riverside_krista__ oct 3, 2024 002_radical_massage the

2:58PM Oct 3, 2024

Speakers:

Krista Dicks

Paul Neal

Keywords:

financial strategist

commercial property

business ownership

wealth accumulation

lease renewal

forced savings

local presence

business expansion

real estate investment

financial benefits

property appreciation

tax advantages

business control

entrepreneurial mindset

retirement planning

Hello radical massage therapist, and welcome to another episode of the radical massage therapist podcast. My name is Krista. I'm a registered massage therapist and a clinic owner in Ottawa, Ontario, Canada. I'm also not the radical massage therapist, but you are. Thank you so much for listening and wanting to learn more about the many benefits that our career provides and the funds that you get to have along the way. And I'm not talking about fun just like inside our profession. I'm talking about the fun that we get to have outside of our profession, because our career offers freedom, flexibility and some really great financial perks as well. In today's episode, we are talking to Paul Neil. Paul is a financial strategist and author dedicated to transforming the way entrepreneurs view commercial property. His book, unleash your business, unlock wealth, autonomy and control. By buying your building and firing your landlord, offers a new perspective on achieving autonomy and wealth, and it's a really great opportunity for you to consider if you are a clinic owner, or you're looking to be a clinic owner in the future, perhaps you don't want to or need to rent your space. Maybe it is more beneficial for you in the long term to own your commercial space. And Paul's going to explain all of the benefits to doing that and how his business is to help you achieve those goals as well. So I really hope you enjoy this episode. You know, it might not seem like something that you need at that moment. I really hope that it's something that you come back to in the future, because I think that this can really answer a lot of our concerns as massage therapists when it comes to, how are we going to pay for our retirement? Really answers a lot of questions as massage therapists that we might have, you know, like the the uncertainty of having a rental property, what if you have to change locations? What if you need to expand? Also, what are you going to do for your retirement? You know, how are you going to support yourself when you want to retire, or how are you going to support yourself if you're unable to work as a massage therapist, Paul's going to be able to answer all of these questions and more. And I really hope you enjoy this episode with Paul.

Welcome Paul to the radical massage therapist podcast, it is a pleasure to have you here.

Well, I'm happy to be here. Krista, thanks for having me

on I know you have this wonderful team that is reaching out on your behalf to record episodes on different podcasts, and I'm really glad that they did reach out to me. One of the best things about the podcast is that I really get to scratch my own itch and talk to guests that I'm genuinely curious about, but also topics that are interesting and sort of relevant to what I'm going through right now on my own professional journey. And I really feel like this episode no matter I feel like it's a good one to have in the bank, because maybe somebody listening is not necessarily ready at this point for what we're going to talk about, but maybe it's something they can come back to later on and be able to use the information and move forward. But also I maybe something in this in this podcast, might inspire somebody to take action that they never, never thought about before. So I'm really excited to chat about that. And essentially, I mean the essence of of the conversation is why owning your commercial space as a business owner is more beneficial than renting, and I'd love to get into it, as I sort of warned you about, I can go all over the place. But did you want to give just a brief introduction as well as to how you got started in this particular area? Yeah,

sure. Sure. Absolutely. So. I am a business owner, entrepreneur, by heart and by nature. And so right out of school, actually, in school, started my first business, and have had six since then, a few years ago. And so most of my like sphere of influence, my tribe, are business owners and entrepreneurs, and several of those businesses, most of them had revolved around in or around a real estate finance in one capacity or another. And so I noticed over a period of time that a lot of my business owner friends kind of fell into two categories, one the ones that were just kind of, you know, heads down and building their businesses and doing well, but they just kind of went from lease to lease to lease as their as their opportunities came up to, you know, potentially buy a building. They just passed on it for whatever reason, didn't understand, wasn't ready. You know, a lot of reasons why they passed but, but then, you know, time. Sort of passed with these guys, then the other group kind of same thing, but at some point they made the decision to buy the space that they run their business out of. And so what I noticed over time is this, this, this delta between the two groups from from a wealth accumulation standpoint, where they both had operating businesses that were, in many cases, doing well, but one camp had this, this asset that was gaining and growing in equity, you know, year after year after year, which created opportunities for them to leverage in many different ways that the other group didn't. And so I became fascinated with it, and I realized that, again, there was not a lot of information, good information, where you could go to get answers on, you know, what's involved in commercial real estate? What's involved, specifically in buying your own business, you know, the building. And because it's different here in the US than residential real estate finance, which is pretty boilerplate, pretty plain, vanilla, most people have done it a few times, and they're kind of used to the process, and they know, and it's, depending on where you go, it's going to be pretty much the same process, the same products, and that sort of thing, commercials, completely different. And so I felt like that there was a need there that we could, we could create a resource and be a resource to help guide people to make an intelligent decision so they understood what they were, what they were facing, and so that's, that's been sort of the mission, and it's been a lot of fun. And that's, that's what we do, and that's why I wrote the book on it. And where we focus our business, although we do other commercial real estate funding, that's, that's kind of the main thrust.

Excellent. I mean, I am a clinic owner, and I am paying rent, and so it's perfect timing to have this conversation as well. And, I mean, you've perfectly described, and I'll be honest, like, I just never considered the ownership part. And I'm sure you can describe maybe a little bit about, you know, where, where the two personalities kind of fall into as well. I mean, I think that people listening to this episode as well might be considering clinic ownership. And so it's a really great opportunity when you are looking for your space in order to decide what you'd like to do, whether you'd like to rent, or whether you want to own. And like I said, I didn't know that ownership was an option.

Yeah. I mean, a lot, a lot, a lot of people don't. They just don't think about it, you know, and then, and for the ones that do, the thought crosses their mind, Krista, generally, what they do, in my experience, is they're unprepared for it. It pops up because they're reminded that the lease is coming due and it's time to re either renegotiate or sign a new lease or or potentially move. There's some trigger, but there's no preparation. And so they saunter down to the local bank, and it's the same bank that they, you know, probably the original relationship they had. They set up their depository accounts, and they opened the business originally, and they, you know, run all their money through that, that bank. And so they have a friendly, you know, a friendly relationship with the their bank or their business banker, but they find out that it's there's much more involved that you know here in the US, the bank's going to tell them, typically, hey, it's going to be 20 25% down, and it's going to be a 20 year term, and you're going to have a five year balloon. And we need all these financials, and in most of them are sort of gobsmacked, for lack of a better term of, whoa, there's a lot involved in this, and overwhelmed, and just kind of turn around, and that idea now just kind of flies out of their brain, and they move on and just like, well, it's a lot easier just to sign the lease and move on, and that's their experience of ownership or the opportunity.

And then what I mean, what I think we're most familiar with, as well as the the potential for wealth in real estate. I think we all understand the concept of of home ownership and the potential for building, building wealth that way. And I really love that you're you're you've already mentioned that people who are owning their commercial space are building wealth and an asset as well. Can you speak more to that?

Yeah, sure. I mean, that's a great analogy. A lot of times I use that as just kind of a comparison. You think about, why do you buy the home that you live in? Most people don't rent it forever. Most people sort of intrinsically know I'm going to create wealth there, even if they're not taught that. But, you know, there's qualitative reasons you want to, you want to be able to, you know, build the home out the way you want it, make changes, renovations, additions, things like that. It's somewhere to kind of stake your flag. This is my family. We're here. This is our piece of the world kind of thing. And then again, there are the financial benefits of that you know, your properties tend to appreciate over time and get greater in value, and every payment that you make on that that mortgage reduces the principal balance of of the loan on the home. And there are tax advantages here. In the US for that, and again, in the US, when you look at like retirees, the numbers are heavily, heavily weighted in terms of the percentage of the bulk of the wealth of retirees in America is in the value of their home, the primary residence, and so. So it's a very it's a very advantaged vehicle, because you have to live somewhere, you're gonna pay a price to live somewhere as a person, as a family, whether you rent or your own. Your business is no different, and I'm gonna classify it in a sense that if you have a business that's a virtual business, and you have virtual employees everywhere, and you have no need for inventory, or you don't have employees or customers or clients or patients coming in to a facility, then you probably don't need a building. So really, specifically, who we're talking to are those businesses that that have a need for a local presence. Like you said, you have a clinic. So if you have a clinic, you've got patients coming in, you know, you've got employees coming in, you've got staff and so it's got to live somewhere. So you're going to pay for that opportunity, whether you pay rent or you pay a mortgage, and so a couple of, you know, variations, when you get when you're renting, you're not really in control. You don't own the space. You have to ask permission if you want to make major changes. They'll limit how you can use the space based upon certain covenants and that sort of thing, or where it is. But beyond that, as the as the owner, you can make those decisions. You don't have to renew a lease when that term comes up, because generally, you'll sign a three or five or seven year lease, you know, with to rent and and people sort of automatically assume, unless they've been through this, or know someone that's been through this, where the landlord says We appreciate it, but we're not going to renew the lease because we've decided we're going to sell the building, or we're going to use it for something else. I get calls all the time on that had a great friend and client who owned a couple pizza restaurants, and, again, local businesses. He had invested I think he'd been in one location eight years, renting the space to put 70 or $80,000 in the kitchen. And, you know, it's a local business, right? You've got people coming from a few miles away. They're not going to drive, you know, 30 miles in a metro area to get to pizza shops. He's cruising thinking about the next location he's going to open the rent and all that. All sudden, he gets a knock on the door and the landlord says, Hey, I'm selling the building. So fortunately for him, the landlord did give him a first right of refusal, and we were able to help him buy the building. But think about the downside of, you know, short notice having to find a new location for your business. If it's a specific business that requires like, like a build out, or a workflow or something, then that's going to take more time and money. You've got to hopefully take your your staff with you. Some of them may or may not go based upon where you have to relocate, same thing with your customers or patients or clients. So you have control issues in our lease. You generally have lease rent increases generally baked in annually. Some leases are triple net. They require you to pay the taxes. They require you to pay the you know, for when things go wrong with the building and that sort of thing. So that's not much different than being the owner. But the cool thing about ownership is, generally, when you buy a building and you get a you get a loan on it. That loan, you know, that loan balance isn't going to go up, right? Nobody's going to say, we're going to raise your loan balance. Now, interest rates can change, but you can get a fixed rate loan on a commercial loan, so you can lock in that, that price of the building today and your payment, and let the property continue to grow in value over time. So no one's going to kick you out. Nobody's going to raise the rent on you. And if you happen to get in a mortgage where rates are a little higher, where they have been in in the last, you know, two years, you can always refinance it so you could, you could lower the, you know, the payment there, like you can on your home. There's tax advantages Krista to it, like on your home, your personal residence. Lot of people don't think about it as you accumulate equity in the property, you can use that, that, that sort of built in bank account to maybe expand to another location, buy a competitor. You can use it to, you know, do a lot of things like that. You could pass you could sell the building and use that money to buy a built, a bigger building. But the biggest thing I see, I think I see with business owners is most business owners, you know, as their income goes up and their business succeeds, they tend to, you know, buy a little nicer house, buy a nicer car, some toys, things like that. And so they're not that great at saving and investing. I mean, most of us aren't, to be honest with it, you know, anyway, but having that building it becomes a forced savings program, because, again, every month you're making the payment to yourself instead of someone else, and so your your your forced savings account. And I gave a great example of that in the medical space. I have a friend, Kathy, who she's an OBGYN, and she bought her building about 1415, years ago, and she is. Paid off the building, and her practice has been there the whole time. She was recently approached by one of these larger medical groups that buys the smaller ones and kind of rolls them up, and she opted to sell. So she sold her practice, the operating part of it. She negotiated a deal where she could stay on for three or four years and continue to work because she wasn't quite ready to retire. And oh, by the way, the people that bought the business, they didn't, they don't want to move the business, because, again, all the staff is there, all the patients are there. They're comfortable with it. So guess what? She's now renting the her building that she owns free and clear back to the new owners for a nice five figure monthly cash flow that she'll just have as long as she wants, and until she decides she wants to sell the building or or there, you know, pass it to her kids, or whatever she wants to do. So, so she set herself up for for not only a savings but a retirement stream of income that, again, 15 years would have passed either way, whether she was paying rent to someone else or buying it from herself. Yeah,

and in the grand scheme of owning a business. I mean, 15 years is, is nothing. I mean, you, you want to be able to own your business for at least that long, which is sort of brings me to, you know, like, the question, like, do you, do you encourage first time, like, business owners to start off right from the bat to to own their business? Obviously, as a new business, there's there's going to be risk and there's fear, and, you know, there's excitement there too, but, but how do you help them sort of approach potentially ownership as a brand new business as well?

Yeah, that's a great question. And the shorter answer, the short answer is, we don't I, you know, the couple of asterisks on whether you should consider buying your building would be, one, you know, are you locally based? You have a need to be local. And then two, do you have a good glide path in the future? So you do expect to be around 510, 1520, years as most, most service businesses, they're not, they're not trendy. You know, restaurants can be tricky. But you know, if you're providing a legitimate service with repeat clients and customers and patients and referrals, you you kind of know. But the third thing is, you also want to have a few years of history you know, under your belt, because if you're starting a new business, there's a lot to learn, as you know, right? You've got to learn you know, how to market, how to serve your clients and patients, how to how to hire employees and staff, how to get your systems and things in place, and so that that's really the most important thing, excuse me, the first few years is getting that business profitable, stable and on a great glide path once you're there, and that might be the three or four or five year mark, somewhere there where you feel comfortable like, Okay, I've got a good handle on this. We've got some some history. That's a good time to be thinking about it. Now. From the very beginning, it could be in the back of your mind. It's like, okay, once I get to this point, I do want to start, you know, looking or considering this opportunity. I don't want to lease forever. And it can be part of your vision for your business, which I think is great, because if it is part of your vision, then, then it will be on your mind and your plan. And some people, Krista, it's, it's a major part of their vision, where they're not just looking to buy the building that they're in. They do that, but then they want to buy another one and open a second location and then a third location. And you know, we have a dentist that did that here in town and came out of school, and after four or five years, bought the building, and then a couple years later, decided he wanted to go to the next one, and then he put it in about 20 minutes away. And then anyway, and he would hire dentals graduates, student graduates, put it in there, let them run it. He already knew how to run the business. He had systems, he had customers. He had great referrals, and so he could airlift it and put it in a different area. And he did that three other times for five buildings. And so now he's got this real estate empire with, you know, five locations that are worth millions and millions of dollars in appreciating. And he's not even operating those businesses. He has people operating those businesses, but it's all quote, unquote, his business, so to speak. I

have a couple directions I want to go. One is, you know, the economy as well, when you're owning a commercial property and the re the resale on that. I mean, there's, we don't really know, you know, you don't even know if your own home is going to sell in when you want it to sell. And you if you're relying on it for retirement, you don't even know if it's going, you know, to to get the amount that you actually want or need. I imagine it's the same with commercial real estate as well. And you know, sadly, since you know, covid, businesses have had to shut down. Commercial properties have just been empty. And obviously, as the owner, you're you're holding you know that those fees, but, yeah, like, how have you seen things rebuilding? What kind of advice do you? Do you have when you're you're stuck, stuck with an empty, empty building?

Well, I think, I think that's a good point. And I think the the larger question is, when we talk commercial real estate, we're talking, you know. A very wide asset class. These tall Class A office buildings downtown. You know, we're not advocating you buy those. That's a whole different animal. That's not where you're going to put your business. But the small, you know, the small shop on Main Street, the the standalone building, or maybe you're in a small strip center, or, you know that those, those are the ones like flex warehouse space. If you're a contractor and you need some warehouse, you've, you've got to, you've, you've got to have space somewhere. Now I can't really speak to, you know, governmental actions and come them coming in and seeing what they did during covid. I mean, that was just, you know, barbaric. What they did to business people. So no one's got a crystal ball on that, but in our country, there was some relief for that from the government, you know, in terms of PPP and thing in what they call eidl loans and things like that, to carry people through. So no crystal ball there. But generally speaking, again, in the long run, if you have a business that that is is going to be needed in the future, I like to say, if you have a business that can't be amazoned away, it can't be outsourced to China. If you have a need, you can't do it on the internet, right? Like it's massage therapy would probably be hard to do over the internet. I'm guessing I've got, I've got some pain in my neck, Krista, I don't think you can handle it from there. I need some I need some help. Same thing with the plumber, same thing with the builder, the electrician, same thing with the coffee shop. That might be a little riskier, because maybe not necessarily, you know, required if the government came in and said, you know, you can't operate your business anymore, which is, again, a bigger problem. But again, we're not talking about you buying a building and having a bunch of tenants. We're talking about you buying a space that you run your business from. So I think that's kind of where the risk is. You're betting on yourself and your ability to maintain and grow this business and and therefore the building. But you know, if you rent up space and you lease, you know, most of those landlords are going to require personal guarantees and things like that, so you're going to be on the hook for that as well. It's not like you get a free pass generally when you're leasing space. In fact, I saw that in 2008 with people that had leased spaces, and, you know, they, they don't want to let you out of a, you know, a five year lease, even though, you know your business is completely going away. So, yeah, there's risk, I mean, and certainly I don't have a crystal ball, and no one knows the future. But again, it's a bet on yourself and your business. And if you're, if you can't be amazoned out, and you have to have a local presence, then I think it's a good bet. Yeah,

I appreciate the clarification that we're looking at one space, you know, one office space that is, is yours. And then, you know, even within that space, though, when you're, when you're leasing, you kind of get comfortable with outsourcing any issues to the landlord, if they're if they're great, of course. How do you, how do you help new, new owners understand, or, you know, navigate the now the ownership part, where you're you're now responsible for everything internal, good and bad. Yeah,

I mean, again, if you most people that buy a building already own a home, and so there it's the same thing, right? You've got an air conditioning, heating in Canada, heating system, right? Maybe heated floors, you know? You got plumbing, you've got electrical, you've got landscaping, you know, not that much different, honestly, than what you currently have. I mean, what some people will do, because some clients will, they'll try to be as they look at their plan, their three and five and seven year plan, they think they're going to need more space in three years and five years and whatever they currently need. So what they'll do strategically is buy a space larger than they need, or build a space larger than they need, and they occupy 5060, 70% of that space, and then they'll lease out the other 20, 30% of the space to other tenants that either maybe have a related business, or it could be completely, you know, non, non correlated at all. And so they also become the owner and the landlord. And so some of them will self manage the building and the tenants, but some of them will get a management company. And the management company, they just pay them a small percentage, and they'll do it, and the same management company will handle the everything on your building as if you were a tenant. Because really, what you're going to do is you're going to have an operating you're gonna have a real estate company that you own that buys the real estate, and then you're gonna have your operating company that your current business is gonna sign a lease to your to your ownership company. So you're gonna lease from your own yourself, so to speak, right? So you'll be a tenant in your own space, which has some tax advantages, some liability. Protections and things like that. So you could get a management company and have them do all of that. And, you know, you just factor it into the numbers when, when you do the cash flow on, hey, does it make sense to buy a building or not? And, you know, circling back a little bit to the question earlier too, about that, you know, when you should buy the numbers have to make sense. The cash flow has to make sense. And we don't generally recommend, depending on what I call if come we like to make decisions based upon what already came in. You know, where have you been? And if you if you can, you maintain that, and if it gets better, then you know, that's wonderful, and we all expect it will, but we're not going to make a decision based on that. So if you're not the type of person that, or you don't have an office manager, I mean, if you have an office manager in your business, or, you know, somebody like that that already handles a lot of those things that, I mean for them to, you know, interface with the AC company, if there's an issue, it's really not that big of a deal, right? As an add on. It's honestly not rocket science. And, oh, by the way, if you have a couple of tenants in the space that you're leasing out to, let's say that 30% space. So if your business does grow as anticipated and desired, then you have the opportunity as a landlord to not renew their lease when that time comes up, so you can expand into that space. So you've got a built in expansion plan right there, and, you know, or you could, you could move to a larger building and lease out the space you were in as well and build some commercial real estate investment empire. Some people do. So, did I answer your question? I'm not sure.

Yeah, definitely answered it. And more, yeah, I love, I love the if come word, because that, that is a very, you know, it's something that everybody, you know, look, might look at in their business and go, Well, this is how we're doing. But, you know, the goal is, but you can't, you can't necessarily predict and and massage therapy, clinic ownership, depending on your space. I mean, there, there really is a limit to how you're at a certain point, you will sort of reach a plateau if you're you're not. There are certain ways that you can scale that, but at the same time, like there's only so many rooms, there's only so many therapist hours, there's only so many clients that you can see. But it is, it is just a nice reminder that to base your your future on the on the if come for sure, that's that's really, really helpful. Yeah, definitely answered the question. Sorry. As as a massage therapist, we also try to encourage massage therapists to diversify their income, because of our job being so physical, and most of us are independent and like, whether they want to recognize it or not, we're entrepreneurs and and it's a big risk being such a physical profession that perhaps it's not something you're going to be able to carry on forever as independent contractors. We don't always have we don't have a pension. I think these are really, this is a really great topic to really, really consider in the in the future for your business, because, as you said, it's going to be an asset. It will fund your retirement. You know, moving forward in the future, you have a sweet spot for entrepreneurs. As your you are one yourself. What? What attracts you to entrepreneurs? And you really seem to be like, be more drawn to work with the like, the independent businesses, like you said, like the mom and pop, the local community. What drives that for you?

Well, I think you know from from the time. I can remember when my father asked me I was, like, eight or nine years old, standing in their bathroom what I wanted to do when I would grow up. And I told them I wanted to be rich, I think. And the motivation was not really rich. The motivation was more free and to be able to call my own shots, to do what I wanted to do, when I wanted to do it, with whom I wanted to do it, wherever I want to do it without asking anybody's permission. I'm a I'm a person who is, you know, I don't like authority, you know, I respect it and and I do get along with authority, okay? But, you know, I just, I've always been very independent, and I feel like that. Most of us, deep down, that's the way we want to live. And most of us, if we're free to make our own choices, we'll make good choices. So I business owners and entrepreneurs, we fly in a different it's a, it's a, it's a different group. You know, we to your point, there's no pension. You're not guaranteed a paycheck every week. You're you're not basically every day you have to show up. It's you can't phone it in. And you know when some and nothing against someone working job. Jobs, great they, you know, wonderful people do jobs but, but it's just a different mindset. And so I. Think that entrepreneurs, as such, we're forced to to be introspective and to learn and to grow. And it's not like you know, they say most people never read a book again after they graduate college, if they go to college, but for business owners and entrepreneurs, every day is a learning experience, and if you're going to be successful, you're probably reading a lot, you're listening things a lot, like this podcast and other podcasts. You're trying to expand your your vision of of of not only what to do, but how to do it, and how far you could possibly go. And there's a great, great motivation for that. And the byproduct of that, I think Krista is then you learn to to communicate that to the people that are on your team and your family and your community. You become an influencer for good, because you're you're as John Maxwell cell says, the leadership, you're the lid of the leadership and so so nobody that you influence and your organization family is going to be at a higher level leadership than than you. And so by growing, you lift everybody up, and by serving, and always laugh about all the you know, business people are greedy and they're they're racist, they will do this is like, that's the farthest of the true business people want to help other people, because that's how they they by serving, is how they create their own wealth and future, and in that all and then therefore freedom. And so that's a group that I love to work with. They're not afraid to take risk. And they probably skin their knee a few times, or, like me, splattered their face a couple of times. You know, face plant, but, but what do you do? You don't have a pension. You just get back up and you go for it again, right with you? Let you learned a new lesson. And so that's that's why,

no, that's amazing. Yeah. Definitely speaks to, yeah, what, what entrepreneurship is, is falling flat on your face sometimes, but getting back up because, yeah, what choice do you have? The podcast definitely speaks to a lot of what you're saying. I wanted to start this to demonstrate the freedoms, flexibilities, the financial potential we have as massage therapists, which sometimes I think we forget and we start to look to the get grass is greener on the other side. So I just yeah, it's just having guests like you is just a really nice compliment to the podcast, the essence of what I'm trying to to share with listeners, and I know it'll resonate with with somebody listening, for sure. So that's wonderful. Paul, is there anything else that we can can chat about that we haven't, haven't covered? You know, I want to just make sure that people understand that you're in the States. And what can you offer people if they are in the states and want to work with you? Yeah.

So, so what we do? I would say, we have, I have a book. You can get the book for free, lease your business, how to unlock wealth, autonomy and control by buying your building and firing your landlord. You can get it on our website. It's own your building now.com, very simple. Own your building now.com. And it's free. I just asked you pay for us to print it and mail it, I think, six or seven bucks, and we get it out to you. But, and it's not Moby Dick, it's a it's an hour and a half cup of coffee or tea, you know, on a Saturday morning. And you can, you can read, it's a great place to start if you have no clue the opportunities, the pros and the cons of owning space versus renting, the tax advantages, the different types of loans and programs that are out there, and the entire process, what to expect through it, and then post, post process. So it's a great primer. What we do Krista, is we focus on getting ahead of that decision. And so for people that are seriously considering it, whether they're, you know, and again, I don't recommend this. If you're within about 90 days of a lease renewal, unless you can ex, you can extend that lease for, you know, six months or something, or go month a month, but you're six months out, you're 12 months out, you're 18 months out, and if you think you might want to build something, you're 24 months out, and you're like, is this something that I should seriously consider? And what we do is we have a process, so four step process, we investigate, we underwrite, we advise, and then we can facilitate the funding itself, but it starts with investigation and really just understanding, you know, what is your business about? Where are you today? Where are you going to go? What are the historical financials? We've got, like, a 53 question questionnaire where we uncover a lot of things that you would not think to ask about, but it allows us to find potential landmines in the process, for you in pitfalls. So because you want to uncover that way in advance, and if there are any skeletons in the closet, we can deal with it up front, and we work on a plan. And from there, we basically then advise and say, okay, based upon all this, what you're trying to do, where you've been, your current financial state. Potentially any issues in your closet. Here are a loan options that are available. Here's what you're looking at in terms of terms and interest rates and programs. Because there are, again, it's all over the map, from, you know, 25 to 30% down on a short term term term, to 0% down, in some cases, on a long term loan. It's all over the map, but then we advise on that. And if someone then at that point, if it makes sense, and they think, yes, I want to move forward, then at that point, we can help them connect up with a good commercial real estate agent in their area that that then can help find the appropriate property, the land, because commercial real estate is completely different from residential, and you're not going to go to Zillow and find a building, most likely, you're going to have to go off market and whatnot. And those people can help you do that. And so that's, that's what we do. We're at the front end getting you what we call a buyer, ready, if it makes sense,

amazing. Well, thank you. I really appreciate your time today, Paul. I think this was wonderful information for everybody to to consider owning their their business. I'm certainly thinking about it myself and yeah, looking forward to the future of what that'll that'll hold for me. Yeah,

Krista was a lot of fun. I appreciate you having me on you