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Hi, my name is George Abraham and welcome to Eyeway Conversations. My guest today is Preetham Sunkavalli, a young corporate executive who lives in Vishakhapatnam and works in Mumbai. Hi, Preetham, welcome!
Hello, sir. Thank you so much for having me.
Preetham, you are one of the few visually impaired persons working in the auto industry. What exactly is your job profile?
Sure, so I work with the leading automotive company in Mumbai, I work with their Business Transformation team. So in a nutshell we are kind of like internal consultants and we work across functions so marketing, brand sales, supply chain, electric vehicles, all kinds of things. And usually they have goals to change a part of their business that you know, day-to-day they're too busy to worry about that. So we kind of go in and we try to help them change, put in place new processes and you know, change to the changing customer requirements, especially post pandemic, there has been so much change in the automotive industry. You know, customer expectations are changing, more people want to buy personal cars and on the other side, there's a shortage of semiconductors and so we kind of help the organization deal with all these changes.
What was your experience interviewing for this job?
Sir, the interview process was pretty lengthy and I interviewed with various executives for various teams. But one moment that really stuck out for me is when I interviewed with the group HR EVP, and this man, I believe, is was my champion throughout and he's one reason that I actually ended up working with that company. And so when we were talking, he was like what role would you prefer? I'm like maybe marketing, he's like you might have to have sales experience for that and I said, yes sir, I do. And he said, see for that, you will have to be out on the field, you will have to go visit dealers independently, things like that. And I said, yes I will work towards it, I'll figure out a way to do it on my own and he said okay we'll, we'll think about it. And then finally when you know, when I got the appointment later and I looked into it, the role I was first assigned to was as an area Sales Manager. And, you know, that's really the confidence that he showed in my ability and of course, later on I did visit dealers independently and I built trust with them and you know, kind of worked with them for a year before I transferred to the head office.
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You know, you are working in an arena where most people you engage with may not be kind of used to interacting with people who are blind or visually impaired. So how did you actually overcome the threshold where there might have been apprehensions but you know, over time you managed to win them over?
There were always apprehensions I mean automotive industry is fairly traditional and you know, I engaged with the teams for diversity and inclusion there and for them, usually diversity inclusion goes as far as women right now. They're not even talking about people with disabilities or you know, the LGBTQ community, things like that. And typically what I've understood is you have to communicate very clearly, you have to tell your team and your managers what you can do and what you cannot do. And also you should really let your work speak for itself. So if your manager trusts you and gives you something to do, you have to deliver and you have to let them know that you know, this is what you can do. So clear communication and letting your work speak for yourself has has really helped me throughout
And how did you win the trust of the dealers?
So once we had a product launch coming up and you know, before these launches, you bring your entire dealer workforce you know, from a whole region, a couple of states, you bring them together and you train them on how to sell the vehicle, what's the sale story, how do you talk to customers, how would you address their queries and so we all prepared the script. But then we had a couple of actors playing as customers and I went in and I delivered a performance. You know, we had a woman customer and the script was that you know, this car is not right for a woman types and so we had to go in and demonstrate about how you would sell this car to a woman and how a woman's requirements might be slightly different while buying the car. And so I delivered that performance and I got a standing ovation from the whole audience and since then, my team you know, my dealer teams never really doubted my abilities, although it was a tiny slice of really what I could do with them. And that was more theater than management bu, yeah, that's kind of how I earned that trust.
You know Preetham, there are very few people who get into management. So when did you decide that you wanted to do management and how did you get interested in management?
Very interesting question. So when I was young, I actually wanted to be a physicist and this was before Big Bang Theory and before nerdy physicists are considered cool but I was fascinated by it. And as I got older, we started having a few issues because my friends and peers would tell me that you know, I couldn't draw diagrams, I couldn't write records, I couldn't conduct experiments. And now today with awareness, I know it's false and I know I could have easily become a physicist if I wanted to but back then, I was not sure. And at the same time, my dad was teaching me economics and he has a nice way of making the most dry, boring subject sound interesting. And you know, economics was not certainly not that but you know, I did have a fascination with economics, thanks to him. And so that's what I picked in my 11th and 12th and you know, kind of logical progression to that was management.
Can you tell us a little bit about your journey as a management student? You, I believe first did a three year course and then you got into the IIM?
Sure. So I got into three year undergraduate Business Management course here in Vishakhapatnam. And when I first went to join the college, my college Principal, who actually happens to be the Vice Chancellor of the university now, he sat me down, and he was like you know, he spoke to me, he's like what are your aspirations, what are your goals? And he was like why don't you join our five year integrated MBA course. You know, it's a three year undergraduate and then a two year MBA and I told him no sir, I aspire to go to an IIM for my MBA. And back then I just said it because it sounds cool. I was not really confident I could reach that. He said sure. I joined the course. It was goo, it gave me a very good base on you know, on the fundamentals and on how I could grow in the future and it really helped build my confidence. So in the third year you know, there were campus placements and I plan to work for a few years before writing my CAT and going for an MBA. So I was being interviewed by a large multinational company and I cleared the first round and then the HR was like you know, Preetham, how do you use computers and we were having a private conversation she pulled me aside and I told her you know, accessibility software, screen readers, things like that. So she comes back 10 minutes later and she tells me see, we can't allow third party softwares on our systems, so we can't put accessibility software on our computers. And this is a company that claims to be a technology company and I was really surprised. But then she said you know, we are an equal opportunities employer but I hope you understand and that made no sense to me, I did not understand. And later you know, I thought about it and I realized, for that company I was just one of maybe 400 candidates and there was nothing particularly special about me at that time. And so I thought you know, I have to work harder, I have to set myself apart in some way. And my placement officer in the college also encouraged me she said you know, I can go in to an IIM or to a good college as a fresher, so I decided to go for CAT right then.
So this CAT you know, Common Admission Test which most students take, it's seen as a very difficult test to deal with. It's competitive and it's pretty intense and people prepare for it for a couple of years before they actually take the test. So what was your strategy and what was your journey dealing with CAT?
Well, I took a year off for CAT and really, my strategy was, I'm going to work as hard as I can in this one year because the incident that happened during undergrad placements really showed me that CAT was the only option for me. And I had to get into good MBA school otherwise you know, things would be much more difficult. And so I joined the local institute and they were not sure about me and so initially when I joined the head of the institute asked me questions like you know, could I read, do I read books and stuff, what's the equation to a line segment, so very basic questions. And just to set the context, a few months after this, I got the bronze medal for my batch for my undergrad batch and this man is asking me if I can do it. So I joined the CAT coaching session and the sessions and it is a bit challenging because I always struggled with Maths. But I was fortunate that few things that I used to do as a visually impaired person actually helped me out because I tend to do calculations in my head rather than putting them down on paper. And doing quick calculations is very important for quantitative ability in CAT and one of my trainers actually recognized this, so he kind of mentored me. My schedule was like a professional athlete, so I would do lots of you know, concept work and then mocks you know, typically people take about 10-15 mocks, I took something like 35. And I think that's what really helped me because when I went into the actual exam, it just felt like another mock and frankly, it was easier than many of the mocks I did. So yeah, my mother helped me with verbal and then I had this mentor who helped me with quantitative ability and logical reasoning. So really you know I got really good support and good mentorship and that's how I think I could crack CAT.
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So you went into IIM, Ahmedabad and tell us a little bit about it because that's again, a tough course and it's a competitive place. And what was the accessibility situation? How did the professor's kind of engage with you. how did your peers engaged with you?
It was an exceptional place and you know, the two years I spent there were two of the best years of my life. And really you know if you talk about the faculty and the support systems, they've seen so many visually impaired people before and all of the visually impaired people put in place some systems. So when I go in and I say I want accessible materials, they know what to do. They know how to provide me the OCR, PDFs and all of that and the mess hall knows that you know, I would prefer if food could be delivered to my room because initially I couldn't navigate the campus on my own. And so most of the systems were in place and the support was there but it was certainly not easy, this was the first time I was doing anything on my own outside home and I didn't have anyone to rely on but myself, at least initially. And, you know my friends also they were of great support. So anytime you know any IIM Ahmedabad grad would tell you that you learn more from your peers than you know from the classroom and that was true in my case. I made some lifelong friends and I participated in a lot of activities and you know, first year was certainly challenging, I was still figuring out how things work. But second year, I had a lot of fun. I even did an exchange one semester in the US, which also gave me some great experiences.
You studied in the mainstream right from childhood. Talk us through your experiences being part of the mainstream, you know you must have had experiences with your classmates, children are very often cruel and mean. What was your experience? How did your teachers kind of deal with you, what was the kind of support that you needed, and that you got to actually cope with the 11-13 years of your schooling?
So throughout my childhood you know, my one main pillar of support was always my mother and my mother would always fight on behalf of me, she would make sure that wherever I was, I would get included and things like that. And pretty early on, she took a call that you know, I would go to regular school and I wouldn't learn braille, I would learn the regular alphabet. So this was a call she took and so you know, even in Vishakhapatnam of course, I tended to go to smaller schools because I was in one of the large prestigious schools initially but we felt the teachers were not able to give me attention and I was finding it difficult to cope in a large class of say 45 people. And so while growing up, overall I would say it was okay. Teachers were generally very supportive and my mother was always there to back them up at home so most of my studying I did at home with my mom. But the peers, classmates are a whole different story because you know, when you go 5th-6th standard that age you know, kids start forming social groups and one thing they love to do is exclude people and point out how people were different. And it was difficult, kids these days, call it FOMO Fear of Missing Out but I probably had that and I was always kind of anxious that you know, all these guys are doing something and I'm not being included. So it really took me a while to understand. And in the meanwhile my mother had some support and so she would read these books and kind of give me little nuggets of you know, wisdom. So one of them was she read this book and you know, it said somebody else's bad behavior is their problem you know, don't make it yours. And so that really helped me, I kind of understood that you know, what they were doing is not because of me but it was because of them and obviously, this realization didn't come easily. There were many moments that I would come crying from school and just say you know, I don't want to go back there again. But yeah, I got through it and I think I'm a much stronger person. I tend to brush off any you know, any form of discrimination these days and that really helped me become a stronger person, I would say.
So, you know all of us, apart from work, you know we always have some interest areas, hobbies, and so on. What has been your interests and hobbies that kind of makes life exciting?
So I love to read. I read mysteries and thrillers, I love spy fiction you know, geopolitics and such. So I read at least, I'd say 2-3 books a month and that's something that I love to you know, immerse myself in. And these days, I'm watching a lot of audio describe content on streaming services, things like that. I do some baking but not very often. Now that I'm working from home, I get a chance to bake. But yeah, one hobby I've had for a long time is making 3D models of things. So since childhood, I always love toys more because you know, they were 3D and I could understand each nook and cranny each feature. And so I would try to reproduce them out of cardboard and you know, whatever recyclable materials I can find. And one of my favorite things that I made is a large aircraft carrier, it's like two feet long and it's got so many details. You know, I really enjoyed crafting those little details. It's got rocket launchers that rotate this way and that way, it has a catapult that launches its little tiny cardboard plane and so there's a rubber band under the deck that powers this catapult and you know, it's got little lifeboats that you can push out of the hull and so that's another thing I really enjoy. But it takes a lot of time and these days with my work, so I tend not to get as much time so I make smaller things now, I don't make these large ambitious projects anymore.
A few weeks ago, we had met for the first time on Clubhouse in the room called Visionaries and I believe you are the one who started this group. So tell us a little bit about this group, why did you start it, what do you hope to achieve and what are your plans for the future in this room?
So the idea of the Visionaries I've had for quite a while actually, since 2017-2018. And the basic idea is that you know, as visually impaired people, most of our conversations are oriented to educating or you know, sensitizing the sighted population. And I wanted a platform where visually impaired people could talk to each other and really connect and you know, feel like they were part of the community you know, independent, visually impaired people, working, studying, who could exchange ideas, who could exchange tips and try to make each other's lives better. Of course, I was thinking of what platform to do it on and how I would go about it. And you know, fortunately, Clubhouse happened in early 2021 and I just felt okay, Clubhouse would be the perfect platform and so we started in May of 2021. And currently, we have about 193 members, out of which about 30 or 40 will be active and we do various events. You know, we conduct accessible game shows, we have a book club every first Sunday of the month. And generally we have conversations about various topics you know, from technology, accessible technology, to accessible travel and how our different travel hacks and also access tips on dating and relationships for visually impaired people. So it's a wonderful platform, I hope to take it off clubhouse, I want to expand it further and develop some content that could be you know, a place for visually impaired people to really come and it would be a guide you know, they would have say, reviews of accessible technology or reviews of different airlines and hotels or travel or you know, reviews of accessible tourist places and you know, we'd have blogs and chats and conversations. I'm working on how I could make this happen, who would create the content, where would we hosted, how would we engage with people. So really, that is my vision for the Visionaries, I want it to be a one stop shop for visually impaired people you know, to gather information about the world, the accessible world, I should say.
I was reading a little background about you and you know, I read that you mentioned somewhere that the world is made of people who are inclusive, people who are indifferent and people who are ignorant, can you throw some light on these thoughts of yours?
Sure. So, when I came up with this, you know this was at a particularly low point in IIM, Ahmedabad and at the end of my first year, I was discriminated against by a member of the staff for a leadership position, handling you know, the the body that helps disabled students on campus. And it's funny because you know, the Equal Opportunity Committee is meant to provide equal opportunities and I was discriminated against it because I wanted to head it up and you know, provide support for disabled members of the IIM Ahmedabad Community. And this was a very hard time for me because I felt, you know if they are not going to consider me for heading up a campus organization, like how will I build a career in the future and so I kind of sat down, I was really thinking about it and one of my friends just to cheer me up, he suggested he's like, you know one eminent professor is visiting and why don't you go speak to him, you know why don't you just meet him. And so I did and he told me this, he was like see there's always a part of society that's going to embrace you that is going to think that, you know you can do anything. And there's a part of society which does not really care, which does not lean either one way or the other and then there's a part of society that just makes its distance and so he said 25-50-25% roughly. And later, you know when I thought about it, I was like I came up with these words, you know inclusive, indifferent and let's just say ignorant. So really, the advice boils down to, you know embrace the inclusive, so don't let go of them, they are your biggest pillars of support. And sometimes, we as disabled people tend to take these people for granted and we should really not do that. They are really like us and they think we are quite capable and so we should embrace them. The indifferent, I felt the best ways to impress them because you can convert them into inclusive people, so just show them what you're capable of and they tend to help, I mean, their heart is in the right place, I very strongly believe that. The ignorant people are a whole different story, so usually they tend to stay out of your way but yeah, there are times when, you know circumstances force us to meet and that is the hardest. And honestly, I have not figured out how to deal with that yet. If you did, please tell me because I would love to know.
You know, these classifications that you're talking about reminds me about when it comes to religious beliefs. You have the believers, you have the agnostics and you have the atheist.
Precisely.
It's something similar.
Yes.
So now you are working in a corporate entity and you're an MBA and looking forward, what are your aspirations in life?
That's a very good question. So I would like to grow in corporate, I really aspire to build exceptional customer experiences. And, you know, today, products are getting homogenous, you know, everyone has access to the same product, to the same designers and all of that. And what is really gonna set companies apart is going to be the experience they provide to the customer, the way they engage with the customer, the kind of you know, kinship the customer feels at the brand. And so my goal is to really build such brands you know, a brand that offers an experience and brand with which the customer can really engage and feel proud about. So how I would do that is a whole different story, whether I would do it within an organization or whether I would start something on my own is something I'm yet to figure out. But yeah, my goal would be to be associated with an exceptional customer experience.
So Preetham, it's been a pleasure talking to you. You've launched yourself into life, there are a lot of things to look forward to. I would like to take this opportunity to wish you the very best and I do hope that this conversation that we've had would inspire many more to kind of take up challenges in life and plan ahead for themselves. Thank you.
Thank you sir, absolute pleasure. Thank you so much.
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