And when you look at the history of indigenous people around the world, what you find is that repeatedly, people make the mistake of wiping out their environment. 800 years ago, there was Melanesian people, Southeast Asian people who got in a boat and and got to New Zealand, and discovered it for the first time, there were no people there. And there were 50 different species of Mo birds there, some as large as ostriches, some as small as a chicken. But they were completely on afraid of humans, so you can just walk up to them and break their necks and eat them. And so these Melanesian travelers, they, they are called the Moriah, which means people who eat them all birds. And for 300 years, they went on this binge of eating these birds, and they just stripped to the island and all the obits. And finally they ate the last one. I mean, they're extinct. And then they started eating the fish in the nearby waters, and they fished out the waters, and then they start and then they ate all the small mammals that they could find down to rats, and then they reading amphibians and frogs. And then then they were experiencing famine in New Zealand. And at that point, they started forming, they formed a, I think, as I recall, was 32. Maybe it's 36 or 38, tribal kind of villages, essentially on the island, and they all went to war with each other. And they would literally take prisoners as meat on the hook, they started practicing cannibalism because they were so protein deficient. And, you know, if you go about 400 miles northwest of the northeast of there to British New Caledonia, so so well, let me finish this. So when Captain Cook in the 1770s arrived at he called a murderers, covert murderers Bay in New Zealand, when he first arrived in New Zealand discovered it, he also discovered Hawaii, you know, all that, but anyhow, he discovered this island of New Zealand and he brought us ships up close and they, his number two guy got in the, in the boat, and along with a half a dozen crew members and they were going to roll up to the, to the, to the shore and say hi to the natives. And, but they didn't realize that this was a culture that had become totally warlike and cannibalistic. And so the more he jumped in their canoes and dugouts and rode out there, and they thought they were meeting them for, you know, hey, how you doing? And instead, the mauri you know, flipped the boat and and took, murdered, killed several of the crew members and the two that they didn't kill, they took them up on the shore and, and slaughtered them and then roasted them and ate them. And you know, while Captain Cook is watching, and he sailed off just absolutely horrified by this. So that was a culture that was like in the process of making this cultural transition. Then he goes a couple 100 miles northeast and runs into British what we refer to as British New Caledonia, which had been occupied about 500 years earlier than New Zealand by Melanesian. Travelers, they had arrived there like 1600 years ago. And they went through the exact same cycle, they ate all the MO Burt's they wiped out the island, they they destroyed much of the foliage, they fished out the waters. And then they rebooted their culture. They were like, you know, holy cow, we can't live this way. And by the time Captain Cook showed up, they had made this complete cultural transmission transition. And we're living in harmony with their environment and complete balance with their environment, they developed religions that were cooperative and caring. And they had gone through a cannibal phase, you know, in a war phase, during, you know, early on and which you can find the remnants of, and Captain Cook wrote in his diaries, these are the happiest people I've ever met in, in the world. This place is a true paradise life here, you know, is better than any human could ever imagine. You know, he was blown away by. So, you know, we see that societies figure out through typically through terrible mistakes, how to how to live, particularly in terms of their environment, and the same thing apparently happened here in North America. You had tribes. I mean, you know, North America was first populated somewhere between 20 and 30,000. Two years ago, and over a period of time up toward, you know, particularly in the, in the 1000 or 2000 years after the end of the Ice Age, excuse me, what 8000 years ago, you had people who were growing, populations will grow to meet the limit of the food supply. That's that's kind of a basic law of nature. You know, Thomas Malthus wrote about this back in the days, and, and, you know, if you and they tend to balance out, I mean, if you've got a lot of rabbits, then the fox population will come up, and then the rabbit population will go down, and then the fox population will go down, and then the rabbit, and there's always this kind of stasis. This is sort of what Darwin identified with the finches with a hardened, you know, big beak and small beaks, and, you know, eating all the large, you know, the hard to crack seeds. And then when they wiped out those seeds, then the smaller ones had, you know, they, they went back and forth, back and forth, and back and forth, who had the evolutionary advantage. And so the population of North America grew to hit the limits of its food. And the result of that was, and there's plenty in the archaeological record to show this. The result of that was devastation, environmental devastation all over North America, and all over the Americas. And what most tribes learned from that was how to live in balance with their environment. This was a hard learned lesson, but they wiped out the giant three toe sloth sloth, but they wiped out the the woolly mammoths say wiped out the Maybe those were, there's a debate about climate change on those, they wiped out a small kind of Camel like animal, they, there were a whole bunch of mammals that were large and an easy to kill and eat, that just got just, you know, went extinct as a consequence of humans running around in North America. And so these today's tribal people, Native American people have the memory of that. You know, when I lived in Vermont, the, you know, the Abenaki, there was a local, you know, the Vermont Public Radio, they were interviewing a guy who was an anthropologist, and he was looking at the Abenaki stories. Now, monarchies have stories about when the walls of blue ice receded. Now, that was 10,000 years ago, the end of the ice age. And so he, they this, this team from the University of Vermont, went out and looked at the the remaining gravel records, I mean, you can see where the gravel is, where the stones are, where the glaciers stopped, when they receded, how far they receded, at what time and in what order. And what they found was that the Abenaki stories about that time, were accurate, that this is literally a 10,000 year old memory that these people still carry. And so, you know, my message to Frank was, you know, I'm guessing my ancestors 3000 years ago had figured out how to live in balance with their environment in Europe. But you know, they got completely blown up. And the reason why this is a crisis, obviously, for all of us now is that this time, we are making the same stupid mistake only we're not doing a local basis where you know, a tribe might die out or a local ecosystem might be destroyed. We're doing it on a planet wide basis.