So welcome to the Kansas reflector. We are with Topeka State Representative Fred Patton, who has dedicated nine legislative sessions to work in the state house. And about twice that amount of time in service of the Seaman public school district in Topeka. He's accumulated an unusual perspective by jumping into the legislative branch of state government responsible, for example, spending on K 12 public education. And he's also seen what it's really like to educate those kids. At the other end of the spectrum, he served several terms as president of the local school board and in the Capitol, he's held chairmanships of key committees, including the Judiciary Committee, and the education budget committee, officially this month, he will be have stepped down from both of those obligations. And he's here now to look back on those years of public service and help us understand what it all means. Welcome, Mr. Patton.
Thanks for having me, Tim.
Thanks for taking your time to be here with us. So first represent a paddle wide stepped down now from the 50th district of the Kansas house.
Yeah, so I decided last spring that I wasn't going to run again. And then one day, last spring, on a Friday, I woke up early, and I'm like, I should start running. And so I ran, I ran everyday sense. Every morning, I get up 3045 minutes by myself, and no one can bother me and my phone doesn't ring. And I just had a lot of time to reflect on what's important. And, boy, we've got two kids, two, two sons, who are finishing up their educations, both starting jobs in Kansas City in the next couple of months, got a daughter at home who have got a year left with and so I want to be able to spend time with them as they transition instead of the next, you know, this spring being gone. That's the big one.
Tough to go to dinner in Kansas City when you're at a committee meeting at 7pm in the evening and March,
right when they were all here. And thankfully, I live in Topeka. I mean, it's much easier, I think, to be a representative in Topeka than being you know, from West gun. So I could go to their stuff. But as they move on, I want to be a part of that. And I just knew that wouldn't be possible if I stayed in the legislature.
And maybe the explanation is comparable, but you join the Siemens school board, and 22,003. And you resigned in 2021. Why did it seem to be the right time to depart then
that one was because for a number of years, I felt that I could do both jobs, I would get done at the legislature and I give time to the school board. It got to towards that end of COVID, that both jobs were terribly busy. And I felt like I was not doing the job that the constituents deserved when it came to the school board. And so that's why I stepped away from that.
Some curious that the legislature, as you well know, offers modest compensation. School board members received no pay. So you weren't getting rich doing all this. But what drew you to these two roles, you
know, school board, we had to our two oldest at the time. One was three and one was one. And I was president of the Optimist Club up north. And our school district for the first time in forever had hired a new superintendent. And he came and he spoke and he wanted full day kindergarten, he wanted to close some buildings, he thought we needed an alternative school. It's one other big thing. And I'm like, I went to school here, this guy's not going to mess up my school district. And I'm like, I should run for school board. I remember pulling the kids around in a wagon and had no idea what campaigning meant. And back then the elections were in the spring, so it's cold and snowy. So I got elected. And I soon found out that this guy knew what he was talking about. We were he was superintendent and I was on the board for a number of years, all good things he wanted to do. But that's what got me started there. And yeah, I did that for a long time. I at one point in time was President school board, State School Board Association. And that's where I began to get a little more concerned with the state level that you know, we had no money. And if we had no money, when when a good portion of the state budget goes to schools, we're seeing schools get cut. And I'm like, I can sit out here and complain, and nothing happens. So why don't you step up and run? And so that's why I ran for the legislature.
Yeah, jump into the cauldron. Yeah. So I know you're an attorney and you work in the field. But do you have any future political plans?
I don't. I've always said, I don't know what I'm going to do when I grow up. And you know, over the last week, since people have known I'm stepping down for this, people have lots of ideas.
I'm not sure what's next, maybe you're just gonna keep running away from it all. Maybe that's an option for sure. So perhaps it'd be best to delve into your legislative and your school board experiences separately. I'm interested, really interested in the thoughts of former legislators because I always feel and imagine that they're now free of those special interests. They're free of legislative leadership free of the expectation of their constituents, and can be more direct in terms of what they say and believe. I know you're a straightforward person, but I just have that general feeling about people. So I'm really fascinated. So if you are briefing somebody about your experience in the statehouse, someone who's thinking about campaigning for the Kansas house What might be a couple of orientation points? You know, you can't be comprehensive here. But, but just what would be a couple of ideas that you might share with him?
Yeah, the first thing I tell anybody who's thinking about the legislature is make sure they understand the time commitment. It's it's extensive. I mean, it's, it's maybe not your first couple years. But once you get on busy committees, or start chairing committees, it's a full day and night commitment. Not to scare people away, because I certainly want good people to do it. And then I just encourage them to go meet with other leaders in their community. I mean, get to know your your school boards, talk to your city councils, county commissioners, learn what they think is important, because and I may say this over and over again, because I always tell student groups this right there in my title in the word representative is the word represent. And I think that's important. I've always tried to, you know, as I'm casting votes, I want to represent what the people in the 50th district think. And so that's the best way to determine if you're the right person for them or not as to go out and meet people in the community and see if your views met least closely, somewhat closely aligned.
Do you think there's merit to getting some some government experience prior to legislature when I'm asking about there is, you know, school board or city council or City Commission, or maybe even the county commissioners to have some semblance of what government is about? Oh,
I absolutely think that's helpful. I mean, if not, you walk in there, and you have no idea how it works. I mean, we've all seen that you know, how a bill becomes a law cartoon. And we all took civics in school, and we think we know how the process works. If you've not had any government experience, and you walk in there, yeah, you just be overwhelmed. So I think that's really important.
So let's think about some things that you really liked about being in a legislature, you know, I think about if you're a policy wonk, or the people you meet, you know, what would be some things that you really liked. And then we'll look at the opposite side of that, yes,
I really like meeting with people. I love talking to student groups, or if there's constituents that come in, or even organizations that maybe I don't see eye to eye with, welcome them to come meet with me. It's just fun to hear other people's perspectives, and learn new things. The other thing I really enjoyed is is kind of being a problem solver in the legislature and maybe stuff that was in my committees, or maybe not, it was fun trying to get together with either the two sides of an issue or, you know, two people working on an issue and trying to figure out what's possible. I mean, you know, you're never going to get everything you want. And so how can we sit down and come up with that? And that's the I really enjoyed that piece.
Well, good, Lord. I mean, you had conversations with Democrats, you're a Republican, you had conversations with Democrats. Right. Crazy, huh? It sounds insane. Apparently, they don't really do that in Washington. So what would be some of the other issues, some of the concerns you had about being an illustrator things you had trouble? stomaching? And there I might think about, you know, the irritating thing about fundraising or, you know,
actually, fundraising, I never put a lot of effort into it. And I did quite well. So that was really not an issue for me. I don't I don't know if I was just lucky or being in Topeka. That wasn't that much of a challenge. I mean, more and more since I've been there, that the division that we see in our community became harder. I thought, for me to, to represent the community, where are they on an issue? And, and being in Topeka while I think it was a great opportunity for someone in Topeka to serve because it's easy to go back, you could try to work a little bit still see your kids, right? You can spend the night at home, you spend the night home, but immediate feedback, like half the people, I bet that work in the capitol live in my district. And so I can't even get out of the building without them saying good vote or bad vote, stop by the grocery store on the way home immediate feedback, go to the basketball game, you know, on a Tuesday night, immediate feedback. Whereas somebody who stays here all week long, they maybe get feedback when they go home on the weekend. Yeah. So the upside, I guess, is that I did get feedback. I mean, and I wanted it. The downside is, is I got feedback, right. And I just didn't have that barrier. Because I was right here. And
politicians get labeled all the time. And basically, you're Republican or Democrat, there are some libertarians and a lot of independent voters out there. But also serve as reference points for voters. There's also terms like hardcore and far left and moderate. So what do you think about those labels? And where do you think you generally fall? Yeah,
I tried my best. Well, when I got there, I did the same thing. I tried to figure out who fell in what camp right I mean, that's how you who are going to be my allies. When I became chair K 12 budget, I remember walking out of Ron Ron Quinn's office, the speaker at the time and certainly he encouraged me to figure out how we're going to solve school finance and address the courts concerns but he told me to get to know certain people on the committee and people who are either further right than me or further left than me and, and I took that to heart and ever since ever since that time, I've made it a goal to get to know truly get to know them instead of just work with people that didn't think like me. Because I think that makes the process better. And
I would think that If you if you understand the position of people that you perhaps disagree with you, it's actually quite possible to write a better bill.
Oh, absolutely. I mean, everyone is sent here by a group of constituents, right? And, and they come here because they have certain beliefs. And then they're here to advocate for those. And so they're just not coming here with their own ideas. I mean, some are, but but most have a reason for it. And so get to know them, and why is that important to them? Or why is it important to their community? And then you can try to figure out
how to come up with this. And I'll let you label yourself. Yeah.
I mean, I've been labeled plenty of things that I'm, I don't know if it's right of center or label. Now, I don't know where
I know, I think I'm certainly more centrist. And you can be right of center.
I'm not on either end of the spectrum by any means. And I wouldn't say I'm right smack dab in the middle, either. I'm, I'm writing them, you could
argue, I think, persuasively that you're pretty good reflection of Kansas. Generally. It might be a state that's a little bit right of center. You know, yeah, there's parts of the state that are super conservative and others in the other end, but I think generally, sure, yeah. Okay. All right, good. Some people say politics changes, folks. And maybe that is a Washington, DC idea. But I can see it happening on the state level as well. You think you're any different person you were right now than you say in 2014? When you showed up at the Capitol?
I think the only thing and I don't know, this is a good thing. But I take criticism a whole lot easier than I used to remember that first couple of years when again, I wasn't all that I was new in the legislature. Right. So the important stuff didn't come to me until I had to press my red or green button. But someone would post a comment online or leave a message and it would bother me for days, I would wake up and I was, you know, Tom down the street really think that about me. And now it still bothers me, but not near to the extent that it used to. I don't know, that's a good thing, though. I mean,
yeah, I think you could see how you could get your feelings hurt when? Yeah, right. And it particularly it would be frustrating when the criticism was off target. Yeah. You know, right. Like, oh, no, that's not what I said, or that's not what I voted
Right. Or on a number of issues. You know, I said, I like meeting with people trying to take something that's maybe not the best idea and make, make it a little better, something that is hopefully good for the state. And I'd often vote for those things. I'm also I almost had to write, I'm helping to encourage some people to come together and make a bill better. And if they got close, I would vote for it. And there still may be some constituents or groups in the state that still thought it was a bad idea. And like, but just think what it could have been had I not helped. That's hard to message like, you know, the people in my district don't always see that because that's not covered in the in the media, just because it's that's kind of down in the weeds.
Sometimes I think, oh, lobbyists and legislators play sometimes they come to the statehouse, and today they're on offense, but other days are on defense, sir. And it's there's a lot about, there's a lot to be said for what was prevented from happening, right legislatively. In addition to watch adapture. So I'm curious if you think your constituents, not necessarily yours, but generally, Kansans have a proper level of empathy for elected politicians. And, you know, you're thinking about very complex questions. Of course, that's the nature of it. And solutions available that come that rise to the surface aren't always perfect, but sometimes the remedy you personally may have just can't gain traction, but people don't appreciate that, you know, I could see that being a reality. Yeah.
I think generally, that's probably true that that people out there don't quite understand what goes on in the building, and they get frustrated because of that. I feel pretty good in in my district, that a number of people, you know, I've met them along the way or had the opportunity to have conversations with them. And and I think they get it most of the time, and I've really felt that the last 10 days since I've announced I have heard from a hundreds of people with such great comments like, that's been the best thing about this and like, people did get it. But I think it's also kind of similar to when we talk about our schools, you know, people people think their local schools are doing great, but then they criticize schools generally right? My neighborhood school couldn't be doing any better but schools in Kansas and they need to do a little better. I think that's the same way we look at the legislature. I think my my representative, he's not doing terrible, but
he can't be right to be a scoundrel, but all those other guys are losers. Yeah. Yeah, I see that. So on a personal level, you your spouse, your children, their adults or relatives, you know, yeah, um, dad, whatever, right, Uncle cousin. Do they grill you on votes in the capitol you take a bunch of heat from those People?
No, not really. They last, as our kids have gotten older, I think they've had fun with it a little bit, like poking at me. And they don't do it a whole lot. My wife does her best just to stay out of it, too. And she, she works in a public school. So she hears about things that may or may not be true. And then comes home. And she's I mean, that's a burden. She's I
don't get grilled on the your your rejection of the Fourth Amendment. appropriations bill. I
do not know. No, but most people are pretty nice to me.
Thinking about lobbying in the Capitol. It's quite significant. Of course, you know, half the people that wandering around the building are lobbyists. They help fund campaigns, they have expectations. Do you think lobbyists or special interest groups have too much control over the legislative process?
I don't know if it's too much. I mean, there's certainly a role for the for lobbyists that I did not know or anticipate before it came to the legislature. I am because every legislator is busy all day long with their committees on the floor. And it's hard to know what's going on in all the other committees. And I'm not an expert in really anything. And certainly not in some issues, right. I don't know the first thing about some issues. And so there are some really good lobbyists that will come in and they'll explain, you know, what, what their client thinks. And if I have questions, they'll tell me what the other side thinks. And those are the ones you respect and you go to. And, yeah, they have influence because they have they have knowledge that I don't necessarily have. But I don't think maybe I'm being naive. It's certainly I didn't believe it was this way with me. I I didn't pay attention where my campaign checks came from, I type up the report, and I went ahead and turned it in. That wasn't that wasn't all that important to me. So
I don't want to give you money might be disappointed. They might
be I can say that now, because they're not going to send me new objects. But that doesn't have I don't think it has near the influence that that other
special interests do have access, though they do. Kansas chamber throws money around and in truckloads. And so you know, but you know, just all depends on your perspective. You love everything that Kansas chamber does, then you don't think that's a problem. Right. Right. Yeah, good point. But there might be another side to a lot of these debates that the can Kansas chamber, you know, ideologues,
and I don't know, I've never looked at any other legislators calendar, I don't know what kind of people or groups they meet with or don't meet with, but I can if the if somebody stopped by my office and wanted a meeting, I didn't care who they were, they were going to find time to work them in. And so
something I've always curious about, and I think, you know, maybe I put too much stock in this, but legislative leadership, the House Speaker, the House Majority Leader, they want certain bills to pass and certain bills not to pass, do you think the leadership puts too much pressure, or an unhealthy amount of pressure on the rank and file?
My thoughts on that would have changed over the time to when I first got there. And maybe it's just because I was the new guy. And you know, you had this speaker or majority leader, whoever, not any specific person, but leadership in general. If they'd come to talk to me, I'm like, Oh, they they, they they're coming to see me. They want me to vote a certain way. And that that was stressful. I didn't the last six, seven years haven't really experienced that. I know where leadership wants me to be. Yeah. But I'm not worried that they're going to strip me on my committees or take my
children to do something really. Tell me this when you're sitting there on the floor voting do do lobbyist and leadership are they sending you taxed saying you're we're a yes on this. We're, uh, no.
I'm not from I don't get that from leadership. And I don't know that that's not, I guess when we're on call the house and you see leadership on the phone, they're talking to somebody, they're not talking to me. I even got in the habit. early on. I unplugged my phone. I turned myself one night we were there for until like three or four in the morning on a tax vote. I disconnected my phone and I turned my cell phone upside down. So they couldn't couldn't try to put pressure on me. I wouldn't say I hear from lobbyists texting me that doesn't mean you know there aren't eblasts going out left and right when an issue pops up, you know from unit whatever.
You know, there's 30 bills up today. Yeah. And on Bill 17. They're sending you the reminder the Republican caucus is a no on this. Or yes on this or or don't don't affirm this amendment. This amendment has his danger signs all over it just I just felt like they were like people behind a curtain pulling strings.
No. There have been whips along the way. So Republican whips and I assume the Democrat whip is as well. I remember at one point in time, I don't remember the WHO whip was had like a green sheet of paper or red sheet of paper and they just stood in front of everybody and I assume that meant green It's good. Okay, but no, I've not. Maybe they just know that it's not going to impact me. So they don't pester me with it even
on you. So there's, before we leave the legislative arena, one of the question there are there are some policies that I consider, if you believe polling are quite popular and one of them is medicinal, at least even recreational marijuana, the polling shows that two thirds of Kansans want it like the surrounding shirts. Another is Medicaid expansion and increasing eligibility to the working poor. Also, polling suggests that that's popular among Kansans. However, neither of those policies have been adopted by the legislature. And do you grind your teeth sometimes about the difference between what the public wants and what the legislative leadership is deflecting?
Yes, at times, I mean, on those two issues, marijuana is one that I don't hear much about. I never did either way, in my district. And I, I've seen the polling that, you know, comes out on social media and reports. I'm not sure. I can't really recall hardly any conversations about that. I've got a farmer up north that that grows some crops, and he's come out, I had me out to show it to me, but not really advocating to change the laws at all. On expansion. I've certainly heard from people. That's one where when I first got there, I voted against it, and the Governor vetoed it. And that's why I'm talking to you, Governor Brownback. Yeah, Governor Brownback vetoed it. And there was some move on the Florida delay the vote over the weekend, and I just so happened to have a forum already scheduled. And there were lots of people there. And I use that weekend. And you know, that Monday before we had to vote on the Override to meet with as many people as I could dig into the details, because I just didn't know enough about it. And I felt pretty confident my district supported it. So I that's I think that's the only time I ever switched my vote on an override.
So yeah, those are two issues that, you know, when all the states around Kansas are doing X, it puts an odd bit of pressure on Kansas itself. Medical marijuana, like people are literally driving two blocks from Kansas to Missouri and buying weed and going home. Yeah. So Kansas lives with the consequences of that, yet no tax revenue, no money, no change in enforcement, you know, just and then on Medicaid expansion, I was just down in Pittsburg, Kansas, and the hospital people down there are competing with Missouri, which has Medicaid expansion, all them federal money that flows into Joplin hospitals from that they're poaching nurses out of Kansas and other employees, and offering buying new equipment that maybe the hospital in Kansas can't afford. There are consequences to this. And I just think those are two good examples of where perhaps the Kansas legislature is at a step with Kansans.
I think on both of those issues, issues and others like it, that if people and I get why people don't want to reach out to their elected officials, right, they feel like they send an email and they don't get a response or some guy or gal I don't know, down the street. So it's a challenge. But on those issues, I think if local constituents would would reach out more directly instead of you know, I polling is great. And this is what we think everyone believes on an issue. But if people got more engaged, and I really wish they would I then I think it would be harder to stop some of those issues or maybe different issues would move forward. I think if people are willing to, you know, realize that the people that work in that Capitol are impacting their lives on a daily basis. Get to know them, spend some time with them when you can and share your thoughts. That's how we make difference isn't just
says marijuana aside, if I'm in my rural hospital closes, and instead of going to an ER with a heart attack, that's nine minutes away, now I'm driving 45 in an ambulance, that's a real consequence. So all right. Let's just go ahead and skip to your school board work. There's a lot of things you would have done over the years there. You know, you're close. You're it brings you closer to people I think actually Oh, yeah. Cuz the schools, kids, your kids went there. Your wife works in a library. And so what's that responsibility, like?
You know, I really enjoyed it. It was stressful at times because you were truly making an impact on individuals. Like it wasn't like you were passing laws in the Capitol, which yes, are impacting everyone. But there you you'd make a decision that would impact one student or one teacher, certainly a class of students. But, but it was, it was fun. It was fun. Most of the time. We passed a couple bonds. She was while I was on the board of our district, like many districts in Kansas was, you know, a number of small little schools that over time came together and they formed a district. And we were extremely inefficient. We had a number of one track school. So one first grade one second grade, 1/3 grade, no ability to divide kids up, right, if, if Tommy and Joey didn't get along, they were going to be together every year, because there was one teacher that taught that grade they were in. So we're inefficient. It wasn't best for kids. And so we had, we had to go to the public and convince them to give us additional tax dollars to close their buildings. And that was quite the case to try to it is a tough sell. But we did it. We went from eight elementary schools. We're down to five. We built a new we combined two Junior High's into one middle school, and we've completely redone the high school and so
so it's to North Topeka growing Yeah, growing.
It was I think we're kind of leveled off right now at least from I don't, I think the area is growing. But student wise, we're not seeing enrollment increases, but not declines either. So it was great. I always have fun and smart group of people on the board. And you've got so you got seven people, right. And as a superintendent and the staff, we always got along really well. Of course, the issue would pop up here there that we didn't get along really well. But overall, we were always working towards the same thing.
I covered the law and school board for a few years. And I I'd see people who their hair on fire and they get elected right to the school board. And they come in there and they're pounding the table with their fist about all the changes you're gonna make. And then six months later, there's a big learning curve that that transpired. And, and to some degree those those sentiments have been moderated. Do you? Do you think there's a big learning curve for people come on in school? Yeah.
I mean, because you know, best case what you're on a PTO. Right. And you're doing a carnival and selling trash bags and doing
good things for your lover? You remember being in elementary school? Yeah. Oh, yeah.
Are you are you are a student, right, which makes you an expert in everything. So like me, when I thought the superintendent had a lot of bad ideas? I quickly learned he didn't. So yeah, I think you have to be open minded and willing to really figure out what goes on in a school district, whether it's a small one or a big one, they all have similar problems.
The stakes are high there. Yeah. You know, I think it's really important work. A lot of talk these days in public education about what's going on in the libraries. And, you know, there's a, there's formalities about challenging books that that individuals don't like. And I'm just kind of curious about your views about, say, I went in and challenge book X, and you know, it gets removed, and now, none of the other three, four or 500 kids in the school can read book x. And so what do you think about that I, we're throwing books on the garbage pile, based on the intervention of one individual, when in fact, maybe those decisions should be left to all the other parents and students in that school?
Right. I think it's important that everyone has a voice in what's taught and provided in our public school. So yeah, I do have a hard time if, if one or two people are concerned that we make a snap decision based upon that one person's concern. I think in my time on the board, we had, I remember one, maybe two challenges. And both of those, I immediately got the book, read the book, and then I called the parent. And I'm like, if you read the book, and they're like, Well, I read, you know, pages 17 through 23. That's frustrating. So I asked him, like, read the book. And let's talk again, and I get what concerns they had on those pages. Right, it was material that I probably wouldn't want my younger kid to read, certainly without me being able to provide some guidance along the way. But both of those I certainly the one, I think there were two withdrew their challenge and never even got to the board. So I've not followed it closely. And so I there probably are materials that are out there that maybe shouldn't be in a school setting. I don't know what they are. And I'm not in a position to weigh in on that. But I want to make sure we're just not taking everything away without we've got librarians and staff who are educated got degrees. And this process is set up in the districts that if someone wants to challenge something that hopefully they go through those processes and get input and make sure that if it doesn't belong there, and the community as a whole agrees it shouldn't belong there, then fine but not snap decisions based upon
people want a band To Kill a Mockingbird, for example. There's some pretty tough language in there. There's some activity in there that might be troubling to some, but if somebody went out in my youth, I was bit rebellious. If somebody put that book on a list of banned books that I wasn't supposed to read, it would be like a magnet. It would be like a call to action to go read To Kill a Mockingbird because it was what some adult thought I shouldn't. Right,
right. Well, that I mean, now kids have access to anything they want, right? It's right there on their phones or their laptops. And so, I mean, my advice to parents is not necessarily to not come in didn't say this or that shouldn't be in a school building. I mean, if they're concerned, come forward, but be involved with your kids, right? Go talk to the teachers follow what they're doing on their phones, see what they're reading. I know and Seema, now if someone wants to, they can let the librarian know. And if I check out a certain book, and they let they let the parents know that, that, you know, Emily checked out whatever book I be involved, and if you're more involved in, I hope you shouldn't get caught off guard.
So there's been a big push in the statehouse to send hundreds of millions of dollars to private schools through vouchers and other means, good idea for the state to use a bunch of tax dollars to help private schools.
So when I first actually even before I ran for the legislature, I was always of the opinion that once you fully fund public schools, and we can talk about if we're going to send money to private schools, we're closer to fully funding schools, for sure,
in part due to work that you performed on the K 12. Budget Committee several years ago, right? A lot
of us but yes, and actually, in that, in that deal, we put together to pass the legislation that resolved the litigation, we had some tax credits in there that you can kind of open the door a little bit. And that was that was part of the I felt like the compromise of the committee to get an
animal is under the nose on some of the excuse me, camel under the tent. Camels under the nose. Alright, anyway, right with the camels got its nose under the tent of funding for private schools. So
there's pieces of it. I mean, I get that there are students out there who are in schools that maybe aren't able to provide what they need. And so how do you address those? I don't know the answer. But I've never been supportive of just sending unlimited amounts of money to private schools.
It's going to outlive your tenure in the legislature.
And for me, when it came up this session, I made it clear to those who supported it. This isn't what Fred Patton thinks or doesn't think my district has made it very clear to me that they don't like the idea of sending money to private schools. And because of that, it was an easy no vote for me. I get that people may come from other areas of the state where they're hearing different things, and you got to vote, you got to vote what you're hearing from your district.
So you know, politically it's kind of in vogue, to to disparage public education, among in some circles. Do you think that has a detrimental effect on the public's confidence in the capacity of educators to do a good job for their kids?
I certainly think it has an impact on educators. I mean, if you're constantly getting beat up, whether it's it's certainly not merited in most situations. Yeah, I think they they work all day long with kids who are acting up and they're not paying attention. I know, I spent, what was it a couple hours in a building. This was 1015 years ago, over lunch, we had a teacher of the year in a building, and they wanted to volunteer to cover lunch for them that day, and like, I'll do it, I can do this. It'll be fun. And before lunch, I read a couple books that the teacher gave me to read, and we go to lunch. And that was fun. We had recess and we go back and she wants me to teach some math. I can No, no, it was it was it was fine. Except there were three or four kids in the front row. And that's just one quit talking. At one point, I'm like, You need to be quiet. And I look up and the teachers in the back of the room and she is cracking up. Fred Patton lost it as a teacher in less than two hours. So I don't know how they do it day in and day out. And I don't I don't helps that we pile on criticism nonstop, because they are dealing with students who have learning disabilities, they're dealing with students who come from areas that, you know, the home life isn't great. They've got all kinds of things on their plate. And they're not just dealing with, you know, ideal students who are all getting A's and sit in their chairs and watch. And so it's stressful to be an educator. And I don't think it's helpful. When we criticize them. I volunteered
in a public school classrooms for 20 years. And I learned after a couple that I couldn't do that teaching job, because I don't have the patience. Now, I've watched people have the most extraordinary amount of patience for people that were testing you their third graders and their testing. Yeah. You know, and I just couldn't do it. And so I was always amazed by some of those teachers and to always be criticized or to pet political people suggest you're doing nefarious things in the classroom. Is it just seemed awful and hurtful. Yeah.
But I also don't think that means that we should not continue to look for ways to improve, right if, if we're doing the same thing over and over again, and we're getting the same results, then how at a local level at a state board of education level and and occasionally the legislature, what can we do to help change that system? Because it's not always just dollars. But, but we should trust the experts in the field.
So COVID struck, you're in the legislature and working with the school board when that occurred. What do you think about that? Long term prognosis here, it's going to take time to heal those academic wounds.
Oh, absolutely think so. I mean, you look at the really young kids who the first couple of years they, they went to school on their laptop, I mean, they're not they've not interacted with other children, they've not had to sit in front of a classroom, they've not had to do team projects. And so I hear from educators all the time that they're struggling with that or even take the higher level kids, my daughter, the first trying to think where she was in school, but I think she was at middle school, maybe she missed most of the middle school or wherever that transition was. So there was a period of time where normally you would you would learn new things, you would begin to interact with students and teachers differently. And they didn't have that. So that's going to take a while to overcome for sure.
Yeah. socially and academically. Yeah, no, I think, Yeah, real, real consequences. Right. Let's hope we don't have another big pandemic. So when you final question, when you look at legislature or the school board, is you could wave a magic wand. Is there anything you would like to change about those? Or do you think, do you think we kind of have it right?
It's, it's not a pretty process. And it's not a fun place to be a lot of the times. But it's worked. It's worked for hundreds of years. I think what we're missing and I talked about a little bit more is the engagement by by the citizens. You just can't sit at home, or sit behind your laptop, or your phone and post stuff on social media and think that's going to change anything. You've got to get involved. And that doesn't mean run for office. I mean, some people need to write and anyone who wants to give me a call, I'll tell you the good and bad about it. Yeah, there's going
to be a vacancy north of
areas. But just figure out a ways to be more involved and talk to your elected officials that I think most of them want to hear from people. And so if we're going to turn this thing around and quit being so divisive, we're all going to have to come together and work together. And you can't do that if you're not a player in the process.
Yeah. Excellent. I want to thank Topeka State Representative Fred Patton, a state legislator for a brief period still, and very long term dedicated local school board member want to thank you for your time today and really helping us understand what it's like to be a bit behind the scenes in some of this public service. Thank you very much.
