S11 E18 Fostering Inclusion and Resilience in Education: The Impact of Circle of Friends

5:34PM Feb 1, 2024

Speakers:

Tim Villegas

Keywords:

friends

students

work

circle

school

kids

teachers

year

support

inclusion

disabilities

robin

bullying

podcast

chapters

peer

workshops

learn

barb

program

Hi friends, I'm Tim Vegas from the Maryland Coalition for Inclusive Education and you've hit play on thinking cluesive. Our podcast that brings you conversations about inclusive education, and what inclusion looks like in the real world. Inclusion isn't a program. But what if there were programs that fostered inclusion and resilience for every learner? If you want to help learners in your school, build genuine friendships, keep listening.

Robin stack Regan has improved systems and supports for children, youth and families for over 25 years. She is a lifelong advocate for children who struggle to make their gifts and needs known. Her first role model was Annie Sullivan, an Irish immigrant who overcame poverty, the loss of her family and blindness to become Helen Keller's teacher and friend. Robin has work with students experiencing multiple challenges in residential programs in high need urban schools, and provided training and consultation for youth workers, parents and educators. She is inspired by young people's resilience and potential for growth when they feel accepted, respected and connected at school. Robyn joined circle of friends in July of 2016. As Executive Director she expanded circle of friends focus to include students impacted by trauma and adapted workshops to an online component during COVID. In this episode of thinking cluesive, Robin and I discussed the mission of circle of friends, which is to promote inclusion for students with disabilities and those living with adversity. Robin shares the origins of the program and how it is expanded to support a wide range of students. We also discuss the impact of circle of friends chapters on individuals and families, as well as the misconceptions around inclusion. Robin highlights the importance of friendship and the power of positive experiences and creating a more inclusive environment. After the break my interview with Robin stack Regan and for free time this week, I've got one simple call to action. Stick around. We'll be right back.

Robin sack Reagan, welcome to the thick inclusive podcast.

Thank you excited to be here. Virtually. Virtually.

I know. I know. Rarely rarely do in person interviews anymore. Yeah. Well, Robin, you are the CEO of circle of friends. And you actually sent me some information, you know, for, for me to look at and to, to ponder and think and reflect. And I just love this mission. Do you mind if I read it for our listeners? Oh, not at all. We're proud of it. All right. All right. So the mission is to promote inclusion for students with disabilities, and those living with adversity, to empower all students to appreciate differences, build genuine friendships, and stand up to bullying. So fantastic mission, Robin, with where did this all start? Like how did it all begin? Well,

and it started in 1999. At Santa Monica High School in Southern California. There was a speech language pathologist named Barbara police. And she was called into an IEP meeting, because a mother of a young man named Alec, so he was our test case, who had Down syndrome and was in ninth grade, that his mother requested that he have a behavior goal on his IEP to make a friend. And in 1999, this dumped the IEP team, and they didn't know what to do with this request. So they brought Barb in because she was working with him. And they asked her to kind of figure that out, what would it look like and she'd been at Sam, Ohio for over a decade. So she really knew a lot of students. She reached out to some of the students that were natural leaders and told them the situation that that Alec needed social opportunities. He needed help with his communication, and asked if they'd be willing to commit to having lunch with him one day a week to help him build those skills and get to know Him. And that's where it started. It started with one student. It went so well that she had all of the students on their caseload do it and they developed Two to three. typically developing peers with a student with special needs was the original model. I think the second year, it was growing and the students, they saw it as a club. So they had officers and everything. And so the second year, the student leaders came to her and said, you know, the ninth graders coming in are really mean. And they're, you know, they're not they're not being cool with our friends. And Barb said, wow, that's, that's awful. What are you going to do about it? So she turned it right back over to them. The students developed a 20 minute ability awareness presentation, with students with and without disabilities, and got permission to present it to every ninth grade health class. And so, as a result of that, it became the most popular club on campus, the local CBS station came out to find out what was going on. And in 2005, when Bob retired, the parents of those early students said, This can't ride off into the sunset with you. This should be at every school. And that's when circle of friends worked towards becoming a nonprofit. You

and you came on in 2012? No, 11? No, no, I can't remember.

It's it's seven years ago, because I'm getting congratulations on my LinkedIn. So yeah, I came in. That's how I find out usually, oh, yeah, it's been a year, I came in as a program director, it was a position created by the board, specifically to be mentored by Barb because she was preparing to retire to really retire this time. And so I had the opportunity to learn the program, connect with Barb. And when she retired, I was made executive director. And one of the things that I did with the board was strategic planning. And because of my background, working with youth residential treatment, youth with mental illness, foster youth, and my interest in resilience, I advocated for us to add the words and those living with adversity to the mission statement, because it was just disability. And as you know, there are so many students, even pre COVID, coming to school with challenges that haven't been identified as eligible for supports. And we really needed to cast a wider net, to support those students. And we've learned that our circle of friends chapters that start with the traditional model, as it takes hold, they expand the focus. And it's a great model with English language learners, with foster youth will with LGBTQ kids, anyone that doesn't naturally connect or get included, that's kind of marginalized, this is an opportunity for them to connect with with students that they might not normally get to know.

Okay, I've got a lot of questions swirling around in my head, but so I'm trying to figure out where to start. But let's, let's start with your personal connection to this work. Okay, so why is promoting inclusion? Specifically through circle of friends important to you, Robin?

Okay, well, I was raised an only child. And so there was sort of isolation. I was kind of a weird, I was considered to be a weird kid, I was very, very tall. And I did not the joke among my family and friends, I do not have a poker face. So if I'm happy, you know it, if I'm not happy, you also know it. And so kids that liked teasing could always count on a reaction from me. And, and so and that thing that grownups tell you just ignore him and it would go away. I never noticed that. I just noticed it, like, piling on and getting louder. So so that was kind of my background. My first hero. In third grade, I read a book called Helen Keller's teacher. And, and I was just so fascinated by Annie Sullivan and where she came from and what she achieved that that's who I wanted to be. I didn't just want to be a teacher. And the friends I had, they were fairly traditional. They wanted to be mommies and stewardesses. And interestingly, whatever Barbie's latest outfit was, and we've got Barbie

now Barbie is back man.

I was never I was a tomboy and I read books and trees so I was so I was never really into Barbie. So it wasn't until my master just programmed in UCLA that I actually connected with a tribe of other people that wanted to be any Sullivan. So that's kind of my background. I worked in summer camps. I always worked with kids that no one else wanted to work with, or could figure out how to work with. And I was fascinated by what made them tick, what was really going on, and what we now know and refer to as their unmet needs. That was kind of my that was I would just always had a fascination for that. I don't know if it's because I didn't have siblings to figure out. But that was just always my fascination. And when I learned about this position, I went to the interview with BB and the board. And when they asked me the question, and what led me here, I told him a story that I think got me the job. So So I said, I mentioned I was a camp counselor in high school. And it was a YWCA camp and really scrubby not well funded. And we had a lot of kids on camperships, which means that they didn't have to pay. They came from inner city La hadn't seen stars hadn't ridden a horse, that kind of thing. And one of the sessions, we had about 15 campers that had profound disabilities, that came with their own staff. And so we're talking, you know, we're talking word boards, symbol boards, wheelchairs. And so we were told to prepare for them, that would be well staffed, but we'd spent most of the session really kind of protecting them, and making sure that that these rough kids weren't messing with them. And so on the last night, we had a dance in the lodge. And there was this one young man who was about 12 that had a rap as being a negative leader, and the kids followed whatever he did. And he kind of had this tough exterior. So we're, you know, kids were dancing. And we had a soul train line, because it was that long ago.

And soul training.

So one point this, this camper walked across the room to where all the wheelchairs were lined up along one wall, and asked one of those campers to dance. And the staff and she, you know, she smiled, and she pointed to Yes, on her board. And so he got her out, and went down the excuse me. I get choked up, every time I tell this story. took her down the line. And within minutes, every kid there was no kid on the wall. There were no wallflowers he influenced the other kids. And it was great. And there was laughter and they were and everyone's dancing with whatever they could move. And it occurred to me that we'd spent the whole week trying to protect those kids from the regular campers. And in fact, we've done them a disservice because we didn't give them credit for their own humanity. So so that's why I think inclusion is important, we have to give these kids the opportunity to get to know and the earlier the better, because unfortunately, we are not living in a time of adults behaving well. And there's been a there's been so much meanness and so much division in the world that these kids are growing up into, and it can leave feeling pretty helpless. And and then you add COVID And then you add class. And then you add, you know, social and racial unrest. So um, school should be a safe place, school should be a place where, where they experience difference, and value it. So hopefully you pick that up on your mic, even though I was choked up.

Thank you for sharing that, that. That was powerful. And you're right, we are living in a really strange time. Especially in public schools. I think that the scrutiny on what happens in public schools is I've never seen it higher, to be honest, never seen it higher. So let's talk about like, what circle of friends really looks like in schools. Okay. And I know you I love that you mentioned in the mission statement about adding adversity to that because that is it is unique. I don't think I've ever seen that language before. So I do want to talk about some of the other things that you're working on either you know, with circle of friends or on the periphery But let's first focus on what does the program or what did the chapters look like in any individual school? And then what will kind of take it from there?

Okay, great. So how we come to a school or a new chapter is created is through, someone finds our website, someone learns about one of our chapters, and we've had about 250 chapters, which mostly represents a cluster within a district. So several schools, most are in southern and central California. But we've had chapters in Vermont, Arkansas, Connecticut, Washington State, and we've had interest from Canada and Australia, but they haven't quite formalized it yet. So we've got teachers that contact us, we've been contacted by many parents that have learned about us. And what I do is encourage them to connect to an administrator or the decision maker at the district level. And so if they're on board, what we request that they do is pick three to five schools within the district that need it and are ready. And that can be K through 12. And we adapt developmentally what it looks like. And each one of those schools we work with the principal to select between three and five staff that will be our circle of friends, advisors and receive the training and the materials. They can be teachers, Gen Ed, special ed, we've had counselors, we've had paraprofessionals. School Sykes, it's great if it's a diverse team, because they'll bring different availabilities and different, different strengths. And so I work with them to find out what their current needs are, and show them how to implement our program, which starts with selecting students. That would be good candidates. And they always start with students with with IEPs, because we kind of come in the special ed door, contacting their parents, then recruiting for gen ed students and what different strategies you can do for that orientation icebreakers. We prefer when Barb started, she hand selected and designed the circle around each of her students. But we found it works better if you let them find each other in kind of mixers, and then promote the advisors are looking for that and then promoting and supporting those circles as they form. The design is to have it meet monthly, weekly and then monthly, they generally work towards some kind of an event or special thing that could tie to a school event could tied to a natural holiday that's occurring that's recognized. Circle events is big on October for bullying prevention month, and April for autism awareness and acceptance month. So because they tie in naturally with what these students are doing and what they can share and promote. So we provide three workshops over the course of a year, we now have annual membership. It used to be a two year program, but it wasn't flexible enough. And some student schools wanted more. So beginning of the year to set up a check in and then an end of the year planning and evaluating. Did they meet their goals? What do they want to do in the fall? Are they adding grades? Are they adding populations? And I just work as consultant and trainer. Gotcha.

Gotcha. And it what kind of cost is involved to be an annual member? Yes,

um, when we were doing all of our training in person, and when Barb was in charge, we had gotten up to between 12 and $15,000 a year, which we well. We had a lot of interest in when they found out the cost of like, you know, special ed is underfunded. Right. So when we sort of went dark, and I was technically on furlough, but working hard. During the pandemic, I looked at adapting our programs so it could be offered online. And so that cuts the cost, it also allows us to record it so they could re re reference it. And so it is now for three workshops, monthly resources and check ins after each workshop because there are always questions that come up when you're actually you're doing it. And each district or chapter gets a Google folder of all of our historical resources, forms, strategies, so they don't have to reinvent the wheel for all of that annual membership currently is the $6,750. And there are some chapters where it's just one big high school that is signed on but most of our districts It can be between three and five that are attending because they just sign on to zoom. And and then we sort of tweak it. If they're lucky enough to be in LA County, then one of those workshops is in person as part of their annual membership. And they can you choose that for a pickup and assessment, a site visit or end of the year planning, whatever they think would work best to have people face to face. And I'm there.

Yeah. Now, I'd like to connect what you're doing. Because you said something about special education being underfunded, which absolutely is chronically it is. But it like he's from listening to the mission of the organization and what the program has to offer. It doesn't sound like this has to be a special education initiative. It can can be funded by any, you know, by by anyone in any part of education. Because here's the thing, you know, you know, Title One, I would think school counseling, right. So, if you're listening, and you're in one of those groups, and this sounds interesting to you, I wouldn't, you know, I would look into it. Oh, yeah. And

that's, thank you so much for mentioning that. Because what I, what I now do, instead of just working with the sped director at the district level, is I look for students support, I look at educational services, safety officers, because funding that goes towards, as you mentioned, Title One, bullying prevention SEL, we, we work with, with all the acronyms MTSS, RTI, PBIS, that the alphabet soup CLF, fits right in there and supports all of that. And those funding pockets. So yes.

Let's talk about the work that you're doing with Tufts University, you shared about the healthy outcomes for positive experiences and the whole building blocks. How does that align with C with C O, f? and D? Utilize this info with C O F? Or is it something different?

So I mentioned that I started in, in camping and residential treatment and working with foster youth. I've always been fascinated by resilience. And it's had many iterations in education and, and youth development. So it could be developmental assets, protective factors, it all works up to How can kids move through and beyond adversity, which is why that word was so important for me. So when I was working on reinventing circle of friends, I learned about this hope model. And I'd been following the Adverse Childhood Experiences research, and was hoping for it to get really more embedded into schools, it's very embedded in health care. But so adverse childhood experiences, and especially how that's been compounded by the experience during COVID of school of students being at home, of not feeling connected of experiencing all the things that we can imagine because we weren't in a bubble, we experienced these things with our own families. So when I learned about hope, as a response to aces, I was fascinated and I had an opportunity to attend some of the early trainings and I'm actually certified to be a one on one facilitator. So, so I've been working on folding that in both as an introduction to circle of friends and as a supports. So what the work of Tufts identified to create these positive experiences is four building blocks, and I'm going to read them to briefly each statement. So the first one is relationships with other children and adults through interpersonal activities. Safe, equitable, stable environments for living, playing, learning at home and in school, social and civic engagement to develop a sense of belonging and connectedness and emotional growth through playing and interacting with peers for self awareness and self regulation. So all of those building blocks are aligned with circle of friends. And so I was so excited about the positive research they found and that through hope, and this awareness and the funding around helping kids come back post COVID is, this is a key to make sure that circle of friends is not just this boutique special ed program to help those kids that it helps all kids come through and beyond those adverse experiences that they've had at home and in the community, and even at school. So I've been incorporating it into our introduction and using it as a way of, of planning and goal setting. And when they come up with extra strategy, additional strategies and resources, they go directly to our chapters to help support them. So that's been kind of a personal mission for me to tie into circle of friends. And I can do that because I'm the executive director.

That's right. You're the boss. What about the impact circle of friends chapters have had on individuals and families? Do you have any stories that come to mind?

Um, well, we have, we have a district, San Benito, in San Benito, which is central California, it's a very rural district that's actually received national recognition from Special Olympics, because through their circle of friends chapter and they've had it for 10 years, they have been able to apply the universe, United champion, unified champion schools, which is a component that's special, that Special Olympics is added to kind of expand beyond the athletic model. And so they've received national recognition and some funding. We've got students that took part in circle of friends graduated, became teachers and have come back because they got hooked on those early experiences they've had. We also have to, to studies that have been, they're really dissertations. But they're they're referenced, we had a teacher in a district close to us that started the his own circle of friends. Because this isn't, we're not proprietary. And so when he found out that we were doing this, he's a he created his own kind of weekly lunch group to help kids get together. And for his dissertation, he wanted to measure the impact in as adults. So he got permission through us to interview between 20 and 30, former, what we call pure friends, from Santa Monica High School and Santa Clarita, and ask them questions about their, you know, self identity, their emotional awareness, their openness to diversity, and found not surprisingly, that students that had had this experience, were more open and valued. Diversity, and what I think is so great, these students that we encounter, first, they they're sent, they're going to be someone's neighbors, they're going to be someone's co workers, they're going to be out in the world, and they've had an experience that grounds them. When they experience difference, and you know, diversity, one in four of us is going to be directly impacted either short term or long term by disability in our lives. It is in minority or invisible minority that you cannot escape from. And so these are life skills for us to develop, and if we can develop it in for children, then that will change the world. It also impacts teachers that have not received training and supports in how to respond. And if inclusion is really happening, and they're physically in the classroom, and a gen ed teacher doesn't know what to do, then they might not respond in the best way. So we've had teachers come to several events, training those one woman that said, you know, I would have told you I was doing inclusion for 10 years. And through this workshop, I realized that those kids in the back of my classroom with their own staff, I don't even talk to them. I talked to their staff. And so after that first workshop, she went back and she got down if they were in a wheelchair, I and she talked to her actual students and let the staff so for their their staff support, and she said, and then I'm modeling that for the students now they're talking to that students. So so she broke down a barrier in her own classroom, but she had to be made aware. And to see how important that was.

Yeah, that brings up a good point about the definition or how people you know, think about inclusion, you know, what are some what are some misconceptions or additional misconceptions that you've run into you, as you've been, you know, coaching staff and, and people about, about inclusion? Because you said, this teacher was like, Well, I thought I was doing.

Yeah, I think the the biggest one is that inclusion just means proximity to gen ed students and being in the same room. And that's unfortunately, as far as most schools have gone, and then sort of they check off that box. Another is that responding to and making accommodations for a student with disabilities is only going to short change the gen ed students in that classroom. And my background in you know, positive behavior supports and what's now evolved into MTSS is, we know that the accommodations that you make for that person that's identified that student, there are other students that need that too. And so everyone is, you know, is whether it's social skills, or academic, everyone benefits from taking that extra time to break things down and making it safe to ask. And students that are helping their friend are working with their friends, they're learning together, often, I think one of the best ways to learn something is to make it clear in your mind and teach it. And so a lot of the students that we work together, there are models that that have their peer friends as tutors, we don't, we're okay with that. But we're we were worried about or we try to avoid having it be a helper healthy relationship, because that's not equity. And so from the beginning, it's very clear that you're both part of a relationship, and you're learning from each other. And we're all working on stuff. And we all have things to offer. And so you know, really setting that tone from the beginning. So yeah, so it won't benefit Gen. Ed kids were already doing it. What's the third one? I think the third, it's not a misconception, but it's for teachers who've received training, and are the grown up in the room for them to be willing to learn from their students. Because often students are more open. One of the things I share with our advisors as part of the training, if I asked them, you know, what was your earliest experience of difference? As a child, and often when kids are curious, so they will notice it? And often with the best intentions, the grownups near them, parents, family, teachers, what do they say? Don't stare. Don't point. Don't be rude. So we're all told what not to do. But no one tells us what to do. And so it's just easier to play it safe. And teachers that that work become advisors, they start playing less safe, and it helps them tap into why they got into the field.

Yeah, yeah. Great. I love it, I think especially teachers who have been in the classroom for a long time, if they may just not have the language around it, or really the mindset around it, because for so long, you know, we've been doing it a certain way we've been we've been protecting children. Right, you know, from each other. When really, it's, it's, it's about supporting every learner.

Yeah, well, I had. So I mentioned I've got grandkids, we started with kids. And my son went when he was in high school. His track coach was also the special day class teacher. So it was so everyone had something they could do, an event they could do or where they could support track. And I picked him up from practice one day and he said, he was walking across campus and he saw one of the younger students that was encircled by a group that were laughing and he just knew they weren't laughing with him. And, and this was one of coach green students from her special day class. And so Bennett who was also he was team captain. He was into that mix. And he said to the guy who said, you know, to me, you know, come on, I gotta talk to you about the meat on Saturday and walked him away from that. And I said, That's so great, you know, why did you take the time to a notice and be intervene, and he said, Well, he's on my team, I'm not going to let people mess with them. And that's it, we need to see each other as being on the same team. That's an issue I have with a lot of the the bullying prevention and intervention models that they put this focus on the bystanders. And that's a lot to ask a kid to step up and possibly be the next victim for a stranger. But we find through programs like circle of friends, they're not strangers, and you step up for your friends. And it changes the power dynamic, if suddenly there are other kids that just say, Hey, that's not cool. Cut it out. And bullying, through surveys, it's been recorded by administrators that bullying goes down at circle of friends schools.

Oh, that's really interesting. Number one, that you that's something you measure, right? That's, that's really great. That's really great. I think, I think bullying is sort of this mystery, it really, it really is, at least, at least to me, like, you know, and I was a classroom teacher for 16 years, maybe I was more insulated. To that, because I taught in self contained and like segregated environments. So so like, my classroom was very much like, I knew what was going on in my classroom, as opposed to if I was in a general education class with more students, or I was an itinerant teacher where I kind of moved around. But I think that I, especially for kids with, you know, disabilities, or that are, you know, living with adversity, I hope I said that, right. It can be a really, really big problem, and not something that I feel like we're equipped to handle.

Well, yeah. And thanks for mentioning that there. There are two things that I think have really well, three things. One is the adults behaving badly at the national and leadership level. But the other two are the bullying. So it's a power dynamic. And it, it happens in the absence of adults. So it rarely happens in the classroom, it happens in the hallway, it happens around that corner, where the stairwell is. It happens before and after lunch, it happens waiting for the bus, what happens in these little pockets, where adults normally aren't. So you're not going to see it. And especially if you're in a contained environment, you're taking your kids to lunch, your kids are going to be shielded from that, and you're not going to see it. The third, unfortunately, is the the advent of social media. And that what what used what when we were growing up what used to be maybe, you know, gossip, or a rumor mill or a note Do you like so and so and everyone, you know, checks off? No, it's a piece of paper, and it's gone in a few days. Social media, you can be relentless. Students can be relentless in attacking a peer. And we've seen, you know, tragic outcomes. We've seen suicides by kids as young as eight, because they just they feel hopeless, they can't escape it. I remember seeing a public service announcement or something online, that I thought was really powerful. And it's a school assembly. And there's this very nice little girl that you know, comes up to the podium. And she says so. No. So I'm going to talk about Alice, like Alice always wears the same sweater and Alice's lunch smells funny. And Alice is you know, hair, and just start saying all these horrible, horrible things and saying, No, I don't know why you even get out of bed, you should just kill yourself. And you see the teachers, the teachers in the wings like blanching and you see all the people in the auditorium going oh my gosh, and then the byline is if you wouldn't say it in person don't say it online. Because that because it's there's that disconnect. You don't feel the other side of it. You don't see the response. And I think that is really that's helped bullying take on more power and more opportunities in this environment.

Yeah, yeah. Wow. That's a lot to take in there. To tickets. Take a second. I really going back to something used said earlier about the it's I guess it's still a power dynamic, but the dynamic between like a helper and a help II, I'm really glad you brought that up because I'm like, I'm not putting any organization on blast here. All I'm saying is that sometimes that may not be clear to either, you know, the, to the peers or the adults, that that's something that should be thought through. Right? Yeah. And So walk me through the intentionality behind that language.

I think one of the first places it comes up in circle of friends, is when we talk to advisors about recruiting, neurotypical peers. Sometimes the question gets asked, especially at the high school level, is high schools have community service, our requirements, this is something like circle friends certainly looks great on a college application in terms of, and I wouldn't discount those, and if that brings them in the door. But if you're giving a certificate or hours to those kids, every kid and circle of friends gets those hours, every kid gets those. And one of the things I learned at SAML high actually, there was an orientation and the advisor was was talking about in a community service hours, and there was a young man that I actually got to know, because he was in a summer program. And he communicated through a device. And so he was there with his step. And he's brilliant. And fact his grandmother and aunt or Carolyn, see, he had authors, nationally known authors and his family. And so so he left the orientation, he just walked out, and his staff followed him up to see, you know, why was he upset, and he angrily typed, I'm not anybody's project. And I share that story of like, you don't want students to have that experience of they need to be helped. We have a part of our application process, we have a getting to know you form that was originally created for the students in the middle of the circle. But now all of them, and it's it's strength based, it says, you know, what do you prefer to be called? What what are you? What do you really like? What are you working on? And what are ways you can be a good friend with someone else? And so that also addresses some of the parents concern like, what are you telling other kids about my kid, it's like, we're not talking about diagnoses. We're not talking about, you know, eligibility or labels. We're just saying that we all have things to work on, we all have things to offer and circle of friends is a place to do that. So. So yeah, so I think I think that's one of the ways that it gets addressed. At the very beginning. And just to keep, keep checking on that. Also, the peer friends. Sometimes, when the circles have started, we tell advisors to look for this, you might see a peer friend that's got his, the other identified student sitting on their lap and twirling their hair and talking way too close. And you can see that they're very uncomfortable. And when the adviser checks in afterwards, they'll say, Well, yeah, I didn't like it, but I didn't want to be mean. And so it's like, well, no, no, no. If you don't like it, part of being a friend is standing up for yourself to and, and that you just want to put it in a nicer way. And it's better for them to learn about personal space from a friend than getting pushed down by a stranger in the playground, because they did that. And so helping them to advocate and model advocating their own needs. Because otherwise kids, they try to be nice, it just feels too weird. And then they drop out. And so that's another thing that the it's both ways you're learning how to address the differences and be a friend how would you tell your friend they were they were talking too loudly? How would you tell your friend so

yeah, yeah, I like that a lot. Because I mean, I think everyone will everyone needs friends, right? And sometimes we just don't know how to make friends and it's not we doesn't matter if we have a disability or not, or you know, if we've are living in adversity or Not, some of us, it's just harder for some people to make friends. So like the intentionality of friendship, and the focus on friendship rather than everything that, you know, is necessarily different, like we accept our differences, right. But we also learn how to be a good friend, like you said, and what better way to learn than in this in this kind of partnership, right? Partnership to, and commitment to friendship.

When we were doing strategic planning, circle of friends didn't have core values. And that was another thing that we kind of hammered out that I felt was was important for people to know going in what we're about, and let me if I can share those five core values. We honor diversity, while celebrating our commonality. We cultivate friendship and emotional intelligence. We support development of the whole child. We presume competence and resilience and others, and we build advocacy through empowerment.

Fantastic, fantastic. We have a lot of educators that listen, so what are some things that you want to make sure they take away from this conversation?

Um think first off that, that programs like circle of friends and inclusion benefits, everyone that touches and so that, you know that that good feeling that acceptance. And the other is that I think going back to that, you know, our first experience of don't point don't stare, don't be rude. I think it's hard for a teacher, especially when they're overwhelmed. And they may have a lot of experience that didn't account for the students that the range of students that are coming into their classroom. Grownups don't want to be put on the spot, we don't want to be embarrassed. And, you know, there's that oops, and, and, you know, we don't want to make mistakes, and that, whether it's addressing disability, or difference in race, or difference in sexuality, getting outside your comfort zone is going to be awkward, and that it's okay, to feel awkward. Even in front of students. And that, that's, that's where that growth comes. And so and as I mentioned, you know, the what got most of us into education was wanting to make a difference wanting to connect with students and and have those that lifelong impact. And, you know, when you're, after over a year of trying to make it work online, and all the focus on standards, and all the paperwork, we've had at one conference, we had an advisor share that they were really worried about circle of friends about it, just one more thing on their plate. But after they got it established, and the goal is to sort of fade and let the students drive it, have it be student driven. And what she said is after it really took off, it was her favorite day of the week, because all the rest of her week was caught up with IEP meetings and quantifying things and just stuff that that that you couldn't really it wasn't really tangible it wasn't really meaningful, but it was measurable. And on circle friends day she got to see her students lighting up because they had a friend because they were you know to see them laugh to see them make new friends because those peer friends in the circle struggle start getting bigger we've had parents that some one of our videos shared IEP needs, that they just burst out crying because they were at the mall with their kid and somebody gave him a high five because their kids were invisible. And now they're visible and everyone everyone has a right and a need to feel seen. And so circle of friends shines a light on that and so don't be afraid of being awkward. And don't be afraid it's great. Jump On In the water's fine

where can where can people find information about circle friends?

We we have our website I'm not as up on twitter and instagram i It's probably an age thing but but we definitely we've got a website we've got contact information there and I do respond to email and phone messages and I'm happy to share and help people figure out if this program is right for them and how to make it work at their school

after a quick break the mystery question

mystery question is what is your kryptonite?

Hmm. My kryptonite? I think my kryptonite is if it's like hypocrisy and apathy, that if if someone just won't be open

to, to change or open to goodness, if they're just really closed and actively defensive and, and attacking that i i find that difficult, so I'm fine. I've always been fine with like problem behaviors, because at least if someone's acting out, you know they're in the game. But if someone just shuts down or just just they're just constantly in attack mode, then then that kind of saps my energy.

Oh, well, you went a lot serious. And I was thinking, I was thinking like, Oh, I'm enjoys.

Oh, then beats I don't like beats.

Well, I see I see I love I love Almond Joy is it's like, that's, that's what like, gives me like, like, if you put if you put a stack of Almond Joys like I would eat all of them. And that's really bad for me. You know what I mean? So like, and that would, that would drain me and all of my power. But going to with what you're saying? I which I think is a really interesting take on this question. I'm like, I'm a pretty even keel kind of person. I don't get worked up very often. But it's really, really hard for me. To and, yes, a disability and inclusion and all that stuff is like really important to me. But I've changed I've changed my mindset a lot around LGBTQIA you know, plus people and same sex marriage and when I when I when I listen to hear really bigoted opinions. It really it really gets me going. And it's very hard for me to stay quiet. Really, really hard. So just putting it out there. So So yeah, a little bonus there for anyone who's listening. But thank you for sharing that and really appreciate that. See mystery question. Isn't it fun? Yeah. Robin stack Regan, thank you so much for being on the think inclusive podcast. We appreciate it.

You're welcome. It was it was great.

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Maybe what I'll do is to start us off. I'll read the mission. Okay circle of friends, because I really like it. And then let's just jump in and kind of you tell me, you can tell me like where did this all start? Because that sounds good.

That sounds great.