite is good at getting rid of that, it's when your body you producing too many too much dust or too many Sparks, your body can't keep up and that those will create damage. So that's where the use of antioxidants come in. There's tonnes of antioxidants out there and AC glutathione a new one that's kind of become known for sleep. But now melatonin has really become a very popular antioxidant, because of its ability to because of the fact that they're really good antioxidant as so many other benefits as well. But you don't want to use antioxidants all the time, we know you kind of usually want to kind of do it occasionally do it as a cycle and not do it in perpetuity. I mean, I just find more than five I mean, the main other ones we look at are again, depletion of any chemicals or anything else. If you're just if your oestrogen is low, you want to fix it, if there's a patient who has low magnesium or any any D like I mentioned before, those are things that want to be replaced. And they're just really small ones that nerd like me love digging into those called fission and fusion, which is chemistry people know is either the breaking apart of the binding of the mitochondria, which actually will affect the way the mitochondria works and, and functions and what's called mitochondrial allele with mitochondria, what's called mitochondrial biogenesis, which is the growing of more mitochondria exercise is the easiest one to do actually, things like dry brushing and things like that actually may augment that cold pool do cold plunges also can induce myocardial easier for me to say mitochondrial biogenesis. And then they'll do what people may be hearing about soon is what's called endoplasmic reticular stress, which is the body's ability to the mitochondria ability to make proteins and regulate proteins. And again, it's like any any other process, your body normally has the ability to get rid of the bad ones, like if you have a bad, whatever bad food that you're making, and you get rid of it. But when the body can keep up with the bad ones and the bad ones take over, then you're in trouble and that we're seeing now with conditions like diabetes, potentially, we're seeing a lot now for Alzheimer's. And they're thinking something actually an antibiotic klutzy. Thermax may help that and a couple other things like actually, rapamycin may have an issue there. A benefit there too. So there's a lot of things that we can do.

Some of you picked up on there, you were talking about dry brushing for the health of the mitochondria. I've always associated that with detoxification and kind of enhancing lymphatic flow.

People who do things like wash or dry brush, and there's been a couple of days, there's done that vigorous action may increase some mitochondrial biogenesis it's not anyone close to we're doing things like saw like sauna or hold or exercise is gonna do. It's just something that any anybody says they can't do something if you can't do any dry brushing or exercise, then we have then then we're in trouble here. So that's kind of why I brought it up, but it's on the lower end of in terms of benefit.

I want to stimulate, regardless, right. Tracking back now. Methylene blue and red light therapy. What's the best way to utilise those two things together? Is there a particular timing? What would you recommend?

Together I mean, together is obviously the perfect time and I tell people to do in the morning, just because it can be spray stimulatory so obviously, we don't want to affect sleep. In terms of how to do it, it depends. I like doing a red light that has a mix of red and near infrared. You do want a 10 which is near infrared to really work on this cytochrome acetate that's been studied more than read the red spectrums. Methylene blue I get asked all the time, what's the best way to do it? In the United States? I mean, you can have access to IVs they find it sometimes easier for people get the doses they need do IV. I'm not sure how the problems that are out there, right. I know. I I've actually have several patients throughout in Europe and they have no access to it, it's very hard for them to find that you can get the oral medication that was methylene blue in general, you want to make sure if you're on any type of psychiatric medicine you discuss with that provider, if you should be on methylene blue because they can have some poor interactions. But again, I recommend find that dose that works to you I'm actually very sensitive to it. So I do low dose. I have a colleague who does the opposite and loves only feels when he does mega doses of it. So some of you have to figure out what fits but the goal is usually find that start low dose, I mean, the most opposer out there for 812 milligrammes and then do that with the near infrared light optimally, either at the same time. That's how we do it in the office or pretty close together. But again, with the methylene blue, you definitely want to talk to your healthcare provider, if you're on certain medications, but its benefits are amplified. So this

will be an example someone has a red light therapy device at home, they would have, like, for example, a sublingual Turkey, that they break off a quarter put it in their mouth as they're in front of so they're kind of absorbing that as they're in front of the red light or immediately before, what would you recommend?

In a perfect world before? Okay, how long before? I mean, the half light? I've heard a different things. I mean, I talked, I've talked a lot the experts on it, they'll say, anywhere to 30 to 60 minutes. I know there's a couple of studies that are going on now that are kind of looking at that, but that's a good estimate. So I'm sorry, go no good, Jr.

So for someone that has obviously, like, for example, myself at home, I have a red light therapy device. And then I have an impulse, infrared sauna by sunlighten, which does everything except for the red light. But that's doing the farther mid and the nearer. Presumably, you could actually just dose up on methylene blue. Here, would there be any downside to doing that free sauna.

It's not going to be as strong. We know the sun Infrared Saunas are not usually at the power that some of the red lights have at home, depending how you're doing it if you're doing either a panel or I mean, there's a lot of wrapped in blankets out there. Now. The other component of this is depends on the court like sunlight and the quality sauna. We now know that there's some saunas because of the made the wood they're made out of, or their EMF leakage or how they're built that it actually may be detrimental. I refer you do with the red light panel or rap, there's a post dishonour, but that's a jihad, that's going to give you more benefits than nothing.

Yeah, yeah. Okay. First Interesting. Okay, you mentioned a few other things that you mentioned a couple of times Montsegur? Can we talk about that and the benefits?

Sure, yeah. So matses is what's called the mitochondrial peptide. There's three out there Mazzi, ss, 31 and umat. And that work on reading frames with or parts of DNA within the mitochondria itself, which are now initially with just thought to be great for ageing and mitochondrial health but have all now been linked to having other benefits might see there's a lot of things and giving it we know that it works on a NPK which is again an energy chemical hormone in the in the body itself. So it has great energy benefits, it also helps similarly NPK become what's called an exercise the medic mean that it can almost it can stimulate it stimulates exercise. So it's like kind of the game worker that doing it obviously paid my love my patient when they do work, as we'll take it before, and they say the workouts are better because it's also anti inflammatory as well. It also works on it. By working it also is makes you more insulin sensitive, which is really helpful. It also because it works ibk works on an enzyme called PG PGC one alpha which again, which induces mitochondrial biogenesis, which we talked about before the importance there. Now there's other studies are now showing that it because of the way it works, and decreasing inflammation may help with cognition may have a link to help in painting with Alzheimer's disease. And then also with a couple of days is showing because of the way it works and muscle building can help women with sarcopenia and osteoporosis which kind of leads back to the other conversations I would think that women can take as they as they age is one of the ones that definitely recommend is part of my anti osteoporosis especially end to end diasporas programme, especially women who already have had poor looking DEXA scans or low oestrogen because they are prematurely menopausal or so on.

Okay, interesting. You mentioned another couple there as SS 31. And there was one other man in humanity. Can you tell us a bit about those two and how they work?

Sure you met SS 31 is was founded by two scientists. Again founded in terms of the mitochondrial DNA, it led it hangs out on the inner membrane of the mitochondria, it initially was just found to be a really good antioxidant. And that's kind of where it was initially used for. And now we're finding that it has other capabilities, we've now using it that it may visit anti inflammatory component can be very useful in terms of people using it as injections for tendinopathy or tendinitis. We're also using it now a couple stages came out that it may help in terms of patients with Alzheimer's disease because of the ability to be again for the same reasons. So that's done to self and both these are both those are self injections you imagine it's kind of like the it's kind of the Forgotten brother there but it's not as easily available. You man and sometimes they feel couples really well with not see as a combo again. Same idea works on mitochondrial DNA. It's been linked mostly to an osteoporosis and muscle building it. Also, there's a couple of small studies that link it potentially with infertility and PCOS. It's not been as evaluated against kind of not being as valuable as the other two are right now, right now all three of those Ss 31. Has money more say that other new thing that we're seeing with SS 31 is that it's really been shown to help improve heart function, patient with heart failure, which is where the heart just can't produce anymore, the lungs become filled with fluid, and it can help there as well. So it's, that's the one that most people are gonna be hearing about. Mazzi has also been pretty out there for a while now.

Are these sort of available easily in the US? I know here in the UK, if people wanted to get hold of peptides, it would be that they were only for animal studies and not for human use.

US are available. The UK? I know in UK, no. peptides are very hard to find. I certainly there's very few countries I know this far into closer to Asia, they're more available. For Germany, they're available. I know in Australia, they're not available. I think again, it really depends on the country. I think Germany, they're available, they're much more open to the for the design stuff. It's very all over the place. So that's what I know I've had patients who come here on trips, we'll we'll get up via when the when it is legal here versus where they're coming from. It's unfortunate, I think. Now there's a lot more data behind them sooner than later. Hopefully, they'll become much more mainstream where everybody can get on.

Are there any downsides to the ones that you're mentioning there any risks that people should be aware of?

Right, like any medicine, especially, I mean, this early, we still don't know all the side effects to it. And in this case, we are working on the mitochondria. There are some good studies for the first two for Matsui and SS 31. It's something that we both them, we I cycle, its meaning that we do, we're doing them for a period of maybe three or four months at a time. It's not something like a vitamin C, where you're taking it forever, or vitamin D, whatever example you want to give there. And also, I do have people that for some reason that's evolved the injections or pills that I get recommend to patients, they can be they can have a not a hive, but they can have like an itching reaction to it. It's the way that the supplement the medicine is as well as the way it's made. That I've a lot of people have to stop it because they have these hives or welts on them that they get from nothing else. So that's probably the biggest side effect I've seen actually is that patients just can't tolerate the injections. Even if I go to really small doses. And at that point, it's not worth because they're pretty expensive. So if they're not, if it's not giving you a great benefit, there's no point in doing it. But that happens about 20% of the time, maybe less probably less than that by 10 to 15%. But otherwise, not really.

And these ones only by injection. I know for example with PVC 157, for example, you can take it orally, or any of these available orally,

not yet. Not yet. We're not close to that I don't think right now.

I don't know about you. But while I'm probably not that interested in living something crazy, like 160, I do want to live the healthiest life possible so that I can enjoy it to the max. I recently tested my biological age with glycan age who have over 200 published clinical studies on how glycans affect your biological age from an inflammation perspective. And my results showed biological age of 20 and 47. So I'm pretty happy with that. Now if you'd like to learn more about how to optimise your health and lifestyle so that you can live younger longer and achieve a state of high performance, then you may be interested in my bio sinking 90 day blueprint. I'll be opening up limited spots soon. So to express your interest and get on the waitlist, head over to Angela foster.me forward slash bio thinking. That's Angela foster.me. Forward slash bio thinking and I'll put a link in the show notes below this episode. Okay, what about in terms of facial peptides? So, kind of colloquially, we see like skincare brands have been using them for a long time they say there's peptides in them. Now there's companies that are offering things like more concentrated doses of things like GH K copper, what would be the key peptides to be looking at from an anti ageing perspective in terms of skincare.

I mean, there's two groups and you mentioned the big one, I mean, GH K by far is the best in terms of skincare by itself. The other ones that we tend to use is a lot of times is PPC which is anti inflammatory and can help boost collagen. Then you have CJC which is a growth hormone booster which is put in very small doses and some helps make your skin look younger. I'm looking at something to use really on a as needed basis. Then we have the Botox but are called like the Botox peptides, which will Faisal And originally, which stimulate that type of reaction, it's not going to be anti ageing per se, it's more cosmetic appearance. And then you have again, there's a couple companies out there a bunch of people using brands or not, that has made their own proprietary peptide that's been shown to help with the damage to this, the mitochondria actually. And it's getting more and more penetration into the market as well, which has had pretty good success. So now a lot of these companies are all making their own proprietary peptides that are just theirs that everyone else can use. That's kind of become the new in vogue one. So there's a bunch out there. There's just stuff like sort of once again, is it exactly I'm referring to ones out there. One skin is the one who's making them, which I

think is available yet in the UK. Oh, it's

not okay. No, it's

not because I'm trying it. But I can Yeah.

Yeah, so they've had pretty good success so far. Okay.

Is there any contraindications to utilising any of those peptides alongside something like retinol, for example?

Um, I'm not really again, I would not ID specifically at all, I mean, again, it comes down to I tell my anyway, patients when they're doing stuff with their face, you want to try one new thing at a time to see if you have a problem, you know, but otherwise, they work differently. I've had no patient have any issues with it. So now,

and with the JGHK. Copper, I've read that when you're utilising that on the skin, it's not just localised to the skin, the effects can be systemic as well.

It depends on the dose, a lot of times the dose is not what we're using for injection. So if you get some I mean, it's But JJ does have brain benefits, too, as you're probably getting that because it's pretty close in proximity. Are you gonna get the same anti inflammatory effects throughout your body that you would if you were self injecting GH K? Probably not. But you get some?

Yeah, what are the benefits for the brain?

Um, because then mostly because of the anti inflammatory effects of GH K, helps ease the inflammation in the brain at higher doses. Some people uses what we call nootropic. Because of the way it works, it's some people find that their cognition is better. There's no data that I've seen in terms of explains it beyond what I just said. But some people find that they really feel really clear, like they took an Adderall or something, but that's what

Yeah, okay. And interestingly, while we move on to the brain, there's more and more that I'm seeing coming out. Dr. Rhonda, Patrick's talking about it quite a lot recently, in terms of people who have carriers of apiary for and the risk of Alzheimer's disease. I have one copy of that is something that I'm kind of following quite closely. I know that alcohol, for example, even very moderate alcohol consumption may be more risky for someone with a pod for when we look at people who have tested their genetics, they're aware that they carry that, that gene, menopause can sometimes be a triggering event for this. What would you say to women who and men who who carry that gene? I think it's just seems to the risk seem to be higher in women, things that they should focus on from a lifestyle perspective. Obviously, I know we've talked about exercise, we've talked about sleep, they're hugely important for things like protecting against dementia. Is there anything else that you would add on any of these bio hacks or things that you think are important?

Yeah, I mean, a lot of a lot of things we already discussed are kind of overlapping here again, is that we know patients who are insulin resistant or there's an increased risk of Alzheimer's so again, it could be anything from fasting to something like a Berberine to a maxi which I mentioned, very helpful. We talked we know again, inflammation same thing. You can use everything from something like a curcumin which we have some also some by itself has some potential benefits with Alzheimer's to like a BBC 157 as well. And other things that we know now Ted are really close to being ready for primetime or not, right, I mentioned red light, but now there's the intro nasal and or the cranial red light therapies, which may have much more benefit because much more localised exposure. They allow these work in different ways. Some have mixed wavelengths, some have only one that still kind of in the which one's better, we don't know for sure yet. So that's something that is very important hyperbaric therapy, Vento, but the really more high end hybrid biohacking side has really good stays with brain issues, including Alzheimer's. Those are the I mean, again, There's a lot of other things that we're using some like ketosis or exogenous ketones have been shown to help. I mean, I could go on again, I mentioned my toffee, G and your licence a before that as some interesting sizes. Again, this is a Luckily, the space has exploded in the last year to eight months in terms of what's out there. spermidine also may have some benefits there as well. So there's the goal. But when I tell my patients who either just trying to be protective, or unfortunately have a history of it, or are in the early stages of it is you want to kind of pick from every budget isn't shouldn't just be all about information. It's not all about lifestyle, you want to do something, if anything you can do to work on your epigenetics is going to be helpful. And if you do mitochondrial, and all the different things, that's gonna give you a much better likelihood of getting there as opposed to just trying to focus everything on okay, I'm going to just eat really healthy. And what I hear some people do, which is great, but it's not going to potentially get you to your end goal.

Yeah, for sure. That's very helpful. I'd like to clear up something with you. Because I've heard different experts talk about this in different ways in terms of red light therapy, some research seems to show very positive impacts on eye health, and improving that. And then other manufacturers of robotic devices are being very cautious, and telling people to put goggles on when they're wearing them. Where do you come out on that?

Um, it depends, partly depends on the device. And I mean, in terms of a panel or a bed, I am probably more on the I would wear the goggle part to it to be honest. If you're doing something like intracranial or cranial or inter nasal, I'm more obviously more. I think there are some benefits to it. I think the jury is unfortunately still advertise a direct exposure. And to me, that's not something I'm willing, I'm, I'm aggressive in certain things. But in terms of my vision, that's not one of them. I so I'm more cautious. But I don't think again, I used to kind of hit, there's no great answer right now. And I think again, the division is not worth the risk. Because I think that there's so many other things out there that can help men to take a chance in terms of red light therapy, which I don't think it's a homerun. I wouldn't take that chance. That's my opinion. Today, a year from now, I may totally change when some other stuff comes out. I suspect the researchers are looking at this every day. We looking at this every day, but I'm still on the conservative side.

Yeah, thank you. My topia, yeah, you're listening, can we talk about or I can never pronounce it connects? Is it your life scenario? We were having this conversation offline before? Can we talk about the benefits?

Sure, um, a lot of different benefits to it. It's derived from the microbiome, the gut, I think everything in the world seems to somehow go back to the microbiome at this point, initiated became a benefit because it was anti inflammatory. And it was helping athletes put on muscle and improve athletic performance. It was being studied here on a professional basketball team in the US. And they saw Wow, this is really the benefit, the studies were even more better than they were better than they thought they would be. And now as the research just come out more and more, as you're using in finding out how important my toffee G is, and a lot of other disease processes, it's now being used as something for osteoarthritis. It's something that's being used again, for Alzheimer's, it helps heal the gut lining. There's some studies have shown that as well, it's now potentially going to go linking back to initial part of the conversation with fertility. So it's something that's very easy to take it's two pills a day. Depending on where you're getting it from. There are some patterns out there as well, that are pretty sure it's still unfortunately not as out there as it should be just because of the cost. And to get really pure your licence is pretty difficult at this point. But the companies that do make it do a really good job with it, and it is something that has, I recommend to pretty much all my patients this point just because of the lack of side effects and the numerous benefits that are out there right now.

Great to know. What about NAD? This is an area there are a few companies that produce supplements that enhance NAD with other kinds of spittoon enhancers alongside there seems to be controversy over things like an MN really, I think partly due to the dose because when we look at Dr. David Sinclair, for example, the amount he was taking isn't really available in a lot of the supplements for example, what would you advise in terms of surmising fan ad.

That's a rabbit hole that is especially us become a I don't think I think it's mostly here to promote anywhere else in the US. Partially because of David Sinclair and a man is banned in the US. Yeah, it's going to become banned in the US, is a proprietary pharmaceutical product that's supposed to be coming out or being in last stage of testing. So that supersedes any of the supplements, and you can still get it a little bit. So that really kind of in the US has kind of narrowed the conversation. So most everybody who is taking NAD is taking nr instead of the n and m n versions of it. Why is it being banned? Sorry. Because the way our government works in the health department, or the pharmacy drug department is, if there's a form, since there's going to be a prescription version of something, there cannot be a supplement version, which is not controlled, since the prescription version will be will be regulated. And there's also some financial stuff, patent stuff, it's a lot different combination of things there. It's gotten pretty ugly. But yeah, so for our patients, it's an AR, I tend to push a dose of OB, if possible. I think it's an ad has initially was like the super drug. I don't think it's a super supplement that fixes everything we know the links into ADS may be questionable at this point. It's not, it's not the anti ageing Fountain of Youth product, but it does have some benefit. Again, it was a stage show that it does help potentially help with a part of the whole cocktail that may help with Alzheimer's disease. And it definitely helps to potentially muscle growth. It can help with cognition in general. So it's something that should be part of your supplement cocktail, I believe, again, like you mentioned, if you are going to do NAD, you do want to take boosters, things like either the six or apigenin or TMG, you do want to take that as part of your cocktail. A lot of patients that we do when they're doing their mitochondrial booster portion, we'll do that with them. And a lot of it, I mean, somebody do it, patients are still doing the IV, which allows you to achieve a much higher dose of NAD. The studies on the IV are very, very sparse at this point. It's more just totally anecdotal at this point in terms of is IV better and more bioavailable than NRHP? Some most studies out there now. So it's part of it's definitely part of the cocktail. I definitely believe in it. If anyone was still available, I probably would lean a little bit close more to nr at this point. I do believe in the higher doses of both to really get the the real benefit of it and you should take it with boosters

with the NR when you're talking about higher doses, what kind of dose

500 even higher. milligrammes Yes.

Okay, and with no man, what dose I know, you can't do that much in the US.

I pushed it a minute, there are people taking 250 500 Some people are taking up to 1000 of these products that are based in Europe that are that high that people are still able to get now we'll see what happens in the over the course of the year here. There's a couple really good products in Europe actually pay better than what's in the US

of any man. Okay. And then spermidine as well. Can you talk a little bit about the benefits of spermidine

Sure, and I love spermidine I think it's again, it's part of my core protocol. Most patients spermidine though, they all say is a downside. If you are allergic to gluten, make sure that you talk to your doctor about it before you go on it. But otherwise, I mean spermidine The benefits are amazing if you looked at any of the anti ageing, the hallmarks of ageing would now up to 12 it has actually the most Hallmark checks of any product in the world. Even more than rapamycin at this point. So something that patients if you're looking to be healthy or anti ageing biohacker is something that you definitely want to look into ng regime it's something that does everything from again, it helps heal the gut lining there's links to heart benefits, it is anti inflammatory and it helps induce autophagy which again, is buys ability to recycle the salads. Some people are now using spermidine because of that autophagy booster adds anti inflammatory profile infertility, so everything kind of links up here. But also it's anti inflammatory it's may be very helpful for patients to after their workout to help with muscle recovery with another substance called Tullos which is a simple sugar. The list goes on and on and on at this point. One of the reasons in my opinion is tend to like it honestly, which is I've talked to the owners of a couple of the major companies the same thing they hear is that

part I take it

does work. You talk I mean I think I hear the motion patients are those two things and What was the other one? Eyelashes?

eyelashes so yeah, so anything and filling in your eyebrows? Yeah, exactly. Eyelashes eyebrows because that's a common thing as well for women right as you start to get a little bit of patchiness around the eyebrow area and then it fills it I like spermidine What dosi you suggesting spermidine

Again, if you're, it's something I build up in patients, the studies are anywhere between six and 15 milligrammes a day so I tend to go I take about 10 a day, okay? That becomes the choice you want to try to get once you know you can tolerate it you try to go higher doses I know there's some people just can't tolerate a higher dose. I tend to do pills just because with damage pattern or liquid is tough. But that's something that I again, I recommend I cycle it probably twice a year. I don't do it in perpetuity continuously, but I love spermidine

you cycle it but so for what period Do you cycle it

for? I tend to try to do it like three months to four months on couple months off? I mean that some people say you can cycle it some people say you can take continuously I don't think there's gonna be an issue. They just the question is how much do you want and keep inducing autophagy continuously that strongly? We don't know for sure yet. But it helps those that you do want to kind of not be in that increasing it all the time. Like that same reason why people say you should be cycling rapamycin and not doing in perpetuity. I'm getting closer and closer probably doing it all the time. I found a product that has it like almost like a multivitamin with a high dose in there. So it makes it easier for me to take again, I'm a bad pill taker, I'll take three or four things I don't want to take 21 pills and three shots a day, just not in my schedule. So by throwing these definitely like top five for me

any benefits then to obviously they're helping with autophagy to actually taking things like an AR spermidine pre workout in the morning in a fasted state going for a fasted workout and kind of layering them in together.

Um, you definitely can I've depends on everybody's individual nr I haven't loved the study that I mean there's some people say it's great for them. Some people love it, and it benefits them. It's there are some studies that show that may so it's trial and error spermidine I occasionally use it for recovery otherwise I tend to use to help patients do spermidine At night that does really help with deep sleep and people see that if we monitor their sleep scores I tend to be kind of again pre workout I usually recommend other things over that. But it gives again, it comes down to how many things you can do one time I could make an argument burning so the recovery is great i and they can definitely do it. I get my core still like a nitric oxide, creatine protein. Those are the audits of the core parts. There are some people do oxytocin before workout there's some people who are doing a lot of different things to add a lot of peptides a lot of people are doing their PPC or their TV 500 or their CDC post workout. So that's a lot of stuff to add in there that you're licenced either using post workout so it's paid down the list a little bit but it's definitely things that everybody's different. I've I find I love by BBC workouts for me I like to get bedtime a colleague of mine takes a post workout and the recovery is incredible. Depends what you're doing is really heavy intense workouts are a jujitsu I've copied into really into jujitsu, they love it because the anti inflammatory aspect of it. I'm more of a like lower weight person I use other things to really to really Max Max out my workout depends on situation.

What about an AC and taking this around exercise? I've I've seen some research suggests you shouldn't be taking that on exercise days.

I don't love it post like, specifically for exercise specifically, it's an antioxidant. There's been data that shows antioxidants post can decrease your workouts and the benefits of it. So it's not my it's not really one of go twos I would recommend to my patients.

Do you avoid it on workout days entirely and take it on non workout days? Or? I'm

in a perfect world? Yes. I mean, I get I'll admit, sometimes I just I do it. I kind of play with things by ear. In a perfect world. Depends where you're taking it for if you're taking I have patients who are taking a part of a brain protocol or post COVID protocol, and that supersedes everything else, in terms of just a maintenance protocol. In a perfect world. If you're doing a heavy workout, you should probably try to not take it if possible. It's probably the best way to answer that.

What about glycine supercheap seems to be very effective in terms of what apart of a kind of longevity stack also seems to have really helped with sleep with gut health. Curious as to your thoughts there.

Glycine is going to be something that everybody will be talking about probably in a year or two. Do you hit everything on the head there? It has a lot of great. It's cheap. It does all the core stuff that you need to do. Very i I've never had anybody have major side effects. They just came out in terms of that in Britain, Alzheimer's. So I mean, if I would, it's definitely something that everybody should be taking.

I love it. Okay, BPC 157. Let's talk about that. Because this is one thing I think, lots of people even if they aren't meant to be getting hold of it or getting hold of it and utilising it. I've seen it in an oral preparation. In fact, I took it in an oral preparation myself from an authorised distributor here in Europe. And it was incredibly effective orally for repairing a rotator cuff injury that I couldn't heal. And it was extraordinarily fast. I was dropping it under the tongue. Can you talk about? So before we talk about how to take it and how to utilise it? It seems to be good for so many things. It seems to be good for repairing it seems to be good for gut health. Can we talk about the multitude of benefits? Like how many things does this peptide work for?

A lot? Yeah, like you said, it definitely works a lot. I would just say it seems to be a very the oral preparation, I get this question probably more than than anything else. It depends on who you're getting it from, it depends on your body. It also depends on your gut health depends on depending if it's droppers or pills. I've had patients who get the pills and they love it, I've had patient take the pills and do nothing, they start doing the shots of the IVs. And they feel like a new person. So it's kind of dependent there. But in terms of what it does it mean it does a lot of things like you said, I mean, it started as a gut health and ulcer healing medication, then it started spreading in terms of the body's ability to heal muscles and joints. And then it spread into I'm using it for cognition, we know that it is a maybe some low grade antidepressant it helps regulate and norepinephrine and dopamine a little bit. So it does. What else I mean, we use it now for skin preparation. So it has very a lot of a lot of great benefits to it. We use it some cases in heart and lung inflammation. That's kind of depends on where you are and to be 500 taken over that a little bit, but it's helpful there as well. So it just does all that you said it has a lot of really impressive benefits to it. And it's something that people should definitely look into that they can have access to it.

And when injecting it does it go into the area you're trying to heal directly, there seems to be some muscles around like doing in a triangle form, what's the best way to utilise that?

See, I've had too many horror stories from patients who've been injecting in the area for a variety of different reasons. Personally, I mean, they don't know what the anatomy and they put in are in the wrong area, or they hit a nerve or veil. So I don't, I don't like that. I also don't like it, I even if it's me doing it, I don't recommend injecting in the area every day because you wouldn't get a flu shot every day. It's just too much. It's too much fluid in a small space. But I have patients do under my direction is I had them maybe doing two or three times a week. And that area depends how big an area Tong over my shoulder a knee, they're injecting pretty close to the area. If it's like a finger or something smaller returned maybe twice a week. But again, much higher up, I don't have people injecting their hands or feet ever. I've had patients that I've had too many issues with it, I don't recommend local on their own. Again, if it works great for you. But I've had I've had, I've always had multiple patients, the practice will have to kind of fix that after they did it. I'm doing an abdominal I've had very few people not have benefitted doing abdominally If they're doing the injections, or if the oils are working for them. Doing it injection everyday to me is going to more likely cause more damage than benefit to it. That's my perspective. I don't recommend it

on their own. So it could be done in cycles as well.

I believe it should be done in cycles. I don't do it for more than three or four months at a time with patients. Because either i It's gonna pay maximise the benefit be there's the presume risk out there that somehow because of the way it works, it may increase the risk of cancer. There's no definitive study that shows that yet it's such an assumption out there. If you don't need something in this, especially now there's 20 Other peptides out 10 Other things I can use the same benefit. We'll come back to it and six months from now. That's what I do. I don't I don't have people doing it continuously. I've gotten in debates in conferences to chat rooms about it. Nobody can show me Did either that why they shouldn't be cycled and I've very few people after the first three or four months notice these dramatic improvements after usually and again, there's hundreds of things that can replace Well, so I cycle it,

you cycle it. You mentioned putting it in the abdominal area, and most people get a benefit. Is that a systemic benefit in addition to a gut health benefit?

Yeah, it's mostly that's how we're using it as a systemic benefit system. Yeah, I mean, got wise. I mean, there's people debate should be oral, should it be injectable. Again, some part of it depends on how the pills made, how damaged their gut. But I mean, I've again, I've had a lot of patients where they just do an intra abdominal, they get all these benefits. And the only time if somebody is like asleep, you mentioned a rotator cuff, somebody's a rotator cuff issue, a lot of times are coming into the office, we're injecting it once or twice a month with the beat with the higher dose PPC, we know where we're going into and putting it where it needs to be. As opposed to just having some person just kind of give themselves kind of like a semi flu shot area thing where they could end up causing more damage.

Okay. And TB 500 is another one you've mentioned, there doesn't need to be a loading phase for that there's that bit of a myth like creatine

I don't believe in loading doses, because I've had people be sensitive to things. So with any of the peptides, I tend to, unless the patient's already done it, I tend to go medium dose for most things that if I'm doing an injection with it, and then just quickly ramping it up, I'll tell either tell the patient how to do it, or they'll call me in two weeks and say, Hey, Doc, this is working great or Hey, Doc, it's not working. And I can just have them increase the dose that's what's great with injections that you can really quickly go from 25 to 30 units and then that's fine so I don't really believe in the loading those added patients a week later BBC or TV 500 Say, I feel so much better. So I don't I don't really buy into that as much I need

to do they help with things like burning fat? Are there any other benefit?

Um, BBC, because of the gut health benefits and anti inflammatory we're using a lot of companies are now mixing in their weight loss products. TV for I mean, again, technically as anti inflammatory. I don't really it's not anywhere close what I would use really for weight loss stuff or burning fat. So not as much with the TV for that to be 500.

And lastly, nootropics. You mentioned these, what are your favourite nootropics

one of my favourite nootropics I love syrup. My favourite if you can get it is sort of relicense which is a European nootropic. It's either in done as an injection, or an IV. I love methylene blue. And I love exotic. I'm an exogenous ketone junkie, I feel really good when I do that. I mean, those are the ones that I like. I also do something simple like spermidine actually works really well for me as a nootropic. And then again, for patients who are looking for I mean, for other patients, they love methylene blue, they love di hexa which is a peptide cream, which I love. It's not an even an injection you can do that. But also is really popping my

heart lies that

they hex is its works on the angiotensin receptors was for blood pressure. But actually by doing that actually has helped patients who have like traumatic brain injury or even Alzheimer's and patients find that's really helpful. The other one I really liked now is something called prodrome, which is a plasma halogen substance which is the part of the the layer of your cells and most patients are people are deficient in them as they get older, like everything else. And I've tried their products, the products, the product, the plasma knowledge and products out there, and my cognition has improved pretty quickly with those, there's probably some other app, there's 2030 other ones out there that are really good. It really just depends like to me it's always dependent about memory and the focus you just want do you have the brain for TV dyad at three o'clock in the afternoon and whatever I mean, creatine is great, caffeine is great. I mean, there's so many it depends on really what your goals are gonna get. Like I said, I try to minimise how many things I'm taking my patients are taking. Otherwise they just get like pill fatigue most of them and then then you're kind of back to square one again.

So for someone who is not looking at targeting anything in particular, they're just looking at health span, and they want to optimise for each of the kind of areas we've discussed, and you want to minimise what would be the top three to five products they might use.

Good five it would be spermidine your licence a probably be PC 157 At least twice a year exogenous ketones and probably Mazzi are probably I mean off the top my head over the INR over and are definitely and then the the plasma collagen products are be right behind that of the ones that are out there now.

Interesting meeting. Well, where can before we link to everything where people can find you if they want to do a little bit more reading on this area, what would be a good resource that they could look at, uh, do you have a blog or why would you recommend

rebury? I mean I live it right now it's either on my YouTube channel is probably the place right now. In the process now restarting on the blog on the website, Dr. pollan.com, as well, those are the best two places to check out. YouTube is usually the easiest because I can just put something up in 10 minutes from a video and a lot of this stuff is there more detailed dyes are on the website.

Amazing. We will link to that in the show notes. You are a wealth of information, I think. I think you're one of my favourite guests for delivering a huge amount of content and value and information in a short space of time. Thank you very much, Dr. Bollen.

Oh, great. Thanks for having me. Appreciate it.

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