[41] Resting in the Present Moment is Annihilation – with Andrew Holecek

12:45AM Jan 11, 2022

Speakers:

Andrew Holecek

Alyssa Alvarado

Keywords:

view

mind

practice

present moment

meditation

reality

emptiness

literally

called

deconstruct

moment

talking

ego

question

recognition

create

thoughts

absolutely

space

arises

So if you're new to the session, and I would suspect most people at this point or not what we do here is something we started quite a few months. ago. Explore the meditative and contemplative arts as a way to really do a number of things. One is to within this framework of the nightclub community, continue to instill in you the importance the centrality of working with your diurnal daytime mind. It was a way to bring about awareness slash lucidity and nocturnal Lena. And so as I said, a number of times in my present times with you, it really proof by my estimation, can't see it too often. The main reason we're not lucid to the contents of our mind at night is because we're not lucid not aware. lucidity is a codeword for awareness for the contents of our mind during the day, and so we've cascaded through a number of different practices. Starting with the infrastructure main practice of mindfulness more technically known as referential shamatha. Shadows tranquility acquiescence referential means that the earliest ages you're working with a reference the hitching post an anchor, in this case, that's body and breath, but it can be a candle. It can be a mantra, we haven't really explored mantra, meditations. That's another very viable way to work with this kind of consecutive regret gathering form. And then eventually with some developing facility. This practice matures with some guidance into what I call the non referential meditations before you start to work with awareness without reference to any particular object. And this becomes really important. Excuse me when you're doing the most advanced subtle practices both in the night and really at the end of life before endless dimensions that we dissolve into when all form is taken away from us. And so the way it's structured, we're going to practice a little bit, I'll run a little bit of commentary. This is a wonderful time to have questions submitted. Either in the chat column, or you can raise your hand is always better, we can have a little conversation. But what makes us different from the other things that we do in the nightclub platform altogether, is there is some group practice of volunteer and I want to just share very briefly before I tell you what I'm going to be talking about is my main presentation. The importance of this kind of group thing, and I can't recall if I've shared this with you before, but this was an eye opener for me. When I did my three year retreat when I did my really long practice where we spent most of our time in our little cubicles, little rooms the size literally a closet, eight women, eight men, but we actually practice a lot together and every one of the teachers that came in to guide us really proclaimed that there are a number of reasons to do this. One is that the power the efficacy of what you're doing in your meditation is proportion is actually amplified by the number of people that you do it with. And so because based on time or constructs we'll say a little bit about that today. Space and time do not exist in true reality. Even though we are doing our little thing from who knows some people are in Europe, some people wherever all over the place. We actually can bootstrap we can support each other in our practice. And so after wrestling with the extraordinary annoyance that I felt the irritation of having to practice with so many people.

I started to really see the wisdom of doing these things in a joint way. And so that's one of the magics of what we're doing here. We have the actual chance to sit down together and cyberspace cognitive space virtual space space all together to really in a certain way, mix our minds with that space and to greater or lesser degrees actually mix our minds with each other. That's no small thing. And so what we do here then is we're going to go ahead and guide you through just a very simple practices away again, this is what's different from the other stuff where we actually it's not all just didactic kind of download, we actually do practice. And then I want to continue with this kind of idea that came to me. Last time I spent some time with you to take some really seminal statements, some of them extremely pithy, like we saw last week and I'll reiterate that one from last night actually not last week. I guess it's three weeks ago at this point. We're going to reiterate that statement from my dear friend, friend as V shalom, augment it with another one by a neuroscientist because they really do lean on each other and then use that as my platform to real fund. What these statements really imply the profundity of what's actually taking place here because that's the thing that's the genius of this practice. I mean, I've been doing it for scary now for decades plus, for such a simple practice. This is a multi valence approach. There's so much going on. It's just layer like a fractal layer upon layer of depth and nuance and subtlety and bringing some of this into the light to create the right view really helps us strengthen our motivation. The reason they all the traditions really big sword, especially in Buddhism, the reason we have troubles accomplishing anything, even a colloquial relative level losing weight, going to the gym, meditating regularly doing whatever the reason we don't accomplish the things that we really aspire to accomplish is our view isn't strong enough. We don't have the proper vision. And so, this extraordinary emphasis on right view, First and most importantly, the Eightfold Noble Path. Right View mind leads all things and so all the riffing all the blah, blah, blah, that does accompany this meditation is all in the service of strengthening the practice and the really the best example of this many of you know this is the very famous inspirational story of what the great master Marpa did to his even greater students Milarepa right. So he basically, Milorad became to study with Martha and he accumulated some pretty bad karma put it mildly. He killed like 35 people. That's, that's a pretty serious karmic load. And so when he realized that the implications of what he did, he said, Well, I better do something about this. I'm in deep karmic trouble. So he went to see his teacher ventually located his teacher Mapa the translator, and over the course of a number of years of Marpa, put him through just tremendous hardship. Really, really difficult stuff brought him to the brink of suicide. I mean, just stretching him as far as he possibly could, and would never really give him the teachings just kept holding out, holding out holding out. He did this for a number of reasons. But one reason was to forge in his students Milarepa view that was so formidable, so strong, that when he finally got the precious teachings and the meditations that he was after, he then took them as a treasure they really were, because he understood the strength of the view that his teacher had inculcated in him. He took them into retreat for 12 years, endured superhuman legendary hardship and became really famous for attaining complete, unconditional awakening enlightenment in one lifetime. And that was all because of the strength of his view. And so before remember J really says if you're having problems, getting to the meditation cushion, we're having problems getting enlightened. anybody listening, having problems getting enlightened right? What a joke is because of the strength or lack thereof of your view, me if you really take these teachings to heart, developed a view

your practice as if your hair's on fire, you realize just how limited just lifetime is how fragile everything is. And you rapidly radically put things in perspective. And you make meditation really the sensuality of your life. And so, what we're going to do for a few minutes before I give you my official riff, is we'll practice for a little bit I always practice with my eyes. Open. But because I'm looking at a screen when I'm doing this sort of practice a little bit of guidance stuff I always do with my eyes closed, it's just a little bit less distracting. So I'm not going to say a ton here because we've had a lot of previous instruction but at this point, let's just take our seat, which means attitudinally not just physically creating a posture of mind. One of stability, dignity, strength, immutability. And so using the instructions from before using the sanity of the body, waking down into the ever present nature of this body

connecting to breath as the bridge between body and mind will center together collect using this wonderfully powerful practice of referential shamatha the mind strays you refer it back to body and breath, that's your hitching post. So we'll do this for a few minutes and that'll bring the bill no mystery juice. My commentary

Always remember that thoughts are never a problem

you're not just trying to get rid of your thoughts. You're not trying to stop your mind.

Less left alone thoughts are just the harmless radiance or play of the mind itself.

stickiness is the issue and appropriate relationship is the problem. Grasping conversion

not a tantric level. Not only are thoughts not a problem they are actually seen as sacred, divine perfectly pure basically good.

Whether we truly acknowledge it or not

each of us here has a beautiful mind with beautiful, radiant to display a font.

We're not trying to pin mine down

to control it in the kind of muscular way we control the mind with space.

In tantric approach thoughts are the ornaments of the mind.

decorations to be celebrated not repressed.

But does not have the inherent power to adversely affect you

so, it only has the power that we impute upon it

we unwittingly reify solidify concretize the display

reification is how we transition from an enlightened mind to an darkened Mind?

A big part of the Enlightenment to journey is literally enlightening lightening up

the play of the mind that literally becomes what the Hindus call Leela Tibetans call Rolpa play divine play.

Lighten up your relationship to the contents of your mind

notice of course the extraordinary tackiness. Or stickiness to the untamed mind regress onto whatever arises and gets sucked into it drawn into endless narratives, constructs and storylines.

Right here is the birth of the city.

We get lost and thought precisely the same way we get lost in dreams.

It's always a little bit slippery to talk about metrics or measures of meditative progress, but there are some.

One such measure is

the gradual loss of the stickiness

instead of being distracted for minutes on end, you may find it's just seconds

and then just regression to levels clots cells liberate the arise and dissolve simultaneously like writing and water

which is a wonderful image because you can't leave a trace and water

and therefore no karma. Karma is created from the stickiness grasping your version.

One of my favorite lines from Trungpa Rinpoche, he cited a lot is good and bad.

Happy and sad.

All thoughts vanish into emptiness like an imprint or a bird in the sky.

Birds don't leave imprints. No karmic footprint.

This means among other things that you can wake up and feel like total crap. Later to properly that does not create karma

is the result or fruition of karma but doesn't create it if you just let it come and go.

So through this practice of appropriate relationship you eventually purify the mind lighten the mind. gradually remove all karma

so what I wanted to talk a little bit about today is an elaboration of this theme that I introduced last time I was with you. And I will read the statement that I read last time and then augmented with the new one like I said at the outset so this is from my friend, the Jewish scholar mystic Z Shalom. So if we are able to immerse ourselves completely in the moment and transformation is guaranteed. We elaborated on that last time I was with you. So the one I want to augment today. I've mentioned this before in different settings. But this is one for my also my friend my new blood. Ruben laukkanen who I interviewed not that long ago. Really a marvelous pretty brilliant neuroscientist. Oh before I forget. And I will forget Alyssa if you could post that link from Joseph. Remember?

Yes, it's in there already.

Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, Joe. Joe asked me to ping us up there about his session. And so I wanted to honor that before I forgot. So thank you for doing that. You're welcome. So this is what Ruben says that when I when I heard this presentation he gave a presentation I met him originally was through this like study group that I was invited to join over a year ago. Consciousness and non duality and science group where we have some pretty amazing individuals actually they come on and present. And Ruben gave a presentation at the very end he popped up the slide that really just smacked me because of its precision and penetration and incisive quality where he said, highly analogous to what he says resting in the present moment is Annihilation is an amazing thing resting in the present moment

is annihilation.

Really what it does and the and this is the genius of the simple practice. There's so much profundity in the simplicity that by sitting rusting in the present moment, you're boycotting. You're deconstructing and as I mentioned last time, you're frustrating, which is one reason why this practice can be literally frustrating. You're boycotting deconstructing frustrating, this ongoing endless construction project. Ego is an amazingly sophisticated entity. When you say entity that's not quite right. An amazingly sophisticated developmental process. And again, just like fun itself, ego in and of itself is utterly non problematic. Ego is actually very healthy way of separating self from other if we didn't have it. We wouldn't have immune systems we wouldn't be here talking about the nature of ego. So ego is absolutely positively critical for human evolution. The problem is it becomes a form of Arrested Development. And so when we sit in meditation one of the reasons it's frustrating is because we're working to boycott picot go on strike against the most rapid, sophisticated construction company in the history of the world. Which is the ego the ego has an amazing armamentarium skill set. Construction, very sophisticated, very rapid construction company. That moment after moment after moment and the most fascinating neurological way and this is where neuroscience and the wisdom traditions absolutely, positively meet at the speed of sight at the speed of thought. This egoic construction company is creating through a narrative impulse, the very sense of self and then by immediate implication, the sense of other because they call merge, they lean on each other right you can't have self without other. And so with a rapidity that is just staggering, literally. Ego is constantly creating this nightmare of samsara, creating this nightmare of reification. As I was alluding to earlier with the guided meditation. It happens so quickly. It's axiomatic. It's a given. It's just like, well, well what do you mean there's no ego? What do you mean there's no duality? What do you mean there's no other? Well, there isn't. It's only because of the lightning fast. Speed, the constancy the history that we simply don't see the brilliance of this ongoing construction process. And so one of the central ways this construction process is generated and sustained is through narrative structure. Like my dear friend, David Lloyd short, really wonderful book highly recommended. The world is made of stories. It's really an incredible book. And that means the world of the ego. And so when we sit in rest in the present moment, we are annihilating that narrative. We're resting in the timeless and spaceless now and so this goes so fundamentally that image and there's a lot lately, because I'm really into this whole thing. The transition from absolute to relative reality that you know, you're in relative reality. Whenever you have space, time and causality. And that's just given right that's why do you mean there's no space? What are you mean, there's no time where do you mean there's no causality? Well, in the domain of absolute truth, there isn't. There is no space there is no time there is no fatality. And so the minute and we cascade we contract away from this absolute dimension, all the time, instead of like it's someplace other is right here right now. But because of the brilliance of this construction process, we constantly contract against that. And at the speed of thought speed of faster than the speed of light. We create construct this narrative structure of the self sets. And so this is also why at the deepest levels, you know, some of you may have already had these types of experiences when you're starting to engage in a longer window shopping. You're starting to engage in deeper meditation, you're starting to do some retreat. You will start to realize a little bit stronger languaging here and this I I've heard this quote from dozens of different masters in the wisdom traditions, not just Buddhist, Hindu, in Sufi and others.

This practice is death in slow motion. So that that Annihilation is a type of death. The deconstruction of this self sense and when you engage in really deep practice, if you've done rigorous retreat, you may have had these moments where you'll you'll notice when you have a glimpse of the true nature of reality, emptiness, emptiness means here empty of this narrative empty of this construction. Very often, if you can't stay in that space, and usually because of the momentum of habitual patterns, we can't. There's a moment of panic. You feel like you're going to lose your mind you feel like you've lost your mind you feel like you'd like to die. You're not going to die. It's just your ego that's expiring. And so by understanding this for the deeper divers, this is really important in terms of right view. And this means when in fact, your your world starts to come apart, like Trungpa Rinpoche said, so famously, right. Chaos should be regarded as extremely good news. deconstruction should be regarded as extremely good news. sounds good on paper and not so good in reality. And so by engaging in a simple simple practice of meditation you're taking the whole bloody thing apart. This is what's so again, so brilliant about it, you start to realize he's starting to slow things down, right? This is that like the little alliterative maxim that I use to deconstruct is the de automatize is to decelerate. So we start the deceleration process and meditation. Excuse me, we literally go on strike. We stopped sit that slows things down that decelerates. But deceleration leads to a D automatization. You start to take things apart, you start to actually see things you've never seen before you start to see how you're constantly contracting, constantly. supergluing linking thinking, constantly slapping the world together. I mean, even a physicist will tell you neuroscientists will tell you we're all arises in a pointillistic way. It's a parsed reality. It's like looking at us painting by Suraj that it's just pixels. It's like reality in mind is pixelated is atomistic in Buddhist psychology, this is what's called dharmas small de armas, Adams of experience. So by decelerating you start to do automatize and therefore you actually start to see that you are the responsible party for your construction of either suffering or happiness. You are the one that super glues the world in your version, usually a version of your own projections of whatnot. Then you literally start to see this and so I mentioned this before earlier, when scientists neuroscientists study things like the speed of mind and mind moments, right? This is not just rhetoric. They do some really sophisticated studies, Francesco Varela, had he lived to win a note won a Nobel Prize for sure. Student of Trungpa Rinpoche and then to Google, generally pretty amazing guy. I met him several times, way back before he died. Liver cancer. He took it upon himself and now students so his entwined lots and others to try to really pinpoint as best they could. The ultimate irreducible mind moment, what is their what is the finite or the infinite resolution? How far how precise can the mind be? And just to give you a rough idea here, untamed untrained mind 250 milliseconds basically we can resolve the use really sophisticated strobe lights to call Kista scopes. And they can start to see like you don't realize that the light in your home is an alternating current flickering back and forth. You don't see that flicker because it's happening above the flicker fusion resolution right? So you see it as continuous when you start to really train the mind, slow it down. You literally take your reality apart, you're you're annihilating you're deconstructing and meditators literally have a tenfold increase from 250 milliseconds millisecond as a 1,000th of a second. They can resolve reality. 10,000,010 milliseconds. That's traumatic and that's where the C when all the wisdom traditions come down with these. These were called the AVI dharmas. Right. All the different mental factors that come into play. These are not at all theoretical. They're absolutely experiential. These are the atoms of mind the atoms of experience. That are detected once the mind slows down to this extent.

And so again, just this simple practice, just this alone, can start to prepare you for death because that's exactly what's gonna happen when you die at the end of life. That's the ultimate slowing down, right. That's the ultimate stop sign. That's when everything falls apart, right? Well, why not invite that dissolution, deconstruction falling apart now? Why not die before you die? So this stuff, many of you know this from my work? ties in totally to the Bible teachings? So these incredibly powerful statements from Zvi right if we are able to immerse ourselves completely in the present moment. Transformation is guaranteed ruin. Resting in the present moment is annihilation. And you'll notice this even colloquially that I'll pause and we can talk about this or any other questions you may have. This to me is a big deal. You might notice this even Cokely when you enter you know what would they call the zone right? The flow state almost always associated with physical activity by the way, because that's when the body in trains the mind you enter you enter the zone you play out of your mind as a tennis player, I had this experience as a musician. I've had this experience. I'm sure many of you had, where you enter like my friend, Lama, Surya Das, LSD talks about his Buddhist Standard Time. Before the moment, you enter the timeless time zone, where even time itself is deconstructed. You actually start to see for yourself through this meditation, the time and then Einstein showed us time and space at same time as a construct. Nima or Connie have read this, I think Princeton physicist right and a really famous talk now you can find it on Zoom. Space Time is doomed. This is coming from a purely physical point of view, but in the meditative point of view, you can start to deconstruct even the very fabric of space and time and when you're doing that what are you doing? You're stepping back into absolute reality. Where space and time don't exist. You can start to see this when you enter this infinite time zone of the present moment. That's when you enter what I've talked about earlier is the fourth moment Right? Beyond Past the future, even beyond the present, because even believe it or not, even the present moment is deconstructed. Even the present moment is illusory at this level. These three times past, present and future. Even the present moment is a construct, but it's the closest it's truer than past and future. So we use the present as a conduit Riven into reality as a way to enter this kind of hidden land the truest hidden land of what's called the fourth moments. The ultimate timezone of Buddha Standard Time. So one final statement connected to this. So this is the third one in this kind of series. One of the more famous ones from the great one of my favorite philosophers lessons for Vidkun Stein, if by eternity is understood, not endless temporal duration, but timelessness. Then he or she who exists in the present moment, lives eternally. Right. So you want to find the founder of loot, youth, you want to find the elixir of immortality. Deconstruct yourself sense deconstruct the ego die into the timeless present moment. And you will enter the gates of heaven really the pearly gates of immortality exist in the timeless moment. And so therefore, here we go, simple, non referential Shabbat as simple mindfulness. Coming back to body and breath. Coming back to the present moment provisionally. Yes, we do. That there is a present moment and relative truth. But eventually, you rest in that present moment completely that collapses, even that is annihilated. And then you enter this fourth moment, connected to what the Hindus called Turia, literally the fourth. So it's amazing isn't it? You're doing this this simple little practice and look at all the dimensions of depth here profundity and so therefore, I think it's worth ripping up this stuff because what does it do for me? Oh my gosh, completely empowers my desire to meditate, like the most important thing I do. And the more I studied, the more I read, the more I practice, the more I realized, this is the only game in town and I'll say more about that next time like with you,

working with your mind, especially at this level directly. This is the only game in town. Everything else is a substitute, which is why it never satisfies everything else is inauthentic. And so really, I would argue that what we're doing here is the most honest, authentic thing you could possibly ever do. Because fundamentally, you're being introduced to reality. So with that said, I'll pause. We can have some discussion around this. It'd be one. I'll see if anything came in on the chat column. And if not, if somebody has a question, that would be a nice time to bring something up if you'd like and I'll give you a minute to

think about that. There. was one question that came in through the chat from Peter, he said, is the act of recollecting of the classic four thoughts which turn the mind to dharma, the best of the means for establishing, establishing and consolidating right view. Always

one of the best ones. I wouldn't say it's the best Peter. But yeah, I mean, the four thoughts, the turn the mind, literally the four reminders. They're colossally contributory to right view because what what do these four do right? They, they're all fundamentally bringing us to the recognition of the fragility of the present moment, the approximate the proximity of death. The results of karma mean basically, they're there for rugged contemplations that fundamentally create like you're alluding to, Peter, that's right view that Whoa, you know, what I'm doing here is really important. Dharma is my only help, as it says, When I'm engaging with my life is extraordinarily fragile, fragile, right? Death comes without warning, this will this body will be a course. And then the very last one connected to what I just finished with the homeless friends wealth and comforts of samsara, are the constant torment of the three suffering so anything else? Outside of this is wrong view is distraction. So the four thoughts absolutely are. Key there. There are some I wouldn't say the supplemental they're augmenting to creating this this this foundational right view. And just to show you the importance of this when I did my three year retreat, when we transition from the second to the third year, we spent 16 days on these guys. Two days, actually, that's 68. Two days on each one of these four thoughts, each one of these contemplations, so over and over and over 30 to 16 hours a day. 32 hours, over two days, over and over. And over. And I still do these every single day I do. I alternate between doing all four, or concentrating just on one. But there isn't a single day that that doesn't go by that I'm not using these four reminders to remind me create the right view because you know, the essence of spiritual practice is remembrance. The essence of samsaric practice is forgetfulness. We forget distraction is a form of forgetfulness. Non lucidity is a form of forgetfulness. So we're always always always forgetting. And so really many of the wisdom traditions will tell you that these practices are all like jogging your memory, helping you to remember. And so that's the way I work computer. They're absolutely my experience. They continue to be really central to turning the mind towards the right view. Probably getting a sustainable view. Okay?

All right. I'll get Kimberly unmuted. Okay. Hello, Andrew, how are you?

Hi, Kimberly. I'm fine. I'm gonna be scanning the chat column as you talk, but I can definitely

Yep. Okay. So, just regarding the that timeless space you were talking about. So if we deconstruct ego, and we enter into that timeless space, what is it that is actually like what are we perceiving with?

Yeah, great question. As usual, this is somewhat similar to a question you asked recently. So this is clearly running deep for you, which is awesome. When you're proceeding at the level of relative reality, so get to get a little bit technical here, just in terms of vocabulary, and this is good because when we start working with this level of nuance and granularity, the languaging that we use is actually quite important. And so the relative conventional ways of relating to space time causality, what we know is our working mind we're working principally with when we work in meditations called SEM, right SEM. And so this is the type of mind or knowing that we know in a conventional dualistic way, but as you I'm sure you're aware, right. At a certain point, Sam was not foundational Sam was foundational to samsara to the illusion to Maya was irreducibly truly foundational was Regpack that's the nature of minds also the nature of reality. And so I can tell you what what that what the answer is simple on one level is rigged pot using NET languaging. Now what rape is we can go there a little bit if you want that may not be so initially simple, simply because we're not familiar with this foundational quality of life. So it is that self reflexive awareness this rigpa is knowing quality of the mind heart itself. That then is aware is what precedes of what knows, and it's underneath it there. It's never here's the other way to look at it that I think is really important to really is not a very absolutely, totally authentic level requests. The only thing there really is, you know, synonyms for this to be clear, like my nirvana. That's all there really ever is. I've been riffing on this a lot over the last year because it's so important. So when we have an experience of of confusion samsara duality some that's just either partial or non recognition of this fundamental dimension of mind. See? And so I mentioned this just parenthetical and then I'll pause to see if you want to go in a particular way with this I mentioned this over and over these days, because it empowers the utter immediacy of what we're looking for, right? Because it may seem through all these machinations and teachings that like, oh, geez, I have to do this. I have to do that. I have to do this. In order to realize, well, stability comes from all that stuff. But the recognition can happen that spot so I'll pause for a second to make sure that's kind of what you're asking. But the the answer, really, especially from a Tibetan Buddhist point of view is rigpa. That's what knows.

Yeah. Okay. So, within that state, though, you're still going to be having a risings of forms and words and sounds like your your conscious mind. So if you're experiencing from the Rick, per se, that's still gonna kind of come up to conscious mind and have a display of some sort.

Well, yes or no, but the relationship here then is radically transformed, because then what arises and this is what I was saying earlier, when I was intimating that what arises is seen as an ornament of the mind that what that means is that right but and again, when we're talking about rape another synonym I was, you know, Kimberly is is emptiness. So, what's important here is what I've been talking about also for the last year, is emptiness, not a source, but his essence. And so, if we think somehow that rigpa source, then what that implies and your question seems to imply it is that when thought form, whatever arises, that seems to be arising from rigpa, from emptiness, see, but it's actually arising as Rigby as emptiness that is a really subtle but super important distinction, because otherwise there's a very subtle cosmological dualism, that somehow I have to return to Riga. I have to return to emptiness. I have to return to the source. No, there's nothing but the source.

And it's just a recognition in that moment is everything

recognition, liberation is how many times as I said in the Tibetan Book of the Dead, you know, the glia garba, tantra recognition and liberation or simultaneous recognition is everything. And parenthetically, this is why I was just so deeply impressed with the recognition sutras from a non dual Shabbatot point of view. That is the classic rigpa text using Hindu languaging. So recognition is the whole bloody thing at this level. And that's why again, oh my god, it's lucidity, lucidity principle. You simply have to recognize and that's it right there. There's nothing but rigpa there's nothing but the display of emptiness and luminosity. That's it. So what you're saying here is pointing to something really, super important, very subtle and really profound. That makes that

nice. Yes. Thank you. And also just want to say that I listened to the interview that you had with the SWAMI. Yeah, it was awesome. Like, I'll tell you how I felt I felt like a monkey on a vine. And you guys are just like this jungle and the leaves and everything. And I'm just hanging on to these threads. So I was kind of I was like with you, but I was lost as well.

I felt like yeah,

it was awesome. But I felt like it was just it. Did it. Tell me it? Did it go around in circles, in a sense where you attacked the situation from one perspective, but it just led back to the same spot? Yeah. And then so it was kind of like that. The main thing I got out of it was the vibrational, you know, Shiva state, and then it kind of contracts out into manifestation is exactly kind of like what we're talking with the rigpa coming out in recognizing, yeah, so it just kind of keeps going around and around like that, but just so many different names and terminologies for the same thing. And I think that's where I get really confused because it's like, I feel like I grasp the essence of it all. But then I get caught up in everybody's like different terminologies and then I get stuck in on what it means. But in the end, I think, yeah, it's all the same.

It's almost like learning different languages. Eventually, you start to realize the similarities of conferences and I have to share because this was this happened off air with Swami Ji after we finished, he very playfully apologized and it was so sweet. He said, he goes, this is so much fun. I just couldn't help myself. And he said I decided to just run with it and I said Swami Ji You can run with it like that anytime you want. I just find him a beautiful human being. I mean, he's razor sharp, right? He's so smart. And he just beams that's why I wanted to keep an eye on video. He just beams this this beauty of His love. And to me is his presence that is just so absolutely magnetizing so I just love that guy to death. He was one of the people that I was introduced to in the consciousness of non duality and science group. And we developed a little bit of a friendship behind the scenes that way but yeah, like you I thought, I think he's just amazing. So cool.

Thank you so much. It was awesome. Thank you, Andrew.

Thank you enjoyed it. Cool. Okay, let me see if there's anything on the chat. Otherwise, somebody else has something to say.

Oh, it was Katie, but her hand went down. There were quite a few comments in the chat though.

Yeah, I'm looking at the swag. Yeah. Yeah, it's not 10,000,010 milliseconds. No, no, it's it's 10 milliseconds, which means you're able to resolve something to 10,000th of a second. So mine moments the ability using what's called attentional blink studies, and that is the scopes. Again, what they do is super simplification right? So what they do here is they use these these it's like a fancy strobe light and untamed mind looks at the strobe light and let's say it can resolve you know, it's called flicker fusion. Were usually 16 to 24 frames pulses per second, but again, it depends. The untamed mind will resolve reality to a certain frequency, right? They see continuity where trained mind does not see continuity. A train mind sees a bunch of gaps, a bunch of Barlow's a bunch of spaces between what we will see as continuous. And so it can be tenfold studies, again, they've shown meditators have a tenfold increase of resolution. And so therefore, literally they no exaggeration, literally not metaphorically, see more, feel more, hear more, taste more, because they're thinking less or they're caught less than that distraction, and therefore their powers of acuteness are so heightened. And so therefore, this is where psychic capacities come from what we know is all these side psi phenomena. These are just natural consequences of the mind opening and slowing down to this extent all kinds of magic. Ordinary magic takes place when the mind slows down, but it's not 10 million milliseconds a 1,000th of a second. Okay. Okay, from Cassandra hired you How's it possible to simultaneously function in both relative and absolute reality simultaneously? The light ones seem to do the same asleep, but it seems like a paradox is only a paradox to the conceptual mind because what would reality look like from this perspective? Oh lordy, what a great question. I try contender to answer this with my second book dreams of light. Oh, jeez. This is such a rich deep question. Read my book. Briefly, it what does it look like from this perspective? Oh, well, again, I can just finger paint. Excuse me. I can finger paint a little bit. I can tell you what it doesn't look like the world that this this level doesn't look like it's out there. It doesn't look solid. It doesn't look lasting. It doesn't look independent. In other words, it doesn't look dualistic. And so the type of the way it looks is the closest information you can get from this is how you look at your dreams. From the daytime perspective, looking back on the nighttime dream in other words, such a great question so briefly when you're when you're in a nighttime dream. So this is the confused way right. There seems to be an object seems to be a subject seems to be something connecting the two ie consciousness, right? Yeah, I see the dream that's just the way it is. No no, that's all a construct. When you wake up to this waking stance, you now have a more realistic perspective. You can look back on that nighttime experience with a new sense of perspective and say, Wait a second. That's not really what's going on. There's no subject in there. There's no object in there. There is no consciousness connecting the two consciousness doesn't connect. It's separate. So what you're doing, but what does it really look like? Whoa, this is talking about what is it like to see through the eyes of a Buddha? That's not so easy, otherwise, we'd all be enlightened. But the dream analogy and this is why we're have a very deep connection to Advaita Vedanta and Swami Ji his teachings is what I first heard of him. I heard an interview with that he did with Rupert Spira, and both of them were pinging big time it's a central analogy from the Manoukian upon Ashad. The the vitamins really run with about the dream example. And so this looks like a dream. From that perspective. This looks like a dream. What that really means Cassandra, Oh, lordy. That's why I wrote the whole book of dreams of light is literally no kidding. The whole book is about answering your question. I'm not kidding. So with your kind permission,

you might might want to refer to that, but it's a brilliant question. It's a really great question, and the the simultaneity. You absolutely can work with a relative from an absolute relative perspective simultaneously who says you can't only Aristotle says you can't only Boolean logic, yes, no binary thinking says you can't. In reality, you can work with both dimensions you that's in quotations. How there's absolutely always forever absolute perspective. But from that lens, it's like a child. It's like an adult, temporarily behaving and looking and acting as a child in order to communicate with other children. You can still have your adult perspective, right, as the absolute, but you can still operate from a relative perspective to communicate with the child, that's the relative. So in that colloquial example, you can get a sense if they're not mutually exclusive. You can still have your adult view and engage in a childlike way to relate to other children. So it's something like that. Okay. Great, one great question. Okay. Yeah, I'm currently doing a course with Tergar Is this the same lineage as Trungpa? No. Well, I guess no, I have to be a little careful. It's not the same organization. So major MPJ turgor is great. I mean, absolutely. Great. She's Kagi Ningbo, mostly Nima, right? As was Trump Erbitux. So on that level, yes, they share the same lineage. But in terms of like the organization they're they're they're totally different organizations, but they come both Trungpa and and manger member che really espouse the same thing two lineages. Oh, can I stay with the for content contemplations are sure Jerry I'll just recite them rather quickly. Number one, contemplate the preciousness of being so free and well favored. This is difficult to gain. Easy to lose. Now I must do something meaningful. Number two the whole world and its inhabitants are impermanent. In particular, the life of beings is like a bubble. That comes without warning. This body will be a corpse. At that time, the Dharma will be my only help I must practice it with exertion. Third, when death comes I will be helpless. Because a Credit Karma I must have been an evil deeds. Always devote myself to virtuous actions for the homes friends wealth and conferences samsara or the constant torment of the three sufferings just like a feast before the execution or leads you to your death. I must cut desire in attachment and attain enlightenment through exertion Parmesan bottle, right all right. She Stephanie I've been using this for reminders, the turn the mind I find them helpful but I apologize for my ignorance on them. Learning Buddhism as I go, in the last four three minder, what exactly are the three sufferings? Let's just put it this way. Stephanie. You're afflicted with all of them. As we all are, my dear you know how much I care for you. Right? Uh, yeah. The suffering of getting not getting what you want the suffering of losing what you have and then suffering of suffering. Basically, just just that pretty much covers everything right? Suffering of suffering is my favorite one. That's when you have like cancer and then the next day you get shot in the foot or something, right. So it's just compounded suffering. So those are those are in a nutshell those three sufferings, my favorite topic

all right. One more from Libby I think you said that contemplating the four thoughts is not necessarily the best way to develop right thought What are other methods?

I didn't I never use the word right thought

oh yeah, she She corrected herself and said right view. Well,

I mean, basically, the best way to cultivate right view is to study the dharma. I mean, that's what the Dharma is fundamentally all about. View meditation in action. So the view is, this is again, one of these really wonderfully colossal questions where the right view in a certain way, the four reminders are beautiful, because they're really pithy, they're condense. They're really articulate bullet points. But fundamentally, the right view then, is also nuanced granulated, depending on the particular tradition in the school. So within the terabyte in Indiana approach you have all the right views connected with that. The Abbe Dharma serve as the bottle all that kind of stuff, the Mahayana then you have all the right views associated with that principally in that school the view of Metallica, middle way and the view of emptiness in the in the Adrianna approach. Then you have the view of luminosity and emptiness. And so the view of Ripa so each one of those vehicles, each one of the turnings, basically every one of the schools has their respective views. And then there's all kinds of wonderful, interesting debates and contest about which view is the greatest and the most supreme? Well, I think it could be argued the Dalai Lama does this many others as well, but it's this is very debatable. It's the view that transcends you know, Mahayana transcends but includes the history of Indiana Tera Vaada. By God, Adrianna transcends but includes both. So therefore, the budget yada is the supreme view. I terrified and wouldn't say that I'm a hyaena. Probably wouldn't say that. But that's the way seems to make the most sense to me. So fundamentally, re view is inculcated with all the teachings and therefore it's a really big deal. What makes the four thoughts who began so powerful is they're they're really pithy, they're really condensed, very concentrated. And they're fundamentally really about bringing the right view of impermanence, karma fragility and futility of the Samsara agenda. So that's a bullet point reason why they're just so great. Okay. Alright.

Looks like Karen posted a page that says this is the right lineage. Okay.

Yeah, I'd have to look at that. Don't have time to click on it. Okay, so let's see here. See here. You have intersection of those two kinds of time at any given moment. Cool. Yeah, from Avila. Oh, yeah. What was being measured brain frequencies don't know not brain frequencies everyone. Resolution capacities, was measured as the ability of the mind to detect without intentional blank. How quickly can the mind discern moments? That's what's been determined. It probably has something to do with brain frequencies in terms of gamma stuff, but they're not measuring brain frequencies. They're measuring the capacity of the mind to resolve reality. How quickly can the mind resolve reality? Okay.

be measured. Yeah, read everyone. If you want to learn more about this. Gosh, there's a lot of data on this. I would recommend probably the most interesting riff on this in the public domain is Evan Thompson's work right? waking, dreaming being. He's got maybe 1015 pages on this whole thing. It's really worth reading. It's a wonderful, he's a really Socratic thinker. So he brings in a lot of really interesting data. I don't remember which chapter but somewhere in that book he talks about this pretty elegantly. Okay, so anybody else? Any other questions or comments? Are we good for today?

Looks like you got them all from the chat. Any

jokes? The whole thing is a joke right? You guys are getting the hang of that. Well, thank you for showing everybody I really enjoy these things. They're so it's so fun to hang with everybody. I really do get a lot out of it. And so Joe will be here next week. I'm off for the week. And we do have some stuff coming up. So Dr. Ed on Wednesday. I'm going to be there with him. We're going to talk about sleep architecture. We have a little discussion behind the scenes. And so those of you who haven't joined it asked for these little kind of science and medicine things on sleep with him. They're really fun and he's great. So that's I think that's still 230 For this Wednesday. This week on Thursday, we have the q&a. We alternate with the book study group. And then I'll get some interview stuff set up. Again, I'm always a little cautious about saying Who exactly I've got coming up because sometimes people tell me Oh 100% I'm going to do it. And then they don't expectation is premeditated disappointment. So, anyway, thank you, everybody. So much fun to see everybody. If we do this totally geeky thing, right? If you want you can turn on. Everybody turns on the camera. Everybody turns off their mic and we do this silly little group. Hug or we just say Yeah, hi. Everybody Yeah, very satisfying. Yeah. Awesome. Lucid dreams. Everybody see me

Thank you. I know.

Bye. Bye.

Bye. Bye. Bye everyone. Goodbye. Bye everybody, Andrew holochain here and I am especially delighted to introduce to you and spend some time with a remarkable individual that I had the opportunity to get to know a little bit this summer during